You're aware that they're futureproofed right? They were designed for HD consoles from the outset and that's why the 3DS often struggled in battle. Using that as a point against it is illogical
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Only Pokémon in Galar Pokédex can be transferred to Sword & Shield from Pokémon Home; similar restrictions intended for subsequent titles
- Thread starter Busaiku
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This make the fact they are cutting pokemon worse and the fact the games run like ass in the 3DS pointless.
Yes I'm quite aware, which makes their argument that transitioning to new hardware is causing them too much work illogical, by extension. All models but the new Pokemon are already complete and futureproofed, right.
Catching them all was never a required thing and I don't get why people are using it as a good reason for why the Pokemon availability got cut.
There's a reason for why there are two games with different Pokemon from the Pokedex available in each game. It was a great goal to achieve if you wanted to get it. But Game Freak has never forced you to catch them all to get a good ending.
There's a reason for why there are two games with different Pokemon from the Pokedex available in each game. It was a great goal to achieve if you wanted to get it. But Game Freak has never forced you to catch them all to get a good ending.
Not a Pokemon player I'm just interested in this discussion so I may be off, but doesn't this decision impact transferring some of the Mons into the new game via the Bank? If your fav is left out then you can't transfer it even if you didn't want to "catch 'em all"
Yes that is correct. So people who want to bring over, say, Typhlosion, and it's not in the Pokedex, then you're out of luck. They may patch it later on, but I'm not having faith in GF on that.
Which then makes the people who say that they're glad that GF is cutting the amount of mons down so that it's easier to catch them all doesn't make sense. Because there has not been any game that forced you to do so.
Isn't it weird to think about the future of the franchise now? Like, maybe with SwSh they'll be more inclined to include the popular Pokémon, like Charizard, Mewtwo, etc, but there's gotta be a time when they'll have to make room for the Pokémon that will be missing in this first Gen VIII release (hopefully). What I mean is, that eventually, we'll most likely get a game where some of the popular Pokémon like Charizard, Lucario and so will NOT be available at all, unless in all the upcoming games they keep the same roster of old Pokémon over and over, but it just will seem weird, for example, the Kanto starters and legendary Pokémon belonging to every regional Dex from now on.
Every game will now have its own lineup of Pokemon. It will change from game to game. There will be compatibility lists online that tell you which Pokemon "work" with each game. It's going to suck.
To be honest, it's stuff like this that is moving me away from Pokemon. The core games we get from Game Freak that have an increasing amount cut content and bizarre decisions, combined with the huge focus on mobile makes me realize this just may not be for me anymore. I enjoyed it when I felt like they cared about making good games and taking the brand forward. Now it feels like the core games are an afterthought while all their attention is funneled into creating more mobile content. I'm losing interest.
I wish people were more conscious of what this change represents. And I don't wanna sound like the typical "you're not a fan if..." but I just seriously can't comprehend how someone who's really been a fan of the Pokémon games / franchise for a while can be happy or totally ok with a decision like this. It's just, to me it was something that was basic for a Pokémon game, the Pokémon creatures.
They could've removed the wild battles like they did in Let's Go, or Gyms like they did in Alola, or the National Pokédex itself as they did in those games too. They could remove any aspect from the "main formula" but as long as the Pokémon were there, everything was fine.
I can't even imagine the developers or whoever made the planning of these games, going through the list of Pokémon and saying "this is in, this is not" and leaving all the cut Pokémon in a drawer as they see how their peers make the jump to the next generation. Ok, maybe that's too dramatic lol but to me it really IS that tragic.
Sites and twitters that wanted to go to bat for the games, making a huge fuss about the fans being problematic by complaining about the game being less than what it was expected to be while uttering not a peep about that were really showing their real motives.
