Phil Spencer on Bethesda exclusivity: “I don’t have to ship games on any other platform to make that deal work for us. Whatever that means.”

Landy828 · Oct 16, 2020

PlanetSmasher said:
This gen's consoles are just too expensive. If their base models were both 300 bucks you wouldn't hear nearly as many complaints from me. But a thousand dollars to have both, plus their own individual parasite online taxes, is too damn to ask when they still overlap so much.

Instead, if you want an affordable console, you have to sign away your right to trade in or lend out games and do all your business through miserable digital storefronts. And in Xbox's case, you have to take a massive hardware power downgrade in the process.

There really is no ideal way to play anymore unless you're rich as shit.

I bought a $900 PC and added a graphics card to it over the summer when I was 16 back in 1999. That was just flipping burgers at McDonald's three times a week and on the weekends. Granted that's in the US, so options like that may not be available everywhere.

A Xbox Series X and a year of Game Pass is way cheaper than that, especially after you throw in inflation.

Now if you have bills to pay and almost no income then yes it's expensive. (And in some countries of course the prices are ridiculous)

Total Cereal · Oct 16, 2020

JomanC137 said:
How can you even say it's a worse value when you don't know it's not a streaming only service?

Because I didn't know that it's not a streaming only service? I haven't owned a PS4 since 2014 and PS Now is almost never talked about, so I apologize for my ignorance.

Bede-x · Oct 16, 2020

Well, he's right that the deal could work in any number of ways without other platforms, but this didn't make us any wiser as to the way it actually will work out. And naturally the section ends with what we already knew:

For now, Spencer has said that platforms for future ZeniMax games will be determined on a case-by-case basis. And even if they make the games multiplatform, Spencer's team can still boast an advantage: ZeniMax's games could be sold at full price on PlayStation but offered at a large discount on the Xbox platform as part of the $10/month Game Pass subscription, a killer deal that already grants players launch day access to every new Microsoft-published game.

Having the games day one on Game Pass, but still releasing on Playstation is certainly not the same as going full exclusive, so the reporter should have been much more direct: "What does case-by-case mean? So you can't actually confirm that the games will be Xbox ecosystem exclusive?"

JomanC137 · Oct 16, 2020

Total Cereal said:
Because I didn't know that it's not a streaming only service? I haven't owned a PS4 since 2014 and PS Now is almost never talked about, so I apologize for my ignorance.

All right all right, sorry didn't mean to come off so agressive

Bigjig · Oct 16, 2020

It's interesting to see how it plays out. On the one hand keeping Bethesda games exclusive will absolutely result in more Xbox sales. On the other, not releasing on playstation and releasing Bethesda on game pass day one I would imagine would result in a massive drop in sales of those games. I'm guessing a game pass price hike would follow in that scenario.

FacelessSamurai · Oct 16, 2020

Bigjig said:
It's interesting to see how it plays out. On the one hand keeping Bethesda games exclusive will absolutely result in more Xbox sales. On the other, not releasing on playstation and releasing Bethesda on game pass day one I would imagine would result in a massive drop in sales of those games. I'm guessing a game pass price hike would follow in that scenario.

Losing game sales could in exchange turn into increasing Game Pass subscribers and those long terms might be a lot more lucrative to MS.

Bigjig · Oct 16, 2020

FacelessSamurai said:
Losing game sales could in exchange turn into increasing Game Pass subscribers and those long terms might be a lot more lucrative to MS.

Sure if you can keep em. Skyrim sold over 30 million copies across all platforms, so that's a lot of ground they have to make up for though

FacelessSamurai · Oct 16, 2020

Bigjig said:
Sure if you can keep em. Skyrim sold over 30 million copies across all platforms, so that's a lot of ground they have to make up for though

But not all of those copies were sold full price. They might still sell 15 million as not everyone wants a subscription service. Some will start paying for Gamepass and later on might not renew but then buy ES6 on sale for 10-15$. People with Gamepass still buy games and not everyone is a full time subscriber and when they realize they still want to play the game they'll still end up buying it. Gamepass is only an option but it's pretty good one!

Nida · Oct 16, 2020

I read that quote as Spencer saying the deal makes sense even if they were only selling games for Xbox. That's an option. But the emphasis on not wanting to take games away from gamers makes me think they are open to releasing games on other platforms and taking the extra money.

