PlayStation Worldwide Studios |OT Se7en| What's in the box?

PlanetSmasher · Mar 18, 2020

Temascos said:
Yeah, that's one of the things I was thinking too. Only first party games will be able to take full advantage of the SSD speed, so few exclusives (if any) are going to be from third party developers. Why would they not just go with XSX ssd speeds as a standard requirement? Would the tech on PS5 cut down on development costs and time compared to Xbox?

I know Arrogant Sony is a meme and a bit of a dumb one, but they will fall behind if this keeps up. The risk of talent drain at ND, lack of confidence in games staying exclusive and just ending up on PC, it WILL lead people to say "Why should I bother?"

That's the part that's so confusing. Why put all their eggs in one basket that basically requires developers completely rethink how they make games in ways they can't replicate on other hardware? It does feel arrogant, like developers are just gonna go "man I want to play with that SSD" and SKIP the XSX and PC.

No sane publisher would agree to that.

tutomos · Mar 18, 2020

PlanetSmasher said:
That's not really the point. Yes, games will be able to make marginal use of faster hardware for loading times, but that's not meaningful. The kinds of stuff Cerny is talking about WILL NOT BE ACHIEVABLE for cross-platform development because the game's entire core design needs to be built around it. It's not an implementation problem, it's a core game design issue.

We can even get into specifics. Seems like you talking in vague terms.

On Playstation Blog:

"Developers are able to stream assets into PS5 games at an incredibly fast rate, so PS5 play experiences can be seamless and dynamic, with near-instantaneous fast travel through large game worlds."

This part was highlighted by Hideaki Nishino, Senior Vice President, Platform Planning & Management. You think that 3rd party PS5 games won't have what's described above?

tutomos · Mar 18, 2020

PlanetSmasher said:
I'm saying that "fast SSD" isn't that big of a deal. Faster loading times aren't going to change the world. The kinds of pie in the sky stuff Cerny was talking about involves developers completely changing the core design of their games in ways that can't be replicated on other hardware.

The XSX will still need the kind of "load mask" game design we have now because its hard drive won't be able to do what the PS5's can.

What are the "pie in the sky" stuff Cerny was talking about?

PlanetSmasher · Mar 18, 2020

tutomos said:
We can even get into specifics. Seems like you talking in vague terms.

On Playstation Blog:

"Developers are able to stream assets into PS5 games at an incredibly fast rate, so PS5 play experiences can be seamless and dynamic, with near-instantaneous fast travel through large game worlds."

This part was highlighted by Hideaki Nishino, Senior Vice President, Platform Planning & Management. You think that 3rd party PS5 games won't have what's described above?

Not in the way that Cerny and journalists are talking about with removing "load masking" game design portions like slow-walk sections and completely redefining core game design. That stuff has to be coded into games on other hardware because it won't have the PS5's SSD.

All it's going to result in for multiplatform games is faster load screens and less texture pop-in, and neither of those things are THAT big a deal.

Kamaros · Mar 18, 2020

Kanethered said:
This is the proof of marketing failure by Playstation team. No offense to the developers but their opinion isn't more important than average consumers' thought and impression.

except that they make the games and present in a impressive way for the average consumer? would you rather that we were impressed and the actual devs with the devkits not? that yes, would be concerning.

when people see Horizon 2 and Demon's Souls remake they will be blown away and rush to buy Ps5, the specs will be long forgotten.

GamingCJ · Mar 18, 2020

I just realized something:
Trails of Cold Steel 4 and Hajimari will be like #3500 of the most played games on PS4. Sonys wording seems to indicate that BC has to be done/tested manually, which in this case will probably be never.

So I guess I'll have to wait months after those games get a western release on PS4 until NISA releases a regular PS5 port.

Or am I wrong? Please let me be wrong.

BrickArts295 · Mar 18, 2020

I think all this "bad marketing", may allow Sony to see the points of impact for when they actually reveal the console.
ex. What are the consumers confused about and should they focus on?

See this is where I see things differently. Xbox has shown all of their hands, except for more games and a price. Sony still has a a lot of stuff left to show, we haven't even seen the OS or its features. Obviously they could continue to botch it but there's still a lot of time for them to come out on top.

