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Komo

Info Analyst
Verified
Jan 3, 2019
7,110
I posted this in the PC builders thread but I think it actually makes more sense here? I hope it's okay if I post it again to get a wider sample size for feedback
NVLink is better then SLI, but its almost never worth it. No game runs for SLI compat. It just isn't in most developers interests to even support SLI.
 

Bradford

terminus est
Member
Aug 12, 2018
5,423
Perfect! Thanks for the suggestions. I'll save my cash, then. It'd be like 450ish total to get all the pieces to do it, but if games aren't supporting it then who gives a hoot.
 

GreenPastel

Member
Nov 3, 2017
28
i dont know if this is recent thing but all of my games no longer start in exclusive / true fullscreen mode.
It´s always borderless window mode, i can tell because i can see the volume slider. Like this:
https://steamuserimages-a.akamaihd....902/489E5C0DE4E00465727CFB0BDF19D470349A85C2/

I tried to disable fullscreen optimizations, enable/disable scaling mode in NVCP, alt + enter, disabling gaming mode and all other
xbox features in Windows 10

Anyway all games are set as "fullscreen" and have a g-sync monitor but any game i start runs in borderless window mode.

Any other setting i can check which may cause this ?
 

Premium Ghoul

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,359
Australia
i dont know if this is recent thing but all of my games no longer start in exclusive / true fullscreen mode.
It´s always borderless window mode, i can tell because i can see the volume slider. Like this:
https://steamuserimages-a.akamaihd....902/489E5C0DE4E00465727CFB0BDF19D470349A85C2/

I tried to disable fullscreen optimizations, enable/disable scaling mode in NVCP, alt + enter, disabling gaming mode and all other
xbox features in Windows 10

Anyway all games are set as "fullscreen" and have a g-sync monitor but any game i start runs in borderless window mode.

Any other setting i can check which may cause this ?
Which games are doing this? I can see The Long Dark in your screenshot and I'm pretty sure that's a Unity engine game that doesn't support exclusive fullscreen by default.
 

Pargon

Member
Oct 27, 2017
11,988
i dont know if this is recent thing but all of my games no longer start in exclusive / true fullscreen mode.
It´s always borderless window mode, i can tell because i can see the volume slider. Like this:
https://steamuserimages-a.akamaihd....902/489E5C0DE4E00465727CFB0BDF19D470349A85C2/

I tried to disable fullscreen optimizations, enable/disable scaling mode in NVCP, alt + enter, disabling gaming mode and all other
xbox features in Windows 10

Anyway all games are set as "fullscreen" and have a g-sync monitor but any game i start runs in borderless window mode.

Any other setting i can check which may cause this ?
Full-Screen Optimizations do not put games into Borderless Mode.
They use a new mode which bypasses the compositor, just like Exclusive Mode, but still allows it to display things like the volume overlay and switch faster via ALT+TAB.
 

daninthemix

Member
Nov 2, 2017
5,022
Is it possible to STOP Windows from re-arranging my Windows whenever something changes the desktop resolution? Or better yet, is it possible to ban / prevent desktop resolution changes?
 

mintzilla

Member
Nov 6, 2017
582
Canada
can someone explain to me why windows based laptops never have good touchpads? I have owned many laptops over the years and used other for work and never once have i had one where i could say " yes this touchpad works and is acceptable 95+ percent of the time"

macbook touchpads on the other hand have always been good. so what gives? i don't even think its a physical hardware problem anymore but it seems to be driver and software related.

i try to use a mouse as much as i can but sometimes you forget one.
 

BeI

Member
Dec 9, 2017
5,972
Does 1080p look worse on a 4k screen (due to scaling) compared to a native 1080p screen of the same size?


And is it worth getting a cheap 4k freesync monitor for £200?
 

Pargon

Member
Oct 27, 2017
11,988
can someone explain to me why windows based laptops never have good touchpads? I have owned many laptops over the years and used other for work and never once have i had one where i could say " yes this touchpad works and is acceptable 95+ percent of the time"

macbook touchpads on the other hand have always been good. so what gives? i don't even think its a physical hardware problem anymore but it seems to be driver and software related.

i try to use a mouse as much as i can but sometimes you forget one.
Precision Touchpads are said to be on-par with Apple's touchpad support - though few still have such a massive glass touchpad, and they all lack Apple's haptic feedback mechanism.
I've read that some newer touchpads can actually support Precision Touch by replacing the driver, but it's generally a feature you would look for when buying the laptop.
 

Sidewynnder

Member
Feb 6, 2018
35
Any suggestions for a "lapboard" for a gaming laptop with mouse? I am hospitalized quite often due to chronic illness and am searching for a good lapboard to use while there as a lot of my time is spent in a bed. They have bedside tables that roll over, but they are pretty cramped, so I was hoping there might be something more comfortable out there. Also, portability is a consideration as well. Thanks!
 