ThatNerdGUI · Oct 16, 2020

Not surprising. Right now what MS cares the most is the monthly active users (which in general will spend more money in their ecosystem) over single sales in or outside their ecosystem. That being said, don't hold your breath hoping for future games to come to any platform outside their ecosystem.

Quellyford · Oct 16, 2020

Bigjig said:
It's interesting to see how it plays out. On the one hand keeping Bethesda games exclusive will absolutely result in more Xbox sales. On the other, not releasing on playstation and releasing Bethesda on game pass day one I would imagine would result in a massive drop in sales of those games. I'm guessing a game pass price hike would follow in that scenario.

Honestly, I don't think it would drop in sales. If anything, Bethesda being under Xbox might help their sales than if they tried to continue operating independently. Xbox is mobile, PC and console. Those three combined outnumber what Playstation offers pretty substantially (mainly mobile).

Like others said, if you don't have Game Pass on your platform, you aren't going to get Bethesda games.

gremlinz1982 · Oct 16, 2020

Markratos said:
Check out Demon's Souls gameplay for PS5 ...

Microsoft has opened Pandora's box by buying a third and leaving millions of players without their games. Sony and other big companies are going to do the same. I know it hurts, but it's a trend that Microsoft has started.

Sony bought Psygnosis, a publisher when they first got into gaming.

Marcus Aurelius · Oct 16, 2020

Timed exclusives all around

overthewaves · Oct 16, 2020

Not sure if its been posted yet. Stolen from PS5 subreddit.

Deleted member 70824 · Oct 16, 2020

So... you're saying there's a chance...?

Godzilla24 · Oct 16, 2020

When starfield is announced and exclusive only to xbox platform. It's gonna be a megaton all over again. Drawing all this out keeps this huge acquisition in the news and more advertisement for Xbox all over again. Absolute geniuses by MS.

Viceratops · Oct 16, 2020

"I don't want to take games away from players, they can play Elder Scrolls on their phone if they want to play Bethesda games still." Is what he should say.

but hey, at least he's an honest snake.

leecming · Oct 17, 2020

lol too bad the geniuses at MS didn't schedule their purchase of a publisher so they had games to launch their new console with

The Lord of Cereal · Oct 17, 2020

Honestly though, I don't get the questioning about releasing on PS5. If Sony or Nintendo bought out Zenimax, then there would be no doubt the games would be exclusive from now on, with maybe some hope of them supporting PC.

PS5 support happen for sure, but it'll be limited and probably only for certain games like another MMO or smaller scale games if I had to guess. But the big AAA single player experiences that the Bethesda studios are known for will almost certainly stay exclusives.

TaterTots · Oct 17, 2020

PlanetSmasher said:
This gen's consoles are just too expensive. If their base models were both 300 bucks you wouldn't hear nearly as many complaints from me. But a thousand dollars to have both, plus their own individual parasite online taxes, is too damn to ask when they still overlap so much.

Instead, if you want an affordable console, you have to sign away your right to trade in or lend out games and do all your business through miserable digital storefronts. And in Xbox's case, you have to take a massive hardware power downgrade in the process.

There really is no ideal way to play anymore unless you're rich as shit.

I mean, Xbox has All Access, which is pretty affordable. The S might be weaker than the X, but its $299. With holiday sales, it wont be too long until its $199. That's pretty affordable in the gaming space. The trade off is digital only though and I can understand why one would not like that, but if you factor in getting the console for under $200 and just signing up for GP whenever a game comes out you want to play, it makes up for it.

TaterTots · Oct 17, 2020

Also, why do people keep talking about recouping cost? Microsoft bought Bethesda. They will wake up and poop 7.5 billion.

They want to entice people to subscribe to their Game Pass service. Subscriptions could drop, but I think its obvious that's why their making these acquisitions. To keep people signed up.

Shoshi · Oct 17, 2020

Good to know.

I'm wondering how Shinji Mikami and 100% trophy achiever John Johanas on Tango Gameworks is going to coupe with this. I always feared something sinister would come to Tango with them being owned by an American company ZenoMax. Hope Tango get enough funds and incentives to create fantastic games. But I really hope they leave Zeni soon and start a new independent studio ;____;

But I will have a PC ready besides my Mac. I have no use for a second game console.

W.S. · Oct 17, 2020

Shoshi said:
Good to know.

