Ori and the Will of the Wisps | Review Thread

[pswii60]

I'm happy to go into detail, I just didn't want to derail the thread. For context I love 2D platformers with super responsive and precise gameplay. Mega Man is my favorite franchise, I have platinums in games like Celeste, Hollow Knight, Guacamelee, Rayman Origins, etc. Ori controls very differently from all of these games (which is fine). Ori moves with a lot of speed and a feel of sweeping roundness. Controlling Ori is like waving a wand. Ori is very small on screen which contributes to that feeling a bit. Floaty isn't the right word, but it distinctly feels like a game that was made in Unity (I didn't know if that was true while writing this, but I just looked it up and it is in fact made in Unity). Nothing to do with performance, just the feel of the movement.

Hollow Knight was not a perfect platformer but I always felt that I was able to control HK with complete precision. Every little flinch was intentional and exactly where I expected it to go with 1:1 correlation to the button input. With Ori I often feel like I'm flying by the seat of my pants; the arc of the jump has such a strange launch and motion to it that I constantly find myself running into the most basic of obstacles. Wall jumps are connected to the wall in such a way that it's often unpredictable at which point I'm actually going to launch. I don't mind dying in HK, Celeste, and Mega Man, because I always know exactly why it happened and that it was 100% my fault, whereas in Ori I honestly feel like I have died several times because the level design is unclear (such as ceilings suddenly stomping you out of nowhere, or all the glowing effects obscuring hazards) or just because at a base level I didn't feel like I could even control Ori. I can beat the kaizo levels in Mario Maker, but in this game I feel like I'm ramming headfirst into a basic goomba over and over again, which is extremely frustrating.

We'll see how the rest of the game goes. I think I'm only halfway through so there are undoubtedly some more moves to collect. Maybe there will be a breakthrough moment where it clicks and I feel like I am the character instead of feeling like I am telling an asset in a game engine where to go. Or maybe it's just not for me, who knows.

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Ok fair points, but honestly I think when you power up and progress further you may well feel different.

HK is a Unity game too btw. My issue with HK is the input lag on all console versions; in fact the only way I could tolerate it enough to fully enjoy the game in the end was playing at 120hz in PC with Gsync/NULL enabled.

Ori runs on a heavily modified/customised version of Unity (Moonity!).

 

[Servbot24]

Ok fair points, but honestly I think when you power up and progress further you may well feel different.

HK is a Unity game too btw. My issue with HK is the input lag on all console versions; in fact the only way I could tolerate it enough to fully enjoy the game in the end was playing at 120hz in PC with Gsync/NULL enabled.

Ori runs on a heavily modified/customised version of Unity (Moonity!).

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Interesting. I remember playing HK on two different screens and on one it felt perfect while on the other it was unbearable. Both PS4 though.

I also remember the HK devs saying they modeled movement after Mega Man X. They didn't nail it 100%, but 95% of MMX is still fantastic imo. I'd be curious to see what modifications Moon made.

 

[Terror-Billy]

I don't dare to give a number but I hope its really damn good.

 

[Mudo]

90-94
Last game was incredible
This looks even better!
Thanks Gamepass!!!! :)

 

[DoradoWinston]

anyone know if Ori is on a global release or is it just local time.

ie does me taking a vacation to New Zealand for the day work

 

[spam musubi]

Ok fair points, but honestly I think when you power up and progress further you may well feel different.

HK is a Unity game too btw. My issue with HK is the input lag on all console versions; in fact the only way I could tolerate it enough to fully enjoy the game in the end was playing at 120hz in PC with Gsync/NULL enabled.

Ori runs on a heavily modified/customised version of Unity (Moonity!).

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Interesting. I remember playing HK on two different screens and on one it felt perfect while on the other it was unbearable. Both PS4 though.

I also remember the HK devs saying they modeled movement after Mega Man X. They didn't nail it 100%, but 95% of MMX is still fantastic imo. I'd be curious to see what modifications Moon made.

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The problem with HK input lag on consoles is worse than it just being high. It's inconsistent - the lag will seemingly randomly go up and down, in my experience. Sometimes there's minimal lag (though still higher than something like Shovel Knight or Guacamelee or Celeste (I actually timed it with my iphone camera in high frame rate mode)), other times it's noticeable. While high input lag is undesirable, varying input lag is worse, because sometimes the same inputs respond differently, and since there are elements of HK that require quite a bit of precision, if you are attuned to this, it can be very frustrating. I haven't really encountered this issue in the PC version, but maybe that's because my PC is too strong and it never spikes.