BeI

Member
Dec 9, 2017
5,972
No, because it's exactly 4x the resolution so fits perfectly. It actually looks better than a native 1080p screen with larger screen sizes, because you avoid the screen door effect due to 4x as many pixels.

It does fit perfectly, but I heard stuff about up scaling making the image look worse with more artifacts, or maybe introducing more input lag because the image has to be scaled.
 

pswii60

Member
Oct 27, 2017
26,654
The Milky Way
It does fit perfectly, but I heard stuff about up scaling making the image look worse with more artifacts, or maybe introducing more input lag because the image has to be scaled.
Are you playing on a TV or monitor. When you look at TV lag tests on rtings there's no additional latency introduced from 1080p to 4k scaling. Most displays scale extremely well too, and some TVs like Panasonics will allow you to scale with nearest neighbour.

In my experience there's only benefits from a 4k display.
 

BeI

Member
Dec 9, 2017
5,972
Are you playing on a TV or monitor. When you look at TV lag tests on rtings there's no additional latency introduced from 1080p to 4k scaling. Most displays scale extremely well too, and some TVs like Panasonics will allow you to scale with nearest neighbour.

In my experience there's only benefits from a 4k display.

Hmm, maybe I should go 4k. Would you say TN or IPS is better for gaming?
 

BeI

Member
Dec 9, 2017
5,972
Always go IPS, or VA. TN is really only if you want absolute performance in terms of response-time and motion-clarity at the expense of picture-quality.

Can't TN monitors usually be adjusted for better picture quality? I feel like there's lots of conflicting / confusing info out there. I am a bit worried about being able to see visible ghosting in the twitchy games I play.
 

Skyfireblaze

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,257
Can't TN monitors usually be adjusted for better picture quality? I feel like there's lots of conflicting / confusing info out there. I am a bit worried about being able to see visible ghosting in the twitchy games I play.

That I do not know but I believe if you pick a VA panel you should be fine. VA is basically a hybrid between TN and IPS in terms of drawbacks and positives and aslong as you have a good panel ghosting shouldn't be an issue. I use a 1ms VA MSI monitor and never see anything of that sort.
 

Rob

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,078
SATX
I have my TV connected to my computer to play games and watch Twitch. My problem is that my TV isn't my main monitor and all games automatically open on the monitor that is the main one in Windows. Is there an easy way to get games to open on my TV automatically? Some apps/games do have the option to change which monitor they are displayed on, but I also run into issues where if I Window a game and move it to the TV and make it go Full Screen again, it changes back to my monitor.
 

Lazybob

Banned
Oct 30, 2017
6,710

BeI

Member
Dec 9, 2017
5,972
The image would be worse without proper scaling. I believe it's called integer scaling. I know one program that can do it for games in windowed mode. Maybe there is a free alternative somewhere. https://store.steampowered.com/app/993090/Lossless_Scaling/

This sounds like something that should be standard at the driver level D:

That I do not know but I believe if you pick a VA panel you should be fine. VA is basically a hybrid between TN and IPS in terms of drawbacks and positives and aslong as you have a good panel ghosting shouldn't be an issue. I use a 1ms VA MSI monitor and never see anything of that sort.

I'll check out VA monitors then :3
 

Skyfireblaze

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,257
This sounds like something that should be standard at the driver level D:



I'll check out VA monitors then :3

Alright do that, I was initially worried with my current VA panel being my first one if the colors and picture-quality are satisfying and upon using it I can say they are. I went into the opposite direction of you though, instead of a 4k 60hz panel I went for 1080p 144hz.

And I tried the Lossless Scaling app before it works great but I agree that totally should exist on a driver-level :(
 

Rean

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,329
pc hardware question:
so i was playing katana zero today when my pc died. since there was no signal on boot and speaker cried about gpu problems, i went ahead and got my old 8600gt instead of gtx770. now when i inserted that into old pci-express slot that didnt work, but my mb has 2 slotss and in the other one it booted.
my guess is that pci-express slot is now toast, but i still dont know if my gtx770 is also toast and i am kinda afraid that it will toast my last working pci-express slot too if i try it now.
so what do i do? is it possible for my gpu to kill pci-express slot or it waas just motherboard failure? should i take the risk? i really dont know

edit: went on to try 770gtx into another slot. it was trying to boot a few times and then gives up with the same beeping error. replaced with my 8600gt and after a few self-checks it worked.

i am assuming it can be either dead gpu or psu issues and card isnt getting enough voltage to fire up. imma try to load it up at work and see if it works at all. first pci-express slot on motherboard is dead for sure i guess since even 8600gt isnt working in it.

if anyone has any idea what can be wrong with the card i'll appreciate any advice

motherboard is p8p67 asus
 
Last edited:

