Pokemon X/Y are better than Pokemon Sun/Moon, I said it

[Phendrana]

You're absolutely right. Gen 6 may have shit writing (as do all Pokemon games imo), but at least it has the decency to be fairly unintrusive. Gen 7 on the other hand is just as trash in terms of storytelling, and it pushes that shit to the forefront. The praise for Sun & Moon's story is clearly totally lost on me. I will never understand how people get value out of such awfully trite dialogue and bland characters.

Even as far as gameplay is concerned, XY gets the nod. I've actually replayed them a few times at this point, and find them far superior for many of the reasons you listed in the OP (dex variety in particular). I think people really take for granted all of the new features and QOL improvements that they brought to the table:

• 3D battles. This is just the status quo now, but back then it was a huge deal and made XY feel super fresh to me. Of course, Game Freak being Game Freak decided that using the exact same poses and animations for the models for the subsequent SIX years (four sets of games) was perfectly fine. This is one example of a good feature that XY introduced, but has probably been tainted over time because of Game Freak's awful decisions.
• Trainer Customisation. Another long-requested and exciting new addition. And yet...low and behold, this is the best the feature has ever been. Gen 7 had less clothing options overall, and much less variance in style.
• PSS. This is the best online functionality a Nintendo game has ever had. Fans universally agreed that it was awesome. So in typical Game Freak fashion, they replaced it with the worst online implementation ever devised in the following gen.
• Super Training, O-Powers and horde battles all simplified EV training and made it more accessible. Game Freak removed these features in Sun and Moon. Are you sensing a pattern here?
• Pokemon Amie. This one is easy to dismiss as it's not everyone's cup of tea...but I do think it was a fantastic new feature that helped give the Pokemon much more personality within the games. As far as I'm aware, it hasn't been improved since?
• Fairy Type. Fans had been clamouring for a new type for years, and we finally got one here.
• Mega Evolutions were admittedly a bit hit or miss, but ultimately I liked their inclusion overall.
• Friend Safari. I get the feeling that this was overlooked by most people? I thought it was awesome! It encouraged connecting with lots of people to try and get a Safari with a specific Pokemon you couldn't get anywhere else (at the time). For those who were interested in the competitive side of things, it offered a good way to get Pokemon with good IV's for breeding, and it also had a super high chance of letting you find a Shiny.
• Battle Maison. This was a decent postgame battle facility, and is only hated as much as it is because ORAS copy and pasted it. Hell, the Battle Tree in Gen VII feels like a re-skinned Maison too tbh.
• New breeding mechanics made getting competitive Pokemon much, much easier.
• Between the Friend Safari, the Poke Radar and Consecutive Fishing, shiny hunters had lots of different options available to them.
• Wonder Trade was a super cool little addition.

On top of all of that, XY had a super vibrant trading and battling community. Especially in those months before Bank was released. It was a seriously magical time, and made me completely unaware that the game didn't have much of a postgame, because I was too busy breeding shinies and competitive Pokemon, as well as trading and battling with others online.

Oh, and the Kalos dex is the best batch of new Pokemon since Gen 1.

 

[BeaconofTruth]

Sun and Moon is more railroadish? Because the notion that any game is getting that heat in comparison to X n Y is absurd to me. X n Y is mind numbing about shit, and omfg your stupid friends it gives you. I loathe the dancing friend so much.

 

[skullwaker]

This needs a poll.

I found Sun/Moon to be a lot more compelling and fun, personally. Alola is a much better region than Kalos, and the starters are better too.

 

[ffdgh]

In some way yeah in some ways no. PSS overall made XY a more enjoyable experience though.

3DS series peaked with ORAS.

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But this is the overall truth despite the missing emerald goods. None can compare to the DS games tho.

 

[Raonak]

3DS pokemon games have been pretty underwhelming.

 

[BurritoBushido]

you are 100% correct

 

[Tavernade]

I agree 100% at X/Y being better. I've been playing Pokemon games since there was Pokemon games. I've beaten every single one except for Sun/Moon. I don't even know at what point I quit at, the combination of far far too many story interruptions, the lack of a National Dex, and the sheer drop in online quality after X/Y did it in for me. I just have zero memories of actually enjoying Sun/Moon at all. I'd consider it the worst in the series.