 

[professor_t]

88-89, which is still damn good. People saying 95+ are insane. How many games even score that high (RDR2, BoTW, what else)?

 

[lvl 99 Pixel]

No idea of the second game functions similarly but I tested my theory on why d-pad feels strange to me even for basic movement and there really are at least 5 levels of movement speed depending on the stick while dpad was all or nothing

 

[Obsonet]

88-89, which is still damn good. People saying 95+ are insane. How many games even score that high (RDR2, BoTW, what else)?

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Yeah I think a 95+ is impossible unless it's a well known IP or developer

 

[RedEther]

Going with 95

 

[Welfare]

Going to guess 89. Would be great if it did better. I'll be playing it either way, I enjoyed the first game.

 

[Stoze]

I 100% agree with you. Floaty is exactly the word I would use. Controlling Ori in the air has this weird acceleration to it that never feels good and makes precise jumps really hard to pull off. It's not tight at all.

This is my biggest complaint about the first game and it's something I really hope they tightened up for the 2nd. But if not, I'm sure it will still be fun. But just wont reach the same highs as Hollow Knight for me (which I remember being a lot tighter).

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Base Ori kind of controls like Donkey Kong but in a small body which takes a little getting used too. He barely has any air control and is very momentum based on his own, but once you get more abilities like Bash you can counteract that. Overall I think making him control like that makes sense, because it helps the abilities feel more impactful when you get them and "refreshes" the game so to speak. Also I think the lower frames of animation on him when playing at 60FPS+ weirdly contributes to him feeling more sluggish than he actually is.

Hollow Knight is designed to have as little animation priority as possible so you can respond quickly to enemies and bosses, and unlike Ori once you get Dash and Mantis Claw early on the feeling of his movement doesn't really change for the rest of the game.

 

[Talus]

 

[almendrabl]

90-92

 

[Stoze]

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Wow, that's a massive difference. I only skimmed through it but they even have different background assets in some spots.

 

[Exentryk]

I like the momentum based movement Ori has. It feels great once Ori gets going and you essentially fly through the level. HK on the other hand the platforming and movement through the levels felt really boring and stilted. I also tended to miss more jumps in HK than in Ori (I mean jumps not registering and your character just falls down the platform instead of jumping). Think it might have something to do with adding extra frames after the platform where the jump can still register (not sure).

Anyway, highly looking forward to the sequel and seeing all the various abilities and weapons.

 

[R dott B]

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Frame rate looks rough.

 

[Drain You]

93

 

[jasius]

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This is going to run poorly on Xbox One OLD, the other one did in places anyway.

If anyone is taking a trip to NZ, what time do the games typically launch there?

 

[Karak]

I'm happy to go into detail, I just didn't want to derail the thread. For context I love 2D platformers with super responsive and precise gameplay. Mega Man is my favorite franchise, I have platinums in games like Celeste, Hollow Knight, Guacamelee, Rayman Origins, etc. Ori controls very differently from all of these games (which is fine). Ori moves with a lot of speed and a feel of sweeping roundness. Controlling Ori is like waving a wand. Ori is very small on screen which contributes to that feeling a bit. Floaty isn't the right word, but it distinctly feels like a game that was made in Unity (I didn't know if that was true while writing this, but I just looked it up and it is in fact made in Unity). Nothing to do with performance, just the feel of the movement.

Hollow Knight was not a perfect platformer but I always felt that I was able to control HK with complete precision. Every little flinch was intentional and exactly where I expected it to go with 1:1 correlation to the button input. With Ori I often feel like I'm flying by the seat of my pants; the arc of the jump has such a strange launch and motion to it that I constantly find myself running into the most basic of obstacles. Wall jumps are connected to the wall in such a way that it's often unpredictable at which point I'm actually going to launch. I don't mind dying in HK, Celeste, and Mega Man, because I always know exactly why it happened and that it was 100% my fault, whereas in Ori I honestly feel like I have died several times because the level design is unclear (such as ceilings suddenly stomping you out of nowhere, or all the glowing effects obscuring hazards) or just because at a base level I didn't feel like I could even control Ori. I can beat the kaizo levels in Mario Maker, but in this game I feel like I'm ramming headfirst into a basic goomba over and over again, which is extremely frustrating.