Arkaign

Member
Nov 25, 2017
1,991
pc hardware question:
so i was playing katana zero today when my pc died. since there was no signal on boot and speaker cried about gpu problems, i went ahead and got my old 8600gt instead of gtx770. now when i inserted that into old pci-express slot that didnt work, but my mb has 2 slotss and in the other one it booted.
my guess is that pci-express slot is now toast, but i still dont know if my gtx770 is also toast and i am kinda afraid that it will toast my last working pci-express slot too if i try it now.
so what do i do? is it possible for my gpu to kill pci-express slot or it waas just motherboard failure? should i take the risk? i really dont know

edit: went on to try 770gtx into another slot. it was trying to boot a few times and then gives up with the same beeping error. replaced with my 8600gt and after a few self-checks it worked.

i am assuming it can be either dead gpu or psu issues and card isnt getting enough voltage to fire up. imma try to load it up at work and see if it works at all. first pci-express slot on motherboard is dead for sure i guess since even 8600gt isnt working in it.

if anyone has any idea what can be wrong with the card i'll appreciate any advice

motherboard is p8p67 asus

Without trace multimeter, it's not possible to know for sure, but there are a lot of possibilities here.

Considering the evidence that :

1- The first slot is now dead
2- 770 doesn't work in either slot
3- 8600 worked in 2nd slot

I'm guessing GTX770 died, and it resulted in rogue current going to pins on the PCIe connection in excess of safe levels. PCIe connections have two main types of pins : pins that can carry a nominal amount of power (for supplemental on higher TDP GPUs, or moderate power for less demanding GPUs/NICs/etc, up to 75 watts).

GTX770 uses ~190+W at load, so definitely more power going through the PCB than would be safe if it shorted and went down any of the pins on the connector itself.

The type of failure I'm describing is more catastrophic than usual, but not unknown. Have a friend who just had slot one die on a Ryzen 1200 box, and my son's Lenovo Thinkstation has a dead first slot as well. Luckily in both of these cases the second slot is both physically and wired up as 16x. I had a P8P67 Pro, IIRC I think you have a fully featured second slot as well, though of course it runs in reduced mode if both slots are in use. Depending on how the damage is, it may or may not let you use the second slot in full 16x mode. You can use the program Speccy to find out what mode the GPU and slot are running in.

At a minimum, you will want to do the following :

1- RMA the PSU if any warranty remains. Otherwise, trash it. The vast majority of the time that a GPU fails like this, it's because the PSU surged it. It's just not worth the risk in re-using it, particularly if it is of the same vintage as a P67 Mobo (circa 2011).

2- You will need a new GPU. I'm seeing a lot of great options now both used and new for not a ton of money. Used 770 on Craigslist for $40. Used 1060 3GB on a trusted forum I've been on for 15 years for $90. Or, look at the sales on the RX570/580 cards, or if you can swing it : a GTX1660, which would be a gigantic upgrade. Even waiting for the 1650 (no PCIe power plug required, $129 I believe) would be a nice move up, and very quiet with modern Turing cores (reportedly 1050ti perf).

Hopefully that's enough to get you by. It's definitely time to start thinking about a newer Mobo/CPU though. Going all new here would be pretty expensive, because you need new everything basically. That's why I advise going with a really robust used workstation for budget users. For about $200, I see S30s come through fairly steadily. Usually 6C/12T 2011v2 Xeons with 15MB cache and 40 PCIe lanes, 16GB of DDR3 quad channel (upgradable very cheaply with ECC RDIMMs to 32/64GB, 8 slots!), 610W PSU of extremely robust quality, I have a 1080ti Strix running in one! Extremely overbuilt Mobo with excellent solid state caps. Great networking ICs, USB 3.0, etc. They're just really nice for the price, you just add a GPU, use the W7 Pro key to install 10 Pro legally, and boom, instant very competent system, utterly unbeatable for the price. Obviously a new Ryzen 5/7 or Coffee Lake i7 would be even better, but look for the price on :

Mobo, PSU, 16GB DDR4, windows license, case, DVDRW, etc, you can barely get a reasonable Mobo and PSU alone for $200, let alone a CPU, Ram, windows license, etc. And Quad Channel DDR3 1600 performs basically identical to dual channel DDR4 3200, even a shade better in some respects thanks to lower latency.

Just a thought, in the event you end up needing a box and don't have much of a budget.

Like I said, first steps will be to get a new GPU and PSU to start with, ideally from a vendor where you could return the PSU if you end up not needing it. One thing I wouldn't do is get a nice new GPU and try to run it off the old PSU, risking it, or placing it in the burnt slot 1 on the mobo. The obvious safest route would be not using any of the old PSU/Mobo at all, but I think the risk of the slot 2 is pretty low.

Good luck, definitely not a fun problem to go through.
 

xGrizzly

Member
Dec 3, 2017
1,147
Atlanta
PC Framerate Question:

I got a new build a few months ago and it's real solid (8700K, RTX 2080, etc.) but recently my frame rates have been suspiciously low. GTA V rarely hits 60fps and sticks around 40-50 FPS at 1440p and even Assassin's Creed Brotherhood has texture flickers and stutters. The drop in frames came seemingly from nowhere and I don't suspect it's a driver issue either. I also have two screens connected to my PC, a monitor and 1080p TV but I don't suspect that being the issue.

