Out of all great FPS out there, Half Life has by far the worst gunplay.

[SofNascimento]

With the announcement of Xen for Black Mesa I decided to revisit the Half Life universe. And what better place to begin than with the game that started it all, and is often mentioned as one of the best, if not the very best, FPS of all time.

I was never a fan of its gunplay, but by god it's even worse than I remembered. There is absolute no feedback for shooting the enemies. It's just a small glob of blood and that's it. This is especially annoying against human enemies that just move around and are not affect but the hail of bullets hitting them. The weapon feel weak in turn and the sound doesn't help either. They also don't feel good to shoot and offer very little precision. Take the SMG for example, all it do is fire bullets that seems to hit everywhere but the center of your aim, and if you are not very close to the enemy it's useless. And the shotgun is definitely the worse in any top tier FPS.

And the granades are simply weird. The slowly fly in this arc and are suddenly glued to the ground when they hit it. It's like when you cut a figure in paint and move around with the mouse. There is no weight to it. It's only some of the more powerful guns that offer the slight amount of satisfaction in using them.

If you compare it to games like Quake 2 or Unreal it's positively embarrassing.

Half Life might be revolutionary in terms of narrative and campaign structure, but when it comes to shooting guns and enemy design it's not even mediocre. It has very interesting firefights in concept, but they aren't fun because the minute gameplay is awful.

That's why when people say HL1 is better than HL2 my mind bends so much I'm afraid I'll fall into another dimension.

 

[Prine]

Agreed. Honestly I understand it was a landmark game but I never really enjoyed either 1 or 2. Gunplay always felt a little flat.

 

[KernelC]

does Red Dead Redemption 2 count since it can be played in First Person? because that is just awful

 

[lazygecko]

This was also a major turnoff for me at the time. Although Unreal wasn't that much better with regards to feedback and enemy pain/interrupts. I think this was just the general trend at the time when FPS had just moved from 2D sprites to fully polygon 3D making enemies much more CPU/GPU intensive, so they cut down on the amount of onscreen enemies and made them a lot more bullet spongey to compensate.

 

[ArjanN]

It was never their strongest suit, really. Fortunately unlike Quake and Unreal these games had other interesting things going on besides the gunplay.

Also to be fair in Half-Life 2 you can just mostly stick to the gravity gun which is easily one of the best 'guns' in a videogame

 

[TaterTots]

I never hear people praising HL1 due to the gunplay. It changed how a story could be played. Half-Life 2 is far better in every regard.

 

[Odesu]

EDIT:

I was thinking that OP was talking about Half-Life 2, not Half-Life. Sorry about that!

 

[Rhete]

I've always hated how HL1 felt, like you said there is no feedback to hitting the enemies.

HL2 is godlike though

 

[shinobi602]

I'd never categorize the shooting as one of the original Half-Life's strong suits personally.

Its sequel is a tenfold improvement.

 

[Deleted member 23212]

It feels better than Quake I feel, honestly Quake just seemed to provide no feedback at all, maybe it's because I felt the gunshot sounds were underwhelming.

 

[Rickenslacker]

The original Half-Life had alright shooting, the marines were decently reactive but Half-Life's animations were just a bit too jank. Still, better than its contemporaries of Quake 2 or Unreal 1 I'd say; though Quake 1, the Dooms, and Build engine games felt better when it came to gunplay.

I'd categorize Half-Life 2's shooting as mediocre at best. You have some weapons with punch like the magnum, crossbow, and Combine AR, but the rest just fall completely flat and it has perhaps the least effective grenades ever conceived because Gordon both tosses them with way too much force and they also just bounce around everywhere that you're never going to get them landing where you want.

 

[Dezzy]

Maybe, but I don't think the appeal of Half-Life was the gunplay. It was the experience.

 

[Messofanego]

Half Life 2's gunplay isn't that much better other than better hit reactions. Agreed on the bad grenades for both games. Half Life 1's enemy AI is still better than 2 which makes for more fun combat encounters, though.

 

[poofynamanama2]

Yea I got to the canals before I gave up. The physics stuff seemed cool, tho

Hopefully they remake the game one day

 

[SofNascimento]

I never hear people praising HL1 due to the gunplay. It changed how a story could be played. Half-Life 2 is far better in every regard.

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I'd never categorize the shooting as one of the original Half-Life's strong suits personally.

Its sequel is a tenfold improvement.

Click to shrink...

Maybe, but I don't think the appeal of Half-Life was the gunplay. It was the experience.