Loudninja · Mar 18, 2020

IonicSnake said:
Sheesh, the hot takes and panic makes me want to stop visiting this site.

I am getting very close to this point too.

Macca · Mar 18, 2020

GamingCJ said:
I just realized something:
Trails of Cold Steel 4 and Hajimari will be like #3500 of the most played games on PS4. The wording seems to indicate that BC has to be done manually by Sony, which in this case will probably be never.

So I guess I'll have to wait months until NISA releases a regular PS5 port.

Or am I wrong? Please let me be wrong.

If that top 100 thing is what we will get at launch. More obscure japanese titles most certainly won't be on there(sadly).

RedHeat · Mar 18, 2020

IonicSnake said:
Sheesh, the hot takes and panic makes me want to stop visiting this site.

Don't worry, reactionists always go back into their holes usually after the first day of a major event.

Tagg · Mar 18, 2020

GamingCJ said:
I just realized something:
Trails of Cold Steel 4 and Hajimari will be like #3500 of the most played games on PS4. Sonys wording seems to indicate that BC has to be done manually by Sony, which in this case will probably be never.

So I guess I'll have to wait months until NISA releases a regular PS5 port.

Or am I wrong? Please let me be wrong.

Every game should work, it's just that select games will be approved to have a boost mode that can improve performance by taking advantage of the PS5's increased horsepower.

shinobi602 · Mar 18, 2020

I get there's disappointment in some of the details today (backwards compatibility) and some weaker aspects compared to Series X, but I'm positive once the public starts seeing things like price, the physical system itself, launch titles and other games coming to the platform and how great they look, this will all be a fleeting memory. It's just a waiting game now.

Gajeel23 · Mar 18, 2020

Ombala said:
Why PS5 magicly enhance it? I must have missed that.

They didn't, but they didn't say what are those 100 games as well. So one can dream.

poklane · Mar 18, 2020

shinobi602 said:
I get there's disappointment in some of the details today (backwards compatibility) and some weaker aspects compared to Series X, but I'm positive once the public starts seeing things like price, the physical system itself, launch titles and other games coming to the platform and how great they look, this will all be a fleeting memory. It's just a waiting game now.

Hopefully it wont be too long until we start seeing some of that stuff, but I can't say I have good hopes of that happening. And something you didn't mention, but we need details on cross-gen cross-boy ASAP. People need to know if they get the PS5 version of a game at no extra costs if they go out and buy the PS4 version.

Deleted member 5725 · Mar 18, 2020

GamingCJ said:
I just realized something:
Trails of Cold Steel 4 and Hajimari will be like #3500 of the most played games on PS4. The wording seems to indicate that BC has to be done manually by Sony, which in this case will probably be never.

So I guess I'll have to wait months until NISA releases a regular PS5 port.

Or am I wrong? Please let me be wrong.

The specifics are unclear but that's how many people read it. Sony needs to clear things up how it's going to be.

Deleted member 887 · Mar 18, 2020

shinobi602 said:
I get there's disappointment in some of the details today (backwards compatibility) and some weaker aspects compared to Series X, but I'm positive once the public starts seeing things like price, the physical system itself, launch titles and other games coming to the platform and how great they look, this will all be a fleeting memory. It's just a waiting game now.

yup

Imitation Of Life · Mar 18, 2020

PlanetSmasher said:
I'm saying that "fast SSD" isn't that big of a deal. Faster loading times aren't going to change the world. The kinds of pie in the sky stuff Cerny was talking about involves developers completely changing the core design of their games in ways that can't be replicated on other hardware.

The XSX will still need the kind of "load mask" game design we have now because its hard drive won't be able to do what the PS5's can.

Not really. The reason games have load masking is because fast SSDs are not standard now. Not because they were not fast enough. Sony just went above and beyond what any one expected. Will will see if that money would have been better spend elsewhere. As you said only permanent exclusives will utilize it.

Macca · Mar 18, 2020

Tagg said:
Every game should work, it's just that select games will be approved to have a boost mode that can improve performance by taking advantage of the PS5's increased horsepower.

We thought that at first, but PS Blog seems to suggest it is not the case unfortunately.