I just downloaded MSI Afterburner to check on CPU and GPU usage and they seem normal. Anyone go through anything similar?
 

XR.

Member
Nov 22, 2018
6,576
This sounds like something that should be standard at the driver level D:



I'll check out VA monitors then :3

To be honest, you can't beat pixel perfect. 1080p on a 4K monitor won't look as good as on a native 1080p monitor, but it definitely can be pretty good, so it's not really an issue unless you're very picky.

IPS/VA are great but I wouldn't oversell their advantages too much; TN panels are for the most part very decent these days and often a good fit for fast paced games and such. You're probably not going to notice the difference between TN and IPS once you're playing a game - while you probably would notice blackbleed or ghosting pretty often.

Sorry if that doesn't make it any easier. :p There's really no right or wrong here.

PC Framerate Question:

I got a new build a few months ago and it's real solid (8700K, RTX 2080, etc.) but recently my frame rates have been suspiciously low. GTA V rarely hits 60fps and sticks around 40-50 FPS at 1440p and even Assassin's Creed Brotherhood has texture flickers and stutters. The drop in frames came seemingly from nowhere and I don't suspect it's a driver issue either. I also have two screens connected to my PC, a monitor and 1080p TV but I don't suspect that being the issue.

I just downloaded MSI Afterburner to check on CPU and GPU usage and they seem normal. Anyone go through anything similar?
Is this across all games or just a few?
 

xGrizzly

Member
Dec 3, 2017
1,147
Atlanta
Is this across all games or just a few?
Just tested a few at 1440p at max settings,

Resident Evil 2 = 100+ fps
Borderlands 2 = 100+ fps
Devil May Cry 5 = 100+ fps
Division = 75-100fps
R6: Siege = 100+ fps
GTA5 = 45-60 fps
AC Brotherhood = Crashes on setting changes

Also I was looking into using the Nvidia Control Panel for V-Sync. Is it true that the panel is better than in game settings for VSync? Also which should I pick? I see On, Adaptive and Fast as the best options.
 

Pargon

Member
Oct 27, 2017
11,988
PC Framerate Question:

I got a new build a few months ago and it's real solid (8700K, RTX 2080, etc.) but recently my frame rates have been suspiciously low. GTA V rarely hits 60fps and sticks around 40-50 FPS at 1440p and even Assassin's Creed Brotherhood has texture flickers and stutters. The drop in frames came seemingly from nowhere and I don't suspect it's a driver issue either. I also have two screens connected to my PC, a monitor and 1080p TV but I don't suspect that being the issue.

I just downloaded MSI Afterburner to check on CPU and GPU usage and they seem normal. Anyone go through anything similar?
If CPU temperature and clockspeed, as well as GPU utilization and clockspeed all look correct, I'm guessing that it's probably something like having anti-aliasing set too high in the games.
It's a fast GPU, but things like MSAA in engines which use deferred rendering, or supersampling options, are still going to have a significant impact on performance.
How do the games run if you disable anti-aliasing?

Apparently AC: Brotherhood has issues with high VRAM usage, but I don't have the game so I can't verify those claims. https://pcgamingwiki.com/wiki/Assassin's_Creed_Brotherhood#In-game_stuttering.2C_freezing_issues
 

Ouroboros

Member
Oct 27, 2017
12,954
United States
Apologies if this has been answered already, but if I get a cpu + apu Ryzen 3000 series chip, and wait to get a gpu is there any downside to that? Like outside of overclocking would a Ryzen cpu perform better than their apu counterparts?
 

Pargon

Member
Oct 27, 2017
11,988
Apologies if this has been answered already, but if I get a cpu + apu Ryzen 3000 series chip, and wait to get a gpu is there any downside to that? Like outside of overclocking would a Ryzen cpu perform better than their apu counterparts?
The main drawback is that you're trading half of the cores for the GPU with a Ryzen APU. Depending on your workload, that could be a significant difference.

Zen CPUs are built using Core Complexes (CCX) which are basically groups of cores.
Ryzen has up to two CCXes per CPU, Threadripper has up to four CCXes per CPU, and Epyc has up to eight CCXes per CPU.
Currently, a Zen 1 CCX has four CPU cores, and Zen 2 is said to double that to eight cores.

This is how they have been able to massively increase core counts at a lower cost than Intel, since splitting the cores into CCX groups makes them considerably less complicated to manufacture.
Instead of having to manufacture one massive CPU die that has 32 cores with no defects, they can build a lot of 4-core CCXes which are inherently less complex, and pair them together to make a 32-core CPU.
The CCXes which fail can still be sold in lower-end parts. If only 3 of the 4 cores are functional, they can still pair two of them together for a 6-core Ryzen or four of them for a 12-core Threadripper and so on.

With a Ryzen APU one of the CCXes is replaced with a GPU. Since Zen 1 has four cores per CCX, that leaves you with only four CPU cores.
Zen 2 should mean there are eight CPU cores alongside the GPU (which is how the upcoming consoles will be configured).
Having an 8-core CPU with an integrated GPU is still pretty good, but the Zen 2 Ryzen CPUs will have two CCXes and 12 or 16 cores.

