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Hollywood Duo

Member
Oct 25, 2017
41,909
Michael Gundersen, 42, falsely claimed he worked hundreds of extra hours in his job as a maintenance supervisor when he was actually on vacation in Williamsburg, Virginia and the Hudson Valley, attending concerts in Atlantic City, visiting a farm, dining in restaurants or simply at home with his family, according to charging documents filed by the U.S. Attorney's Office for the Southern District of New York on Thursday. The nature of his work doesn't allow him to work from his Manalapan home.

Gundersen was paid about $385,000 in 2018, including about $283,000 in voluntary overtime shifts on top of his $102,000 base salary, according to court papers. He reported working 3,914 hours of overtime in addition to 1,880 regular hours. That meant Gundersen would have to work an average of more than 10 hours of overtime a day for 365 days on top of his regular 40-hour work schedule.

He made more money than the chairman of the MTA that year and was among the agency's five highest-paid employees, authorities said.

FBI Assistant Director William F. Sweeney Jr. described the scheme as "incredibly blatant."


www.nj.com

NYC Transit employee from N.J. among 5 charged in massive, ‘incredibly blatant’ overtime fraud scheme

MIchael Gundersen, of Manaalpan, claimed to be at work when he was at concerts, on vacation or home with his family, prosecutors allege

I can't knock the hustle lmao
 

Reym

Member
Jul 15, 2019
2,660
One one hand, it's so blatant it's almost comical. What made him think he wouldn't immediately get caught?

...on the other hand...he didn't immediately get caught...
 
Nov 18, 2020
1,408
I live in NYC, and I've heard about this ridiculous overtime abuse for years. It's schemes like this that give unions a bad name. You can plainly see the unbelievable corruption that leads to a blatant lack of oversight and rampant mismanagement of federal funds.

I'm really glad they're finally starting to clamp down on it now that we have huge budget shortfalls to account for, and it looks like these bastards are getting up to 10 years in prison each for defrauding taxpayers.
 

Bear Patrol

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,042
Hustle? Wat?

Fucking idiots like this only reduce trust in government run services. Just as bad as those cops that keep getting overtime pay.
 

Ducarmel

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,363
i dont understand why some mta workers are stupid enough even try they always get caught eventually.

The worse one i heard of was an MTA employee who retired and he was still getting his salary on top of his retirement and did not say anything for years.
 

Davilmar

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,265
Hustle? Wat?

Fucking idiots like this only reduce trust in government run services. Just as bad as those cops that keep getting overtime pay.

As a New Yorker myself, the MTA had bottom trust for years even without employee corruption. I think myself the the OP are just not phased anymore with the incompetence. It's basically a way of life that isn't going to substantially change for NYC. Hard to not have humor when cynicism is all you got.
 

captmcblack

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,063
Never forget that when the MTA and LIRR oversight installed biometric clocks to provide oversight for when people did their shifts, they literally cut the wires of the machines.

www.nbcnewyork.com

Time Clocks Vandalized Amid Overtime Crackdown, MTA Says

The MTA says a screen on an employee time clock was smashed in an “apparent act of vandalism” that’s seen as retaliation for a crackdown on hefty overtime pay.

www.cityandstateny.com

MTA pushes biometric timekeeping at heated board meeting

The technology, however, isn't impervious to abuse.

www.newsday.com

LIRR union officials cry foul: Biometric clocks point of contention

The MTA already has installed about 1,600 new devices, including more than 400 at LIRR employee facilities.


I support union labor, but the lengths people go to facilitate abuse is hilarious, lmao.

I would argue this is more of a problem caused by the bad actors abusing stuff than it is of the organization's oversight unit having disinterest in cracking down.
 
Nov 18, 2020
1,408
This is my question as well, anyone should have seen this was way too many hours.

Rampant corruption in countless industries. AKA a way of life in NYC.