I'm wondering how Shinji Mikami and 100% trophy achiever John Johanas on Tango Gameworks is going to coupe with this. I always feared something sinister would come to Tango with them being owned by an American company ZenoMax. Hope Tango get enough funds and incentives to create fantastic games. But I really hope they leave Zeni soon and start a new independent studio ;____;

But I will have a PC ready besides my Mac. I have no use for a second game console.

So Zenimax + Microsoft = Evil owners & Shinji Mikami needs to escape before it's too late?

gremlinz1982 · Oct 17, 2020

Rental said:
My thoughts with a long term strategies in mind:

If sony dominates this gen in sales..

Microsoft jumps to software and content only next gen

Sony then allows gamepass on their system at this point, Microsoft will dedicate all efforts to software/content and not worry about hardware battles...

Focusing on software and content on as many platforms is the ultimate goal. This will be cheaper for Microsoft as well as all they need to do is make games and not research and develop hardware.

This leads into a battle they will have with other services/content creators similar to game pass they will need to compete against.

They don't want to be fighting a long-term hardware battle while pushing gamepass in my opinion. If their vision is to have gamepass on as many platforms as possible for subscribers, they don't want to look at Sony or Nintendo as competitors.

Microsoft will always have hardware. Too many people game on console for them to give that up as an access point.

KeRaSh said:
I mean technically that would depend on where they would potentially make the most money. At the end of the day Microsoft is a company that wants to make money and create value for shareholders. If they bought a publisher for a ton of money and then lost a ton of sales by limiting the revenue streams then shareholders might get pissed.
Not saying that will be the case but Microsoft does not only exist to push Xbox and hinder Sony. If they don't make enough money and GamePass subs start stagnating after making this deal then they will look for ways to make that money back.

Shareholders will care about growth in the gaming unit. Giving up money to grow has been a viable business tactic for decades across different industries.

PlanetSmasher · Oct 17, 2020

TaterTots said:
I mean, Xbox has All Access, which is pretty affordable. The S might be weaker than the X, but its $299. With holiday sales, it wont be too long until its $199. That's pretty affordable in the gaming space. The trade off is digital only though and I can understand why one would not like that, but if you factor in getting the console for under $200 and just signing up for GP whenever a game comes out you want to play, it makes up for it.

I can honestly say I would never spend money on a console where I can't own the games I play on the thing. It's just not how I operate. You want me to sign up for your subscription service where I surrender all ownership, fine - give me the console for free, then. The whole subscription model is effectively a tax already.

I know that sounds silly, but I just see zero value in a console that only plays digital games, especially in a world of bandwidth caps and insanely awful refund systems.

TaterTots · Oct 17, 2020

PlanetSmasher said:
I can honestly say I would never spend money on a console where I can't own the games I play on the thing. It's just not how I operate. You want me to sign up for your subscription service where I surrender all ownership, fine - give me the console for free, then. The whole subscription model is effectively a tax already.

I know that sounds silly, but I just see zero value in a console that only plays digital games, especially in a world of bandwidth caps and insanely awful refund systems.

I understand your position. I think playing on PC for so long I've been conditioned for it. Really does look like you just might miss out on Bethesda games then if you aren't able to bend for anything. Is what it is I guess.

gremlinz1982 · Oct 17, 2020

PlanetSmasher said:
It's just a shame Microsoft thought that the best way to respond to a stupid timed exclusivity deal was with ultra-aggressive permanent exclusivity of an entire publisher.

Because yes, this is only going to get worse. And when Sony counters with a publisher of their own we'll see all the same complaints from the Xbox side.

And when Google, Apple or Amazon decides to eat a publisher, EVERYONE will be mad. This road only ends in disappointment.

Microsoft is building a subscription service; the one business model that gaming has not fully embraced. To attain a quality service, they need content and the best way to gain that is to own IP and studios.

We were only ever going to see more mergers, more acquisitions going forward when it comes to gaming.

People also sadly behave as if this is new. Sony bought a publisher before, they were looking to buy Leyou too.

vestan · Oct 17, 2020

leecming said:
lol too bad the geniuses at MS didn't schedule their purchase of a publisher so they had games to launch their new console with

Their 2021 is gonna be crazy tho, Sony too, so ultimately I don't think it matters

Deleted member 68874 · Oct 17, 2020

Lots of people are in for a surprise when Starfield's platforms are announced lol.

OtterX · Oct 17, 2020

bsigg said:
In the same interview, he kinda said that ports to Switch are done.

