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Hey Please

Avenger
Oct 31, 2017
22,824
Not America
It will be interesting to see how many non-trash tier servile bandwagon chasing YTubers even mention PDP in relation to the greater issue of online radicalization. I think only Hbomberguy has publicly tweeted about it thus far. Presumably a Contrapoints video will follow within the coming months.



In case anyone was wondering...


Essentially akin to that new white supremacist hand gesture save for the fact that given the current battle for YT subscriber count dominance, it is ostensibly more benign.
 

EdibleKnife

Member
Oct 29, 2017
7,723
I think most people probably aren't interested. But the white nationalists sure are.

What people need to understand is they count on that naivety to give them cover and maintain plausible deniability. They've perfected and weaponised it, they brag about it, and they laugh at how people fall for it despite that bragging.
This. If you claim to care about how to stem the tide of bigoted hate and stop the radicalization of people like this xenophobic shooter, it starts with what they consume. To not care is to not actually care about how to change things. It starts at what these people consume, who they idolize and who they gain their rhetoric from. And PDPs list of follows is filled with literally the biggest names in contemporary alt-right white nationalism. These are the people who send out the message in the world to fear minorities, despise and belittle women and degrade LGBTQ+ people. These are the people responsible for building and decimating the very message that reinforces the ideals of the bigots who commit massacres like this as well as those who just vote for and support policies to harm marginalized groups.
 

Hey Please

Avenger
Oct 31, 2017
22,824
Not America
Oh and another point to make about this:



Can people at least admit he's signal boosting the alt right and should be criticised for that?


I don't know if it has already been discussed in this thread before but ideologies of GamerGaters are very much in line with those very to ultra right wing degenerates. "Gamers" of the toxic variety flock to and elevate channels who share their ideologies. I am unequivocally certain that there is a large overlap GG crowd that subscribes to PDP who also subscribe to degenerates like Lauren Southern, Ben Shaprio, Jon Tron, Paul Joseph Watson etc. And as the numbers of subscribers grow for one of these people, there is a great chance that through a few clicks, a certain number of these people will latch on to the other people within the network (i.e. whoever they are following is "Following").

It is literally networking 101 and akin to disease vector.
 

billion

Member
Dec 22, 2017
34
User Banned (2 Weeks): Dismissing the impact an influencer who has consistently supported hate speech
I'm honestly confused as to why 75% of people in this thread is just pointing fingers at pewdiepie. I watched the livestream and yes he uttered the phrase "subscribe to pewdiepie" but half of you clearly haven't watched the stream nor read the entire manifesto. The shooter had such a different agenda that pulling Pewdiepie into this and shouting in caps that pewdiepie is the one to blame is lazy.

Pewdiepie isn't dogshit, isn't complicit. or whatever dumb phrases you guys like to pull out to make the situation more complex.
Pewdiepie is a youtuber like any other just making youtube videos while doing big things for himself and nothing else.

If pewdiepie ever had an agenda to manifest a culture for shootings then he wouldn't be at 90+ million subscribers.

Pewdiepie has 90+ million subscribers because people like games and meme culture to a extent.

People like the shooter are NOT the manifestation of pewdiepie culture. The shooter is a manifestation of someone who couldn't see whats reality and what isn't on the internet and in real life. The man was literally raised from 4chan memes. Not pewdiepie.

I feel like like i'm rambling on here but I'm just stunned that people in this thread can just write vague 5+ worded sentences stating that pewdiepie is the problem.
Like you literally add no value to the discussion except causing threads like mine. More heated arguments and drama. Like wtf
 

L Thammy

Spacenoid
Member
Oct 25, 2017
50,041
Pewdiepie isn't dogshit, isn't complicit. or whatever dumb phrases you guys like to pull out to make the situation more complex.

If pewdiepie ever had an agenda to manifest a culture for shootings then he wouldn't be at 90+ million subscribers.

qpiejauiekjq.jpg


I do agree, however, that this is not a complex situation.
 

