"The only absolute XP attainable by Mario is that Battles are meaningless."
- Tolstoy, Game Reviewer
Last edited:
-
Ever wanted an RSS feed of all your favorite gaming news sites? Go check out our new Gaming Headlines feed! Read more about it here.
Paper Mario: The Origami King - Preview Thread
- Thread starter Phendrift
- Start date
Honestly they should just make Paper Mario a visual novel at this point.
Like that isn't even meant to be sarcastic or insulting. I think if the combat is going to be largely superfluous and avoidable there's not much point in including it in the first place, except for bosses. If the writing and presentation are engaging enough on their own then you don't need to waste resources reinventing the wheel each go.
Like that isn't even meant to be sarcastic or insulting. I think if the combat is going to be largely superfluous and avoidable there's not much point in including it in the first place, except for bosses. If the writing and presentation are engaging enough on their own then you don't need to waste resources reinventing the wheel each go.
Exploration and environmental stuff is a bunch of the appeal. There's a whole lot of RPG series that I jokingly state should be made visual novels, but Paper Mario ain't even that close.
They're been breezy adventure games since (and including) TTYD.
I mean, even if the coin economy is perfect, the progression still wouldn't be good.
so it feels weird arguing about it.
The linear accessory progression and limited options don't come close to a basically customize able system like badges.
so it feels weird arguing about it.
The linear accessory progression and limited options don't come close to a basically customize able system like badges.
well we know the game will definitely sell really well and most likely will challenge SPM.
One of the previews I read mentioned that you get more money for finishing battles sooner so it encourages you to not horde your expendables. That actually reminds me of the Persona games - they encourage you to not horde your MP and spend it on your fancy spells so you can initiate All-Out attacks which deal really good damage AND improve your rewards (shuffle time in P4, holdups in P5).
According to the Gamexplain preview the regular jump and hammer are enough to take out most enemies in a single turn if you line them up properly (as lining them up also gives you an attack boost) rendering the consumables moot in most of the regular battles. And one of the people in that preview had already beaten the game.
I mean like make it an adventure game. I also count games like Disco Elysium or Planescape as visual novels because the focus is on the writing with very little to no combat.
USG preview
www.usgamer.net
Paper Mario: The Origami King
Discover everything you need to know about Paper Mario: The Origami King.
www.usgamer.net
great preview, thanks!USG preview
Paper Mario: The Origami King
Discover everything you need to know about Paper Mario: The Origami King.
Except enemy encounters in a platformer take a matter of seconds, if that, and even most encounters in action games are quicker than the average RPG battle. Having a turn-based combat system that takes up a fair amount of the player's time with little reward doesn't incentivize the player to engage in drawn out combat.
If they wanted a system like that, Super Paper Mario is right there.
I think it had something to do with their former CEO if there was any bad rep.
not to mention that enemies in platformers tie into the core of the game via level design that makes avoiding/jumping on them more challenging as well as the fact that they are essentially platforms themselves.
It's really hard to take this as anything more than looking for a reaction given your Sonic 06 comment.
How in the world could you enjoy Unchsrted 1 but not Uncharted 2?
This series once achieved greatness. It doesn't matter how long it's been since then; I'm going to keep fighting for it to rediscover what made it great.
People pushed for 3D Mario to go back to its 64 roots and Nintendo eventually listened. People pushed for Zelda to go open world and Nintendo eventually listened. People pushed for Metroid Prime to come back and Nintendo eventually listened.
You say it like we don't have monthly threads of people complaining that BOTW is not a traditional Zelda or that Odyssey is a bad game.
That you cannot assume that Nintendo is going to listen to you because perhaps you are not part of the target audience they are looking for.
Hah. Spot on. Let alone that the same person who tweeted that said the following:
Absolutely based
Won't know if you don't try
There were 15 Zelda games between the two open-world ones, so they still have us beat on perseverance but I'll hold out hope.
Yes, I am sure that when Ocarina of Time was released people were complaining that it was not open world.
Not much challenge in battles and no XP... these things don't give me much confidence in the game.
But I really need a fun Switch adventure to tide me over and I'd rather finally play through a Paper Mario from start to finish than jump into Bug Fables at the moment (but if reviews say this is a cakewalk, I may do just that).
But I really need a fun Switch adventure to tide me over and I'd rather finally play through a Paper Mario from start to finish than jump into Bug Fables at the moment (but if reviews say this is a cakewalk, I may do just that).
How do you guys even play the old Paper Mario games without skipping 90% of the battles? They've pretty much always been pointless. The exp scaling on 64 and TTYD makes fighting more than a couple fights completely pointless. That's how the series has been from day one.
Because while I enjoyed UC1, I did not enjoy it enough that I wanted to play the sequels.
It's almost like different people prioritize different things about games and can look at something that's overall positive and come away knowing that they will dislike the game.
No, it's implying that we're ignoring the positive previews and just looking at the tweets (while comparing us to anti vaxxers). I can listen to the Gamexplain preview and read the USGamer preview and come away thinking the game sounds baddespite the fact that all three of those people enjoyed the game over all.