The only reason Cuphead and Ori are on Switch is because Moon/MDHR wanted it to happen and MS wanted to keep a good relationship with those studios.

FacelessSamurai · Oct 17, 2020

PlanetSmasher said:
I can honestly say I would never spend money on a console where I can't own the games I play on the thing. It's just not how I operate. You want me to sign up for your subscription service where I surrender all ownership, fine - give me the console for free, then. The whole subscription model is effectively a tax already.

I know that sounds silly, but I just see zero value in a console that only plays digital games, especially in a world of bandwidth caps and insanely awful refund systems.

Good thing MS let's you buy all your games, physically or digitally!

also, let's not pretend we live in a world of bandwidth caps. The only place in the world where they still exist is the USA. Look north and south of the border, no bandwidth caps. Go to Europe or Asia, again it's a non issue. The world is definitely ready for it!

MiDoZ · Oct 17, 2020

Shoshi said:
Good to know.

I'm wondering how Shinji Mikami and 100% trophy achiever John Johanas on Tango Gameworks is going to coupe with this. I always feared something sinister would come to Tango with them being owned by an American company ZenoMax. Hope Tango get enough funds and incentives to create fantastic games. But I really hope they leave Zeni soon and start a new independent studio ;____;

But I will have a PC ready besides my Mac. I have no use for a second game console.

Cringe.

Paulogy · Oct 17, 2020

I think they can release games on their systems initially, and whenever they feel like it later (ie. when sales begin to dip) they could release on PlayStation/Switch. Makes sense.

Deleted member 59 · Oct 17, 2020

Paulogy said:
I think they can release games on their systems initially, and whenever they feel like it later (ie. when sales begin to dip) they could release on PlayStation/Switch. Makes sense.

Issue is, people then get expectant of these releases and decide to skip buying an xbox for fallout 6 and just wait for the "inevitable" ps5 release.

cyrribrae · Oct 17, 2020

PlanetSmasher said:
I can honestly say I would never spend money on a console where I can't own the games I play on the thing. It's just not how I operate. You want me to sign up for your subscription service where I surrender all ownership, fine - give me the console for free, then. The whole subscription model is effectively a tax already.

I know that sounds silly, but I just see zero value in a console that only plays digital games, especially in a world of bandwidth caps and insanely awful refund systems.

Funny enough, if you buy a lot of games, Game Pass isn't actually a bad deal at all. In fact, if you pay for GP console and you buy at least $60 worth of games in any given month, you OWN the game and you spend $2 less thanks to the 20% discount.

Let me say that again. You can spend $10 for GP, $48 after the 20% discount from $60, and that will equate to $58. Now you own the game forever AND you get to play as many other GP games as you want. That could be 1 full price game or two $30 games, which could be halfway covered by just XGS games.

Watership · Oct 17, 2020

Russell said:
Doesn't matter as they will come to PC.

Possum said:
I have it on good authority that everyone has a very capable gaming PC, so yeah, I don't see what the fuss is all about.

This reaction does seems to break the "I don't need an Xbox, I have a PS4/PC" myth. The Bethesda purchase, and Xbox not screwing up starting the generation is making Era super weird.

DeoGame · Oct 17, 2020

FacelessSamurai said:
Good thing MS let's you buy all your games, physically or digitally!

also, let's not pretend we live in a world of bandwidth caps. The only place in the world where they still exist is the USA. Look north and south of the border, no bandwidth caps. Go to Europe or Asia, again it's a non issue. The world is definitely ready for it!

They exist in Canada but unlimited has gotten cheaper.

Adrifi · Oct 17, 2020

leecming said:
lol too bad the geniuses at MS didn't schedule their purchase of a publisher so they had games to launch their new console with

I made a double comment for some reason

Sweep14 · Oct 17, 2020

Bessy67 said:
MS was running out of options if they wanted to stay competitive with Sony though. Sony has been getting more and more aggressive with timed exclusivity deals and MS can't compete with that and get the same kind of deals since no publisher wants to lose out on sales from Playstation customers. Sony beat them down so bad this generation and them keeping their foot on Xbox's neck with the 3rd party timed or full exclusive deals kinda forces MS to bolster their own exclusive content somehow to stay relevant.

MS was running out of options ? I think they could have secured timed exclusives here and there. Those moves would have cost them a lot more than for PS, sure, but I think they have enough money for it.

gremlinz1982 · Oct 17, 2020

Sweep14 said:
MS was running out of options ? I think they could have secured timed exclusives here and there. Those moves would have cost them a lot more than for PS, sure, but I think they have enough money for it.

