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KingM

Member
Oct 28, 2017
4,475
Just trying to sell some crappy kitchen equipment by bringing up two of the most popular women in the home decor and kitchen market. At least keep the energy consistent instead of back pedalling immediately. There's lots of MAGA dollars if you shit on people who are more foreign than you, so keep it up.
 

Dice

Member
Oct 25, 2017
22,164
Canada
Interesting she only called out women of color....interesting in a Post Goop world

Man. It's honestly fucked to see people call Meghan Markle "unmaternal" and shit when dumb (pretty much always white) critics(?)/pundits(??) talk about her.

People have gotten more skilled at less overt racism but it's still clearly the same difference.
 

entremet

You wouldn't toast a NES cartridge
Member
Oct 26, 2017
59,910
I learned about Karens today lol.

Does the urban dictionary post do a good job? I feel it's missing more detail.

Urban Dictionary: a karen

she has the children that she treats like angels that can "never do anything wrong" but in reallity are spoiled bratty ass little shits that treat other people poorly and think that they can do whatever they want. karens usually never vaccinate because of "big pharma putting poison in vaccines...
 

Deleted member 18021

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
4,000
I also don't really get "minimalism" out of Kondo's show, although I guess that's how it's packaged/interpreted widely. She seems to be a pretty big advocate of keeping stuff around that falls in the "useless junk" category just because it makes you happy. Like the teen boy who wanted to keep his old sippy cup, she legit went well let's find a place to display it. Most other minimalist gurus would have told him to toss it.

A whole heck of a lot of people got the impression that Kondo wants them to throw all of their stuff out. The reaction to her in some of the book related circles I'm a part of was wild.

But yeah, she's not really preaching minimalism, but downsizing. Keep what makes you happy or that you use, donate what you haven't seen or touched in years. That's probably a more healthy and sustainable way to go about it for most people than going on big minimalist purges.
 

whatsinaname

Member
Oct 25, 2017
15,047
I also don't really get "minimalism" out of Kondo's show, although I guess that's how it's packaged/interpreted widely. She seems to be a pretty big advocate of keeping stuff around that falls in the "useless junk" category just because it makes you happy. Like the teen boy who wanted to keep his old sippy cup, she legit went well let's find a place to display it. Most other minimalist gurus would have told him to toss it.

The snippets/social media meme'ing have given people a very different take of the show. (tbh, that was my first reaction when I heard about her selling trinkets - I hadn't watched the show at that time).
 

Zoe

Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,222
I learned about Karens today lol.

Does the urban dictionary post do a good job? I feel it's missing more detail.

Urban Dictionary: a karen

she has the children that she treats like angels that can "never do anything wrong" but in reallity are spoiled bratty ass little shits that treat other people poorly and think that they can do whatever they want. karens usually never vaccinate because of "big pharma putting poison in vaccines...
Karen has exploded in use over the past few weeks to refer to any specter of a person who doesn't agree with you.
 

Slayven

Never read a comic in his life
Moderator
Oct 25, 2017
92,987
Nigella Lawson and Andy Richter follow Chrissy. Real recognize Real
 

effingvic

Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,132
If I had the opportunity to "sell out" I would sell the fuck out. Only person I have to impress is myself.
 

kvetcha

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
7,835
I like both Chrissy and Alison, and I think Alison's message isn't really wrong, just tactlessly delivered, so, uh, just gonna sit this one out and keep cooking, I guess?

Not sure where shitting on one successful woman for having an opinion on two other successful women really gets us.
 
Oct 25, 2017
1,447
In this very thread someone actually said Teigen is anti black? Obviously people can still be shit about the people they love but, Correct me if I'm wrong but I gotta be extra sure but isn't her husband, John Legend Black? 🤔

You're obviously not obligated to like everyone but if all these comments about her in these thread really stem from her supporting Warren over Sanders like some people have said, that's some real pathetic shit.
 