Of course there's nothing preventing you from buying an APU now, adding a GPU later, and then replacing the APU with a CPU after that if you want more CPU power.
The nice thing with AMD's platform is that you have options like these. AM4 should theoretically allow someone to have built a system with an APU that has 4-cores ~18 months ago, and swap that out for a 16-core Ryzen CPU later this year without having to change anything else in their system (assuming they now have a GPU).
Intel required people to buy new motherboards to go from 4 cores to 6 on the same platform.
 
Last edited:

Arkaign

Member
Nov 25, 2017
1,991
Apologies if this has been answered already, but if I get a cpu + apu Ryzen 3000 series chip, and wait to get a gpu is there any downside to that? Like outside of overclocking would a Ryzen cpu perform better than their apu counterparts?

Pargon had a great answer about this already, so to take it to practical terms, I'd recommend just getting a good deal (scour techbargains, buy/sell/trade forums, etc), and just get the best deal you can on a non-APU. Unfortunately while the AMD APUs on PC are the best available igp for PC, they're still not really suitable for more than absolutely minimal gaming.

If you snag a dirt cheap used 750ti or whatever, you can get by until you get your ideal GPU, and then resell the temporary GPU for basically the same value. Eg; getting a good deal on a $30-$50 used GPU will be worth basically the same in roughly a year, and worst possible case is worth zero (unlikely unless it dies lol), but still not a big loss.

IDK, that's just how I'd approach it. Get your ideal CPU and Mobo in place with a temp GPU, then plop one in later since you're planning on it, vs getting invested in an APU that is going to be a good few bars under the more capable Zen CPUs.

The limiting factor is the memory bandwidth. Eg; a Zen + DDR4 2400 + ~Vega64 or GTX 1080 is not heavily penalized by the mediocre DDR4. However, an APU at less than. 2933/3000 is pretty well hobbled, doubly so if you run a single stick, and even in ideal dual channel 3200+ speeds is only barely passable at 720p medium/1080p low with contemporary AAA multiplats.

A hypothetical quad channel AMD APU, or one that had onboard 256-bit GDDR6 or HBM2/HBM3 would be pretty awesome, but unfortunately that's not how they're set up :/ They're cheap options that share a 64+64 bit dual channel ram interface with the rest of the system. Perhaps DDR5 APUs will start to get more exciting, but these are promises we've heard for like 20 years now. I remember hype for soooo many IGP/APU gens, and they're invariably mediocre to laughable.

I guess if you're into Mobas or AA level steam gaming that isn't very demanding, it's pretty ok for that niche though, and still far far better than your typical Intel HD 4000/4600/Iris Pro/etc. The Intel Vega NUC thing was pretty cool though, but seemed more like a weird one-off than a serious product.
 

Ouroboros

Member
Oct 27, 2017
12,954
United States
The main drawback is that you're trading half of the cores for the GPU with a Ryzen APU. Depending on your workload, that could be a significant difference.

Zen CPUs are built using Core Complexes (CCX) which are basically groups of cores.
Ryzen has up to two CCXes per CPU, Threadripper has up to four CCXes per CPU, and Epyc has up to eight CCXes per CPU.
Currently, a Zen 1 CCX has four CPU cores, and Zen 2 is said to double that to eight cores.

This is how they have been able to massively increase core counts at a lower cost than Intel, since splitting the cores into CCX groups makes them considerably less complicated to manufacture.
Instead of having to manufacture one massive CPU die that has 32 cores with no defects, they can build a lot of 4-core CCXes which are inherently less complex, and pair them together to make a 32-core CPU.
The CCXes which fail can still be sold in lower-end parts. If only 3 of the 4 cores are functional, they can still pair two of them together for a 6-core Ryzen or four of them for a 12-core Threadripper and so on.

With a Ryzen APU one of the CCXes is replaced with a GPU. Since Zen 1 has four cores per CCX, that leaves you with only four CPU cores.
Zen 2 should mean there are eight CPU cores alongside the GPU (which is how the upcoming consoles will be configured).
Having an 8-core CPU with an integrated GPU is still pretty good, but the Zen 2 Ryzen CPUs will have two CCXes and 12 or 16 cores.

Of course there's nothing preventing you from buying an APU now, adding a GPU later, and then replacing the APU with a CPU after that if you want more CPU power.
The nice thing with AMD's platform is that you have options like these. AM4 should theoretically allow someone to have built a system with an APU that has 4-cores ~18 months ago, and swap that out for a 16-core Ryzen CPU later this year without having to change anything else in their system (assuming they now have a GPU).
Intel required people to buy new motherboards to go from 4 cores to 6 on the same platform.
Thanks for the detailed answer! Makes complete sense. I guess I will just have to see what my funding is like when Zen2 drops. Now I know I have some options. Thanks again!
 

low-G

Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,144
How often do different brands of RAM that have the same timings & clock rate & capacity cause compatibility issues? Wondering how much effort I should put into mixing RAM brands and seeing if I can get a memory-error-free experience.
 