 

[AbsoluteZ3R0]

In terms of gameplay I found x/y to be way better than sun/moon. The new pokemons like protean greninja, gale wing talonflame were lot more useful in competitive game play. Also, mega evolution added a whole new layer to competitive battles and brought a lot of old pokemon back to meta. Most new pokemon in sun/moon other than the ultra beasts were pretty useless and z-move did not have the same impact mega evolution did. I liked sun/moon story better but the pacing sucked and was not fan of the trails. Also, imo the environments in x/y were lot more memorable. Also, pss was one of the best thing that happened in pokemon game but too bad they removed in sun/moon.

 

[JetBazooka]

Also dont forget x/y were the first games on 3ds and for like a month weren't hacked so you could actually trade legit like pokemon was intended. The 3d models and animations wowed me for a pokemon game. Nobody should have been complaining about the game at all in my opinion.

 

[Soul Skater]

Maybe

But personally I think all the 3DS Pokémon games are so bad it's hard to compare them.

 

[aSqueakyLime]

Sun/Moon actually has so many things going for it over XY, it's not even funny:

Characters
Story
Atmosphere
Region
Enemy Team
Music
Gameplay (even discounting the Z-moves vs Megas argument, SuMo has the better AI)
Graphics
Pokemon

The only thing XY has going for it in certain terms (I personally disagree it's a bad thing but w/e) is it's quicker to get started and doesn't have as many story interruptions... buuuut it just ends up with making the player not give a shit about what they're doing because everything's so bland. Oh, and online; the stupid plaza thing sucks.

SuMo is great and I'll take a bit of story railroading to get me interested in the world/story over nothingness any day.

 

[rgibbo36]

I loved X/Y, and I was actually surprised when I found out about all the hate those games get. I enjoyed Sun/Moon, but not as much as X/Y.

 

[Deleted member 249]

Sun and Moon is more railroadish?

Click to shrink...

Yup

 

[ArchedThunder]

I really dislike Sun and Moon and love XY despite it's issues.

 

[Forkball]

Love both games, both were my GotY, but OP is right. Many things that are great about SM are owed to XY building the foundation.

For XY
+XY has a massive Pokédex allowing for an incredible array of team combos
+Kalos was more fun to explore, with less linear routes and better cities
+Kalos gyms were creative and among the best in the series while Island Trials were mechanically the same
+While the new Pokémon were minimal, everyone had either an incredible design, interesting gimmick, or were useful in game
+PSS made it seem like a Pokémon MMO. Wonder Trading is also a fantastic addition. The EV training, while not the fastest, was a unique way to introduce the ideas of EVs. SM's Island Festival or whatever it was called was a complete airball.
+Mega Evolution, while broken until the nerfs, was far more interesting than Z moves and terrain effects
+Bike theme

SM has better QoL changes, story, characters, music, and Poke Pelago, But XY is much stronger.

 

[saiko]

Well I couldn't even finish S&M while XY felt new and refreshing at the time. So you're probably right.

 

[Ryengeku]

I agree.

 

[Deleted member 41502]

X/Y are the only Pokemon games I've ever actually finished on a device, and I have no idea what any of these features people are listing are. Super Training, Pokemon Amie, Friend Safari, Battle Maison? I vaguely remember some sort of training with a punching bag, but could never figure out what the hell it was. There was some sort of weird room you could put a Pokemon on and put snacks on it, but again, I could never figure out what it was. I have no idea what those other terms are. It felt like an 80s RPG that had just kept piling shit on and never bothered to actually polish any of it.

When Sun/Moon came out I remember hearing that it was better and I was hopeful they'd cleaned up and modernized. Sounds like they did!

 

[Deleted member 48434]

I'm still mad that Ultra Beasts exist.

Click to shrink...

 

[Flygon]

X/Y was a mess, but I at least felt compelled to go through and finish it. In spite of all of its problems.

Sun/Moon was just... it didn't pull me along. Rather, it felt like it was just trying to push me away every chance it could get.
Never mind the whole, uh. Ultra Beasts... thing. That was a thing.
I kind of erased that from my mind until the past few posts, I wanted to forget them that hard.

I'm a bit of a loon for Pokemon, as my username probably posits. I just hope there's a brighter future ahead for us.

 

[chaobreaker]

I don't think I will ever be as excited as I was for X/Y than any other Pokemon game. It was the first 3D main series one and honestly they hit it out of the park. It could have been a bastardized slog like Pokemon Colosseum or XD but it played as fast and responsive as any 2D core series game. All while giving us the massive content and new features introduced like OP said. Sun/Moon basically retread the same path as X/Y but with a slightly better presentation. I liked those games too but it wasn't that gamechanger for me X/Y was. I doubt Sword/Shield will be either tbh.

