Opinion: The current run of Walt Disney Animation Studios films has surpassed the Disney Renaissance

[EdReedFan20]

I know this will ruffle many feathers, but I'll say it anyways. The Disney Renaissance from 1989-1999 was considered to be a new Golden Age for Walt Disney Animation Studios. It was (and still is) a fantastic run However, it seems we're in an equally impressive run of films. I personally think it's a more impressive run because it's been going on for longer and shows no signs of slowing down. The 90's run was very front-heavy. They never reached the highs of The Little Mermaid, Beauty and the Beast, Aladdin, and The Lion King in terms of pop culture impact. While it's arguable those four movies are better than any of the movies out during this current run, I think the current run has been better overall. Most consider the current run to begin with Tangled, I however, think it should begin with Meet the Robinsons because that is where John Lasseter started overseeing Disney Animation (which I assume ended with Moana, following the fallout due to the reports of sexual harassment unless he still has a credit on Wreck it Ralph 2). I know nostalgia means a lot, but I just see what they've been able to do from 2007-2016 and think they have surpassed 1989-1999.

Here's the Rotten Tomatoes scores for the Disney Renaissance, the "Dark Ages" (despite some winners), and the New Disney Renaissance:

Disney Renaissance:
The Little Mermaid (1989): 92% Certified Fresh
The Rescuers Down Under (1990): 68% Fresh
Beauty and the Beast (1991): 94% Certified Fresh
Aladdin (1992): 94% Certified Fresh
The Lion King (1994): 93% Certified Fresh
Pocahontas (1995): 57% Rotten
The Hunchback of Notre Dame (1996): 74% Fresh
Hercules (1997): 83% Certified Fresh
Mulan (1998): 86% Certified Fresh
Tarzan (1999): 88% Certified Fresh

"Dark Ages"
Fantasia 2000 (2000): 82% Certified Fresh
Dinosaur (2000): 65% Fresh
The Emperor's New Groove (2000): 85% Certified Fresh
Atlantis: The Lost Emperor (2001): 49% Rotten
Lilo and Stitch (2002): 86% Certified Fresh
Treasure Planet (2002): 69% Fresh
Brother Bear (2003): 38% Rotten
Home on the Range (2004): 54% Rotten
Chicken Little (2005): 37% Rotten

New Disney Renaissance:
Meet the Robinsons (2007): 67% Fresh
Bolt (2008): 89% Certified Fresh
The Princess and the Frog (2009): 85% Certified Fresh
Tangled (2010): 89% Certified Fresh
Winnie the Pooh (2011): 91% Certified Fresh
Wreck-it-Ralph (2012): 87% Certified Fresh
Frozen (2013): 90% Certified Fresh
Big Hero 6 (2014): 89% Certified Fresh
Zootopia (2016): 97% Certified Fresh
Moana (2016): 96% Certified Fresh

 

[Finaj]

I agree. The characters, stories, and themes have become more complex and interesting. While big expressive villians have taken a back seat, there's more time dedicated to fleshing out the protagonists.

 

[Puck Beaverton]

They're more consistent. Honestly only Winnie the Pooh, Frozen, and maaaaybe Tangled I would consider legitimate classics. Kinda pushing with those three.

 

[TheFireman]

Gonna have to disagree. There's been some good stuff, but none are as good as Aladdin was.

 

[EdReedFan20]

I think it should be noted that we are getting more sequels in the next few years than ever before. Prior to this year's Ralph Breaks The Internet: Wreck-it-Ralph 2 and next year's Frozen 2, Walt Disney Animation Studios has only released on sequel in their history: 1990's The Rescuers Down Under, the sequel to 1977's The Rescuers. That's pretty good restraint, though that seems to be changing slightly.

 

[Neptonic]

Bolt being better rated then a lot of the more interesting Dark Age films sucks

 

[PeakPointMatrix]

If you mean in terms of consistency, then yes.

In terms of heights, the current run has simply not even gotten close. Lion King, Aladdin, Little Mermaid, Beauty and the Beast I can say without hesitation remain unmatched in terms of film/song/plot/cultural impact. Even late renaissance had great films (Hercules, Mulan, Tarzan).

That's not to say the current run isn't good or even great, I just don't think it reaches the same heights.

 

[EdReedFan20]

If you mean in terms of consistency, then yes.