AbsoluteZero0K

Alt Account
Banned
Dec 6, 2019
1,570
White woman sees two of the most likable Asian women cutting into her profits and throws a tantrum, tries to roll it back, but this is 2020 where everyone remembers when the white woman showed her true face.

I'm surprised she didn't drag Ayesha Curry into this.
 

Griselbrand

Member
Oct 26, 2017
3,234
🤣🤣

The same chef who rebrands a staple Indian dish as 'Alison Roman's Internet-famous Chickpea Stew', markets it everywhere and talks like she re-discovered turmeric in the wild? Who woulda see this coming?

Wow, that's infuriating. This is what people mean when they talk about cultural appropriation of food but that topic is never taken seriously here.
 

orlock

Member
Oct 28, 2017
1,286
A whole heck of a lot of people got the impression that Kondo wants them to throw all of their stuff out. The reaction to her in some of the book related circles I'm a part of was wild.

But yeah, she's not really preaching minimalism, but downsizing. Keep what makes you happy or that you use, donate what you haven't seen or touched in years. That's probably a more healthy and sustainable way to go about it for most people than going on big minimalist purges.


this is what pisses me off especially re: all the "Kondo call-out" posts. none of them seem to actually understand what Kondo is proposing.

its not pro-minimalism so much as its anti-hoarding.

do you have something really fancy and new and expensive but kinda loathe using it, or never have the opportunity, so it just sits in your pantry or closet taking up space and it never sees the light of day? probably doesnt spark joy, get rid of it, either through donation or rehoming.

do you have an old collection of children's books you had growing up that arent in good shape but your nieces love so you enjoy reading them to bed when they come over to visit? they probably spark joy, so keep them, and maybe display them in a way that suits their purpose.

its never been about, "get rid of everything and live like a monk, but also buy a bunch of my cheap shit", ever.
 

Addleburg

The Fallen
Nov 16, 2017
5,061
Marie Kondo doesn't claim to be a minimalist:
konmari.com

KonMari Is Not Minimalism – KonMari | The Official Website of Marie Kondo

Minimalism champions living with less, but Marie's tidying method encourages living with items you truly cherish.

She actually recommends that people use the containers they already have, like empty shoe boxes, instead of buying pretty new boxes. Her store is just selling to people who want her design aesthetic.

That's a fair point, and I misspoke with "minimalism." But my larger point is that her philosophy is only to keep things that spark joy, and I think there's an irony to holding that belief while simultaneously leveraging your name and affable personality to sell hundreds of items to people on your store that are destined to be novelties.

Again, I understand that people aren't forced to buy the stuff on her store, but the same could be said of anyone selling gem tuning forks and $300 utensil bowls.
 

Antrax

Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,262
Absolutely on the bolded. Not gonna defend her on the other shit, but I remember my girlfriend and I sending each other links to Marie kondo's store, which was filled with tons of unnecessary and expensive shit that was no doubt being at least partly bought by people who understandably loved her. I don't think it's wrong to note the hypocrisy of pushing a minimalist lifestyle while still pedaling junk that is inessential. Yes, people don't have to buy it, but you could say that of any salesperson selling overpriced wares with their names attached to it.

This is a bit of a misunderstanding of the "spark joy" thing. If a $300 cup or whatever sparks joy, then you should buy it and keep it. Kondo isn't pushing a spartan lifestyle, but a deliberate one.

Critiques of capitalism are always on the menu! Also Chrissy Teigen sucks ass and deserves criticism as a very vocal and useless lib. I'm not familiar with Marie Kondo. I think I get what this woman is trying to say, about monetizing your fanbase and making yourself wealthy on their back. It's just not real well formed here.

The existence of trade is not a capitalist thing. Do you think that if workers owned 100% of their labor at Rockstar (for example), GTA6 wouldn't make them all super rich? Or do you think we should go back to a bartering system or something?

Being mad that Teigen didn't vote for Bernie and then deciding that she can't sell spoons and shit is weird.
 