Online was great + accessible competitive breeding/training meant that this game had some fucking legs long after the main story ended. PSS was a godsend. My heart was broken the moment I first delved into Festival Plaza in Sun/Moon.

I will forever stan X/Y.

 

[Deleted member 48434]

The only people I've seen stan X and Y were mostly those who like online and comp.
As someone who plays pretty much exclusively offline, X and Y were abominations.

 

[ThisIsBlitz21]

Pokemon X/Y was like the only pokemon you can easily beat without catching a single pokemon. They give you a Kanto Starter, then the fossil, then the mega lucario, then the lapras. Bam, five pokemon team already, two of them able to mega evolve, and that lucario capable of sweeping full teams by itself.
It cannot be overstated how braindead easy this game really is.

 

[ThisIsBlitz21]

Love both games, both were my GotY, but OP is right. Many things that are great about SM are owed to XY building the foundation.

For XY
+XY has a massive Pokédex allowing for an incredible array of team combos
+Kalos was more fun to explore, with less linear routes and better cities
+Kalos gyms were creative and among the best in the series while Island Trials were mechanically the same
+While the new Pokémon were minimal, everyone had either an incredible design, interesting gimmick, or were useful in game
+PSS made it seem like a Pokémon MMO. Wonder Trading is also a fantastic addition. The EV training, while not the fastest, was a unique way to introduce the ideas of EVs. SM's Island Festival or whatever it was called was a complete airball.
+Mega Evolution, while broken until the nerfs, was far more interesting than Z moves and terrain effects
+Bike theme

SM has better QoL changes, story, characters, music, and Poke Pelago, But XY is much stronger.

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- Kalos cities's don't even come to Alola's cities in any way. The region is the blandest too, aside from the gen 1/2 (which is understandable due to them running on game boy hardware)
- Klefki, Aromatisse, Slurpuff, aka each gen has their stinkers (I think it's a good batch, but quality can only go so far to make up for the small number, cause its not like previous gen had bad batches)
- Massive pokedex drowned out the new mons even more. Felt more like a "best hits" pokemon culmination, with all the old mons, fan service, literally ripping off gen 1 at certain parts.

I agree, PSS is a GODSEND. It was perfect.

 

[GamerJM]

I actually can't disagree with a lot of what you said, but I really dislike Kalos, the way gen 6 looks, and the X/Y post-game. Because of this it's probably my least favorite gen.

 

[Valkerion]

OP must be drunk.

Sun and Moon had a lot of fluff but no other region had that much good vibes in it. X and Y just had.... nothing. You might as well just have run to the end and not had any dialog at all.

 

[dreamlongdead]

Strongly disagree about the story and gameplay points in the OP.

The single player in XY is grossly unbalanced. It is literally autopilot the whole entire time, while Sun/Moon actually has some challenging battles.

I think most of us can agree that Sun/Moon's characters are much more likeable than the ones in XY.

XY did a lot for the metagame, which no one will deny. However, it failed miserably as a single player experience, and that makes it dead last for so many people here.

Sun/Moon is far from perfect, but it made up for a lot of the sins in Gen 6.

 

[Bradford]

As a non-fan of the series who has skipped a bunch of games, the one thing that I can say about X/Y that made me stick through it over Sun/Moon was that there wasn't a refresh to the X/Y line literally right after I bought one of them.

What makes it worse is that people can't seem to decide if SM or USUM are better, and trying to find a list of actual differences and reasons to pick one or the other is almost just as confusing. I have no idea which version to play so I just... Didn't.

 

[Professor Beef]

Also XY had an awful postgame. You can miss me with that dumb Looker bullshit, at least Ultra SuMo went all-out.

 

[MrWonderworld]

I preferred the story of Sun/Moon but I had more fun actually playing X/Y. I The Totem Pokemon thing was nonsense to me, so I'm glad if gyms are returning.

 

[Blade24070]

Pokemon X/Y was like the only pokemon you can easily beat without catching a single pokemon. They give you a Kanto Starter, then the fossil, then the mega lucario, then the lapras. Bam, five pokemon team already, two of them able to mega evolve, and that lucario capable of sweeping full teams by itself.
It cannot be overstated how braindead easy this game really is.