EdibleKnife

Member
Oct 29, 2017
7,723
Oh and another point to make about this:



I don't know if it has already been discussed in this thread before but ideologies of GamerGaters are very much in line with those very to ultra right wing degenerates. "Gamers" of the toxic variety flock to and elevate channels who share their ideologies. I am unequivocally certain that there is a large overlap GG crowd that subscribes to PDP who also subscribe to degenerates like Lauren Southern, Ben Shaprio, Jon Tron, Paul Joseph Watson etc. And as the numbers of subscribers grow for one of these people, there is a great chance that through a few clicks, a certain number of these people will latch on to the other people within the network (i.e. whoever they are following is "Following").

It is literally networking 101 and akin to disease vector.
I genuinely can't take how we're still tiptoeing around this shit after Gamergate and the plummet of Jon Tron. We should be wanting the people we watch to really show that they aren't just another bigot in sheeps clothing but somehow we continue to act like these content creators are just innocent people who shouldn't be held accountable for literally having a reach of millions.

I'm honestly confused as to why 75% of people in this thread is just pointing fingers at pewdiepie. I watched the livestream and yes he uttered the phrase "subscribe to pewdiepie" but half of you clearly haven't watched the stream nor read the entire manifesto. The shooter had such a different agenda that pulling Pewdiepie into this and shouting in caps that pewdiepie is the one to blame is lazy.

Pewdiepie isn't dogshit, isn't complicit. or whatever dumb phrases you guys like to pull out to make the situation more complex.
Pewdiepie is a youtuber like any other just making youtube videos while doing big things for himself and nothing else.

If pewdiepie ever had an agenda to manifest a culture for shootings then he wouldn't be at 90+ million subscribers.

Pewdiepie has 90+ million subscribers because people like games and meme culture to a extent.

People like the shooter are NOT the manifestation of pewdiepie culture. The shooter is a manifestation of someone who couldn't see whats reality and what isn't on the internet and in real life. The man was literally raised from 4chan memes. Not pewdiepie.

I feel like like i'm rambling on here but I'm just stunned that people in this thread can just write vague 5+ worded sentences stating that pewdiepie is the problem.
Like you literally add no value to the discussion except causing threads like mine. More heated arguments and drama. Like wtf
This is not just about PDP. Remember Jon Tron? He also had millions of subscribers and was unequivocally a fucking wretched bigot. Being a YTuber doesn't prevent people from having ideals and just because PDP games doesn't mean he doesn't also speak to people. PDP chose to have videos where he invited on Islamophobes like Sharpio and promoted the book of faux-intellectual and alt-right darling Jordan Peterson. Whether PDP has an agenda or not is secondary to the fact that he does make jokes about Jewish genocide, he does use slurs and he doesn't genuinely apologize. This article is literally a rolling list of PDP's fucked up behavior and his fucked up posse. This isn't about PDP telling people to go out and murder. This is about PDP contributing to and promoting the ideals shared by bigots: that it's fine to joke about rape, it's fine to insult black people, it's fine to not take the holocaust seriously. He isn't the only one guilty of this but it's because he has an audience of millions that it becomes important for him to actually be willing to be progressive, think with empathy and speak inclusively. The killer wasn't just a chan memer with a gun. He had intention. An intention to kill Muslims and spread fear into the Muslim community. That mindset doesn't just appear from nowhere. It's cultivated and reinforced by talking heads on YT, Twitter, FB etc. People who don't challenge the mentality of people like the killer and rather reinforce it by telling him over and over again that he should continue to fear and hate and devalue the lives and identities of those different from him.
 

Psittacus

Member
Oct 27, 2017
5,933
People like the shooter are NOT the manifestation of pewdiepie culture. The shooter is a manifestation of someone who couldn't see whats reality and what isn't on the internet and in real life. The man was literally raised from 4chan memes. Not pewdiepie.
Attributing the actions of terrorists to them being delusional is naive and betrays a lack of understanding of their typical psychological makeup
 

Deleted member 18360

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
2,844
i wish i had the confidence of the people who just stroll in here with a scorching hot take that both makes no sense and also dismisses everything in the entire thread

Not to mention, with no sense of irony, stretching a single poorly argued point into several paragraphs, all while claiming everything here is blown up and insubstantial.

Compared to most people here, my posts lack delicacy, but even I have to wonder how the people coming in here to defend PDP could be so bad at this.
 
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Coloursheep

Member
Oct 31, 2017
185
Big oof. Other than the fact that he's an alt-right pseudo intellectual windbag? I remember him saying once that global warming and rising oceans won't be an issue because the people that live on the coasts will just sell their houses and move. 🤔

Slight correction, but that moment of genius logic that you mentioned was Ben "smartest man on the right" Shapiro not Jordan Peterson, though they are both equally shitty.
 