The MTA / NYC transit system is just one example. You see it everywhere, like in the construction industry, the NYPD, or longshoremen working at the docks. It's grift after grift enabled by corrupt unions bribing local politicians.
 

Bear

Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,871
The MTA is rife with this shit, and I remember it every single time they want to raise costs on commuters. They line their own pockets just to have a beat to shit system and fuck over the customer consistently. What a garbage organization.
 

PanickyFool

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
5,947
MTA y'all, worst run organization in this country
And LIRR is the worst run division in the worst run transit organization on the planet.

But NYers will never reform labor. So it will continue to get worse and worse until it reaches idiocracy levels of ability regardless of how much money they light on fire.


I don't pay these taxes no more. I don't pay these taxes no more!
 

DarkLegion

Avenger
Oct 28, 2017
1,679
One one hand, it's so blatant it's almost comical. What made him think he wouldn't immediately get caught?

...on the other hand...he didn't immediately get caught...

When they notice the OT looks sus there's a team that does a deep dive and gather a ton of evidence to completely destroy the person lol. So that usually takes time.
It ruins stuff for the people who do honest work though.
 

skeptem

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,747
Personal story

I took over running a dept at a union manufacturing facility. Early on I noticed that one of my depts had massive overtime. Questioned it, but was told it was necessary.

About a month later I came back to it, turned out that they had a scheme going where they would divy up work to make it seem like two people were necessary, while one did the work and the other hid in a secret club house. They would rotate based on their own secret schedule.

Lucky for them they were a skilled role that just doesn't exist anymore, but their pay was cut in about half.
 

smurfx

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
10,578
if these guys weren't incredibly greedy they could have gotten away with a lot of fake overtime until they retired but human nature can't be beat.
 

Septimus Prime

EA
Verified
Oct 25, 2017
8,500
jimmy-mcnulty.gif
 

PanickyFool

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
5,947
About a month later I came back to it, turned out that they had a scheme going where they would divy up work to make it seem like two people were necessary, while one did the work and the other hid in a secret club house. They would rotate based on their own secret schedule.

Don't worry, metro north workers had a secret clubhouse also!

nypost-com.cdn.ampproject.org

MTA workers had hidden ‘man cave’ below Grand Central tracks, IG report finds

The lounge — complete with futon, flat-screen, microwave and refrigerator — was found behind a sheetrock wall in an unused locksmith shop below Track 114.
 

GK86

Member
Oct 25, 2017
18,762
The MTA needs to be burned down to the ground and started over. Fuck all these assholes and fuck the MTA.
 

effingvic

Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,200
He was thinking that literally everyone in the organization does it.

He was thinking this organization pays ticket collectors $120k per year.

Which is just insane. I've always heard stories of MTA employees abusing overtime but this is just some next level stuff. I dont know how you can remove this rot from the organization.
 

captmcblack

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,063
You'd probably have to terminate so many people and claw back so many pensions, but the litigation would be so bitter.

Then, you gotta figure the strikes and such would probably be even more debilitating to the city than the bitter litigation...
 

PanickyFool

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
5,947
Which is just insane. I've always heard stories of MTA employees abusing overtime but this is just some next level stuff. I dont know how you can remove this rot from the organization.
You can't politically. These are all patronage jobs. "Good paying Union jobs" that are horribly unproductive and heavily subsidized by tax payers.

Wait what? The folks that come on the train? Why don't they just use turn-styles like the subway?

They should, even China does on its high speed rail lines, but yes all six people on each LIRR train collecting tickets get paid 120k per year before benefits.

The job requires less skill than being a cashier say McDonald's.

You'd probably have to terminate so many people and claw back so many pensions, but the litigation would be so bitter.

Then, you gotta figure the strikes and such would probably be even more debilitating to the city than the bitter litigation...

Ah the traditional NYC extortion claim. That such and such is critical to the economy, so we should be willing to spend up to 100% of GDP and not worry about cost management.

