Lol I remember that one of my reactions to TLJ when I was first watching it was how the slow spaceship chase was a boring ass version of the chase in 33, the first episode of the Battlestar Galactica remake.
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Obi-Wan Kenobi |OT| Well of course I know him. He's me! [SPOILERS ON EPISODE DROP - NO LEAKS]
- Thread starter WadiumArcadium
- Start date
- OT
Lol I remember that one of my reactions to TLJ when I was first watching it was how the slow spaceship chase was a boring ass version of the chase in 33, the first episode of the Battlestar Galactica remake.
He didn't sound "off" in Rogue One so much as he sounded like an 85-year-old James Earl Jones.
oh reeeeeeeally
well that may explain it. I thought something felt very....neutral about some of those lines, a sort emotional consistency that gave me AI-Luke vibes, less range in the inflections and cadence
But then other lines didn't give me the same feelings so I wasn't sure what to believe
Like his conversation with the inquisitor sounds normal to me but then things like "I am what you made me" and other lines later in the episode made me suspicious
Perhaps they had him dub all the lines and then they redid some parts that sounded a little too aged with AI
Or maybe that didn't come into play much and I'm full of shit, maybe someday we'll find out
Honestly I didn't even care that JEJ sounded older in R1. Of course he's older, whatever. The voice is different but it's still totally rockin. It's not like it's attached to a face of a specific age (like Luke), it's a vocoder in a fictional mask, it can sound however they want. Of course I can't say with certainty how JEJ sounds today in 2022 but I think I'd rather have all of aged JEJ's nuanced performance than an AI doing a good but subdued OT impression. As long as the man is still with us I'd rather get it straight from the tap, there'll be plenty of time later to make robots say shit.
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Saw Ep. 3 tonight. Still a very mid-to-low tier show all-around. I liked the interactions with Leia and Ben, as well as some aspects of the Vader/Obi-Wan fight (him burning Obi-Wan is just too perfect), but everything else was a mess.
The editing and direction especially was extremely poor this episode, even more so than the writing, which still isn't great.
I agree with what others have said, this feels like a fan-film, not something officially produced.
Also, although I was initially receptive to the idea, I'm starting to really question the whole "Obi-Wan is off his game, he hasn't been keeping up with his Force exercises" approach that they're taking.
It makes very little sense when you think about it for a second. After RotS, Obi-Wan takes it upon himself to watch over Luke, protect him from any threats, and presumably train him when the time comes. This is further underlined in this show.
If Obi-Wan is planning on training him, or protecting him in any meaningful way, why has he completely cut himself off (seemingly)? Wouldn't he want to be at the top of his game in case an Inquisitor or Vader himself showed up? Even if he doesn't want to draw attention, couldn't he use more subtle Force abilities (mind trick and whatnot)?
Also, upon reflection, I think he's too far away from who his character is in ANH at this point. I mean, in ANH, he's pulling out all the tricks in the book to protect Luke- hell, he chops off a guy's arm without a moment's hesitation when it seems Luke is under threat. How is he going to go from inexperienced jobber to confident Jedi master in three episodes?
And as much as I love tiny Leia, I think it would have been a much better decision to build off of Luke and Obi-Wan's relationship and explore that. It contextualizes their interactions in ANH and also how sad Luke is after losing him. It also wouldn't have caused all these inconsistencies, which- while minor- are starting to add up and get a bit ridiculous.
The editing and direction especially was extremely poor this episode, even more so than the writing, which still isn't great.
I agree with what others have said, this feels like a fan-film, not something officially produced.
Also, although I was initially receptive to the idea, I'm starting to really question the whole "Obi-Wan is off his game, he hasn't been keeping up with his Force exercises" approach that they're taking.
It makes very little sense when you think about it for a second. After RotS, Obi-Wan takes it upon himself to watch over Luke, protect him from any threats, and presumably train him when the time comes. This is further underlined in this show.
If Obi-Wan is planning on training him, or protecting him in any meaningful way, why has he completely cut himself off (seemingly)? Wouldn't he want to be at the top of his game in case an Inquisitor or Vader himself showed up? Even if he doesn't want to draw attention, couldn't he use more subtle Force abilities (mind trick and whatnot)?
Also, upon reflection, I think he's too far away from who his character is in ANH at this point. I mean, in ANH, he's pulling out all the tricks in the book to protect Luke- hell, he chops off a guy's arm without a moment's hesitation when it seems Luke is under threat. How is he going to go from inexperienced jobber to confident Jedi master in three episodes?