Red Arremer

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
12,259
It's kind of like conservatives saying they're pro free speech. They mean only for themselves. Always look for the asterisks next to any statement.

Yeah.
Just gotta look at Hungary.
Or heck, even here in Austria - basically the moment the right wing government was elected into power, one of the first things they've been doing was discussing out loud in how they want to curb freedom of the press, and a paper leaked where the interior ministry (which is controlled by the far right party) wants to "punish" critical media by denying them interviews, and "reward" ones that applaud them by giving them exclusives.
It's really disgusting.
 
Oct 25, 2017
6,948
Yeah.
Just gotta look at Hungary.
Or heck, even here in Austria - basically the moment the right wing government was elected into power, one of the first things they've been doing was discussing out loud in how they want to curb freedom of the press, and a paper leaked where the interior ministry (which is controlled by the far right party) wants to "punish" critical media by denying them interviews, and "reward" ones that applaud them by giving them exclusives.
It's really disgusting.

Trump wants to investigate SNL for making jokes at his expense, but somehow college campuses struggling with violence stemming from hosting hateful people on their grounds is a bridge too far that demands executive power to allow.
 

Deleted member 6730

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
11,526
To the people in the thread defending PewDiePie even though he's a racist who knowingly created a shitty fanbase that had a terrorist repeating his shitty meme,
 

jviggy43

Banned
Oct 28, 2017
18,184
I thought subscribe to Pewdiepie was meant so he can remain number one on YouTube? I've never taken it like that. He has a lot of fans around the world and even a lot of Indian fans that always say that too.
The irony of this post literally following that image is too much for me, unless youre literally doing exactly what its saying and in that case, gross.
 
Oct 27, 2017
1,970
Thanks for this; I had no idea things were this bad tbh. I tend to think of these people as basement dwellers but you really get a sense of the organisation behind the whole operation from reading this.

Couple this with frat boy culture on one side and the ramifications of austerity on the other, low social mobility, lack of meaningful employment for so many and fucking social media and you have yourself a global problem. Jesus it's depressing.

Also what is up with the women that take part in the alt-right? Not an expert on it obviously (had no idea youtube was quite this bad for example) but how can any woman be red-pilled? I don't get it. The whole thing seems to have misogyny at it's core.

I'm not sure which is worse that PDP could very well be red-pilled or that he's doing all this for his own amusement. I mean quiet frankly he's got to be pilled.

I'm glad I'm not raising kids right now that's for sure, must be a fucking nightmare with this shit out there. You'd be at your wits end if you knew about this.
 

Rutti

Avenger
Oct 29, 2017
206
Also what is up with the women that take part in the alt-right? Not an expert on it obviously (had no idea youtube was quite this bad for example) but how can any woman be red-pilled? I don't get it. The whole thing seems to have misogyny at it's core.

More white women voted Donald "grab them by the pussy" Trump than Hillary. Women can internalize misogyny.
 

Atisha

Banned
Nov 28, 2017
1,331
I think the ok symbol derives from the us president. He does it all the time when at the podium. Proud real proud.
 

Saya

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,972
Was this posted? From last weekend.

Nazi swastikas and 'PewDiePie' sprayed on UK school after New Zealand attack

SEI_57270584.jpg


The graffiti, believed to have appeared this weekend, was removed by council workers, who were joined by Thames Valley Police officers, on Sunday morning.

Horrified Oxford locals have called for action to stop vandals described as 'extremists' from 'destroying the peace' following the incident.

Thames Valley Police say they have launched an investigation following the incident.
 