100% this. While I respect the fact that Gamefreak have been honest about these decisions early enough in the cycle (allowing people to cancel their pre-orders), their statement about this being the policy for all games moving forward is a real killer. This essentially confirms that Ultra Sun and Ultra Moon will remain the last Pokémon games I'll ever buy. If I have a Pokémon itch, I'll prefer playing the older games again instead of paying 60$ for incomplete products. This is tough for me, because Pokémon is my favorite series and growing up, I didn't really play other games that much. That all has changed with the 3DS and the Switch, and I don't mind not playing the new Pokémon games as much now, as I would have in the past. It's a real shame, because I was really looking forward to getting back to the series after getting burned by Sun and Moon and not being interested in the Let's go games
Sooo, fun fact time. Me complaining about all of this news to my sister, who had just started getting back into Pokemon through Sun and Moon (And is now not getting Sword or Shield after having this controversy explained to her), somehow ended with her girlfriend lending me her copy of Let's Go Eevee for a little while. I've been playing it for a bit and I figured I'd leave my thoughts here in this thread rather than bitch about it elsewhere.
My biggest thoughts so far are that I kinda find it boring and hard to stay interested in. Maybe it's just my negative feelings about the series since this news bleeding through or maybe I'm just sick to death of Kanto. As I play, it just becomes more and more clear how unambitious it is. This is our fifth pair of games with Kanto in it and rather than really shake things up and make things fresh, it's just a boring, near 1-1 recreation of the originals with prettier graphics. They really missed a chance to truly change things up with this remake and expand the Kanto region into something bigger that the new hardware would allow, and you get the impression that they almost want to treat it like a real shake up by giving us a new protagonist and rival, but it never goes much farther than being a direct remake. It feels like wasted potential. They could have at the very least shaken things up a little by expanding the Pokedex, but I guess we can't ruin the sanctity of the original 151, aside from Alolan forms and megas for some reason. It would at least be holding my attention a little more if the pokedex was bigger and had new options compared to the usual Kanto lineup. They could have at least done something with the Hoenn Pokemon that had just been introduced into Go at the time.
It also kinda blows my mind that there was a huge narrative back when Let's Go came out that the old way of catching Pokemon was boring and this is better. As far as I'm concerned, the Go mechanics in this are far more uninvolved and boring. Maybe it's because I'm playing it in handheld mode and the motion controls aren't coming into play as much, but I was expecting it to be a little more of a game changer for how much people were praising it. I don't hate it but it's just kinda there for me. It works better in a mobile format when you're literally on the go. I'm not sure how I feel about overworld Pokemon yet either. Sometimes I like but sometimes I miss the random encounter format. I wish there was an option to switch between the two since the grass for random encounters are there anyway.
I also don't care for how heavily they push your partner onto you. I was intentionally avoiding Eevee because I didn't want to break the already easy difficult in half with an OP partner Pokemon but then they pretty much vacuum seal Eevee to your head anyway so you can never truly get away from it. Walking and riding Pokemon are really nice though, so of course those are the features that got tossed for Sword and Shield...
It just kinda bothers me how once these games came out so much of the criticism dried up. It got me wondering if maybe they were a lot better than what they looked like to me, but even going in with low expectations they still aren't doing much for me. It really is emblematic of how Gamefreak can get away with anything that these didn't get way more criticism from game reviewers on release, especially while being full priced games. They could have done so much more with this remake and they didn't. I was hoping that it would be better than I thought it was going to be, but in the end it pretty much is the uninspired, cash grab remake that I figured it was that's only getting away with it off nostalgia and a late attempt to cash in on the Pokemon Go hype.
My biggest thoughts so far are that I kinda find it boring and hard to stay interested in. Maybe it's just my negative feelings about the series since this news bleeding through or maybe I'm just sick to death of Kanto. As I play, it just becomes more and more clear how unambitious it is. This is our fifth pair of games with Kanto in it and rather than really shake things up and make things fresh, it's just a boring, near 1-1 recreation of the originals with prettier graphics. They really missed a chance to truly change things up with this remake and expand the Kanto region into something bigger that the new hardware would allow, and you get the impression that they almost want to treat it like a real shake up by giving us a new protagonist and rival, but it never goes much farther than being a direct remake. It feels like wasted potential. They could have at the very least shaken things up a little by expanding the Pokedex, but I guess we can't ruin the sanctity of the original 151, aside from Alolan forms and megas for some reason. It would at least be holding my attention a little more if the pokedex was bigger and had new options compared to the usual Kanto lineup. They could have at least done something with the Hoenn Pokemon that had just been introduced into Go at the time.
