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Kaitos

Tens across the board!
Moderator
Oct 25, 2017
14,705
not releasing a third version is a huge net positive imo.

now they just need to make these new open world areas actually interesting to explore versus the Wild Area which got boring in an hour
 

Dream Machine

Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,085
The legendary bird trio all look like they replaced flying type with dark. Yes, two of them still have wings and fly, but whatever.
 

Moara

▲ Legend ▲
Member
Oct 25, 2017
23,833
30 dollars EACH? Gonna need to wait and see how content rich these DLCs are because that's a hard sell for me.
 

Deleted member 42102

User requested account closure
Banned
Apr 13, 2018
733
Then these people should stop acting like them being personally disappointed in what Sword and Shield ended up being means that GF can't make DLC for these games without being accused that they're selling us content for an incomplete game even though that accusations is wrong

They made a game that was rushed and under delivered on some elements but are now developing expansions to add more meat for those interested such as new areas, a campaign with new characters and story elements, Pokémon, and a handful of other features

You're kinda contradicting yourself. If you can acknowledge that the game was "rushed and under delivered" then it's not too much of a stretch to see why people would feel like the game is unfinished no? The latter half of the game feels like a straight line and some of the towns don't even feel like towns. I wouldn't blame anyone for saying some of the towns in the game were unfinished so I can see why they'd say the game itself is unfinished.

If I paid for a game I felt was bare bones popped out with new DLC in the works a couple months later my initial grievances don't just disappear lol.
 

Phellps

Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,800
Duh? Which is why they shoulda just delayed the game and came out with a better product instead of having people parroting bad arguments about sustainability when we've had 3ds games with more Pokemon than this for like half a decade.
More than one developer will tell you that developing for the 3DSand developing for the Switch are wildly different things.
They also said that it was policy that they wouldn't add more Pokemon post-launch, so I don't know why you're being selective with your argument while conveniently ignoring everything else.
They were obviously dodging the question because announcing the expansions before release would've been a PR nightmare. It's not the first time a developer says they don't have plans for a specific thing because they can't talk about it yet.
 

KillstealWolf

One Winged Slayer
Avenger
Oct 27, 2017
16,069
not releasing a third version is a huge net positive imo.

now they just need to make these new open world areas actually interesting to explore versus the Wild Area which got boring in an hour

I hope they improve visibility in the wild area as well.

Sky beams to guide you wear to go don't really work when either.

A. Hammerlocke is blocking the view of a good portion of the Wild Area.
B. A Sandstorm, Hail or even just Fog makes them very hard to see.
 

Moara

▲ Legend ▲
Member
Oct 25, 2017
23,833

Zedark

Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,719
The Netherlands
The only thing I can see that points to this is that the leaks mentioned "Armor" being a gimmick/mechanic/thing very early on in the production. Perhaps a mechanic was scrapped and then they reused something similar for this expansion?

That's the only thing that's interesting, the tundra I don't remember being mentioned but "armor" was definitely a thing, including MewTwo like in the trailer. But it could all be the product of rushed/changed/stressed development too.
Right, but consider the following as well: developing those DLC ideas can very well be (in part) working out an idea that was at one point conceived but quickly left out of the production scope. Then, the DLC provides a good possibility to revisit that idea and work it out. As such, traces that refer to the DLC idea can surface without it indicating the work has already been done. Software development is a continuous process of considering which features are possible, which are necessary, and which are going to be shipped and which abandoned (at different stages of completion). The idea of the Ireland (I think?) featuring as the Isle of Armor in the Galar region could definitely have existed, but have been taken out of the scope early in the development process.
 

Mekanos

▲ Legend ▲
Member
Oct 17, 2018
44,124
If the first update launches in June, I'll wait until then to get Sword, see how substantial the new content is.
 

Zedark

Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,719
The Netherlands
30 dollars EACH? Gonna need to wait and see how content rich these DLCs are because that's a hard sell for me.
30 dollars gets you the isle of armor and the crown tundra DLC, for either Sword or Shield. If you want it for both games, you must buy the expansion pass twice (THAT is where the 'each' comes from).