Timed exclusives do not move the needle unless they are pushing Game Pass.

VaanXSnake · Oct 17, 2020

He don't need too but he's not saying he won't, why would he seat on so much money ?

Dragonyeuw · Oct 17, 2020

I mean, yeah? MS spent 7.5 billion for future installments of some major franchises to be associated with their brand going forward. If that wasn't the endgame I don't see why they wouldn't have just kept that money or at least secured timed exclusivity deals. Elder Scrolls, Fallout and Doom being associated with Xbox going forward is a big deal.

Sweep14 · Oct 17, 2020

gremlinz1982 said:
Timed exclusives do not move the needle unless they are pushing Game Pass.

Then instead of the timed exclusivity, they could have negotiated to get some of the new Bethesda IP to come day 1 on gamepass. They also have enough money for that, no ?

Laver · Oct 17, 2020

VaanXSnake said:
He don't need too but he's not saying he won't, why would he seat on so much money ?

Just imagine how much money Sony would make if they ported God of War to Xbox and PC.

Armaros · Oct 17, 2020

Watership said:
This reaction does seems to break the "I don't need an Xbox, I have a PS4/PC" myth. The Bethesda purchase, and Xbox not screwing up starting the generation is making Era super weird.

it is funny, you saw it all over Before the Zenimax purchase in just about every Xbox or console war thread.
"I don't need Xbox I have a PC since MS is bring their games over on PC"

Oddly enough many people stopped saying that after MS bought Zenimax.

funny that

RedRum · Oct 17, 2020

PlanetSmasher said:
I can honestly say I would never spend money on a console where I can't own the games I play on the thing. It's just not how I operate. You want me to sign up for your subscription service where I surrender all ownership, fine - give me the console for free, then. The whole subscription model is effectively a tax already.

I know that sounds silly, but I just see zero value in a console that only plays digital games, especially in a world of bandwidth caps and insanely awful refund systems.

Bruh. I have been trying to figure you out since the Bethesda being sold to MS thread weeks ago. People have been trying to sell you on getting and Xbox or PC w/ Gamepass if you for sure want to play Bethesda games. Your response is more or less that you really can't afford another console, PC, or subscription service. Then you turn around and say that you never spend money where you don't own the games nor do you see the value in a digital only console, even when it might cost less w/ a subscription service like gamepass. As well as basically saying you're just going to by physical copies of what I assume are PS5 exclusives for $70 a pop. Gonna' be expensive for you regardless for the entire life of the generation.

Tragicomedy · Oct 17, 2020

Bethesda games will only show up on the PS5 if Game Pass is on there.

Do you think Game Pass will ever be on there? I don't.

Xando · Oct 17, 2020

Makes sense. If you want to be the Netflix of gaming you need a steady stream of original content.

No one should be suprised by this. They have been following this strategy for a few years now.

They offer like 2 billion devices to play those game so i don't really see the issue outside some petty console war bullshit

gremlinz1982 · Oct 17, 2020

Sweep14 said:
Then instead of the timed exclusivity, they could have negotiated to get some of the new Bethesda IP to come day 1 on gamepass. They also have enough money for that, no ?

How is that going to establish Game Pass when as a platform it needs IP that differentiates it from others?

Deleted member 8784 · Oct 17, 2020

VaanXSnake said:
He don't need too but he's not saying he won't, why would he seat on so much money ?

You could ask yourself the exact same question with Nintendo. Zelda and Mario on other systems would make an absolute killing. Why are they sitting on so much money? It's all about pulling people into their 'ecosystems'.

I think there's a lot of denial here, I think Bethesda's games are as likely to go to third party as Naughty Dog ones are. You don't spend 7.5b and not utilise every advantage that purchase gives you - especially when the sentiment here and elsewhere was previously "I don't need to enter Xbox land as they have no games I want".

Phil Spencer on Bethesda exclusivity: “I don’t have to ship games on any other platform to make that deal work for us. Whatever that means.”

Prophet of Truth

User requested account closure

#REFANTAZIO SWEEP

Honest Work

The Abominable Showman

#REFANTAZIO SWEEP

Account closed at user request

Deleted member 59

Guest

Chicken Chaser

Attempted to circumvent ban with alt account

Newbie Paper Plane Pilot

User requested account closure