It also kinda blows my mind that there was a huge narrative back when Let's Go came out that the old way of catching Pokemon was boring and this is better. As far as I'm concerned, the Go mechanics in this are far more uninvolved and boring. Maybe it's because I'm playing it in handheld mode and the motion controls aren't coming into play as much, but I was expecting it to be a little more of a game changer for how much people were praising it. I don't hate it but it's just kinda there for me. It works better in a mobile format when you're literally on the go. I'm not sure how I feel about overworld Pokemon yet either. Sometimes I like but sometimes I miss the random encounter format. I wish there was an option to switch between the two since the grass for random encounters are there anyway.
I also don't care for how heavily they push your partner onto you. I was intentionally avoiding Eevee because I didn't want to break the already easy difficult in half with an OP partner Pokemon but then they pretty much vacuum seal Eevee to your head anyway so you can never truly get away from it. Walking and riding Pokemon are really nice though, so of course those are the features that got tossed for Sword and Shield...
It just kinda bothers me how once these games came out so much of the criticism dried up. It got me wondering if maybe they were a lot better than what they looked like to me, but even going in with low expectations they still aren't doing much for me. It really is emblematic of how Gamefreak can get away with anything that these didn't get way more criticism from game reviewers on release, especially while being full priced games. They could have done so much more with this remake and they didn't. I was hoping that it would be better than I thought it was going to be, but in the end it pretty much is the uninspired, cash grab remake that I figured it was that's only getting away with it off nostalgia and a late attempt to cash in on the Pokemon Go hype.
People who said this are dumb as hell when the reality of the game's controls are a total joke. The controls dont work in TV mode being inaccurate and in handheld mode you have to not be moving at all for you to gyro aim. The mechanics aren't even as good as Go, Go has spin balls which aid in capture and give you more exp. Here the only capture variants are just the regular nice, great, and excellent and the only reason you want to get a Nice, Great, or Excellent is for an exp multiplier, where as in Go it also makes catching mons easier. But since the game is so fucking easy anyway, there isn't any point.
Look it's about fostering an atmosphere of positivity and it's easier to have that with racist fan art than memes about N64 trees.
The way of encountering Pokemon was arguably better and something they stuck with for gen8, the way of catching them was not. The (sometimes forced and glitchy) motion controls were the low point of the game, which is a shame because a more indepth version of the GO style could have been done a lot better.
This is why people see you as defending Game Freak.
Their argument only has 'merit' in the sense that it's probably true they can't complete animation work in time for an October release with the staff/budget they have right now. But...that's why so much current criticism is directly focused on that! You absolutely can throw money at stuff like this - I have no idea why you would say otherwise. But the idea that the developers of a game in the most successful media property on the planet can't or won't increase their staff or budget to get the job done properly just isn't acceptable.
Other, less successful developers/publishers do it. Game Freak doesn't, and there's only one real conclusion you can draw from that: corporate greed. Whether on the part of them or The Pokemon Company. Either way, people defending that is why the word shill gets thrown around so much.
Edit: To be clearer - they have openly said that they almost made the decision to remove Pokemon during the development of Sun and Moon. Which means that they knew this was even more likely for Sword and Shield. You're right that they might not be able to throw money at it right now to have everything ready at launch (although even that seems questionable), but...they knew this was coming. And did nothing to prepare for it. So there's no excuse.
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It's true that they should have seen this coming if they were already thinking about cutting the amount of Pokémon available back during SuMo's development, but they 100% don't have enough time to fix this before launch. See this Tumblr post by a game dev about similar situations.