Click to shrink...

You're right. HL1 is not remembered because of its shooting. But I would argue, to little agreement I believe, that the shooting is so below average that it stops all HL1 ideas to come together as they should. In other words, I don't think HL1 is a good FPS. It's a FPS with incredible ideas that are not cemented together. It's a weird thing to say, but HL1 is more of movie than, say, Uncharted 2. It works when you ignore gameplay. It's more about controlling a camera than playing a game.

It's different from games like Witcher 3, for example. In which gameplay is not their strongest aspect, but they are good enough to hold the game together.

 

[Adam Sadler]

The gunplay honestly in both half life games stopped me from fully appreciating them.

 

[jediyoshi]

In other words, I don't think HL1 is a good FPS.

Click to shrink...

This was the take you should have led with.

 

[nogoodnamesleft]

Thats fine, still the best FPS ever (2)

 

[SofNascimento]

This was the take you should have led with.

Click to shrink...

The original OP would be called: Half Life as you remember it doesn't exist. But I think I needed more to justify that opinion. One day perhaps.

 

[Deleted member 4494]

Having recently played Black Mesa, I sort of feel that the remake sort of short changes the combat of the original game; by increasing the size of the environments, and reducing the cover in the environments and by kind of merging some of what HL2 does into a container that doesn't support it all that well, I suspect that Black Mesa makes HL1 look like an even worse 'pure shooter' than the original. Even with the added physics, I really didn't like playing Black Mesa as much as I did the original. I still have yet to try out the Xen levels, though, and I suspect those will be a major improvement.

That being said, I would echo that statement that HL2 is a legitimately great shooter mechanically.

 

[Mr.Deadshot]

It's up there with the best. It's what makes an FPS great in the first place.

 

[Deleted member 23850]

Half-Life 2 I disagree, but the first Half-Life...yeah it's a bit dated. Still love it.

 

[eraFROMAN]

It's not really about the shooting in isolation, the movement and, in 2, the physics, add up to a greater-than-the-sum experience

 

[sleepnaught]

Guess I'm weird, I love the gunplay in OG Half Life

 

[Charamiwa]

It's mostly the pistol and the SMG. You really can't say that with the shotgun or the crossbow. Especially the right click on the shotgun. Now that's punchy. And then you have all the late game weapons which are just simply great.

But if you start saying that it's not a good FPS because of it, yeah I'm not gonna go there with you.

 

[SofNascimento]

It's mostly the pistol and the SMG. You really can't say that with the shotgun or the crossbow. Especially the right click on the shotgun. Now that's punchy. And then you have all the late game weapons which are just simply great.

But if you start saying that it's not a good FPS because of it, yeah I'm not gonna go there with you.

Click to shrink...

I think the shotgun is one of the worst shotguns in any FPS I've played. Even when shooting two bullets at once it doesn't feel powerful, it's oddly innacurate for a shotgun. Even at close range it doesn't feel I'm doing the damage I should be doing. In turn, Half Life 2's shotgun, which work in the same one, is one of the best shotguns in gaming.

 

[Xero grimlock]

You're right. HL1 is not remembered because of its shooting. But I would argue, to little agreement I believe, that the shooting is so below average that it stops all HL1 ideas to come together as they should. In other words, I don't think HL1 is a good FPS. It's a FPS with incredible ideas that are not cemented together. It's a weird thing to say, but HL1 is more of movie than, say, Uncharted 2. It works when you ignore gameplay. It's more about controlling a camera than playing a game.

It's different from games like Witcher 3, for example. In which gameplay is not their strongest aspect, but they are good enough to hold the game together.

Click to shrink...

while it's definitely not its strong suit I highly disagree that the gun play in hl1 is THAT bad. or that it's more of a movie then uncharted 2. I swear we cant have simple discussions here it always has to be these vast extremes.

 

[Atom Heart Mother]

It's mostly the pistol and the SMG. You really can't say that with the shotgun or the crossbow. Especially the right click on the shotgun. Now that's punchy. And then you have all the late game weapons which are just simply great.

But if you start saying that it's not a good FPS because of it, yeah I'm not gonna go there with you.

Click to shrink...

Yeah, just like HL2 the pistol/SMG are weak but everything else is great. The Revolver in HL2 feels awesome to use.

 

[SlumberingGiant]

It's got the best gunplay

 

[Skux]

Apart from the SMG feeling like a pea shooter I didn't have any issues with it.