Oct 25, 2017
19,165
I like both Chrissy and Alison, and I think Alison's message isn't really wrong, just tactlessly delivered, so, uh, just gonna sit this one out and keep cooking, I guess?

Not sure where shitting on one successful woman for having an opinion on two other successful women really gets us.
Does she have a point or is she actually just a snake lazily tearing down two POC who are currently relevant in the same age bracket and products space she's targeting and is attacking them to make herself seem like the smarter, more conscious decision for the kind of dumbasses who read things like this and nod their heads?

Hmm I wonder
 

Stinkles

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
20,459
A while ago a friend showed me a link to Marie Kondo shop where she was selling exorbitantly expensive shit. Like....nearly $300 for a metal cup.

shop.konmari.com

Authentic Japanese Brass Tool or Utensil Holder

The Futagami brass foundry is renowned for its sand-casting technique, which creates a distinctive, rustic texture that will develop a rich patina over time. This faceted brass vessel was designed by Oji Masanori to hold kitchen utensils and is striking enough to be used as a vase. Lined in...

Marie Kondo does not teach frugality she teaches almost the opposite - edit down to useful happy luxury.if you can find a Japanese hand forged brass, tin lined, silicone based tool caddy for less then go nuts.
 

Grifter

Member
Oct 26, 2017
2,570
Some of it is useful, sure, but she also sells things like this: https://shop.konmari.com/collection...-konmari-tuning-fork-crystal-set-smoky-quartz

You're selling crystals, you are at some level some form of huckster.
That's certainly unnecessary, but her lesson isn't to strictly remove everything you don't directly need.

The crystal is a pretty thing to strike against and it's not a goop-level write-up and she's a credibly spiritual person besides. I strive for minimalism but the aesthetics here would spark joy.
 

BossAttack

Member
Oct 27, 2017
42,927
Chrissy:

tenor.gif
 

Addleburg

The Fallen
Nov 16, 2017
5,061
This is a bit of a misunderstanding of the "spark joy" thing. If a $300 cup or whatever sparks joy, then you should buy it and keep it. Kondo isn't pushing a spartan lifestyle, but a deliberate one.

The people that Marie Kondo helps are all people who bought the items in their house because they initially sparked joy. Again, I'm not saying that the items she sells on her store can't spark joy for some people. But I do think that Kondo is ultimately leveraging her name and her persona to sell items to people that they may buy out of an initial thrill or interest more than out of "deliberate" consideration. I used "minimalism" wrong in my original post, but I meant it in the sense of only keeping the items that you feel are worthwhile to you.

She's a businessperson who will do what businesspeople do, but I just feel that in her case it's less compatible than it is in the case of people who've never espoused a deliberate lifestyle filled with self-reflection about the items one brings into their life.
 
Oct 27, 2017
6,730
So like... is anyone who said "Chrissy Teigen is a useless lib/anti-black" going to come back and substantiate shit, or are we just slinging hot takes and muddying the water on the story of a white woman punching down on minorities?

Just asking.

Edit: And so help me god, if those sentiments are couched in "she didn't support Bernie!" or "she didn't like that one child singer at the Oscars 5 years ago!" Because holy shit are those the biggest reaches in history.
 

KingM

Member
Oct 28, 2017
4,475
A while ago a friend showed me a link to Marie Kondo shop where she was selling exorbitantly expensive shit. Like....nearly $300 for a metal cup.

shop.konmari.com

Authentic Japanese Brass Tool or Utensil Holder

The Futagami brass foundry is renowned for its sand-casting technique, which creates a distinctive, rustic texture that will develop a rich patina over time. This faceted brass vessel was designed by Oji Masanori to hold kitchen utensils and is striking enough to be used as a vase. Lined in...
That is a luxury brand. Costs about the same on the brands website. It would be like Goop selling a Gucci thumbtack for $150. It's not the website, it's the niche of rich people home decor.
 

orlock

Member
Oct 28, 2017
1,286
The people that Marie Kondo helps are all people who bought the items in their house because they initially sparked joy. Again, I'm not saying that the items she sells on her store can't spark joy for some people. But I do think that Kondo is ultimately leveraging her name and her persona to sell items to people that they may buy out of an initial thrill or interest more than out of "deliberate" consideration. I used "minimalism" wrong in my original post, but I meant it in the sense of only keeping the items that you feel are worthwhile to you.