Nanashrew

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
6,328
I'm glad I've never so much as read anything from the manifesto. When I came into all this, all I knew was the shooter shouted "subscribe to PewDiePie!" and that the guy was also an 8channer. That's all I needed to know to see the connections to this tragedy and the whys and hows. It seems the manifesto only gives people brain worms when all of this is about white supremacy and the ways a white male is radicalized into believing such hatred towards people of another color. Jokes and memes are a funny thing, they can be used for a lot of fun and good laughs, but they can also be used to desensitize you to evils. Something that has been more and more frequent since GamerGate and it becoming a safe banner for neo-nazis to hide under while converting many to white supremacy, to the evolutions and creating stuff like "meme magic" which was used to promote Trump for presidency, using bigoted imagery and phrases, to whatever it is we have now, where it's all just out in the open without anyone hardly even trying to hide their repugnant beliefs in white supremacy. None of these things that PDP and others spout are just "jokes and memes" but the harmful spread of ideals and beliefs, while desensitizing many young minds and shaping them to these beliefs. And PDP and the like have done so with the help of alt-right individuals, showing their audience the way to radicalization. PewDiePie, as a public figure, holds some responsibility for the actions his fanbase does in his name. He is an influencer on YouTube, and an influencer's job is to influence. He has never really done anything to ever curb what his fanbase does in all his years as a YouTuber.

Idiots who come in to try to defend PewDiePie, maybe actually learn something and listen to what people are saying. And for the love of God, read the damn threadmarks.
 

Servbot24

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
43,137
For the "don't blame pdp" crowd - He's obviously not directly responsible, and he didn't give the order for the attack. Obviously he didn't want the attack to happen at all. But he created a community where these types of people are welcome and can thrive. Terror might have found a way without PDP, but he is still responsible for creating a safe space where that type of person can feel welcomed and have their beliefs feel normal. That deserves a LOT of criticism. 'Don't foster white supremacists' should not be too high of a standard to set for content creators.
 
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Jebusman

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,087
Halifax, NS

JonTron currently HAS millions of subscribers. He's just as popular now as he had ever been. He took an extended hiatus and that was it. The people who JonTron exposed himself to as a bigot aren't the same as the people who were subscribed to him, they're indifferent to it all. He gets the same amount of views on videos as he used to.
 
Nov 14, 2017
4,928

'just memes' incoming.

it's likely a feature, not a bug. you can only watch this dude apologize so many times before you have to give up on the idea that it's lack of understanding.

Most likely his solicitor told him to plead guilty, and said he couldn't help him mount any defence. Hopefully the trial judge won't let him grandstand in court and tells him to mount a defence or just shut up.

I bet he'll probably claim it was out of necessity due to the 'Great Replacement'.
 

Artdayne

Banned
Nov 7, 2017
5,015
Pewdiepie probably believes in some of this stuff the evidence is just too strong.

1. When you follow a bunch of anti-sjws or even blatant white nationalists on twitter but do not follow any prominent left leaning people
2. Say the N word multiple times on stream
3. Pay people to hold a "Death to all Jews" sign as a meme along with a couple other sketchy antisemitic things
4. Have Ben Shapiro on your show for the memes

He's not responsible for the shooting or something obviously but when you have an enormous platform you have a responsibility to push back against these white nationalists in your audience not tacitly support them.
 

Lant_War

Classic Anus Game
The Fallen
Jul 14, 2018
23,580
Pewdiepie probably believes in some of this stuff the evidence is just too strong.

1. When you follow a bunch of anti-sjws or even blatant white nationalists on twitter but do not follow any prominent left leaning people
2. Say the N word multiple times on stream
3. Pay people to hold a "Death to all Jews" sign as a meme along with a couple other sketchy antisemitic things
4. Have Ben Shapiro on your show for the memes

He's not responsible for the shooting or something obviously but when you have an enormous platform you have a responsibility to push back against these white nationalists in your audience not tacitly support them.
You forgot that time where he gave a shootout to a literal Nazi YouTube channel
 

EdibleKnife

Member
Oct 29, 2017
7,723
JonTron currently HAS millions of subscribers. He's just as popular now as he had ever been. He took an extended hiatus and that was it. The people who JonTron exposed himself to as a bigot aren't the same as the people who were subscribed to him, they're indifferent to it all. He gets the same amount of views on videos as he used to.
Honestly after he came out and did that Destiny interview, I unsubscribed and put him out of my mind completely. I guess I really should have expected it but it still fucking makes me sick.

All the more so when I watch people like Ross from Game Grumps throw their hat in with PDP when the early years of that channel were literally obliterated because of one half of the original duo being a bigot. I said it earlier but it's frustrating how many people just straight up don't want to watch, work with and support people that are openly and blatantly progressive. Why support people where there's even any vagueness about their ideals? We should want our friends, family and peers to not pussyfoot around when it comes to truly outlining their beliefs in equality and disdain of bigotry.