We'll see how the rest of the game goes. I think I'm only halfway through so there are undoubtedly some more moves to collect. Maybe there will be a breakthrough moment where it clicks and I feel like I am the character instead of feeling like I am telling an asset in a game engine where to go. Or maybe it's just not for me, who knows.

Click to shrink...

I love Ori and the Blind Forest but I absolute without a shadow a doubt get where you are coming from at times.

 

[StudioTan]

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Wow, they really changed a lot at the last minute. Game looks gorgeous though.

 

[Deleted member 1594]

Wonder why they went with a shift in the art direction for the patch. I kinda like the look of the retail version in a lot of those scenes. Looks like the patch bumps up contrast and saturation a lot.

 

[TheCrackedJack]

Yeah I think a 95+ is impossible unless it's a well known IP or developer

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Celeste on Xbox One has a 94 and that's a budget, low-fi indie. So, I wouldn't say it's impossible. But it does take time for a developer to hone their skills. Even Naughty Dog and CD Projekt didn't start out making 95+ games.

 

[Firefly]

Celeste on Xbox One has a 94 and that a budget, low-fi indie. So, I wouldn't say it's impossible. But it does take time for a developer to hone their skills. Even Naughty Dog and CD Projekt didn't start out making 95+ games.

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Thats a very small review count. Its 91 on Opencritic all reviews considered. I think the highest I've seen an indie title go is Minecraft, Braid and Inside. They're all 93. Would be amazing if Ori joined that list.

 

[TheCrackedJack]

Thats a very small review count. Its 91 on Opencritic all reviews considered. I think the highest I've seen an indie title go is Minecraft, Braid and Inside. They're all 93. Would be amazing if Ori joined that list.

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That's true, but Xbox Metacritic titles as a whole tend to have less reviews than say a PS4 title. Gears 5 has only 88 reviews counted, while God of War has 118. So, a smaller review count for Ori with great critical reception could still push it higher than normal. But realistically, I think it will be tough to go above say a 92.

 

[elzeus]

I think the day one patch is up it's about the same size as the game.

 

[Lady Gaia]

Loved the original but I'll have to wait to play this on a Scarlett family console when they launch. I hope it does well but expect it won't be universally loved to the degree that gets you a high 90s score. Just not mainstream enough.

 

[Yam's]

I'm happy to go into detail, I just didn't want to derail the thread. For context I love 2D platformers with super responsive and precise gameplay. Mega Man is my favorite franchise, I have platinums in games like Celeste, Hollow Knight, Guacamelee, Rayman Origins, etc. Ori controls very differently from all of these games (which is fine). Ori moves with a lot of speed and a feel of sweeping roundness. Controlling Ori is like waving a wand. Ori is very small on screen which contributes to that feeling a bit. Floaty isn't the right word, but it distinctly feels like a game that was made in Unity (I didn't know if that was true while writing this, but I just looked it up and it is in fact made in Unity). Nothing to do with performance, just the feel of the movement.

Hollow Knight was not a perfect platformer but I always felt that I was able to control HK with complete precision. Every little flinch was intentional and exactly where I expected it to go with 1:1 correlation to the button input. With Ori I often feel like I'm flying by the seat of my pants; the arc of the jump has such a strange launch and motion to it that I constantly find myself running into the most basic of obstacles. Wall jumps are connected to the wall in such a way that it's often unpredictable at which point I'm actually going to launch. I don't mind dying in HK, Celeste, and Mega Man, because I always know exactly why it happened and that it was 100% my fault, whereas in Ori I honestly feel like I have died several times because the level design is unclear (such as ceilings suddenly stomping you out of nowhere, or all the glowing effects obscuring hazards) or just because at a base level I didn't feel like I could even control Ori. I can beat the kaizo levels in Mario Maker, but in this game I feel like I'm ramming headfirst into a basic goomba over and over again, which is extremely frustrating.