Strikes are critical in controlling costs. If you do not have strikes your service likely sucks (which the MTA's service does in fact suck).
 
Last edited:
Nov 18, 2020
1,408
Fuck that. People complain about taxes and government waste as-is, and this just gives them more fodder - nobody should be celebrating this as some kind of moral victory for the little man.

Throw him in jail and take that money (or anything he bought with it) back.

This corruption has led a lot of people in upstate New York to vote for Republican candidates down ballot. Specifically as a reaction to this shit that's enabled by de Blasio and Cuomo. I'm still a bleeding heart liberal but you can see how, with no real answer from Albany about how to address this at a systemic level, this manifests as a rejection of the status quo.

We really need progressive candidates to come in and reform our institutions to rightfully serve the people and expand opportunities for employment, instead of repeatedly funneling money to the grifters in the bubble. This just isn't fair to taxpayers.
 
Last edited:

PanickyFool

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
5,947
We really need progressive candidates to come in and reform our institutions to rightfully serve the people and expand opportunities for employment, instead of funneling money to the grifters in the bubble. This just isn't fair to taxpayers.
NYs participation is so incredibly low in primaries that the civil service unions decide who the next mayor/governor/assemblyman/state senator is by being single issue voters (their pay) voting as a block.

It is not fixable unless the Democratic machine tries to increase participation.

Just think about how every single government services in NY sucks in quality but costs more than anywhere else. Think about how despite the incredible taxes, homelessness and inequality are higher than anywhere else. The worst landlord in the country in NYCHA...
 

entremet

You wouldn't toast a NES cartridge
Member
Oct 26, 2017
60,069
You can't politically. These are all patronage jobs. "Good paying Union jobs" that are horribly unproductive and heavily subsidized by tax payers.



They should, even China does on its high speed rail lines, but yes all six people on each LIRR train collecting tickets get paid 120k per year before benefits.

The job requires less skill than being a cashier say McDonald's.
Yeah, I used to take the Metro-North to CT. So I'm familiar with them. Didn't know they cleared six figs like that. Damn. That job is dead simple. I know people that kill themselves getting paid way less.
 

Jo-awn

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,039
New York, NY
I'm glad to see our taxpayer money being put to good work. 🙄 This isn't surprising in the slightest. It happens all the time. Some people do a better job of getting away with it than others. Management doesn't find out until it's too late. Just look at the NYC Board of Election employees rife with nepotism and people pulling a George Constanza all the time. https://www.nytimes.com/2020/10/26/nyregion/nyc-voting-election-board.html

I'm pretty sure if it was employees of color pulling it, they would have potentially faced 15-20 years in prison compared to the 10 years the 5 white employees are facing. Stuff like this is infuriating to read but it's going to keep until --as the article suggests--management keeps track of employees on the clock. But the union will resist heavily. They have an iron fist so stuff like this will keep happening.
 

GYODX

Member
Oct 27, 2017
7,237
Seems to be a common theme with these super high-tax cities producing dreadful outcomes in terms of public services, homelessness, inequality...
 

Kamek

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,977
This has been known for years. The common word is that there are tons of superfluous Mta jobs where people do nothing and get paid exorbitant sums and overtime. I wish we had real transit reform. It's the one wish I have for the city.

But the Mta is about to get a lot worse due to the covid finsncit fallout. Nyc won't be nyc without 24 hour subway.
 

PanickyFool

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
5,947
This has been known for years. The common word is that there are tons of superfluous Mta jobs where people do nothing and get paid exorbitant sums and overtime. I wish we had real transit reform. It's the one wish I have for the city.

But the Mta is about to get a lot worse due to the covid finsncit fallout. Nyc won't be nyc without 24 hour subway.
This also extend to is construction side. The MTA has 4x as many people digging tunnels when it constructs anything compared to Europe. At one site at 2av an auditor could not figure out what 200 high paid tradesmen were getting paid for (or even if they were on the job).