Zukkoyaki · Mar 18, 2020

shinobi602 said:
I get there's disappointment in some of the details today (backwards compatibility) and some weaker aspects compared to Series X, but I'm positive once the public starts seeing things like price, the physical system itself, launch titles and other games coming to the platform and how great they look, this will all be a fleeting memory. It's just a waiting game now.

Shinobi our guiding light as always lol. Thanks for the info and optimism, dude!

Nazgûl · Mar 18, 2020

I'm sure if the PS5 had been 12tf no one would be talking about marketing issues. Still a lot of time to "fix" the problem.

tutomos · Mar 18, 2020

PlanetSmasher said:
Not in the way that Cerny and journalists are talking about with removing "load masking" game design portions like slow-walk sections and completely redefining core game design. That stuff has to be coded into games on other hardware because it won't have the PS5's SSD.

All it's going to result in for multiplatform games is faster load screens and less texture pop-in, and neither of those things are THAT big a deal.

Still very vague to me. I will rewatch the whole thing again but I have a feeling what Cerny said isn't what you make it out to be.

PlanetSmasher · Mar 18, 2020

Tagg said:
Every game should work, it's just that select games will be approved to have a boost mode that can improve performance by taking advantage of the PS5's increased horsepower.

That's incorrect - the PS Blog made it clear that the 100 games they mentioned were the ones supporting BC at all at launch. Their messaging has been so cloudy and stupid on this it hurts to watch.

Imitation Of Life said:
Not really. The reason games have load masking is because fast SSDs are not standard now. Not because they were not fast enough. Sony just went above and beyond what any one expected. Will will see if that money would have been better spend elsewhere. As you said only permanent exclusives will utilize it.

Pretty much. It's a lot of hooting and hollering over a feature a micro-fraction of games will even use, which is disappointing. The PS5 really has nothing else to be excited about so I guess that's why they focused so hard on it.

Deleted member 887 · Mar 18, 2020

Tagg said:
Every game should work, it's just that select games will be approved to have a boost mode that can improve performance by taking advantage of the PS5's increased horsepower.

that wasn't the language used. They just tested 100 games based on playtime and they worked. I assume most games will work but they want to test them out first in case some games just aren't compatible

Ombala · Mar 18, 2020

Gajeel23 said:
They didn't, but they didn't say what are those 100 games as well. So one can dream.

What I mean is that PS5 might just run PS4 games like a pro, no higher resolution or framerates we don't know.

Deleted member 864 · Mar 18, 2020

shinobi602 said:
I get there's disappointment in some of the details today (backwards compatibility) and some weaker aspects compared to Series X, but I'm positive once the public starts seeing things like price, the physical system itself, launch titles and other games coming to the platform and how great they look, this will all be a fleeting memory. It's just a waiting game now.

Thanks Shinobi.

Infernostew · Mar 18, 2020

shinobi602 said:
I get there's disappointment in some of the details today (backwards compatibility) and some weaker aspects compared to Series X, but I'm positive once the public starts seeing things like price, the physical system itself, launch titles and other games coming to the platform and how great they look, this will all be a fleeting memory. It's just a waiting game now.

Honestly, they should've went with that first..

tutomos · Mar 18, 2020

Imitation Of Life said:
Not really. The reason games have load masking is because fast SSDs are not standard now. Not because they were not fast enough. Sony just went above and beyond what any one expected. Will will see if that money would have been better spend elsewhere. As you said only permanent exclusives will utilize it.

Bookmarked.

Deleted member 887 · Mar 18, 2020

PlanetSmasher said:
That's incorrect - the PS Blog made it clear that the 100 games they mentioned were the ones supporting BC at all at launch. Their messaging has been so cloudy and stupid on this it hurts to watch.

Pretty much. It's a lot of hooting and hollering over a feature a micro-fraction of games will even use, which is disappointing. The PS5 really has nothing else to be excited about so I guess that's why they focused so hard on it.

lmao terrible doom and gloom here. Everyone included devs are excited for the SSD.

John Frost · Mar 18, 2020

shinobi602 said:
I get there's disappointment in some of the details today (backwards compatibility) and some weaker aspects compared to Series X, but I'm positive once the public starts seeing things like price, the physical system itself, launch titles and other games coming to the platform and how great they look, this will all be a fleeting memory. It's just a waiting game now.