Rean

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,329
Good luck, definitely not a fun problem to go through.
thanks a lot for advice. i was planning to buy new PC this summer when new ryzens are coming out so the whole situation is kind of a bummer, it only had to last a few more months.
my friend has used radeon 7800HD series card, i'll think i'll just get that one from him and see how it goes. PSU is old and cheap so i guess i'll replace that too.
You can use the program Speccy to find out what mode the GPU and slot are running in.
says
Bus Interface PCI Express x1

guess i'm fucked with this motherboard?
forums say i need to enable something in bios, i guess imma try that.

edit: changed it in bios, it wont let me select higher than x4 :<
PCI Express x16slot 2 (black) only options are auto (x1) and x4

from motherboard specs: https://www.asus.com/Motherboards/P8P67/specifications/
Expansion Slots
x PCIe 2.0 x16 * (max. at x4 mode [Black])

will it have big impact on performance if i get new gpu? :(
i guess x16 card can run in 4x speed just fine?
i really dont want to get new motherboard also
 
Last edited:

Arkaign

Member
Nov 25, 2017
1,991
thanks a lot for advice. i was planning to buy new PC this summer when new ryzens are coming out so the whole situation is kind of a bummer, it only had to last a few more months.
my friend has used radeon 7800HD series card, i'll think i'll just get that one from him and see how it goes. PSU is old and cheap so i guess i'll replace that too.

says
Bus Interface PCI Express x1

guess i'm fucked with this motherboard?
forums say i need to enable something in bios, i guess imma try that.

edit: changed it in bios, it wont let me select higher than x4 :<
PCI Express x16slot 2 (black) only options are auto (x1) and x4

from motherboard specs: https://www.asus.com/Motherboards/P8P67/specifications/
Expansion Slots
x PCIe 2.0 x16 * (max. at x4 mode [Black])

will it have big impact on performance if i get new gpu? :(
i guess x16 card can run in 4x speed just fine?
i really dont want to get new motherboard also

Dang. Yeah, IIRC, that's before even PCI Express 3.0, so being limited to X1 or even X4 for a GPU is going to be pretty limiting.

Do you have a micro center around? If you have an i5 or i7 2xxx/3xxx, you can resell your CPU and RAM for some decent value, and put some investment into a new basic B450 Mobo + Ryzen + 8GB DDR4 combo. Drop that HD7850/7870 in it, and you'd be in pretty awesome shape until you could afford a new model GPU.

I'm afraid that for any type of gaming usage, that P67 board is pretty wiped out :/
 

Rean

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,329
I'm afraid that for any type of gaming usage, that P67 board is pretty wiped out :/
i was planning to move this pc to countryside house so it isnt a big deal.
just how much slower its gonna be in 4x? i mostly play small games (street fighter, mortal kombat, card games, jrpgs etc) so if it could run those its more than enough for me.
i mean even now i can play trails in the sky on my 8600gt, so it shouldnt be that bad?
 

Arkaign

Member
Nov 25, 2017
1,991
i was planning to move this pc to countryside house so it isnt a big deal.
just how much slower its gonna be in 4x? i mostly play small games (street fighter, mortal kombat, card games, jrpgs etc) so if it could run those its more than enough for me.
i mean even now i can play trails in the sky on my 8600gt, so it shouldnt be that bad?

Ah, for light duty it should be passable enough. Definitely something to prepare for though. Often when a board has had some kind of critical failure, there may be errant current or other components being overstressed, so don't be surprised if the problems potentially spread further with time.

Good idea to take a good peek at Speccy or other voltage monitoring app to look at the 3.3v/5v/12v levels to see if things are maintaining in safe ranges.
 

//DEVIL//

Banned
Aug 13, 2018
363
I have a question and I would like help if possible.

by default I always use vpn when browsing etc. sometimes I forget it its even on.

anyway I wanted to buy SC 6 and I noticed its not available in Saudi Arabia ( I am guessing the character design is too revealing for them ? I dunno )

anyway , I decided to buy it from third party resellers that listed the game as Global ( instant - gaming ) and I delt with these guys before and they are legit.

I activated the game through Steam web browser but I did activate it through VPN.

am I in any sort of trouble ?

I honestly didn't even think about it only after I downloaded the game and played it. I don't think I will ever do that again unless its safe. can someone give me his/her opinion on this matter ?
 