THANK YOU!
This whole thing been going round and round with defenders and defenders denying their defenses and I was starting to feel like I was taking crazy pills.
That post specifically focuses on developers, though. Based on what Game Freak has said, I'm not sure how much of that really applies to Game Freak's situation. Modeling, texture work and animations aren't really the kinds of thing that you'd think one would need to be 'brought up to speed' on. New programmers would definitely have an adjustment period as they get used to a new studio's quirks, but as far as I've heard the more artistic side of game development is fairly uniform across the industry?
Launch of the game or launch of Home? Like we don't really know when the launch of Home is besides it being in 2020
It obviously isn't an apples-to-apples comparison and the post is talking about people with very specific skillsets, but finding animators you can ease into the production pipeline does take time, and the game needs to go gold in 5 months, give or take. It's hard to gauge without knowing how GF's animation team works specifically, but it doesn't strike me as possible.
That's fair, actually, I hadn't considered that Home is the thing this conversation should focus on. The other mons can get patched after the games come out but before Home launches, I can see that.
- Models were futureproofed.
- Most animations are identical to the animations from the 3DS games. I'm aware that there are definitely some new animations as well, but most of what we have seen is recycled from older games.
- We have not seen the revolutionary camping feature yet. However, an optional feature (which probably does not add much to the game) should not be prioritized over including all the Pokémon.
- The battle animations in general have not evolved at all compared to the gen 7 games. Why are the Pokémon still not walking to their target for physical moves?
Shit pisses me off. All that bullshit sanctimony and won't say shit about an actual problem.
Yeah, I love tapping on my screen without thinking during battle, or not having abilities and items. /s
Unless they're adding the option to completely overhaul the battle system for something closer to the main games its not really comparable. Spamming 2 moves in real time put me off ever playing the game. That was never the draw for GO anyway.
Is it really an offering when its so stripped down in utility? the most you can kind of say is that some of the old models can be displayed on your phone.
This is quite ridiculous. You're basically shaming the people at Game Freak by saying that lesser devs can do better. You know nothing of how Pokémon games are developed or the environment they're made in. Saying that they should should have planned this by just hiring beforehand shows you really don't know much about development.
Good lord...
I think you're severely overestimating Pokemon Go's capability of being complex (or polished).
Biggest entertainment brand in the world couldn't afford to put all the creatures in the next installment. Please keep making excuses and PR for them, they need it.
Thinking about how they were planning to start the cull back during Sun and Moon's development, I have to wonder why they even bothered with the virtual console games and their forward compatability
We know from interviews that GameFreak simply has too many different projects going at once to make an excellent HD Pokémon. They lack technical expertise and manpower and that's why they've been struggling to make the games as complete as their DS entries since they moved to the 3DS.
No one is accusing you of defending it only because you're "slamming down misinformation", they're accusing you of defending it because of statements like this:
"Na, let's stay hyped.
Other than the dex issue, which absolutely sucks, it still looks like a fantastic game and the game we're getting in November would have been the same regardless of if we had it all coded in or not so it's still the game we were excited about two weeks ago.
So let's stay positive! "
...How did I shame the people at Game Freak? I said that less successful studios (in a financial sense) have hired more staff when needed. What is incorrect about that? It happened a ton when studios first started to move to HD development. Game Freak makes games in one of the highest-selling franchises ever, so don't you think it's odd that they're still keeping their studio and budgets relatively lean?
Care to explain why you think planning ahead wasn't a solution here? What do you know about game development? Cutting Pokemon is basically a dealbreaker when it comes to the series imo. And literally all they needed to do to avoid that is have more modelers/animators on the payroll from the getgo. If that's not the case, please elaborate. But even Game Freak themselves have alluded that it was basically just a time constraint issue, so I'm not sure what you're meaning here.