Edit: Heh, I guess you know by now!
 

Deleted member 42102

User requested account closure
Banned
Apr 13, 2018
733
More than one developer will tell you that developing for the 3DSand developing for the Switch are wildly different things.

I'd then ask those same developers if they think developing for the PS2 is gonna be the same for the PS5. I'm just bored of all the excuses made for GF at this point, if it's not one thing it's another. People would blame the weather if they could.
 

Murfield

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,425
I suspect/hope they will go in more heavily on the concept of wild areas. I felt with Shield that they used traditional routes for much of the game out of fear of negative backlash.
 

Roliq

▲ Legend ▲
Member
Sep 23, 2018
6,177
They're releasing the new big game feature forms for the starters as DLC. This was planned at the same time they decided to cut the main story time by 10 hours and cut away most of the exploration aspects of the game along with forgetting about the last half of the gyms/towns.
Do you have a source or are trying to stay mad for no reason?
 

Nitpicker_Red

Member
Nov 3, 2017
1,282
Someone on Twitter gave me a random idea. What if Pokémon Home ends up being a Nintendo Online Feature? As in, it comes with Nintendo Online at no additional charge? I admit that would be too good of a move to be true, but there is also some facts that don't make sense in my head until I consider this an option.

1) Why was it necessary to get rid of Pokemon Bank in the first place? The 3DS etc not having Nintendo Online could be a reason for that.
2) They wanna launch this in February. Yet they told us NOTHING about it (like pricing etc.). We are waiting on a Nintendo Direct. Maybe they will announce Pokemon Home as part of Nintendo Online then. God knows that service needs some more value for the buck and for Pokémon fans, Pokémon Home would add that value.


Just a thought tho.
Unfortunately, Game Freak is not Nintendo.
Nintendo is Pokémon's producer, Game Freak is Pokémon's developer, both of them have a stake in The Pokémon Company, but they have different goals and different management teams.
Game Freak even makes games on non-Nintendo consoles.

So Game Freak getting money from Nintendo's Online subscription or offering free services for the subscription as if they were part of the company is unlikely.
 

HardRojo

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
26,096
Peru
PR and media relations work on their own interest. If they have to use creative language or just outright lie to make sure they don't reveal things they want to keep secret, they will 11 out of 10 times.

People really need to stop using PR/media stuff as proof of anything. They aren't government institutions, they have no obligation to be truthful.
Holy shit this has got to be a parody post or something lol, no way you're being serious, right?
This basically reads as "Hey guys it's ok if companies lie to us in our faces because they're covering their business strategies and will surprise us, so let them lie".
Ultimately the stuff GF revealed today is good news, but please let's not turn into brainless robots for no reason.
 

Bit_Reactor

Banned
Apr 9, 2019
4,413
Right, but consider the following as well: developing those DLC ideas can very well be (in part) working out an idea that was at one point conceived but quickly left out of the production scope. Then, the DLC provides a good possibility to revisit that idea and work it out. As such, traces that refer to the DLC idea can surface without it indicating the work has already been done. Software development is a continuous process of considering which features are possible, which are necessary, and which are going to be shipped and which abandoned (at different stages of completion). The idea of the Ireland (I think?) featuring as the Isle of Armor in the Galar region could definitely have existed, but have been taken out of the scope early in the development process.
Right Right, I wasn't saying it confirms it, just stating that the ONLY piece of evidence I can see at all is about them trying to think of it when the game was still in production.

I wasn't trying to say it 100% points to it being factual but just how someone COULD deduce based on knowing the data beforehand. All in all though to me I still have more issues with what the game was released as versus arguing over "schemes" or "plots" to rip off people.

I have a lot of issues with SwSh but can still enjoy a lot of it too, but I feel too often the issues are handwaved and/or treated as asking too much when the game has a lot of problems. I just think arguing about game mechanics and design is more beneficial than going "THEY PLAYED US LIKE A FIDDLE!"
 