And as much as I love tiny Leia, I think it would have been a much better decision to build off of Luke and Obi-Wan's relationship and explore that. It contextualizes their interactions in ANH and also how sad Luke is after losing him. It also wouldn't have caused all these inconsistencies, which- while minor- are starting to add up and get a bit ridiculous.
This show has been a surprisingly mixed bag for me. There's a lot I like, tiny Leia is great and helps add a little context to why she might ask for his help in IV, I like seeing Obi again, I like building on the more of the Inquisitors and all that. There's good stuff here.
But there's also weird/uneven stuff here and it's throwing the feel of the show for me. The Leia chase feeling a little doofy, the parkour, Vader apparently being stopped by a fire. There's just some weirdness that makes the show feel a little like a rollercoaster, but not always in a fun way.
I'm still on board and still looking forward to seeing the story play out, but it definitely has had a few stumbles.
But there's also weird/uneven stuff here and it's throwing the feel of the show for me. The Leia chase feeling a little doofy, the parkour, Vader apparently being stopped by a fire. There's just some weirdness that makes the show feel a little like a rollercoaster, but not always in a fun way.
I'm still on board and still looking forward to seeing the story play out, but it definitely has had a few stumbles.
Ugggh the little kid acting is so bad. Obi One's acting is the only thing holding this together
They are just lacking so much creativity with this IP. And yet it still feels like they don't really kniw what they are trying to do. If the appeal of the show is to get Obi Wan and Vader swinging lightsabers at each other by episode 3. Then lean into it, don't cut away from the fight every 10 seconds. How can this epic, anticipated showdown somehow lack all gravitas? It's so contrived, and they insult the viewer with the laughably written 'escape' afterwards.
It was far from perfect, but enjoyable enough to keep watching after the premiere. But this episode left me feeling totally empty.
It was far from perfect, but enjoyable enough to keep watching after the premiere. But this episode left me feeling totally empty.
I don't know, I feel like that perfectly explains why the beginning of the episode felt tonally stronger while parts later in the episode and the ending felt pretty different and weren't as strong, like different people were writing for different scenes.
also - protect luke at all costs - ah fuck leia let her go alone with a random stranger through a tunnel while I look through a window at Vader. Yes I get he was freaked out by him which seem the theme of the show but he should be better prepared.
I guess/hope the end of the season is him getting his mojo back and Qui-Gonn ghost. Probably with another bout with Vader with Ben more prepared.
Cue flashback scene where 10 year-old Reva tis chased by Clone Troopers
Ten years is a really long time man.
That's longer than he's known Anakin!
Now imagine being nearly completed isolated, alone, solo in a hot dessert doing slave labor. And imagine knowing you're being hunted, and that yes you are gifted but by simple affect of using your gift, you can summon the hunters - what risk can he take using the Force, if by sheer virtue of using it at all senses the empire and they come looking for him? He can't afford to put Luke in danger like that.
Also, it parallels Luke - he has a hand in a loved ones tragic turn, he hide himself a way, cut himself off from the Force, and simply - waited. Same as Yoda. That does shit to your mind and body!
Not to mention his entire universe was literally murdered and destroyed in front of his eyes and hes had no solace of comfort for a decade.
I dunno, this version of Obi is the only one I buy at all. It's good. Though!!! How can this only be 3 more episodes? That makes me feel cheated. It's a great starting point, but How do we get Obi from this to the confident wise master that kills Maul and sets Luke on his journey in only three more low budget episodes?
We need at least another series or it won't feel earned I fear
Obi-Wan spent 10 years being poor, hiding on a shitty desert planet, not using the Force, away from all his friends, with the guilt of killing someone he considered his brother, surviving after almost all the other Jedi got slaughtered by clones that he considered friends and after the republic he lived to protect turned into a fascist dictatorship that murders civillians for the hell of it... And suddenly he sees his brother again, but a cyborg now, and even more ruthless than when they last met. I'd cut Obi some slack for not thinking clearly in this situation.
Are they doing an ai recreation of James Earl Jones voice? Vader sounded perfect in this episode. He sounded old in rogue one, something changed.
Also, daaamn Anakin burning obi wan was brutal. They portrayed Vader's anger perfectly.
Really liking that between the shows, games and movies the only person who gives Vader a challenge is Ashoka and she loses. Vader is a force of nature for 25 years until Luke in Rotj. A pure implementation of unstoppable fear and power.
Also, daaamn Anakin burning obi wan was brutal. They portrayed Vader's anger perfectly.