Shinobi, my man.

PlanetSmasher · Mar 18, 2020

Boke18 said:
lmao terrible doom and gloom here. Everyone included devs are excited for the SSD.

Why am I supposed to be excited over a feature that will only see meaningful use on exclusive first party games when Sony has completely stopped making exclusive games that appeal to me?

TsuWave · Mar 18, 2020

lapsu said:
Not dropping 400-500€ for a console that has underwhelming performance

it does?

nolifebr · Mar 18, 2020

So, Horizon 2 at launch is a must now, right?

Chopin the Third · Mar 18, 2020

shinobi602 said:
I get there's disappointment in some of the details today (backwards compatibility) and some weaker aspects compared to Series X, but I'm positive once the public starts seeing things like price, the physical system itself, launch titles and other games coming to the platform and how great they look, this will all be a fleeting memory. It's just a waiting game now.

I agree. That said, this BC situation is my only issue, and it's a big one. I don't care about PS1-3, but PS4 BC is important as I've invested heavily in this ecosystem over the years. They need to clear things up.

asd202 · Mar 18, 2020

Imitation Of Life said:
Not really. The reason games have load masking is because fast SSDs are not standard now. Not because they were not fast enough. Sony just went above and beyond what any one expected. Will will see if that money would have been better spend elsewhere. As you said only permanent exclusives will utilize it.

Now imagine if Sony will start doing more PC games. That SSD will not even be that big of a deal considering the game would have to run on what will be on those PC's.

GamingCJ · Mar 18, 2020

McMoneyman said:
If that top 100 thing is what we will get at launch. More obscure japanese titles most certainly won't be on there(sadly).

Tagg said:
Every game should work, it's just that select games will be approved to have a boost mode that can improve performance by taking advantage of the PS5's increased horsepower.

Astrochelys said:
The specifics are unclear but that's how many people read it. Sony needs to clear things up how it's going to be.

The wording on PS Blog seems clearer than Cerny was:

'We recently took a look at the top 100 PS4 titles as ranked by play time, and we're expecting almost all of them to be playable at launch on PS5. With more than 4000 games published on PS4, we will continue the testing process and expand backwards compatibility coverage over time.'

To me that clearly means that only up to 100 games will work at PS5 launch, with more being added over time.

gundamkyoukai · Mar 18, 2020

PlanetSmasher said:
I'm saying that "fast SSD" isn't that big of a deal. Faster loading times aren't going to change the world. The kinds of pie in the sky stuff Cerny was talking about involves developers completely changing the core design of their games in ways that can't be replicated on other hardware.

The XSX will still need the kind of "load mask" game design we have now because its hard drive won't be able to do what the PS5's can.

You don't have to change your core design in certain aspect like texture streaming , pop in problems or loading data in and out the ram .
Those things that are done with the engine that scale with speed .
I am not expecting anyone to change there core design but engines will soon be made around the SSD and Sony faster SSD will have the benefits of that .
It will be more than loading but it also not some huge game changer .

Bundy · Mar 18, 2020

shinobi602 said:
I get there's disappointment in some of the details today (backwards compatibility) and some weaker aspects compared to Series X, but I'm positive once the public starts seeing things like price, the physical system itself, launch titles and other games coming to the platform and how great they look, this will all be a fleeting memory. It's just a waiting game now.

Feels like the price won't be a win for them either. This needs to be $399, but it kinda looks like it will be $499. The same price as the XSX imho.

It's on Sony. People aren't happy and one of the reasons is Sony's bad communication. Now they have to deal with it. And they need to change. Asap.

Gero · Mar 18, 2020

I probably still get the PS5 because i want to play the 1st party games but still really disappointed, not just the spec, but the whole messaging and current PR

Evolved1 · Mar 18, 2020

shinobi602 said:
I get there's disappointment in some of the details today (backwards compatibility) and some weaker aspects compared to Series X, but I'm positive once the public starts seeing things like price, the physical system itself, launch titles and other games coming to the platform and how great they look, this will all be a fleeting memory. It's just a waiting game now.

Well thankfully so far they've been on point with messaging and really transparent so i'm sure the wait won't be excruciatingly long and tone def.