Phellps

Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,800
I'd then ask those same developers if they think developing for the PS2 is gonna be the same for the PS5. I'm just bored of all the excuses made for GF at this point, if it's not one thing it's another. People would blame the weather if they could.
Could it be that all of this is playing a part in what happened?
That developing for the Switch requires much more of their time and resources and, therefore, they can't work on a big number of Pokémon like they previously could?
And that they have a strictly planned release pattern and therefore it's not so simple to just delay things?
No one is making up excuses here, people are saying how things usually go with Pokémon. Could it be different? Yes. Will it ever? It's anyone's guess. My original point still stands. No one was wrong for saying that working on all Pokemon was unsustainable, because the way Pokemon as an IP works makes it so, regardless of Game Freak adding another 200 more via patches.
 

Metto

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 27, 2017
12,108
You're kinda contradicting yourself. If you can acknowledge that the game was "rushed and under delivered" then it's not too much of a stretch to see why people would feel like the game is unfinished no? The latter half of the game feels like a straight line and some of the towns don't even feel like towns. I wouldn't blame anyone for saying some of the towns in the game were unfinished so I can see why they'd say the game itself is unfinished.

If I paid for a game I felt was bare bones popped out with new DLC in the works a couple months later my initial grievances don't just disappear lol.
Sure but then we get to why the accusations of the expansion pass selling back held back content being ridiculous.

What we're getting is two new areas with their own mini campaigns and objectives. The DLC isn't making Spikemuth into a city, or making Rose Tower into a dungeon, or adding scenes to flesh out the villains and putting them behind a paywall. At most you could say that these would've been nice for post game but I doubt whatever these would be would've been fleshed out as much if they weren't DLC.
 
Oct 25, 2017
3,814
Holy shit this has got to be a parody post or something lol, no way you're being serious, right?
This basically reads as "Hey guys it's ok if companies lie to us in our faces because they're covering their business strategies and will surprise us, so let them lie".
Ultimately the stuff GF revealed today is good news, but please let's not turn into brainless robots for no reason.

It's not okay. But it happens everywhere all the time. Just how it is. And for something as trivial as pokemon (relative to the grand scheme of things) I'm okay with this.

Same reason why I have to come in in time but my bosses can slide in later. It's not okay. It's not fair. But you can go to HR if you want to if that's a hill you want to die on.
 

karmitt

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,818
I suspect/hope they will go in more heavily on the concept of wild areas. I felt with Shield that they used traditional routes for much of the game out of fear of negative backlash.

I really hope you're right. if they focus on creating an entire experience around the wild area, I might actually enjoy this dlc more than the main game.

I'm not hyped for this yet, but I could see myself getting it, which is more than I could have said about 24 hours ago. A new region to play around in is literally all I wanted with BotW DLC, and they didn't remotely deliver there. After that I had kinda similar but slightly lower expectations for whatever this might be, and I'm happy to be proven wrong here - Looks meaty.
 

Deleted member 42102

User requested account closure
Banned
Apr 13, 2018
733
Could it be that all of this is playing a part in what happened?
That developing for the Switch requires much more of their time and resources and, therefore, they can't work on a big number of Pokémon like they previously could?
And that they have a strictly planned release pattern and therefore it's not so simple to just delay things?
No one is making up excuses here, people are saying how things usually go with Pokémon. Could it be different? Yes. Will it ever? It's anyone's guess. My original point still stands. No one was wrong for saying that working on all Pokemon was unsustainable, because the way Pokemon as an IP works makes it so, regardless of Game Freak adding another 200 more via patches.

To be honest, your original point stands as much as mine does.
 

Zedark

Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,719
The Netherlands
My derpy bird boys got a MAKEOVER

8d249fpcmr941.jpg


I love those designs a ton! Zapdos is the worst one, though.

arguably better than the originals
Definitely better imo.
 

Monkey D.

Banned
Oct 31, 2017
2,352
damn iam in. Much better then what they did before. Expansion pass is a great idea and it looks like old pokemon come back. nice.