 

[Charamiwa]

I think the shotgun is one of the worst shotguns in any FPS I've played. Even when shooting two bullets at once it doesn't feel powerful, it's oddly innacurate for a shotgun. Even at close range it doesn't feel I'm doing the damage I should be doing. In turn, Half Life 2's shotgun, which work in the same one, is one of the best shotguns in gaming.

Click to shrink...

Shotgunning headcrabs in HL1 is one of my great pleasure so I can't agree. Maybe against marines at mid distance it feels weak but then you just one shot these fools with the magnum and that feels great.

 

[residentgrigo]

It´s fine but HL 1 very dated by now. The gunplay in Deus Ex 1 is near torture even with many of the (in-game) mods installed but you can obviously play in other ways in such games.

 

[capitalCORN]

Did everyone forget the large caliber handgun and crossbow?

 

[SofNascimento]

while it's definitely not its strong suit I highly disagree that the gun play in hl1 is THAT bad. or that it's more of a movie then uncharted 2. I swear we cant have simple discussions here it always has to be these vast extremes.

Click to shrink...

I'm not even being hyperbolic.

Shotgunning headcrabs in HL1 is one of my great pleasure so I can't agree. Maybe against marines at mid distance it feels weak but then you just one shot these fools with the magnum and that feels great.

Click to shrink...

If you hit the head. If you hit any other part you might as well have shot them with Peashooter.

 

[capitalCORN]

If you hit the head. If you hit any other part you might as well have shot them with Peashooter.

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What's so bad about headshots?

 

[SofNascimento]

It´s fine but HL 1 very dated by now. The gunplay in Deus Ex 1 is near torture even with many of the (in-game) mods installed but you can obviously play in other ways in such games.

Click to shrink...

It's not about being dated. Quake 2 is older than HL1 and it holds up spectacularly. In fact, Quake 2 is a handbook of how to do a good gunplay. So everything I'm saying for HL1 was true at the very moment it was released.

 

[Survivortype]

I remember liking the laser guided missle launcher.

I also like that weapon that's just the little alien bugger. Thought it was pretty creative when I was younger.

 

[SofNascimento]

What's so bad about headshots?

Click to shrink...

Nothing. Shooting enemies in the head with the magun is good.

 

[No Depth]

The human enemy AI in HL1 was one of the more discussed aspects back at its launch in the late 90's. The way the agents communicated and flanked and attacked you was a giant leap forward from other FPS titles at the time. Primitive today, but playing it at launch was unreal.

 

[Semfry]

The SMG is kind of shit (which applies to both HL games, but at least HL1's system don't force it on you as much), but it's sort of a red herring, as the Pistol uses the same ammo, is pinpoint accurate, does more damage per shot, and even has a secondary that kind of emulates the SMG's function; making it a much more gratifying alternative. Outside of that and the shotgun (...it's a shotgun, and the primary actually has a tight enough spread to have okay range), there aren't really any imprecise weapons at all, and landing stuff like Magnum or Crossbow headshots and seeing a giant blood explosion, or using a heavier weapon and getting a bunch of gibs is very satisfying. The enemy variety is also matched by very few other "pure" FPS, and several of them require quite different approaches to deal with safely (and listing this aspect as a flaw is the most inexplicable part of the OP, as it carries the combat even when the gunplay is an issue). Multiple enemies also do have reactions, it's a bit inconsistent, but with enemies like Houndeyes the fact every hit interrupts them is essential to crowd-controlling groups of them. For it's age there's actually a lot of destructable objects and similar too (basically a precursor to the full physics approach of HL2), so bigger fights can also result in FEAR type instances of a bunch of carnage being left over in the end.

Given they're listed as comparisons I'd easily put it over Quake 2 and Unreal at least; Quake 2 maybe has some guns that feel better, but they're mostly pretty typical FPS guns vs Half-Life which has a bunch of cool exotic stuff (that are all pretty useful outside the Snarks which are just an amusing gimmick). I love Unreal but it basically has your listed issues tenfold as enemies are very spongy and rarely react until they get weak (albeit offset by the game having a smaller enemy count), and the only guns with any precision at range are the Automag, Rifle and Minigun.

 

[SofNascimento]

I remember liking the laser guided missle launcher.

I also like that weapon that's just the little alien bugger. Thought it was pretty creative when I was younger.

Click to shrink...

The rocket launcher is an interesting example of why I believe HL2 is what HL1 wanted to be, but the technology was simply not there. Compared using the rocket launcher in HL2 to fight a gunship to using it in HL1 to fight the helicopter. It doesn't even begin to compare.

