This. My brother is a huge UFC nut so I know a lotta tangential shit and this is one of them. Feel like every time we've gotten together to watch, every other woman fight has a fighter with this hairstyle, regardless of race.
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Overwatch's new Mei skin draws criticism for cultural appropriation (Read staff post)
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This. My brother is a huge UFC nut so I know a lotta tangential shit and this is one of them. Feel like every time we've gotten together to watch, every other woman fight has a fighter with this hairstyle, regardless of race.
I always think cultural appropriation as a proof that a certain culture is influential. For example, if you go to chinese or korean buddhist temples you will see that the buddha statures are using similar styles to greek ones. Or as Miyamoto (and Oscar Wilde before him) puts it "Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery."
This makes more sense in a world where Black people aren't constantly maligned in their everyday lives for having "Dirty, unkempt hair" when using natural hairstyles.
Like, make no mistake, in this PARTICULAR instance, I still claim no foul, Cornrows, box braids and the like are basically required for most people in combat sports, let alone most sports in general (i'm surprised that most swimmers don't use cornrows). But that doesn't make the issue of cultural appropriation when it comes to black hairstyles being a constant issue in media, especially when it comes to games where the only black hairstyles are usually really dated looking rows ripped out of GTA:SA with no efforts being taken to actual give people of color any real options. It's a serious issue that does need addressing.
Like, shit, go to a black hair stylist and look at a fucking style book game developers, there's a plethora of options out there and the most you can do is old ass cornrows and afros? You are not trying. Do better.
aren't cornrows and buzzcut used because they are quite practical for fighting? In a more "daily" use I'd get it, but for mma seems a tad dubious.
That said, I'm hispanic, so ethnic haircuts are a bit odd to me, and thus I have an implicit bias.
That said, I'm hispanic, so ethnic haircuts are a bit odd to me, and thus I have an implicit bias.
It might be proof of influence. But for example, say if the imitators get a whole bunch of money and status, while the originators languish in poverty and obscurity. That's why I brought up Elvis. He may have had respect for Big Mama Thornton and her singing "Hound Dog." But he rode his version of the song to stardom and pretty much no one knows who Big Mama Thornton even was. That's where appropriation can be really dangerous. Ideally, we'd want a culture or whomever to be rewarded for their "influence."
So, for this case, we want to make sure that Black people are recognized for their cultural contributions and treated well in society overall because of it. We're still working out the kinks on that one, lol. But I don't see how the answer would be to wholly stop anyone else from wearing cornrows, etc. It's like, would we be holding it as a bargaining chip until Black people are more equal in society or...? "After we get Reparations, then you can wear cornrows." lol
Being white I wouldn't know so I'm not going to comment on what someone else should find offensive.
I do know that including this particular hairstyle, no matter how justified in context, before the proper black character people have been asking for years at this point looks like a mean joke.
I do know that including this particular hairstyle, no matter how justified in context, before the proper black character people have been asking for years at this point looks like a mean joke.
I'm always a bit sceptical when cultural appropriation is mentioned, especially regarding hair. I come from a background where cultures mix and take from each other and add to each other to the point where origins of certain things are muddled.
However, in this instance it's quite clear. There's a hairstyle that's typically associate with black people used in a game that features no black characters. Looking at just the game, with no prior knowledge of said hairstyle, you wouldn't think that it's a black hairstyle. Hence 100% appropriated.
However, in this instance it's quite clear. There's a hairstyle that's typically associate with black people used in a game that features no black characters. Looking at just the game, with no prior knowledge of said hairstyle, you wouldn't think that it's a black hairstyle. Hence 100% appropriated.
User Banned (1 Month): Concern trolling with regards to cultural appropriation
Would it not be a concern that gatekeeping cornrows (or other traditional black hairstyles) when people are already discriminated against having them yourself and prevented from wearing them could lead to the erasure of the hairstyles altogether? If no one is allowed to wear them that isn't black, but black men and women are also prevented/discouraged from wearing them themselves, will eventually no one be able to wear them and they will eventually be forgotten?
...There are 2 black characters in overwatch with a black woman coming next. Likely two if The Queen is also going to be in the first wave of new characters for OW2.
That's pretty extreme. I don't see this happening. It's mainly the white-collar business and broadcasting world that has had an issue. Elsewhere, not so much. In sports for example, it's clearly whatever. And no one cares in a casual setting, especially among groups of black people.
And luckily, we're at a point where if a school outlaws cornrows or other black hairstyles in a dress code, they'll get smacked upside the head with backlash pretty damn quick.
The wider problem I think is the fact that a patently black hairstyle is more accepted on non-black people (e.g. in MMA) than on actual black people (see stuff about "unprofessional"/"nappy" hair), and Blizzard putting that hairstyle on Mei before/instead of a black character feeds into that.
Honestly as much as I love the game I'm going to delete and boycott it.
We've been asking for a Black woman character for years.
We've been asking for a Black woman character for years.
The take I've been waiting for honestly. Cultural appropriation is a problem for a lot of the reasons people mention in this thread, but the point is and always has been that black people shouldn't be discriminated against for their hair/fashion. If Whites don't get job opportunities revoked for having locs, neither should black people. If Whites don't have issues getting into prestigious colleges because of their name, neither should black people. I understand the frustration of seeing part of your culture being A-okayed when it's being paraded around melaninless characters/people, but the focus needs to be about correcting the attitude the world has when black people(or other minorities) exist with their cultural heritage being on display on themselves, the ORIGINATORS, versus the leniency that exists when those same cultural elements are displayed on white people.
And for the whole sojurn thing, I mean, it's a start? But they've got a ways to go still.