Click to shrink...

I replayed it last year without EXP share, and its difficulty is perfectly in line with older entries, if not even a bit "harder" due to the endgame having really high levels.

EXP share is the true culprit here, but I've stopped using it. It made US much more fun too (the RR battles were super fun without being overleveled as shit).

 

[k4mon]

I agree. I didn't like Sun/Moon at all.
Although X/Y are better I would say the last good Pokemon game was B/W2.

 

[Aprikurt]

Neither of them are particularly good if I'm honest. But at least I managed to make it through XY's main story without totally losing interest.

 

[Normal]

Don't hate X/Y as much as other since it improved the metagame from the mess that was in Gen 5. It also introduced some pretty cool pokemon like Helio line, Aegislash, Talonflame, Greninja, etc.

 

[Camisado]

I agree, Sun and Moon are probably my least favourite main line games.

They both don't come close to the god tier Heart Gold/Soul Silver or Platinum though.

 

[abrasivemurk]

The 3DS era of Pokemon was a slump for the franchise, and I absolutely agree with this assessment, but you know what? In the end, I think Pokemon X/Y were better games than Pokemon Sun/Moon, which, as far as I am concerned, represent the nadir of the franchise. There are so many reasons for this:

• The fucking railroading: This is the biggest thing for me. Pokemon X/Y have the decency to at least pretend to get out of my way and let me do my thing. Sun/Moon are absolutely counter to this- they interrupt you all the fucking time. There are tutorials, long cutscenes, inane exposition, and an emphasis on storytelling that frankly, the game simply does not earn. The writing in X/Y is absolutely shit, as is the story, but at least it mostly stays in the background; Sun/Moon's writing, while marginally better, absolutely does not earn the emphasis that is put on it through the game's play time.
• Better online: The Player Search System may be the best online suite any Nintendo published game has ever had. You can fight and trade with randoms, award or receive buffs, create introduction videos and a surprisingly extensive profile, send friend requests to randoms, engage in system-level voice chat, and more, far more. PSS turns X/Y into a faux-MMO, especially with its "Players In Proximity" feature. Meanwhile, Sun/Moon's contribution to online functionality is to take all of that and throw it out of the window, to replace it with... the Festival Plaza, a discrete physical location that exists independently and must be accessed from the menu to even activate online functionality, and then involves the player manually engaging online interactions with other players who are also using the specific service as them in the Festival Plaza to achieve anything. It's a shocking regression, not just from X/Y, but even Black/White.
• Team building is better in X/Y: The variety of Pokemon available in X/Y is staggering- over 450 Pokemon can be found in the wild easily, spread across a great range of types, letting you easily build a varied roster of more than six Pokemon to cycle in and out of. Sun/Moon on the other hand make bizarre decisions with Pokemon availability, locking entire creatures away behind obscure locations, or mechanics such as calling for help. Speaking of which...
• Team training is better in X/Y: X/Y make actually training your Pokemon far better and easier than Sun/Moon do. Super Training is a fantastic "beginner's feature" for EV training, but if you want to engage in actual Pokemon building, horde battles provide a far better way to EV train your Pokemon than the "call for help" mechanic in Sun/Moon, which has an element of randomness to it that you, as the player, cannot control.
• QOL in X/Y: This is a theme through X/Y vs. Sun/Moon, as you may be noticing. X/Y is just far better at QOL than Sun/Moon is- the UI and menus are better, the game has the decency to truncate, for example, Mega-Evolution animations after the first time (versus Z-Move animations that you have to sit through the entirety of every single time), and everything is easy to initiate and do, versus in Sun/Moon, where things are randomly hidden behind tedious and obscure mechanics.
• X/Y tried to mix things up more: Apart from the shift to 3D, X/Y also made several other major changes to the series' longstanding formula: a new type (for the first time since Gold/Silver), alongside a brand new type chart, Super Training, Pokemon Amie, riding Pokemon, persistent online connectivity via the PSS, Mega Evolutions; Sun/Moon in most cases regress from this, and the only changes they bring to the table are Z-Moves (which are admittedly cool) and getting rid of HMs (also very cool).

Sun/Moon actually have their merits, I love the Pokemon designs, the soundtrack is fantastic, they're harder than X/Y, and Alola as a region has so much personality and atmosphere. But on the whole, in consideration of what I want from my Pokemon games, they're far worse than X/Y. X/Y themselves are fairly weak games, weaker than the first five generations, but I think they at least provide a (very vanilla) Pokemon experience- Sun/Moon just try to get in the way of that constantly.