IMO it's only a matter of time till people like that pull the rug out from under you and reveal their nature. PDP is already on the course to just being another JonTron who hides what they really believe until they suddenly don't want to and then people like Dan and Markiplier will act so shocked as though it wasn't already obvious who PDP was and what he believed.

Edit: mistakenly flipflopped the names and identities of Ross and Dan from Game Grumps.
 
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Bufbaf

Don't F5!
Member
Oct 25, 2017
12,659
Hamburg, Germany
He's not responsible for the shooting or something obviously but when you have an enormous platform you have a responsibility to push back against these white nationalists in your audience not tacitly support them.
You know what? No. I don't buy this anymore. He is partially responsible. He knows damn well what he's talking and posting about, who he's following and whose content he appropriates and amplifies. He MIGHT not be a literal Nazi, and I'm honestly doubting even that, but he didn't give all the shoutouts, links, guest star spots and twitter follows to just anybody. He is responsible. Not him alone, but him as well as others. By his actions and by the deafening silence around his actions. He doesn't get to wash his hands clean from this by claiming he personally didn't make the guy do it, because he did.


edit
All the more so when I watch people like Dan from Game Grumps throw their hat in with PDP
Wait, what?
 
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EdibleKnife

Member
Oct 29, 2017
7,723
I'm gonna go looking for it since it's somewhere in this topic but Ross was among the ranks with Markiplier, Boogie and more in the wake of the tragedy coddling PDP and pulling the whole "You okay man? This must be rough for you" -type stuff on Twitter.
EDIT: Found it:
He's definitely responsible for pandering to nazis, promoting hate speech, harassing T-series, and consistently shit the bed being a racist in sheep clothes. He does all of that. No lies detected lol.



Meanwhile ROSS WHAT THE FUCK



Double Edit: Damnit I knew I was missing something. I continue to mix up both Ross and Dan. Apologies.
 
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Bufbaf

Don't F5!
Member
Oct 25, 2017
12,659
Hamburg, Germany
I'm gonna go looking for it since it's somewhere in this topic but Dan was among the ranks with Markiplier, Boogie and more in the wake of the tragedy coddling PDP and pulling the whole "You okay man? This must be rough for you" -type stuff on Twitter.
EDIT: Found it:


Double Edit: Damnit I knew I was missing something. I continue to mix up both Ross and Dan. Apologies.
Aw man. Arin can't keep his channel dick-free it seems. Glad it wasn't Dan, but yeah this sucks.
 

sph3re

One Winged Slayer
Avenger
Oct 28, 2017
8,403
Aw man. Arin can't keep his channel dick-free it seems. Glad it wasn't Dan, but yeah this sucks.
I think the issue lies in these YouTubers backing PDP to show a sense of community. To go against its biggest star is not only YouTube suicide, but will have you ostracised by other YouTubers (which is probably the same thing, honestly).

Danny doesn't strike me as a "YouTuber" like Arin does. Or Ross. He's a musician who uses YouTube. He's got a career outside of YouTube, and he's probably got no dog in the race regardless. Hell, he even took a jab at Tobuscus for being accused of rape. Danny's cool as shit in my eyes.

Everyone else is just posturing. "We stand behind you, Pewds! Brofist!" No shit. He's got millions of fans. How bad would your views take a hit if you called him out? How much of a "traitor" will you be to the dumpster fire that is the YouTube community if you suggested that its biggest star MAYBE be careful with his words and actions?

If the YouTube community wants to stand in support of PDP, that's their god given right. All that means to me, though, is that the "YouTube community" is fucking worthless.
 

EdibleKnife

Member
Oct 29, 2017
7,723


Damage control mode.

Yep. And I really wish I could believe otherwise. I really wish I could believe that this is a sign of legitimate contrition and legitimate growth and change and not just a desperate attempt to hide the evidence of his beliefs. He really has to do quite a bit more to counter the image of himself he's already put forward. Unfollowing bigots is the easy part. The real change comes from his own behavior and what he uses his platform for.
 

mael

Avenger
Nov 3, 2017
16,812
And he's just keeping BTS as his follows?
I half expected the nitwit to just have 1 follow being the kpop star embroiled in the sex scandal right now.