POC doesn't mean Black. We're not interchangeable, you know?
User banned (permanent): dismissing concerns around cultural appropriation over multiple posts, prior severe ban for dismissing sexism in a sensitive thread
I honestly have a lot of difficulties to understand the criticisms to the lack of a black woman in Overwatch. I mean: if the game would have included only white females characters I would have perfectly understood it but the roaster presents female characters from a lot of different countries that are not tipically represented in videogames. Like Egypt, India, Mexico... I mean, this is not common at all and in general I think that the game has one of the wider ethnic cast of characters.
Probably it's because I'm european and I can't understand what exactly is the problem with the lack of black women in the game. Probably it's an USA-only problem? I don't know...
Probably it's because I'm european and I can't understand what exactly is the problem with the lack of black women in the game. Probably it's an USA-only problem? I don't know...
User Banned (1 Month): Dismissive commentary around representation; multiple prior bans for conspiracy theorizing, insensitive commentary, and more
Still better than forced cultural assimilation.
thats why I said PoC. Also isnt Ana supposed to be egyptian and egypt is in Africa. Usually seen as a black continent. Pharah is from Egypt too.
I think this are particular people saying sad, racist things. If you use popular characters that have afros or cornrows that isnt an attempt to make them dirty right?
I understand that. But you cant represent everyone. I would love to have a korean male for example but we only have a korean female. And also she fucking sucks without her mech.
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It's quite simple. People want to see themselves represented in the game.
It is up to the individual to use whatever term they want for themselves.
Of course it is.
Anyway, this essentially being the first bit of black female representation in Overwatch certainly had me giving it the side eye. Overwatch has been good with it's diversity (except for, you know, Tracer) but that's an oversight they need to fix sooner rather than later.
no doubt , regardless it stood out to me as being mixed myself so i asked the question
Oh, ok.
Well, I would also like a lot to see an Italian heroes in Overwatch. I mean, I would like it A LOT!
What could be its peculiar ability? Hmm...
You are being both incredibly ignorant and incredibly offensive in your posts. What the hell is "Black Country/Continent" even supposed to mean? But Indians aren't Black. Don't post if you can't tell POCs apart.
I know some use terms like these in an empowering way, as you know mixed race people face specific discrimination.
This statement is at best super ignorant and at worst extremely offensive to many types of people.
I apologize. It was a wrong statement from me to make and I didnt mean it that way. I was just trying to say that there are a lot of PoC characters and that there are limits to the number of characters you can include. Thats why I used the word PoC originally. I should have just used Ana and Pharah as an example. To be honest (and embarassingly to me) I have mixed up Pharah and Symetra and just realized later in the thread that Pharah is the daughter of Ana while Pharah is a different character.
I have mixed up the characters Pharah and Symetra.
Thats why I said PoC. Sorry for being ignorant on my part. What I meant was that I think there are many PoC Female Characters in Overwatch. There are even two African Female Characters. Just not an African American Female (at least so far).
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You have to consider that a lot of people here are not from the USA and they don't know in deep this kind or racial problems.
For example, in Italy in the past we had a lot of immigration from east Europe, north Africa and Middle-East but the immigration from central and south Africa is a more recent thing.
A lot of this cultural issues never happened here and seing people with certain hairstiles has usually never lead to discrimination.
A similar situation can be applied to a lot of european countries too.
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Mei was my main when I played and all her skins were trash, the original and the xmas one are the only decent ones. I see that hasn't changed.
I mean sure, you can have a character with a Black identity that is not inherently america. Doomfist and Baptiste are not american but they are unequivocally, unashamedly Black. A Black Italian is well within the realm of possbility.
People's problem with Overwatch, which is warranted is that after 5 years, 52 characters and a plethora of possibilities:
They STILL haven't arrived at a Black Woman. Sojourn has been on the cusp for literally 3 years now and the tease of giving the fanbase what they want but constantly pushing things back, arguably for gains to be found in OWL, which is kind of being mismanaged right now. I don't fault anyone for being upset about Black representation in the game when that sort of thing is what we've had to deal with for so long.
Empirically false.
Mei actually has a bunch of good skins now.
What they really need to do is stop fucking around and port Mei, Zarya, Genji and Tracer's skins from HOTS into the game proper.
You don't have to American to know that Indians aren't Black people lol regardless if people aren't familiar with the cultural nuances that concern hairstyles it's best to not post in a thread like this. Just read it
It definitely happens in the real world all the time. Especially in the US when people abandon things we might consider cultural markers or identifiers and people place you in a racial box from first glance. You can always refer to that Seinfeld episode with Elaine's "I thought he was black" boyfriend.
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Mei had an amazing skin since launch, smh my head.Empirically false.
Mei actually has a bunch of good skins now.
I mean sure, you can have a character with a Black identity that is not inherently america. Doomfist and Baptiste are not american but they are unequivocally, unashamedly Black. A Black Italian is well within the realm of possbility.
People's problem with Overwatch, which is warranted is that after 5 years, 52 characters and a plethora of possibilities:
They STILL haven't arrived at a Black Woman. Sojourn has been on the cusp for literally 3 years now and the tease of giving the fanbase what they want but constantly pushing things back, arguably for gains to be found in OWL, which is kind of being mismanaged right now. I don't fault anyone for being upset about Black representation in the game when that sort of thing is what we've had to deal with for so long.
Empirically false.
Mei actually has a bunch of good skins now.
What they really need to do is stop fucking around and port Mei, Zarya, Genji and Tracer's skins from HOTS into the game proper.
Sorry for my partial reply, I updated the post 😅