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Yeah I just played Sun and endless cutscenes/railroading is insane enough to drive me mad.

 

[Cokesouls]

Let's go is the best game right now. Has the best qol improvements. And it'll all be gone by november.

 

[Deleted member 23158]

Wondering if I should drop X and just play Ultrasun (which I also own). I'm playing X atm the cities are indeed pretty bland and I still haven't reached the second gym.

A lot of criticism mentioned align with my feelings until now. If I stick with X I'll probably won't play ultrasun for a while. While I enjoy pokemon games, I am unable to play them back to back.

 

[Euler007]

I beat X/Y around nine times total, got a Yveltal and Xerneas with every potential competitive nature and decent IVs (bought both versions). I only went through SM once and it was a chore. I naively thought USM listened to feedback and changed enough things to make it a more enjoyable playthrough and quit halfway through the first island. ORAS is much better than XY, but at least XY allows a quick playthough to the legendaries.

 

[RocknRola]

Ninja Frog>>>>>>>>

 

[Armite]

I enjoyed them both, honestly (and somewhat more than Gens 4 and 5 since I actually liked most of the new Pokémon). Sun/Moon definitely stops the game for story time too much, but it at least tries with its world, characters and story while X/Y had very little worth paying attention to. Most of the things I have issues with in these games are typical Pokémon quirks that exist in all gens though, like unhelpful inventory management, annoying evolution methods (trades, late game shit) and no option to skip tutorials.

 

[ScoobsJoestar]

What I dislike about both is that it feels like the animations/transitions/dialogue feel like just a little too slow. It's like there's a delay between every character action, the dialogue box takes one second too long...I can't quite explain it, but it drives me insane and it feels so less responsive than the old games that I can't replay them like, ever.

 

[BanetteAndBaguette]

I replayed it last year without EXP share, and its difficulty is perfectly in line with older entries, if not even a bit "harder" due to the endgame having really high levels.

EXP share is the true culprit here, but I've stopped using it. It made US much more fun too (the RR battles were super fun without being overleveled as shit).

Click to shrink...

How the goddamn hell is it harder than the other games.
Look at the last gym leader: he has three miserable mons that are ICE types.

 

[Phellps]

I honestly can't pick just one. I think they're both great for different reasons and each has their own different flaws.

 

[Carbonox]

Sun/Moon is the first mainline game in the series I couldn't finish. Really did not enjoy it despite the cool setting.

So yes, I agree, X/Y is better.

 

[RingoGaSuki]

I completely agree. The only thing S/M has over X/Y is the designs of the Pokemon themselves (X/Y's legendaries are much better though).

X/Y are still the second worst gen though. S/M just far outshat them in every way possible. ORAS were great (not as good as plain Emerald, but still great), but the 3DS gens in general have been terrible. I really hope Gen VIII is good, but I have very low expectations for it.

 

[n_than]

I love XY generation.
These games did so much for the metagame. In the beginning everyone was trying to discover the full potential of the megaevolutions, the anticipation for Pokémon Bank, the online interactions... Was so much fun to play.

I think Kalos region had so much potential for more.

Sun and Moon was the first main games that I didn't finish.

 

[WolfeTone]

What I dislike about both is that it feels like the animations/transitions/dialogue feel like just a little too slow. It's like there's a delay between every character action, the dialogue box takes one second too long...I can't quite explain it, but it drives me insane and it feels so less responsive than the old games that I can't replay them like, ever.

Click to shrink...

This is definitely true. It makes the cutscenes very frustrating to get through. I wish dialogue was snappier like in the DS games.

 

[Blade24070]

How the goddamn hell is it harder than the other games.
Look at the last gym leader: he has three miserable mons that are ICE types.

Click to shrink...

Not exactly a refutation of what I said, but okay, werk.

 

[greenhadoken]

Sun and Moon are the only games that I put absolutely no time into the post-game. The fact that I had to re-earn all of the mega stones was enough for me to put the game away and never return. While Sun and Moon look great, and have a fairly decent story compared to the others, they are worse than every other entry for me for anything else. Too many systems in place, especially with the added z-moves. Let's Go, despite being a step back in a lot of ways, at least stripped away so many of these frivolous systems and had a simple core game. Hope they do that moving forward.