 

[Shmagney]

I disagree! Playing Half-Life for the first time now and it holds up surprisingly well, since i find its contemporaries unplayable at this point

 

[Crayon]

Thats true. Its only passable. I really like how 2 plays, tho. Im sure many would disagree.

Is there a mod to lower and he volume of the sub machine gun tho? God damn.

 

[skeezx]

I'd never categorize the shooting as one of the original Half-Life's strong suits personally.

Its sequel is a tenfold improvement.

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yeah "gunplay" comes to mind in HL1 like shooting in RDR/GTA. like, it's there. but it's just "there"

 

[Jon God]

The actual gameplay in Half-Life was always it's achilles heel.

That, and in Half-Life 2, taking the story seriously when the main character is mute. I don't get it.

 

[SofNascimento]

The SMG is kind of shit (which applies to both HL games, but at least HL1's system don't force it on you as much), but it's sort of a red herring, as the Pistol uses the same ammo, is pinpoint accurate, does more damage per shot, and even has a secondary that kind of emulates the SMG's function; making it a much more gratifying alternative. Outside of that and the shotgun (...it's a shotgun, and the primary actually has a tight enough spread to have okay range), there aren't really any imprecise weapons at all, and landing stuff like Magnum or Crossbow headshots and seeing a giant blood explosion, or using a heavier weapon and getting a bunch of gibs is very satisfying. The enemy variety is also matched by very few other "pure" FPS, and several of them require quite different approaches to deal with safely (and listing this aspect as a flaw is the most inexplicable part of the OP, as it carries the combat even when the gunplay is an issue). Multiple enemies also do have reactions, it's a bit inconsistent, but with enemies like Houndeyes the fact every hit interrupts them is essential to crowd-controlling groups of them. For it's age there's actually a lot of destructable objects and similar too (basically a precursor to the full physics approach of HL2), so bigger fights can also result in FEAR type instances of a bunch of carnage being left over in the end.

Given they're listed as comparisons I'd easily put it over Quake 2 and Unreal at least; Quake 2 maybe has some guns that feel better, but they're mostly pretty typical FPS guns vs Half-Life which has a bunch of cool exotic stuff (that are all pretty useful outside the Snarks which are just an amusing gimmick). I love Unreal but it basically has your listed issues tenfold as enemies are very spongy and rarely react until they get weak (albeit offset by the game having a smaller enemy count), and the only guns with any precision at range are the Automag, Rifle and Minigun.

Click to shrink...

The enemy variety is not the problem, is the enemy themselves. I find them just not interesting. The ones that made into Half Life 2 are the best ones, posibly that's why they made it. I feel that Half Life combat plays more like a puzzle than a proper shooter. And some weapons can even be fun to use at the right circumstances.

About putting in above Quake 2 and Unreal I disagree immensily. The thing with Unreal is that its combat is balanced in a different way. Almost all weapons are about relatively slow projectiles. So movement takes a much more prominent role. And there is nothing in Half Life 1/10 as fun to fight as the Skaarj.

 

[residentgrigo]

I played Quake 2 last year and the campaign aged like shit SofNascimento. The gunplay is fine but the context ain´t. HL 1´s campaign somewhat holds up on the other hand if I look at only the levels and the variety but the Xen bits and the jump n´ run bits were trash even in the late 90s.
The gunplay, well... it´s functional enough. Just save scum.

 

[Deleted member 56580]

Op you should play Stalker, it sounds like an experience you'd truly hate because it has quite a bit of recoil and bullet drop, as well as not feeling "meaty" yet its one of the very best fps one can play on pc

HL 1 has great gunplay, all the weapons are working as they should. I absolutely don't get the SMG comment, it should never be precise at anything more than close range

 

[SofNascimento]

I played Quake 2 last year and the campaign aged like shit SofNascimento. The gunplay is fine but the context ain´t. HL 1´s campaign somewhat holds up on the other hand if I look at only the levels and the variety but the Xen bits and the jump n´ run bits were trash even in the late 90s.
The gunplay, well... it´s functional enough. Just save scum.

Click to shrink...

I think Quake 2 holds incredibly well.

Anyway, let's just all agree I never said Half Life wasn't a good FPS ok? It never happened.

 

[residentgrigo]

I´ll agree with you that Unreal is still worth playing today SofNascimento. Fuck the sequel though. All graphiX, not fun.
It predicted all the nonsense during the 7th gen a near-decade early and helped to kill the brand.