In terms of heights, the current run has simply not even gotten close. Lion King, Aladdin, Little Mermaid, Beauty and the Beast I can say without hesitation remain unmatched in terms of film/song/plot/cultural impact. Even late renaissance had great films (Hercules, Mulan, Tarzan).

That's not to say the current run isn't good or even great, I just don't think it reaches the same heights.

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I specifically said that:

They never reached the highs of The Little Mermaid, Beauty and the Beast, Aladdin, and The Lion King in terms of pop culture impact.

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[sphagnum]

The only one of the new era movies I liked was TPATF, so can't say I agree.

 

[Elandyll]

How did the periods get determined?

It seems to me that Fantasia 2000 would logically close the Renaissance, while Meet the Robinsons would end the Dark Ages and their terrible streak.

Bolt, P&TF and Tangle were clearly the new start imo.

 

[mrmickfran]

The Lion King alone trumps the new age.

 

[Richietto]

The consistency is far better but the highs are not even close. Alladin and Lion King are just... Fantastic and Little Mermaid and Beauty are great. Tangled and Zootopia are up there but they don't have me watching again time and time again.

 

[Servbot24]

Aladdin and Lion King are waaaay better than any of the new ones.

 

[kurahador]

I dunno. Robinsons, Bolt, Frozen, BH6 and Moana felt like it could belong in the dark ages.

 

[EdReedFan20]

I do think this will be an interesting debate when kids growing up with the current movies are as old as the ones who grew up with the older movies. Nostalgia is such a powerful thing. I definitely have more of a connection to the older films, but I wonder if nostalgia is factoring in.

 

[Josh5890]

I don't know. DIsney is having a nice run but that 90's run is pretty incredible.

 

[Tambini]

Not even close tbh. None of those films hold a candle to Aladdin, Lion King, Beauty and the Beast. They have been consistently good but that's about it. Although I did love Moana

 

[Maximo]

I dunno. Robinsons, Bolt, Frozen, BH6 and Moana felt like it could belong in the dark ages.

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What the frick.....

 

[Finaj]

I'm really interested in how Frozen 2 will turn out. Disney hasn't done many sequels, and certainly no sequels to princess movies (the straight-to-dvd films don't count). Anna was given more focus in the first film, so will Elsa get more focus this time around? What kind of arc will they give her? What kind of villain will they introduce? How will Elsa end up using her authority as Queen? Will they give Elsa a love interest?

 

[Razgriz-Specter]

Eh,

only Tangled and Frozen are classic on that level imo.

 

[Jarmel]

lol no

None of Disney's recent output is close to the heavenly trio of Lion King, Aladdin, and Beauty & the Beast. You might have a better argument if you were comparing some of the weaker movies in the Renaissance to the current output. As a whole though? lol no

 

[Window]

I've only seen Wreck it Ralph from the new ones and thought it was thoroughly mediocre. I think the new Disney films are a lot more comparable in their storytelling to Pixar than Renaissance Disney, outside of maybe the 3 princess films.

 

[EdReedFan20]

I'm really interested in how Frozen 2 will turn out. Disney hasn't done many sequels, and certainly no sequels to princess movies (the straight-to-dvd films don't count). Anna was given more focus in the first film, so will Elsa get more focus this time around? What kind of arc will they give her? What kind of villain will they introduce? How will Elsa end up using her authority as Queen? Will they give Elsa a love interest?

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The rumor is that they will and it might be a same-sex relationship. That would be a first for the studio, I think.

 

[DeathPeak]

Moana is the only movie from the New Renaissance that I personally can enjoy on the same level as the 90s films.

 

[oreomunsta]

Lilo and Stitch (2002): 86% Certified Fresh

Who am I going to have to fight to bring this score up?

 

[Maximo]

Eh,

only Tangled and Moana are classic on that level imo.

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Fixed.

 

[lidmat]

I think having clearly defined villains puts the 90s renaissance over the top. The stories are good now, but there isn't that one memorable villain.... except for Princess and the Frog.

EDIT: And Big Hero 6.... the fact they humanized the villain by revealing what led him to his actions.

 

[Deleted member 2085]

How did the periods get determined?

It seems to me that Fantasia 2000 would logically close the Renaissance, while Meet the Robinsons would end the Dark Ages and their terrible streak.