But again no change will come, NY will try and raise taxes even more and go broke before ever cutting or reforming a job.


Don't even ask about the $500k per year deal the long shoremen Union gets.

And why does this fraud reduce trust in government run services while fraud in the private sector doesn't change anyone's perception of it?

Because for the most part those poorly run companies cannot force it's customers to pay more for a worsening product.
 

samoyed

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
15,191
And why does this fraud reduce trust in government run services while fraud in the private sector doesn't change anyone's perception of it?
Because wasting taxpayer money is perceived as a bigger moral failing than wasting corporate money. There is a contract of trust that is renewed every time someone pays their taxes and breaking that contract is highly upsetting for most people.
 

Kamek

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,977
This also extend to is construction side. The MTA has 4x as many people digging tunnels when it constructs anything compared to Europe. At one site at 2av an auditor could not figure out what 200 high paid tradesmen were getting paid for (or even if they were on the job).

But again no change will come, NY will try and raise taxes even more and go broke before ever cutting or reforming a job.


Don't even ask about the $500k per year deal the long shoremen Union gets.



Because for the most part those poorly run companies cannot force it's customers to pay more for a worsening product.

Would love to see some of the resources you're using to find this corruption. MTA is somewhat of a Stockholm Syndrome passion of mine. It's a love/hate relationship. I just wish it were better.

Not to sound too elitist or anything, but after riding the Yamanote line last year and the JR rail, I'm hoping for some real infrastructure reform. I don't think it'll happen as long as Cuomo is gov.

All these "new signals" and MTA "fast track" programs - I expect them all to be cut because of COVID.


No monthly metro I guess isn't that big a hit since a lot of people won't be going back to the city 5 days a week anymore.
 

PanickyFool

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
5,947
Would love to see some of the resources you're using to find this corruption. MTA is somewhat of a Stockholm Syndrome passion of mine. It's a love/hate relationship. I just wish it were better.

Not to sound too elitist or anything, but after riding the Yamanote line last year and the JR rail, I'm hoping for some real infrastructure reform. I don't think it'll happen as long as Cuomo is gov.

All these "new signals" and MTA "fast track" programs - I expect them all to be cut because of COVID.


No monthly metro I guess isn't that big a hit since a lot of people won't be going back to the city 5 days a week anymore.
tunnelingonline.com

Why Tunnels in The US Cost Much More Than Anywhere Else in The World

Why is tunnel construction more expensive in the United States than anywhere else in the world? And how can the cost be reduced?

www.nytimes.com

The Most Expensive Mile of Subway Track on Earth (Published 2017)

How excessive staffing, little competition, generous contracts and archaic rules dramatically inflate capital costs for transit in New York.

Note that the Times article is 3 years old and zero reform has happened.

I have traveled the world and intentionally ride metro's throughout.

Compared to any international transit line from Toronto (Bad) to HK, Taiwan, Moscow (Great). The MTA sucks.
 

Djalminha

Alt-Account
Banned
Sep 22, 2020
2,103
Because wasting taxpayer money is perceived as a bigger moral failing than wasting corporate money. There is a contract of trust that is renewed every time someone pays their taxes and breaking that contract is highly upsetting for most people.
Right, that's where I was going for: it's the same action and same human nature but we are biased to blame the system in some cases and just the person in others. This doesn't happen in other countries to the same degree, not at least in the ones where I've lived.

What I'm saying is that saying that this will hurt the way people view the public sector reflects a negative cultural bias against that sector. News like this one confirm that bias while the equivalent in a private environment doesn't hurt them. The opposite happens too: positive news about how public services are cheaper to run than subcontracting public companies don't produce positive reception while something about how some billionaire "made it" gets lots of praise.

Don't get me wrong I'm just trying to understand where this allergy that most Americans have against public services comes from. Media and the education system are responsible I'm sure, but I suspect they are just a reflection of something that was already there.