Really liking that between the shows, games and movies the only person who gives Vader a challenge is Ashoka and she loses. Vader is a force of nature for 25 years until Luke in Rotj. A pure implementation of unstoppable fear and power.
Really liking this series so far outside of some of the dodgy leia scenes. Totally wasn't expecting a vader meetup until the final episode and his scenes were really well done
Going with Luke instead of Leia would've gotten more complaints if anything
Little Leia is the one thing I consistently like about the show.
Man I want to like this show so much.. I mean it's Obi-Wan and Ewan McGregor! This should have been a homerun. How did they mess up this big? It feels so cheap and cartoonish at times. I can't get that scene out of my head where Obi-Wan sees Vader for the first time and then just joggs off the screen to the right. WHAT THE FUCK.
My suspension of disbelief is more or less suspended at this time. It's just not believable. Little Leia actress is cute, little Leia in the context of the show annoying.
My suspension of disbelief is more or less suspended at this time. It's just not believable. Little Leia actress is cute, little Leia in the context of the show annoying.
I think the most damning thing I can say.
Is that I'm not mad at the show I just kinda don't care.
And it's probably the first time I absolutely do not care about SW media that's featuring my favorite characters ?
That's until the flashback tho, they fuck that up I'll be in full hatred mode.
Is that I'm not mad at the show I just kinda don't care.
And it's probably the first time I absolutely do not care about SW media that's featuring my favorite characters ?
That's until the flashback tho, they fuck that up I'll be in full hatred mode.
Oh and also that Batman scene where she jumps down and then is running along roofs for like 5 mins and then ends up nowhere.. hahaha. what. in. the. fuck.
Guess I'm also in the minority that liked how this show portrays Obi-Wan. In many ways it mirrors Luke in TLJ. Somehow it seems people expected Obi-Wan to continue with his sarcasm and be the top jedi he was in the Clone Wars.
10 years alone, with traumas about your best friend, your brother, betraying you, the Jedi Order, the Republic and his wife, killing children and other innocent, watching him burn alive... If he didn't get PSTD, that would be surprising. 10 years later he sees his old student for the first time continuing killing people, children again, without a second thought, and in that big robotic armor, with that horrible breathing sound. Oh, and he might also believe those people died because of him, because he didn't make sure Anakin died in Mustafar. I think this show is doing a great job with Ben.
Another aspect I liked is how they kept Vader intimidating. But also sluggish. 10 years trapped inside that armor and Anakin hasn't mastered his robotic limbs.
10 years alone, with traumas about your best friend, your brother, betraying you, the Jedi Order, the Republic and his wife, killing children and other innocent, watching him burn alive... If he didn't get PSTD, that would be surprising. 10 years later he sees his old student for the first time continuing killing people, children again, without a second thought, and in that big robotic armor, with that horrible breathing sound. Oh, and he might also believe those people died because of him, because he didn't make sure Anakin died in Mustafar. I think this show is doing a great job with Ben.
Another aspect I liked is how they kept Vader intimidating. But also sluggish. 10 years trapped inside that armor and Anakin hasn't mastered his robotic limbs.
Agreed, I think this portrayal of Obi Wan is spot on.
As far as Vader's movement goes, in the old EU it was described that Palpatine intentionally put him into a rudimentary suit that wasn't as advanced as it could be. Reason being that the struggle and pain that the suit causes Vader actually feeds into his anger and abilities in the dark side. Not sure if that's still the case in the new lore but I always liked that.
I want to see a Vader show. I want to see/Vader's inner monologue. His thoughts and conflict. I want to know what goes through his head immediately following ROTS. Live action or animated doesn't matter. I want a Vader show to tell that story. His side of it.
I know comics have dived in to it and I've seen some of that, but I want to see it depicted on screen.
I know comics have dived in to it and I've seen some of that, but I want to see it depicted on screen.
Incredibly well said, I don't understand what people were expecting
As much as I enjoy getting three episodes in a week, I am very impatient about the fact I have to wait another week for more.
I read on Twitter that apparently they're combining James Earl Jones and Hayden Christensen for all the Vader lines? It's a neat idea.
I read on Twitter that apparently they're combining James Earl Jones and Hayden Christensen for all the Vader lines? It's a neat idea.
I think that was just an excuse to explain why Grievous had better mobility lol
I knew it! When Vader said "You should have killed me when you had the chance!" I was really impressed because it felt like classic Vader's voice but the mannerisms of RotS Anakin. For such a cheesy line I loved the delivery there.