Bolt, P&TF and Tangle were clearly the new start imo.

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Fantasia 2000 was not as well received and was a flop. Tarzan marked the end of the Renaissance because it was the last movie (for a while) to have huge success in the BO.

 

[Jarmel]

I'm not sure I buy the consistency argument either as the only dud in the Renaissance era is Pocahontas and maybe Tarzan.

 

[Gundam]

Opinion: Most of the renaissance films aren't that great to begin with.

 

[Antrax]

Frozen, BH6 and Moana felt like it could belong in the dark ages.

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Hard disagree

 

[EdReedFan20]

Fantasia 2000 was not as well received and was a flop. Tarzan marked the end of the Renaissance because it was the last movie (for a while) to have huge success in the BO.

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And Dinosaur was such a huge departure from their previous movies.

I'm not sure I buy the consistency argument either as the only dud in the Renaissance era is Pocahontas and maybe Tarzan.

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I'd put Rescuers Down Under as a dud before I'd put Tarzan.

 

[Deleted member 9399]

I had no idea brother Bear was that negatively received. I figured it was just a serviceable yet underperforming film like princess and the frog or something

 

[Herne]

Meet the Robinsons was god-awful tripe, though. I really wouldn't use that as your starting point of a golden age.

 

[Aangster]

On the villain front, it's not even close to the 90's Renaissance's favour. Moana's take/twist on it was solid, but the run of

Spoiler

surprise-villain twists from Ralph to Zootopia have been rubbish.

Unlike Monsters Inc. or Incredibles 1, it didn't really work for more recent Pixar films like the Incredibles 2 either.

Sure, the films are generally aimed at younger audiences and teach us more about judging a book from its cover etc., but this plot device has become overused to the max.

 

[Adam_Roman]

Moana and Big Hero 6 are top tier.

 

[EdReedFan20]

Meet the Robinsons was god-awful tripe, though. I really wouldn't use that as your starting point of a golden age.

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I was debating that part. I wanted to begin it with the start of John Lasseter's involvement with Walt Disney Animation Studios. If I'm not mistaken, he actually came in late during that movie's development. Bolt would've been the first movie to have more of his influence. And if I made Bolt the start of this current era, it would work out where the Renaissance was ten movies, the Dark Ages was ten movies, and The New Renaissance will be ten movies with the release of Wreck it Ralph 2.

 

[HeartofWinds]

Yup. I think its better than Pixar as well.

 

[Ryan.]

Agreed. And to add: Meet the Robinsons is highly underrated

I dunno. Robinsons, Bolt, Frozen, BH6 and Moana felt like it could belong in the dark ages.

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What is this?

 

[Fuchsia]

Lilo and Stitch (2002): 86% Certified Fresh

Who am I going to have to fight to bring this score up?

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I'll back you up. Let's do this.

 

[Window]

Lilo and Stitch (2002): 86% Certified Fresh

Who am I going to have to fight to bring this score up?

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That's a fantastic score. Rotten tomatoes is only worthwhile as a binary indicator of good vs bad films. Relative comparisons between films based on a few percentage points are meaningless. Hate people's obsession with the specific scores in Rottentomatoes and Metacritic.

 

[Gentlemen]

Rearranged the list based on personal ranking, and I think the old renaissance edges out the current crop.

Too much of the new stuff lands in B tier or below for me to view it as a big leap forward from the 90s stuff.