She's a businessperson who will do what businesspeople do, but I just feel that in her case it's less compatible than it is in the case of people who've never espoused a deliberate lifestyle filled with self-reflection about the items one brings into their life.


what... what is the criticism, here? thats why anyone buys anything. its also why, as she proposes, you revisit the shit you own at some point and decide, "does this still spark joy? or should i throw it in the fucking trash?".

do people expect her (or anyone) to act as proponent for living a life where you... dont buy anything anymore, and only keep the things you like and know you will like for the rest of your life? should i only buy from unapologetic, outwardly pro-late-stage-capitalists who make no qualms about the fact that im probably buying overpriced, planned obsolescent goods instead of someone who is 'totes fake and leveraging their name and social credit to sell knick knacks"? whats the real difference?

i bought shit when i was younger that legit brought me joy for the 5 to 10 years that followed initial ownership. as i got older, i found they no longer had a place in my life. should i not have bought them, or were they not a true "deliberate" purchase at the time because i didnt know my lifestyle or personality would be so wildly different a decade later? what is that?
 

kvetcha

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
7,835
Does she have a point or is she actually just a snake lazily tearing down two POC who are currently relevant in the same age bracket and products space she's targeting and is attacking them to make herself seem like the smarter, more conscious decision for the kind of dumbasses who read things like this and nod their heads?

Hmm I wonder

She has a point. Kondo's capitalizing on her 'get rid of all your useless shit' philosophy by peddling expensive useless shit certainly raised some eyebrows, and it's not racist or questionable to point out the irony.

re: Teigen, she's pretty clearly saying she doesn't want to stumble into managing a huge brand; she wants to stay small and keep cooking. She acknowledges Chrissy is making a zillion dollars doing her thing, and that it was clearly a smart thing to do. But she's not interested in empire-building.

people here are essentially shitting on Roman for being outspoken and opinionated. How dare she.
 

Slayven

Never read a comic in his life
Moderator
Oct 25, 2017
92,987
She has a point. Kondo's capitalizing on her 'get rid of all your useless shit' philosophy by peddling expensive useless shit certainly raised some eyebrows, and it's not racist or questionable to point out the irony.

re: Teigen, she's pretty clearly saying she doesn't want to stumble into managing a huge brand; she wants to stay small and keep cooking. She acknowledges Chrissy is making a zillion dollars doing her thing, and that it was clearly a smart thing to do. But she's not interested in empire-building.

people here are essentially shitting on Roman for being outspoken and opinionated. How dare she.
No, they are shitting on her for the causal racism and putting down of others
 

Socivol

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,652
The fact she specially choose two women of color to bash says it all. There are so many chefs doing exactly what these people are and so many male chefs as well. I didn't even know who this woman was but now I know she's a hater and the "joke" was racist as fuck. Digging the hole deeper because her pride and privilege won't let her see anything outside of her own life lens.
 

TheRuralJuror

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,497
Does she have a point or is she actually just a snake lazily tearing down two POC who are currently relevant in the same age bracket and products space she's targeting and is attacking them to make herself seem like the smarter, more conscious decision for the kind of dumbasses who read things like this and nod their heads?

Hmm I wonder
Could be one of the other. Could be both depending on you ask. Doesn't really benefit me of you to pretend we definitively know, so maybe more of us could acknowledge that when commenting on the specifics of things we have no real idea about. The only honest critique I see here is her racist paraphrasing of Kondo, which contributed nothing to the point she was making. Other than that, she's free to feel however the heck she likes about whoever else imo, just like folks are free to call her a sell out for doing something similar. Personally, I don't see her point in trying to tear folks down one way or the other to lift herself up.
 