Yeah, it also makes sense since they brought Hayden back to begin with. I'm kind of surprised they didn't do it in ROTS in retrospect.
what? He literally says he's going to draw Vader away so that Tala can escape with Leia. It's not "fuck Leia, I'm just going to be freaked out over here" he is making sure she can get away safe! Vader is there for him, running away with Leia only ensures Vader will be on her trail too, which is the #1 mission.
using AI tech for vader's voice is so stupid
they could just hire a sound-a-like and it'd be so much better
its an emotionless mask, theres not even any lipsyncing that needs to be done
they could just hire a sound-a-like and it'd be so much better
its an emotionless mask, theres not even any lipsyncing that needs to be done
yeah woops haha. i replied before hitting the last few posts
interesting
Regarding episode 3:
I really enjoyed the moment where Obi-Wan is talking about his past and family, and how that's a sort of mirror to Leia. I also generally appreciate the dynamic wherein Kenobi likely cares for her as the daughter of two of his old friends, and that associated conflict in that one of her parents is technically alive, but I guess as it relates to the Jedi - technically not alive? Dunno, all that shit kind of works, but I'm less sure how I feel about the Vader and Kenobi meeting at the end of the episode.
The show has some nice, emotionally or psychologically interesting moments, but also plenty of clumsiness. Gotta admit I haven't been super impressed by the directorial effort thus far.
I really enjoyed the moment where Obi-Wan is talking about his past and family, and how that's a sort of mirror to Leia. I also generally appreciate the dynamic wherein Kenobi likely cares for her as the daughter of two of his old friends, and that associated conflict in that one of her parents is technically alive, but I guess as it relates to the Jedi - technically not alive? Dunno, all that shit kind of works, but I'm less sure how I feel about the Vader and Kenobi meeting at the end of the episode.
The show has some nice, emotionally or psychologically interesting moments, but also plenty of clumsiness. Gotta admit I haven't been super impressed by the directorial effort thus far.
Just imagined Vader saying this with Hayden's voice. And it is on character which is even more funny. Anakin still needs to work to become the Vader machine we knew in the OT.
Yeah that does make sense lol
Either way, the excuse works for me personally.
Oof that episode was rough to say the least. So much bad I wouldn't even know where to begin but everything has pretty much already been said so whatever. It's so strange that they are actively diminishing the ip's most popular characters. First Boba and now Obi-wan and Vader. These shows are just cheapening everything with how badly they are directed, edited, written, acted, you name it. It's in train wreck territory now. Obviously Deborah Chow is doing a terrible job but Robert Rodriguez's Boba Episodes were also trash. So what is the through line that is making these shows so bad?
Your expectations? Obi Wan is reviewing great compared to boba lols. LF greenlit a second season because of the reception.
A second season of book of boba is pretty much dead.
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Def liked Ep3 more than Ep2. It got a little sloppy at the end, but I like that Obi probably hasn't even used the force in a decade. By the sounds of it, he hasn't even spoken with Jinn or Yoda and probably feels abandoned by them as well. I like what they're doing with the character. I still think some of the directing and editing is sloppy, but Vader had a great presence despite it and I did like all the stuff with the stormtroopers.
It doesn't seem realistic to you that a man hiding in a cave not fighting for 10 years due to his complex traumas and possibly literally harboring the only hope for the galaxy would run away when his former student, who he dismembered and left for dead, starts chasing him with a lightsaber?
Some of you all seem to make no effort to get inside the character's minds and it shows. Obi-Wan in that quarry is not the quipping Jedi Knight of TCW or even the prequel movies, he's a totally broken man.
If Vader's voice in this episode was fully performed by that algorithm that did Luke I'll admit I'm impressed.
It must be the voice filter making it sound less artificial, but those few lines really nailed the subdued rage Vader feels against Obi-wan, and combined with some amazing body language by the guy in the suit, I pretty much forgot how cheap the actual set where all of this was taking place looked. I could only think about how impressive their encounter felt.
It must be the voice filter making it sound less artificial, but those few lines really nailed the subdued rage Vader feels against Obi-wan, and combined with some amazing body language by the guy in the suit, I pretty much forgot how cheap the actual set where all of this was taking place looked. I could only think about how impressive their encounter felt.
They even telegraphed it when Leia told him to say hello to the moleman and he just said "...hello" in very hesitant way instead of going full General Super Obi-Wan "Hello there ;) ;)" Kenobi
Now that you mention it, it does feel a lot more like a PT Anakin line than an OT Vader line. Good call.
and/or a willingness to take some creative risks and try new things.