Daebo · Mar 18, 2020

shinobi602 said:
I get there's disappointment in some of the details today (backwards compatibility) and some weaker aspects compared to Series X, but I'm positive once the public starts seeing things like price, the physical system itself, launch titles and other games coming to the platform and how great they look, this will all be a fleeting memory. It's just a waiting game now.

are you saying ps5 is cheaper than series x? And that 3rd party games will look better on ps5?

I think we saw the physical form already. One of the slides today had the ps5 logo on an x looking form which resembles the "leak" form from a few weeks ago that looked like an X.

Deleted member 23046 · Mar 18, 2020

I guess the (full) reveal will be planned around april-may, now that all the Europe is under a medical tent for a mont at least.

Jayembi · Mar 18, 2020

PlanetSmasher said:
Why am I supposed to be excited over a feature that will only see meaningful use on exclusive first party games when Sony has completely stopped making exclusive games that appeal to me?

You may be less than thrilled and disappointed with the PS5 as much as you like, but don't try to evangelize the rest with that your look has to be standard for everyone. There are some of us who are really excited and it doesn't depend on what difference there is of specifications with the competition.

PlanetSmasher · Mar 18, 2020

Jayembi said:
You may be less than thrilled and disappointed with the PS5 as much as you like, but don't try to evangelize the rest with that your look has to be standard for everyone. There are some of us who are really excited and it doesn't depend on what difference there is of specifications with the competition.

Do what you want. The point is that at the end of the day they have to sell this to as many people as possible and their marketing is doing a terrible job of telling anyone who wasn't already on board with buying a PS5 why they HAVE to get one.

I have been waiting MONTHS for Sony to give me even a hint of why I should bother with their console next gen, and this announcement has changed nothing.

SolidSnakex · Mar 18, 2020

Bundy said:

I hope that with ND doing these posts regularly now that it means that PII is still on track. With Jason saying anything after April being up in the air my mind immediately went to PII. Although that's mainly because it's the game I want most right now.

tutomos · Mar 18, 2020

Imagine GTA VI with larger, richer worlds without traditional limitations. Seamless and dynamic, with near-instantaneous travel.

Sounds like Cerny made the right decision.

Loudninja · Mar 18, 2020

SolidSnakex said:
I hope that with ND doing these posts regularly now that it means that PII is still on track. With Jason saying anything after April being up in the air my mind immediately went to PII. Although that's mainly because it's the game I want most right now.

It hard to say as thing gets worse each day. I guess they can do what SE did,but wont to be hard to market during this time?

tutomos · Mar 18, 2020

PlanetSmasher said:
Do what you want. The point is that at the end of the day they have to sell this to as many people as possible and their marketing is doing a terrible job of telling anyone who wasn't already on board with buying a PS5 why they HAVE to get one.

I have been waiting MONTHS for Sony to give me even a hint of why I should bother with their console next gen, and this announcement has changed nothing.

Poll got closed had PS5 leading by a healthy margin.

Looks like this helped them actually. Just not you.

N.Domixis · Mar 18, 2020

PlanetSmasher said:
Do what you want. The point is that at the end of the day they have to sell this to as many people as possible and their marketing is doing a terrible job of telling anyone who wasn't already on board with buying a PS5 why they HAVE to get one.

I have been waiting MONTHS for Sony to give me even a hint of why I should bother with their console next gen, and this announcement has changed nothing.

There's nothing to change, been day one since day one.

PlanetSmasher · Mar 18, 2020

tutomos said:
Imagine GTA VI with larger, richer worlds without traditional limitations. Seamless and dynamic, with near-instantaneous travel.

Sounds like Cerny made the right decision.

You're really going to be disappointed at the end of the day if you think the PS5 version is going to be bigger or more dynamic than the XSX version.

Kamaros · Mar 18, 2020

shinobi602 said:
I get there's disappointment in some of the details today (backwards compatibility) and some weaker aspects compared to Series X, but I'm positive once the public starts seeing things like price, the physical system itself, launch titles and other games coming to the platform and how great they look, this will all be a fleeting memory. It's just a waiting game now.

thank you for the guiding light! honestly the overreaction and fearmongering here is just tiring and makes me drop this site.

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