You've lost your mind if you don't think people have been criticizing the post-LttP Zelda games for sticking too closely to its linear formula since the '90s. Every game up until arguably ALBW used the exact same structure and it's been a common criticism of the series ever since.
Now obviously it's not a perfect analogy since none of the Zelda games are even in the same ballpark as being as bad as Sticker Star, but still there's nothing wrong with people having their preferred style of game and being disappointed when a different one comes out.
It's a mistery...
But people hava romanticized version of the old games battle system. The upgrades to partners are scattered in the overworld, boots and hammer by progressing the story and when you have Vivian who has a way to avoid all damage and a AOE attack that pierces and burns enemies you know that you don't need to level up with optional battles.
You're still rewarded for leveling up and that sense of progression is rewarding. It's satisfying to beat that last Goomba and level up and be able to boost your stats and then use those new boosts in future battles. The Paper Mario games are easy, I don't think anybody would dispute that, but the sense of progression is still satisfying.
This is the only place I've ever seen people say 64 and TTYD have bad gameplay. I genuinely don't understand.
Well for one, there's no "us" / "we" / "them". This isn't a war with sides; people have different reasons for supporting and not supporting the direction the game took. Second, I took the image in a much more lighthearted manner without context to it. I don't at all think you're ignorant to the positive impressions, but a lot of people dipping into the conversation / end of the thread may just see that one tweet being quoted and run with it.
By pulling in the new tweets, I just meant to support the idea that battles are not necessarily central to this game's experience. With the different variations of battles and return to an open world, they seem to be less of a hinderance even if "useless". I myself skipped Color Splash, this feels different to me.
Haha, you should check out the SmashEra DT. Dunking on TTYD is one of the like six conversation topics that circulates endlessly there.
64 though I agree, that game is flawless.
I would not call fighting tedious and long-winded battles for 1xp from a Goomba so I can get +5FP that I don't need at all "rewarding." They were never worth the time.
Honestly, this is all I needed to know. I'm super excited and really looking forward to a fun little adventure.
This right here. I love the first few games, but it was obvious even to 8 year old me that battles became pretty pointless shortly into each chapter. Bug Fables reaffirmed that feeling. You want to fight a handful of enemies at the beginning of each chapter to level up once or twice, but even with just a slight level lead the battles result in just a single experience point for each enemy and thus become totally pointless.
The influx of coins means I can spend it on all sorts of accessories and items to use whenever I feel like getting into combat. That, coupled with you finding something like heart containers to increase your health, is all I need for the combat to feel satisfying.
You're entitled to that opinion but I've never agreed. Leveling up and making my character stronger in a game is satisfying, even if I don't strictly "need" it. I can pick and choose if I feel like fighting enemies for progression or if I'm good for a chapter/dungeon.
The Goomba was just one example to make a larger point.
Yeah, running away from 90% of battles is exactly how I played TTYD. TTYD is especially annoying because of the large amount of backtracking in that game. I still remember being so annoyed every time I encountered an enemy in the sewers while I was trying to fast travel somewhere. Or when going through old dungeons with incredibly weak enemies to complete side quests.
TOK has a lot of room to improve over TTYD if it has less backtracking. This is something I haven't seen commented on in the previews very much yet, though.
TOK has a lot of room to improve over TTYD if it has less backtracking. This is something I haven't seen commented on in the previews very much yet, though.
But by the time you start only getting 1EXP from enemies in an area, you start killing them with a single jump or hammer on the overworld rather than being force to battle with them though.
It honestly blows my mind people actively avoided most encounters on a casual playthroughs. 16 years later and I still fight every enemy I see on every playthrough.
I get why long-time PM fans are bummed. Now that AlphaDream is dead, the only living Mario RPG series (maybe) is Mario + Rabbids. It's a really great SRPG, but if you're not an SRPG fan, you're up a creek re: Mario RPGs. This game represented hope that Nintendo would move PM back in that direction.
(As an aside, people who lecture about entitled or closed-minded people who just want PM games to genre-shift toward the RPG again are lame. People are allowed to want things. As long as someone's not being abusive or sending death threats, their feelings and disappointment are valid.)
For me, I was never super into those old PM games, and I haven't played one since TTYD, so I'll give this a try. A light, simple adventure sounds nice. Plus, the folks at Treehouse write good jokes.
But I wouldn't have minded a more complex RPG, either.
(As an aside, people who lecture about entitled or closed-minded people who just want PM games to genre-shift toward the RPG again are lame. People are allowed to want things. As long as someone's not being abusive or sending death threats, their feelings and disappointment are valid.)
For me, I was never super into those old PM games, and I haven't played one since TTYD, so I'll give this a try. A light, simple adventure sounds nice. Plus, the folks at Treehouse write good jokes.
But I wouldn't have minded a more complex RPG, either.
I think a few people are just desperate to justify their takes on TOK by arguing that the older installments were never good in the first place. Then again, I don't want to dismiss every negative response as having those intention; that'd make me as bad as some other Paper Mario fans view every discussion about the newer installments with a us vs. them mentality.