We'll see how the rest of the game goes. I think I'm only halfway through so there are undoubtedly some more moves to collect. Maybe there will be a breakthrough moment where it clicks and I feel like I am the character instead of feeling like I am telling an asset in a game engine where to go. Or maybe it's just not for me, who knows.

Click to shrink...

This is exactly why I still haven't finished the first one. Didn't help that I tried it right after Celeste too.

 

[Temtastic Muns]

Frame rate looks rough.

Click to shrink...

Yeah, it does look a bit concerning. Even with the patch, the XboxOne X appears to be struggling. =\

 

[GennadiyKorol]

Yeah, it does look a bit concerning. Even with the patch, the XboxOne X appears to be struggling. =\

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I believe they were comparing Physical Release with the pre-release patch, not Day1 since that one landed just a few hours ago.

 

[Talus]

I believe they were comparing Physical Release with the pre-release patch, not Day1 since that one landed just a few hours ago.

Click to shrink...

That's encouraging. Hopefully the dips are kept to a bare minimum and we can enjoy the incredibly beautiful experience you've cooked up for us in all it's glory.

 

[Papercuts]

So when I land from my flight to New Zealand the proper patch is already out?

 

[thomasmahler]

So when I land from my flight to New Zealand the proper patch is already out?

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Yes, the Day1 patch dropped a few hours ago, so people should have a smooth experience from the get go :)

 

[Edge]

So when I land from my flight to New Zealand the proper patch is already out?

Click to shrink...

It's out already, so yeah.

 

[Datrael]

Yes, the Day1 patch dropped a few hours ago, so people should have a smooth experience from the get go :)

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Time for another playthrough then! :D

 

[KeRaSh]

Yes, the Day1 patch dropped a few hours ago, so people should have a smooth experience from the get go :)

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Like locked 60 fps smooth or close to that?
The game looks great so it's no surprise that it is demanding but I would have thought that the X1X could still handle it without any issues.
That's not meant in a way to insinuate the game is not optimized. I'm just generally amazed that a 2.5D game can be so incredibly fleshed out to push a console as powerful as that to the limit.
That being said, since I don't even own an Xbox I'll play it on PC just like I did with the first game.

 

[Theswweet]

Whatever happened to 120hz support?

 

[Drain You]

Like locked 60 fps smooth or close to that?
The game looks great so it's no surprise that it is demanding but I would have thought that the X1X could still handle it without any issues.
That's not meant in a way to insinuate the game is not optimized. I'm just generally amazed that a 2.5D game can be so incredibly fleshed out to push a console as powerful as that to the limit.
That being said, since I don't even own an Xbox I'll play it on PC just like I did with the first game.

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Also curious about the first bolded.

Second bolded, I don't really know much at all tbh, but it being a 2.5D game shouldn't really discredit it if that makes sense.

 

[KeRaSh]

Also curious about the first bolded.

Second bolded, I don't really know much at all tbh, but it being a 2.5D game shouldn't really discredit it if that makes sense.

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Yeah, it's not meant to look down on it. It's just that subconsciously you might think "it's a 2(.5)D game, how demanding can it be?" which is a very outdated line of thought. It's amazing what they've achieved with Ori.
Is the game running at 4k on the X1X? Maybe that's another factor as to why it's taxing the console as much as it does.
I haven't read up on any details about the game and its versions so far because I want to go in blind.
The only thing I've read about so far was the fact that they removed the manual save points and I'm glad they went that way.

 

[Brrandon]

Whatever happened to 120hz support?

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I dont think they ever said there will be 120hz, thomas just asked if there would be interest in 120hz on (presumably) xbox series x and pc

 

[Drain You]

Yeah, it's not meant to look down on it. It's just that subconsciously you might think "it's a 2(.5)D game, how demanding can it be?" which is a very outdated line of thought. It's amazing what they've achieved with Ori.
Is the game running at 4k on the X1X? Maybe that's another factory as to why it's taxing the console as much as it does.
I haven't read up on any details about the game and its versions so far because I want to go in blind.
The only thing I've read about so far was the fact that they removed the manual save points and I'm glad they went that way.

Click to shrink...

We are on the same page I think. I have an X1X curious to see how it runs tomorrow. Wish I didn't have work.

 

[Namtox]

I can confirm the patch is great. I revisited some trouble spots after the day 1 Patch to finalize my review and they ran perfectly.