Oct 27, 2017
6,730
She has a point. Kondo's capitalizing on her 'get rid of all your useless shit' philosophy by peddling expensive useless shit certainly raised some eyebrows, and it's not racist or questionable to point out the irony.

re: Teigen, she's pretty clearly saying she doesn't want to stumble into managing a huge brand; she wants to stay small and keep cooking. She acknowledges Chrissy is making a zillion dollars doing her thing, and that it was clearly a smart thing to do. But she's not interested in empire-building.

people here are essentially shitting on Roman for being outspoken and opinionated. How dare she.
.....
"I'm like, damn, bitch, you fucking just sold out immediately! Someone's like 'you should make stuff,' and she's like, 'okay, slap my name on it, I don't give a shit!'"

"[ ... ] That horrifies me and it's not something that I ever want to do. I don't aspire to that. But like, who's laughing now? Because she's making a ton of fucking money."

"Please to buy my cutting board!"
But yea yea, totally just "opinionated" and not hyper-aggressive/racist. She just "telling it like it is."
 

Grifter

Member
Oct 26, 2017
2,570
I like both Chrissy and Alison, and I think Alison's message isn't really wrong, just tactlessly delivered, so, uh, just gonna sit this one out and keep cooking, I guess?

Not sure where shitting on one successful woman for having an opinion on two other successful women really gets us.
how are you sitting this out while posting, agreeing with the criticisms, and perching yourself above other posters as if the racism, for starters, wasn't a factor
 
Oct 25, 2017
19,165
She has a point. Kondo's capitalizing on her 'get rid of all your useless shit' philosophy by peddling expensive useless shit certainly raised some eyebrows, and it's not racist or questionable to point out the irony.

re: Teigen, she's pretty clearly saying she doesn't want to stumble into managing a huge brand; she wants to stay small and keep cooking. She acknowledges Chrissy is making a zillion dollars doing her thing, and that it was clearly a smart thing to do. But she's not interested in empire-building.

people here are essentially shitting on Roman for being outspoken and opinionated. How dare she.
First of all actually learn something about Kondo's stated philosophy, second of all it's cute watching people defend a white woman whose peddling the exact same shit complain about two women of color "selling out" but you do you! Oh and the blatantly racist joke but we've decided to ignore that obviously.
 
OP
OP
RastaMentality
Oct 25, 2017
13,124
The fact she specially choose two women of color to bash says it all. There are so many chefs doing exactly what these people are and so many male chefs as well. I didn't even know who this woman was but now I know she's a hater and the "joke" was racist as fuck. Digging the hole deeper because her pride and privilege won't let her see anything outside of her own life lens.
When she says "I didn't mention any men because there aren't any doing anything I find comparable, so", It's just ridiculous. Tons of male chefs built up high quality brands on television only to slap their names on cookware for coins.

I wouldn't even call fucking Marie Kondo similar to anything Alison does.

I liked Alison but she has this entitled egotistical tone where she doesn't realize how her words are coming off in this particular interview. Race related drama is the WORST drama to get on Twitter with and the jokey Brooklynite white woman energy she got online with did her no favors.
 

kvetcha

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
7,835
User Banned (Permanent): Dismissing Concerns of Racism and Inflammatory Generalizations Attacking the Community; Prior Severe Ban for the Same
how are you sitting this out while posting, agreeing with the criticisms, and perching yourself above other posters as if the racism, for starters, wasn't a factor

You're right, actually. Disagreeing with the Era Hive in these sorts of discussions is just begging for a ban.