And lastly...even if I was 'shaming' Game Freak (which again, I wasn't)...why would that upset you? They're a company. They're not exempt from criticism. It's so weird that people feel the need to defend corporations like this. They make games you like, but they aren't your friend.
Yeah, hitting the A button on the move the game explicitly tells you is "Super Effective" is much more engaging.
People who shout "you're wrong and don't know how game development works" without actually bothering to correct or educate the user they're replying to are not worth responding to, they just want to imply they know what's up. It's peak armchair developer, even if they're trying to dress it at the oposite.
You're intentionally misconstruing their statement. They aren't saying other devs can do better, they're saying other devs put in more effort with fewer resources, or acquire the resources necessary. Its not really about quality at this point since we can objectively see that there are no animation updates for any models thus far. Its about manpower necessary to do the grunt work of incorporating things that have been completed for years. Its not shaming, its questioning why they don't do what is easily and demonstrably doable.
Can you imagine the next Mario Kart game having half the characters and tracks of the current one despite using the same models for characters, while only looking marginally better graphically?
If their reasoning was truly based on improving the game, it'd be nice to see the improvements. But, as evidenced by them almost cutting pokemon for gen 7 and then not doing it because they finished in time, proves that is not the case and it is simply a capability issue of which the creators of the Most Successful Franchise On The Planet can afford to address.
Why don't they? Because they actively choose not to. Why choose that? Because the games will not sell any worse or better for that extra effort. Why do they sell regardless? Thats really where you gotta draw your own conclusions.
Are people unironically equating the battle mechanics for the two games? I don't even know who is just having a laugh any more
like, you're comparing something that facilitates a competitive e-sport with a pretty basic orienteering app
User Banned (2 Weeks): Doubling down on banned behavior, inflammatory false equivalencies, and modwhining over a series of posts in this thread
This thread is literally about how limited the Galar Pokedex is. That's not positive. That's negative. Go spread your 'positivity' in another Pokemon thread.
Serebii is basically the John Gruber/DaringFireball of Pokemon. It''s fucking baffling how anyone that tries to argue with him gets banned (Seriously the first ban I've gotten on ResetEra/NeoGaf since I joined in 2008) but he gets off scott free because he's curbing 'misinformation' and spreading 'positivity'?
We can't have a bitching thread about how shitty this decision is? We can't just be angry about this? Imagine if Serebii were a Trump supporter instead, going into political threads to look at 'the positives' of it.
This forum is a joke with its biases and trigger happy mods. They got pantsed during the Jussie Smollett thread. That mod got embarrassed and demodded in the Etika thread. But fuck, let's just keep banning people who might actually just be extremely passionate and firey about this decision right?
This decision sucks. I'm gonna keep bitching about it. How does that Pokemon Masters game have better trainer animations than SwordShield?
Look, I'm upset about this decision too, but getting mad at Joe isn't gonna accomplish anything. Yes, it's kind of annoying that he feels the need to "explain " decisions and only corrects misinformation when it comes from people who are criticizing gamefreak/the games for whatever reason, but you gotta let him do him. Focus that energy on the message instead of lashing out.
I've argued with him a ton and not gotten banned, I really don't think that's a thing unless you're completely uncivil
Speaking as someone who was very upset when we first heard the news about the limited number of Pokémon in these games, every time the conversation drifts back to Joe I get more and more convinced that half of the posters here are more interested in forum drama than in GF's decision. It's exhausting to share the same viewpoint with some of you, let me tell you.
Just put him on ignore and focus on the real issue if he really upsets you that much.
I asked him if he was PR for GameFreak. Which by all intents and purposes was a joke to allude to the fact that he comes in here anytime someone complains with a high horse attitude acting like he knows what's going on. Dude is acting like the USSR government in Chernobyl.
"Oh it's not that bad". "Oh we haven't seen everything yet". Give me a break.
A forum is for discussing a topic, whether or not we agree. I'm not gonna put him on ignore, but I can dunk on him when he tries to defend himself without showing any concrete proof
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