Pargon

Member
Oct 27, 2017
11,988
i was planning to move this pc to countryside house so it isnt a big deal.
just how much slower its gonna be in 4x? i mostly play small games (street fighter, mortal kombat, card games, jrpgs etc) so if it could run those its more than enough for me.
i mean even now i can play trails in the sky on my 8600gt, so it shouldnt be that bad?
The faster the GPU is, the more noticeable it will be. Even in a worst-case scenario, it's really not that bad in games if you are only dealing with a single GPU:

https://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/NVIDIA/GeForce_GTX_1080_PCI_Express_Scaling/24.html

I have a question and I would like help if possible.
by default I always use vpn when browsing etc. sometimes I forget it its even on.
anyway I wanted to buy SC 6 and I noticed its not available in Saudi Arabia ( I am guessing the character design is too revealing for them ? I dunno )
anyway , I decided to buy it from third party resellers that listed the game as Global ( instant - gaming ) and I delt with these guys before and they are legit.
I activated the game through Steam web browser but I did activate it through VPN.
am I in any sort of trouble ?
I honestly didn't even think about it only after I downloaded the game and played it. I don't think I will ever do that again unless its safe. can someone give me his/her opinion on this matter ?
I think Valve are only concerned about people trying to buy games on Steam via VPN, rather than activating games. It's not something I've done before though, so I'm not really sure. I've only ever used a VPN to unlock games early (that I purchased in my region).
 

osnameless

Member
Jan 13, 2018
1,928
I have a dumb question...

What's the most demanding game today on PC?

Like what game would consume the most processing and graphic power to be run on max (ultra) settings at 1080p/60fps

I wanna say Assassin's Creed Odyssey, but I am not sure.
 

spool

Member
Oct 27, 2017
773
I have weird issues with my PC crashing. I had decided to build a new PC even before the crashing started, but since I want Zen 2 I figure I should try to sort it out anyway so that I have something to use for more than web browsing while I wait.

So here's what I'm experiencing. My PC has been freezing and become completely unresponsive at random points when playing Mass Effect 2. Sometimes I could go hours, other times not more than a few minutes. First I thought it might be a driver issue, but multiple Nvidia driver updates later and it was still doing it. Since my GPU was due to be upgraded soon anyway, I bought an AMD GPU. And Mass Effect 2 still freezes my PC.

I then started playing Assassin's Creed Odyssey and it was fine for 30 hours and then that game started freezing my PC as well. Not at random points though like ME2 did, but always right as it finishes loading, at the black screen before the in-game graphics comes in.

I've also been playing Baba Is You and it never freezes. Perhaps the game must put a certain amount of stress on your hardwase before it happens? I had my first desktop freeze yesterday, but since it has never happened before it might just be a fluke.

So I think I can rule out both GPUs and their drivers since I I bought a new one and did an Nvidia to AMD switch. And since ACO is so reliable in where it freezes, probably bad RAM as well. Could a bad PSU or motherboard cause issues like this? Anything else to consider?
 

Pargon

Member
Oct 27, 2017
11,988
I have weird issues with my PC crashing. I had decided to build a new PC even before the crashing started, but since I want Zen 2 I figure I should try to sort it out anyway so that I have something to use for more than web browsing while I wait.

So here's what I'm experiencing. My PC has been freezing and become completely unresponsive at random points when playing Mass Effect 2. Sometimes I could go hours, other times not more than a few minutes. First I thought it might be a driver issue, but multiple Nvidia driver updates later and it was still doing it. Since my GPU was due to be upgraded soon anyway, I bought an AMD GPU. And Mass Effect 2 still freezes my PC.

I then started playing Assassin's Creed Odyssey and it was fine for 30 hours and then that game started freezing my PC as well. Not at random points though like ME2 did, but always right as it finishes loading, at the black screen before the in-game graphics comes in.

I've also been playing Baba Is You and it never freezes. Perhaps the game must put a certain amount of stress on your hardwase before it happens? I had my first desktop freeze yesterday, but since it has never happened before it might just be a fluke.

So I think I can rule out both GPUs and their drivers since I I bought a new one and did an Nvidia to AMD switch. And since ACO is so reliable in where it freezes, probably bad RAM as well. Could a bad PSU or motherboard cause issues like this? Anything else to consider?
When you say that it is "freezing" do you mean that the system completely locks up and you have to restart it, that games are freezing and have to be force quit, or that games are 'freezing' during gameplay for a few seconds before going back to normal?

Is any of your hardware overclocked? If it is, the first thing you should do is disable that.
If the GPU is overclocked and crashing, that would typically be reset by the OS and you'd see the screen flash before it is restored.
If the whole system is freezing and requiring you to reset the PC, I'd test the RAM and the CPU.

You can test RAM with this: https://www.techpowerup.com/download/techpowerup-memtest64/
And I'd use Prime95 with 128K min/max FFTs running in-place to check CPU stability. https://www.mersenne.org/download/

Keep something like HWiNFO64 open to monitor temperatures when running Prime95 though. That will really put out a lot of heat, which may be a problem if your issue is that the cooling is failing/inadequate. https://www.hwinfo.com/download/
 

pswii60

Member
Oct 27, 2017
26,654
The Milky Way
Is there any way of easily toggling HDR on and off without having to go in to display settings? Like a way of doing it via a hotkey or something?