Also side note, I'm 100 plus reviews in my career and I'm pretty sure the score we are publishing for this in a couple of hours is one of, if not the highest score I've ever given out.

I can't wait to see other people dive in and experience it.

 

[Vico]

I can confirm the patch is great. I revisited some trouble spots after the day 1 Patch to finalize my review and they ran perfectly.

Also side note, I'm 100 plus reviews in my career and I'm pretty sure the score we are publishing for this in a couple of hours is one of. if not the highest score I've ever given out.

I can't wait to see other people dive in and experience it.

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Goddamn! We're in for a treat, aren't we?
Just downloaded the day-one patch, can't wait!!!

 

[Phonzo]

3 mmore hours

 

[GennadiyKorol]

I dont think they ever said there will be 120hz, thomas just asked if there would be interest in 120hz on (presumably) xbox series x and pc

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I am personally a huge fan of high refreshrate gaming and HDR. So Ori 2 was engineered ground up to support variable refresh rate and high refresh rates, it can go up to 180 if your machine can handle it :) I am running it between 144-180 personally. This was one of the reasons we switched away from the 2d sprite pipeline. With 3d you can do perfect blending, secondary layered physics and perfect super-sampling of all animations and run it at any frame-rate. It's an unbelievable leap from Ori1 once you see it running at those hertz, so silky smooth with all of the transitions between all the poses our animators added and secondary physics (things like Ori's tail and ears) and I absolutely love it.

HDR is going to come to PC a bit later, we hit a few hiccups with the PC support there and we'll probably add a few more tweaks into settings for X1 HDR as well.

As for 2d, 2.5d vs 3d games and how taxing they can be on different hardware I would love to talk about it more one day... Maybe after we're done in a little bit :)

 

[thomasmahler]

I can confirm the patch is great. I revisited some trouble spots after the day 1 Patch to finalize my review and they ran perfectly.

Also side note, I'm 100 plus reviews in my career and I'm pretty sure the score we are publishing for this in a couple of hours is one of, if not the highest score I've ever given out.

I can't wait to see other people dive in and experience it.

Click to shrink...

Thank you. These last 2 days have given me heart-palpitations...

 

[Kiyoshi]

HDR isn't day one on PC? In that case I'm going to wait ☹️

 

[pswii60]

I am personally a huge fan of high refreshrate gaming and HDR. So Ori 2 was engineered ground up to support variable refresh rate and high refresh rates, it can go up to 180 if your machine can handle it :) I am running it between 144-180 personally. This was one of the reasons we switched away from the 2d sprite pipeline. With 3d you can do perfect blending, secondary layered physics and perfect super-sampling of all animations and run it at any frame-rate. HDR is going to come to PC a bit later, we hit a few hiccups with the PC support there and we'll probably add a few more tweaks into settings for X1 HDR as well.

As for 2d, 2.5d vs 3d games and how taxing they can be on different hardware I would love to talk about it more one day... Maybe after we're done in a little bit :)

Click to shrink...

No HDR at PC launch is a shame. I might wait then, do you know how long we'll have to wait for it?

Good to hear about the high framerates. Does the PC version support exclusive fullscreen (for auto HDR enable and refresh/res not being tied to your desktop?)

 

[Brrandon]

I am personally a huge fan of high refreshrate gaming and HDR. So Ori 2 was engineered ground up to support variable refresh rate and high refresh rates, it can go up to 180 if your machine can handle it :) I am running it between 144-180 personally. This was one of the reasons we switched away from the 2d sprite pipeline. With 3d you can do perfect blending, secondary layered physics and perfect super-sampling of all animations and run it at any frame-rate. It's an unbelievable leap from Ori1 once you see it running at those hertz, so silky smooth with all of the transitions between all the poses our animators added and secondary physics (things like Ori's tail and ears) and I absolutely love it.

HDR is going to come to PC a bit later, we hit a few hiccups with the PC support there and we'll probably add a few more tweaks into settings for X1 HDR as well.

As for 2d, 2.5d vs 3d games and how taxing they can be on different hardware I would love to talk about it more one day... Maybe after we're done in a little bit :)

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Awesome! Thank you for responding and being active around here

 

[ImaginaShawn]

Wow,rare post from two senior devs.

Hey, guys, I hope you guys score as high as possible.