Y'all win. Bury her!
 

whatsinaname

Member
Oct 25, 2017
15,047
She has a point. Kondo's capitalizing on her 'get rid of all your useless shit' philosophy by peddling expensive useless shit certainly raised some eyebrows, and it's not racist or questionable to point out the irony.

re: Teigen, she's pretty clearly saying she doesn't want to stumble into managing a huge brand; she wants to stay small and keep cooking. She acknowledges Chrissy is making a zillion dollars doing her thing, and that it was clearly a smart thing to do. But she's not interested in empire-building.

people here are essentially shitting on Roman for being outspoken and opinionated. How dare she.

She completely misunderstood what Kondo is about and said "I'm like, damn, bitch, you fucking just sold out immediately!"

And oh guess what, the wording on that next line has been changed on the article.

RpHfQDq.png


But she's not interested in empire-building

"I'd rather stay small and always be myself," she tells me. "But at the same time, I do need to figure out how to turn this into money."

So she wants money? But doesn't want to monetise or build an empire and looks down on people making money?

people here are essentially shitting on Roman for being outspoken and opinionated. How dare she.

No, people are shitting on her for being mean and a hypocrite.
 
Last edited:

NoName999

One Winged Slayer
Banned
Oct 29, 2017
5,906
"This white woman is totally in the right to shame these two particular women of color for partaking in the heartless capitalistic culture that she and plenty of white men do on a regular basis" say several Era members who probably get into routine arguments about #$300+ boxes and purchase the latest $60 discs.
 

KingM

Member
Oct 28, 2017
4,475
She has a point. Kondo's capitalizing on her 'get rid of all your useless shit' philosophy by peddling expensive useless shit certainly raised some eyebrows, and it's not racist or questionable to point out the irony.

re: Teigen, she's pretty clearly saying she doesn't want to stumble into managing a huge brand; she wants to stay small and keep cooking. She acknowledges Chrissy is making a zillion dollars doing her thing, and that it was clearly a smart thing to do. But she's not interested in empire-building.

people here are essentially shitting on Roman for being outspoken and opinionated. How dare she.
She has already built an empire and is actively trying to make it larger. All this wanting to stay small junk is just folksy pandering to people running Etsy shops and doing MLMs to look like "one of them" and keep their support while making herself look like a homegrown authentic success compared to Marie and Chrissy. It's textbook.
 

Addleburg

The Fallen
Nov 16, 2017
5,061
what... what is the criticism, here? thats why anyone buys anything. its also why, as she proposes, you revisit the shit you own at some point and decide, "does this still spark joy? or should i throw it in the fucking trash?".

do people expect her (or anyone) to act as proponent for living a life where you... dont buy anything anymore, and only keep the things you like and know you will like for the rest of your life? should i only buy from unapologetic, outwardly pro-late-stage-capitalists who make no qualms about the fact that im probably buying overpriced, planned obsolescent goods instead of someone who is 'totes fake and leveraging their name and social credit to sell knick knacks"? whats the real difference?

i bought shit when i was younger that legit brought me joy for the 5 to 10 years that followed initial ownership. as i got older, i found they no longer had a place in my life. should i not have bought them, or were they not a true "deliberate" purchase at the time because i didnt know my lifestyle or personality would be so wildly different a decade later? what is that?

The quote of mine you're responding to already summed up my point - that for someone who promotes a lifestyle where you only buy and keep deliberate items that bring joy, she leverages her status to sell items that some people will buy for the same fleeting reasons they buy anything else.

People can buy and keep whatever they want. I certainly have some things that I've bought flippantly or without giving as much thought as I should have. I just feel/fear that in trying to spark joy, some people may erroneously believe that a $44 bookend on Kondo's store may get them closer to that than a cheaper one elsewhere, especially as it's a tacit endorsement of said bookend by Kondo.

It's the last I'll say on it, as this isn't the point of the thread or the larger contention that people have with Roman's comments. As I said in my first post, Roman is largely in the wrong with her comments. I think it's fair to question the people she chose to call out (and not call out) in her quote.