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MayorSquirtle

Member
May 17, 2018
7,929
www.nytimes.com

As Census Count Resumes, Doubts About Accuracy Continue to Grow (Published 2020)

Officials project optimism. But a chorus of experts says the pandemic and politics could lead to a deeply flawed count.

With the 2020 census into its final stage, more than one in three people hired as census takers have quit or failed to show up.

Many still on the job are going door to door in areas that largely track places where there are elevated rates of coronavirus infections, according to calculations by the National Conference on Citizenship, Civis Analytics and The New York Times.

And with 38 million households still uncounted, state and local officials are raising growing concerns that many poor and minority households will be left out of the count.

Wracked by the pandemic and politics and desperately short of time, the last stage of the national population count — a constitutional mandate to tally everyone living in the United States accurately — is unfolding in historic doubt.

Unlike the Postal Service, another fundamental American institution suddenly under siege and where problems have unleashed a furious public backlash, the census is racing toward a finale largely out of sight. But many experts are increasingly convinced that a public reckoning over a deeply flawed count may be unavoidable.

"If the current situation holds, I do not expect a census of the quality that the Census Bureau will even want to release the data," Kenneth Prewitt, the Columbia University professor who oversaw the 2000 census, said at a University of Virginia forum this month.

Mr. Prewitt's view is shared by many state and local census officials and private experts. "This is truly, truly, hair-on-fire awful," said one government research contractor long involved in census issues, who declined to be identified because of an employment prohibition against being quoted.

That said, the bureau has perhaps more uncounted households than at this stage in any previous census — and under the worst circumstances in memory. Just as crucial, the speedup in the deadline gives experts less time to check the data than ever before. Inside Census Bureau headquarters, officials are assessing which quality checks must be jettisoned and data-processing software rewritten to finish on time.

And on the ground, the early door-knocking has been riddled with kinks like sloppy training, a clunky mobile app and unsettling encounters with people not wearing masks and who were unconcerned about spreading the coronavirus to the stranger on their porch.

Such problems have raised doubts among experts about whether the 2020 population totals will be accurate enough for crucial national decision making. The numbers are used to divide the 435 seats in the House of Representatives among the states, draw political maps nationwide and fairly dispense more than $1.5 trillion in federal grants and aid annually.

Shortfalls could mean a severe undercount of the poor and people of color, and an overcount of whites — skewing both political representation and federal largess further away from already undercounted populations.

No census is perfect, and many have been marred by incidents like fires in 1890 and 1980, lost records and even skulduggery.

But none has been rejected as fatally flawed. Indeed, no metric for a flawed census exists. Congress, which has legal authority over the census, could make that judgment, and a lawsuit could seek to. Either would put the census in uncharted waters.

It really can't be overstated how much fuckery is going to happen if the census data ends up being as bad as it looks. It affects so much of how our government operates and it's being sabotaged in plain sight. Please fill it out if you haven't already and encourage everyone you know to do the same. And hell, if you're young and healthy, consider applying to be a door-knocker cause it looks like they need all the help they can get in this final month.
 

Z-Beat

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
31,837
Eat their livers with some fava beans, and a nice chianti

FUFUFUFUFUFFUFUFUFUF
 

King Alamat

Member
Nov 22, 2017
8,111
Yup, I didn't even bother to show up to training. In my defense, I had emailed the Census Bureau that I was no longer able to take the position about a month and a half before training was to begin.
 

Pau

Self-Appointed Godmother of Bruce Wayne's Children
Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,838
Damn, I didn't realize the staffing issues were so dire. :/
 

99nikniht

Member
Oct 28, 2017
1,352
Throw another problem on the pile for the Democrats to fix when they hopefully win the WH come Nov and take the office in Jan.
 

Killthee

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,169
ny7Kk24.jpg


What a shitshow.
 

tokyostomp

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
855
I met a census person at my door yesterday and the only thing she asked was how many people live in the household.
Do I really need to fill out the census data as a man living alone for the past 14 years?
Does it make a difference at all in California (SoCal)?
 
Oct 25, 2017
10,714
I met a census person at my door yesterday and the only thing she asked was how many people live in the household.
Do I really need to fill out the census data as a man living alone for the past 14 years?
Does it make a difference at all in California (SoCal)?

Yes. It affects the House of Representatives apportionments.
 

Sunster

The Fallen
Oct 5, 2018
10,009
I met the guy. He said he lives just 2 blocks away from me and was at the hospital working as a paramedic and saw my family there when I had a car accident and was in a coma back in 2017. so that was weird lol.
 