I don't like leaving it on all the time because it makes SDR content look a little 'off' but equally it's annoying having to manually enable it whenever I play Sekiro or something.
 

spool

Member
Oct 27, 2017
773
When you say that it is "freezing" do you mean that the system completely locks up and you have to restart it, that games are freezing and have to be force quit, or that games are 'freezing' during gameplay for a few seconds before going back to normal?

Is any of your hardware overclocked? If it is, the first thing you should do is disable that.
If the GPU is overclocked and crashing, that would typically be reset by the OS and you'd see the screen flash before it is restored.
If the whole system is freezing and requiring you to reset the PC, I'd test the RAM and the CPU.

You can test RAM with this: https://www.techpowerup.com/download/techpowerup-memtest64/
And I'd use Prime95 with 128K min/max FFTs running in-place to check CPU stability. https://www.mersenne.org/download/

Keep something like HWiNFO64 open to monitor temperatures when running Prime95 though. That will really put out a lot of heat, which may be a problem if your issue is that the cooling is failing/inadequate. https://www.hwinfo.com/download/

I mean (almost) completely frozen. Screen frozen, sound sometimes playing, other times not. I have two monitors and the second screen freezes too. No mouse, no keyboard. Waiting doesn't unfreeze it. I can only push and hold the power button on the case. If sound can sometimes still play though, it appears parts of the system are still alive.

I don't overclock anything, not either of the GPUs I've tested, nor the CPU. Every component is at stock values, just as they were when installed years ago. I can max out the CPU outside of a game without any problems, but the fan does get loud. I considered testing my RAM, but I figured RAM issues would be random due to the random nature of it, as opposed to being completely predictable when tested with the right game.

The software I can't run because I'm not a Windows user. I'll see about a RAM test though if you think it's something it can actually be.
 
Oct 25, 2017
5,530
What would make my PC reboot itself during games? Division 2 won't get past the load screen lately before the system reboots itself. Hitman 2 reboots the whole deal after about 20 minutes of play. I've deleted and reinstalled the games and updated everything. Driver issues? GPU Overheating?
 

Pargon

Member
Oct 27, 2017
11,988
What would make my PC reboot itself during games? Division 2 won't get past the load screen lately before the system reboots itself. Hitman 2 reboots the whole deal after about 20 minutes of play. I've deleted and reinstalled the games and updated everything. Driver issues? GPU Overheating?
Power supply issues would be my first guess. If you haven't changed anything recently, it could be going bad.
If your GPU requires two power connectors, make sure you have two separate cables connected to the power supply and not a Y-cable, a splitter, or adapters.

The GPU should throttle if it's overheating, and driver issues should result in a BSOD at worst, not a hard reset of the PC.

The software I can't run because I'm not a Windows user. I'll see about a RAM test though if you think it's something it can actually be.
There are other memory tests which can be booted from a USB drive no matter what OS you have installed (Memtest86 being common).
 

Ultimadrago

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,136
Hi guys, sorry for this stupid question. I'm currently playing Metro Exodus and normally, with the settings I'm playing with the game has a variable framerate of 75-130 fps or so. It's only a 60hz display, I'm playing with.

I noticed that there was no FPS limiter in the options, but I decided to turn on V-Sync. Now the game runs at 60-61 fps constant. I've heard that V Sync trashes gameplay performance to prevent screen tearing but does it always lock to 60fps as well?

I was curious since it had the intended effect I wanted, I just didn't know it tied directly towards 60fps. Maybe it's just tied to the display's max refresh?
 

Skyfireblaze

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,257
Hi guys, sorry for this stupid question. I'm currently playing Metro Exodus and normally, with the settings I'm playing with the game has a variable framerate of 75-130 fps or so. It's only a 60hz display, I'm playing with.

I noticed that there was no FPS limiter in the options, but I decided to turn on V-Sync. Now the game runs at 60-61 fps constant. I've heard that V Sync trashes gameplay performance to prevent screen tearing but does it always lock to 60fps as well?

I was curious since it had the intended effect I wanted, I just didn't know it tied directly towards 60fps. Maybe it's just tied to the display's max refresh?

V-Sync generally tries to sync a game's framerate to the refreshrate of the display yes. It introduces some input-lag but that should be fine and not really noticeable in most normal, common gaming situations unless you play a hyper-competitive, fast paced game.
 

Ultimadrago

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,136
V-Sync generally tries to sync a game's framerate to the refreshrate of the display yes. It introduces some input-lag but that should be fine and not really noticeable in most normal, common gaming situations unless you play a hyper-competitive, fast paced game.

Ah, alright. Thanks! I won't mind the input lag for a game like this as long as it's rather minor.
 

ContraWars

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
1,517
Canada
I usually don't have time to troubleshoot crap these days, but I have 2 Windows 10 PCs with emulators and stuff already installed. I have the latest version of LaunchBox and paid for a BigBox lifetime key.

Neither machine I'm testing will pull the metadata and allow me to import any games via Steam or hook any emulators. It just hangs for hours. It's been doing this for a few weeks now.

Anyone else having any problems with it?
 
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