S Tier
Disney Renaissance: Beauty and the Beast (1991): 94% Certified Fresh
Disney Renaissance: Aladdin (1992): 94% Certified Fresh
Disney Renaissance: The Lion King (1994): 93% Certified Fresh
New Disney Renaissance: Wreck-it-Ralph (2012): 87% Certified Fresh
A Tier
Disney Renaissance: The Little Mermaid (1989): 92% Certified Fresh
"Dark Ages" Fantasia 2000 (2000): 82% Certified Fresh
"Dark Ages" Lilo and Stitch (2002): 86% Certified Fresh
New Disney Renaissance: Tangled (2010): 89% Certified Fresh
New Disney Renaissance: Frozen (2013): 90% Certified Fresh
New Disney Renaissance: Zootopia (2016): 97% Certified Fresh
New Disney Renaissance: Moana (2016): 96% Certified Fresh
B Tier
Disney Renaissance: Mulan (1998): 86% Certified Fresh
Disney Renaissance: The Hunchback of Notre Dame (1996): 74% Fresh
Disney Renaissance: Hercules (1997): 83% Certified Fresh
"Dark Ages" The Emperor's New Groove (2000): 85% Certified Fresh
New Disney Renaissance: Bolt (2008): 89% Certified Fresh
New Disney Renaissance: The Princess and the Frog (2009): 85% Certified Fresh
New Disney Renaissance: Winnie the Pooh (2011): 91% Certified Fresh
New Disney Renaissance: Big Hero 6 (2014): 89% Certified Fresh
C tier
Disney Renaissance: Tarzan (1999): 88% Certified Fresh
Disney Renaissance: The Rescuers Down Under (1990): 68% Fresh
Disney Renaissance: Pocahontas (1995): 57% Rotten
Roll Tier
"Dark Ages" Dinosaur (2000): 65% Fresh
"Dark Ages" Atlantis: The Lost Empire (2001): 49% Rotten
"Dark Ages" Treasure Planet (2002): 69% Fresh
"Dark Ages" Brother Bear (2003): 38% Rotten
"Dark Ages" Home on the Range (2004): 54% Rotten
"Dark Ages" Chicken Little (2005): 37% Rotten
New Disney Renaissance: Meet the Robinsons (2007): 67% Fresh

Edit: Hold up none of the 'dark ages' stuff is what I recognize as 'dark ages' disney. when did that definition change.

 

[HeartofWinds]

Meet the Robinsons was god-awful tripe, though. I really wouldn't use that as your starting point of a golden age.

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I dunno, I thought it was pretty endearing. Bowler Hat guy was a fun villain.

 

[Oniletter]

I think Emperors new groove and the original Lilo & Stich are better movies than anything in the new renaissance ( I really liked Tangled and Princess and the frog though).

I don't get why people like Frozen, Moana and especially Zootopia so much. I disagree with the op.

 

[Deleted member 2085]

Looking at the numbers, I think the Disney Revival started with The Princess and the Frog since it made $267 million worldwide on a $105 million budget. You can make the same argument with Bolt but not with Meet the Robinsons as that did not have a massive BO return.

 

[Razgriz-Specter]

The rumor is that they will and it might be a same-sex relationship. That would be a first for the studio, I think.

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Won't be too crazy for them, Disney already set the table for it with Once Upon a Time.

(Dorothy and Red Riding Hood)

and

(Mulan in love with Aurora)
which sadly never got resolved.

 

[Herne]

I dunno, I thought it was pretty endearing. Bowler Hat guy was a fun villain.

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I've only seen it once and it was many years ago now, but I remember that, some nice moments aside, almost the entire thing was utterly dreadful. I'm very surprised to see that people in here actually like it. To me it seemed more like a low-budget, low effort film from a lesser studio, kinda like Space Chimps or the Nut Job movies, not anything that came from Disney. It seemed way too low quality in every respect to be a Disney movie to me.

 

[Blader]

I liked Wreck It Ralph and Zootopia but wouldn't consider either of them classics, let alone on the level of Aladdin, Lion King, etc. And I never saw what the hell the big deal about Frozen was.

I'd put Rescuers Down Under as a dud before I'd put Tarzan.

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How dare you!

 

[TheGhost]

I prefer the dark ages, not into half the crap they put out now. Well besides Frozen, but I feel like I can file that one under indoctrination. The Cinderella/Sword in the Stone/Sleeping Beauty/Robin Hood era remains my favorite. Also...kind of fuck 3-d animation. Hand Draw me a classic one if you still remember how to do that Disney

 

[TDLink]

I would definitely still count Meet the Robinsons and Bolt as part of the Dark Ages.

With the current run really starting with Princess and the Frog. That said, I do agree the current run is great. But where it still lacks in comparison to the renaissance is the amazing music. While Tangled, Frozen, PatF, and Moana have all had good music, I don't think they really hold a candle to Little Mermaid, Aladdin, Beauty and the Beast, Hercules, Mulan, Pocahonats, Lion King, and Hunchback. Just an absolutely amazing string of movies with amazing music.

I feel like the modern era's music has just been alright/middling with some exception and the movies have been good somewhat in spite of that. I would even say the best movies of the era (Zootopia and WiR) have no songs at all.