Killthee

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,169
I met a census person at my door yesterday and the only thing she asked was how many people live in the household.
Do I really need to fill out the census data as a man living alone for the past 14 years?
Does it make a difference at all in California (SoCal)?
Did you refuse to do the census interview with her? If you refuse, the enumerator is supposed to skip directly to a last ditch effort to just get the number of people living in the household so that the government at least has a population count for the home that they can use for congressional apportionment. After the third refusal/no answer at the door they have to bug your neighbors and property owner to see if they'll fill out your census for you and if that fails they have to ask if they know the population of your household so that they can have multiple sources verifying the amount of people in the home.

So by not filling it out not only are you wasting your time with these visits, you're wasting the time of the enumerators and bogging down the whole count by forcing them to make repeated trips to your home, visits to your neighbors to get them to do your census, and delaying the knocking of doors that haven't been visited yet all because you don't want to take the 5 mins to do it online or with an enumerator.
 

kirby_fox

Member
Oct 29, 2017
5,733
Midwest USA
Hopefully the Democrats will learn a lesson from Trump and throw lawsuit after lawsuit at this. Tie it up in the courts for months so nothing can be done to make it official. Push it back far enough for Dem control and reject it to be redone or at the very least done properly.

I'm not surprised at the people not showing up though- the mail I got trying to recruit made it sound like you make your own hours. Probably a lot of people who have no idea what they're signing up for.
 

BoboBrazil

Attempted to circumvent a ban with an alt
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
18,765
Hopefully the Democrats will learn a lesson from Trump and throw lawsuit after lawsuit at this. Tie it up in the courts for months so nothing can be done to make it official. Push it back far enough for Dem control and reject it to be redone or at the very least done properly.

I'm not surprised at the people not showing up though- the mail I got trying to recruit made it sound like you make your own hours. Probably a lot of people who have no idea what they're signing up for.
They've known Trump is making them stop counting a month early for like a month or two now and haven't done anything so far...
 

davepoobond

Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,537
www.squackle.com
I wonder what would happen if a census is invalidated. Would they fall back to the previous one or would they redo it or would they just say no one lives in the USA anymore and there is no more constitution
 

Deleted member 21709

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 28, 2017
23,310
It is so fucking irresponsible to send door to door census people.


I met a census person at my door yesterday and the only thing she asked was how many people live in the household.
Do I really need to fill out the census data as a man living alone for the past 14 years?
Does it make a difference at all in California (SoCal)?

Was she wearing a mask at least? Gloves? Not that it matters much, as she already put herself (and therefore you) at great risk.
 

Siyou

Member
Oct 27, 2017
864
I was offered a job in November, then they pushed it to December, then every month they'd touch base with me up until April which I told them to not bother hiring me. In my city covid's a joke and knocking on doors here... Not a good idea. I bailed.
 

Captjohnboyd

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,569
I hadn't gotten around to filling mine out, much to my shame, when a worker knocked on my door a week or two ago. I happily filled it out with her for myself and my partner. When I thanked her for the hard work she was doing her appreciation was palpable. It's a tough gig and it's likely going to be for naught due to GOP fuckery.
 

BigAlKaiju

Alt-Account
Banned
Jul 13, 2020
98
Yeah I quit. Was just a curiosity side thing I signed up for before Covid. I actually got more hours at my real job now anyways.
 

Toast

Member
Oct 28, 2017
487
I did it via internet months ago and had a notice of visit slip arrive on Sunday.

Also know of a lot of people who did it via internet having enumerators show up.
 

GreenMonkey

Member
Oct 28, 2017
1,861
Michigan
I worked on the Census in 2000 for a month or so. I can't imagine doing it right now with Covid running around. But it still has to get done somehow. If only people would just do it online, that's super handy and we didn't have it that way in 2000 - it was just paper forms.
 

WarMacheen

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
3,540
How about I did it online months ago, yet the damn people keep coming to my house telling me to do it.
 

Whitemex

Member
Oct 27, 2017
15,425
Chicago
I filled out the online form as soon as I got the letter with the code. Like literally opened the mail still standing at the door.
 

ColdDeckEd

Member
Jul 25, 2018
524
www.nytimes.com

As Census Count Resumes, Doubts About Accuracy Continue to Grow (Published 2020)

Officials project optimism. But a chorus of experts says the pandemic and politics could lead to a deeply flawed count.







It really can't be overstated how much fuckery is going to happen if the census data ends up being as bad as it looks. It affects so much of how our government operates and it's being sabotaged in plain sight. Please fill it out if you haven't already and encourage everyone you know to do the same. And hell, if you're young and healthy, consider applying to be a door-knocker cause it looks like they need all the help they can get in this final month.

Ive applied and gotten a job as a door knocker but they dont offer training sessions on weekends and informed me of my training date like a day before so no way to get out of my real job. And the people i talked to at the local census office didnt seem tgaf.
 

Tacitus

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,030
Doing your census manually is so 20th century. Though I suppose you guys can't properly track it because a certain subsection of the populace would decry it as the "mark of the beast" or other such nonsense.
 

Futureman

Member
Oct 26, 2017
9,400
I filled out online and I've gotten reminder emails at least twice now AFTER I filled it out. Can't they have some system that shows I already filled it out and to not email me again?
 

Caped Baldy

Member
Dec 11, 2017
807
I'm one who also had to quit before getting started. I was excited to help this year, and then was laid off my job due to Covid.

Was fortunate enough to get a new job, but that new job works longer days and I just couldn't see how I was going to have the energy to do the door knocking and still have time for my family. It's the perfect gig for young people with no family or maybe just a spouse at home. I feel bad now though because it looks like I'm definitely not the only one.
 

entremet

You wouldn't toast a NES cartridge
Member
Oct 26, 2017
59,972
Doing your census manually is so 20th century. Though I suppose you guys can't properly track it because a certain subsection of the populace would decry it as the "mark of the beast" or other such nonsense.
there's online too!

The issue is that many don't trust it, are not tech savvy, or have no internet. They still should be counted.

I did mine online.
 

Blader

Member
Oct 27, 2017
26,605
Doing your census manually is so 20th century. Though I suppose you guys can't properly track it because a certain subsection of the populace would decry it as the "mark of the beast" or other such nonsense.
It can be done online. My wife and I did ours online. Although we did have a census taker come to our door and ask about address verification (though I'm a little worried that, in the way he framed it, he's going to end up eliminating us from the count altogether...).
 

vanmardigan

Member
Oct 27, 2017
710
I signed up and started working a few weeks ago. As of this week, me and my group have not gotten any work. Which makes no sense given that this article says we still have a lot of households to count. We are all wondering if we're being sent home, our supervisor didn't know what's going on.
 

Tacitus

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,030
there's online too!

The issue is that many don't trust it, are not tech savvy, or have no internet. They still should be counted.

I did mine online.
It can be done online. My wife and I did ours online. Although we did have a census taker come to our door and ask about address verification (though I'm a little worried that, in the way he framed it, he's going to end up eliminating us from the count altogether...).

That's also manual to me. I'm talking about this https://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/cros/content/register-based-census_en
When the govt needs data, they just pull it from the register(s). No crummy counting every n years.
 

FaceHugger

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
13,949
USA
I did mine online this year. Hopefully everyone got the mail in form (which included the online link in case the person didn't want to fill it out and mail it in)?
 

Zoe

Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,236
I met a census person at my door yesterday and the only thing she asked was how many people live in the household.
Do I really need to fill out the census data as a man living alone for the past 14 years?
Does it make a difference at all in California (SoCal)?
Why do you not want to be counted?
 

captmcblack

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,059
I did it online...but yeah, this one is gonna be super fucked up. It seems clear that there should be reason, even given the constitution, to understand that there's a pandemic complicating things and that there should be a proper count, but lol America and all that.
 

Lobster Roll

signature-less, now and forever
Member
Sep 24, 2019
34,305
I met the guy. He said he lives just 2 blocks away from me and was at the hospital working as a paramedic and saw my family there when I had a car accident and was in a coma back in 2017. so that was weird lol.
"Oh hey! I recognize you! You look much different awake, though."
"...can I help you?"
 
Oct 27, 2017
45,029
Seattle
I mean I get it, we've had people not understanding why they need to do it, or can't be bothered to do it because they thought it would take 'hours'

The online census literally takes 10 minutes.
 

RedMercury

Blue Venus
Member
Dec 24, 2017
17,648
I almost did this but I ended up getting a better job, they hounded the shit out of me though about it. I guess I didn't fill something in correctly on my application and they were calling me every 2 to 3 days even after I told them I wasn't interested for weeks.
 

SoleSurvivor

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,016
I was a census taker (the actual job title is enumerator) in 2010 and loved the job. But I did it in West Boca Raton, primarily in gated communities and other high end neighborhoods. So I never felt unsafe. It was the most money I'd ever made from a job at that point in my early 20s. I remember saying at the time, "man, if I still have free time in ten years, I'd love to do this again." How times have changed.
 
OP
OP
MayorSquirtle

MayorSquirtle

Member
May 17, 2018
7,929
I signed up and started working a few weeks ago. As of this week, me and my group have not gotten any work. Which makes no sense given that this article says we still have a lot of households to count. We are all wondering if we're being sent home, our supervisor didn't know what's going on.
That's very bizarre. There are definitely pockets of the country that are doing well and even tracking ahead of where they were at this time in 2010, but I doubt there's any place that doesn't have a whole lot of homes to visit regardless.
 
Mar 29, 2018
7,078
Do I really need to fill out the census data as a man living alone for the past 14 years?
Not to pile on, but yeah. The census system plugs into all sorts of other important systems, and has no idea where or who you are all decade except for the one year the data is taken. As far as they know you moved to Nantucket, until you fill out the form and confirm. The system has no idea until it asks you the question.