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NVIDIA announces RTX I/O - PCIe 4.0, on-GPU storage decompression, collaberating with Microsoft on DirectStorage

platocplx

platocplx

2020 Member Elect
Member
Oct 30, 2017
36,072
LCGeek said:
The next pc one can build with a 3090 can be insane. This is before next gen ryzen show.

Next gen ssd was announce, but say you take the other two components especially 3090 and get 96GB of system ram one could enjoy of lot games with insane IO performance.
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Yes and it will be at least 2000 dollars or more vs a 500 dollar console. like pretty much are comparing apples to oranges here lol. you get a lot of value for what the consoles are giving and its great PC has an option now that frankly would last someone at least 7 years or more. which is great if they go for that card.
 
Detail

Detail

Member
Dec 30, 2018
2,947
platocplx said:
it should benefit in newer games, not sure how much benefit in older ones, there are APIs. There is prob some benefit with the decompression, but the APIs prob need to be utilized to maximize it i think. but sounds like there should be newer games using it going forward. at least thats my first glance at it. def can be wrong need more info to be sure and see performance differences.
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See my concern is I am using a rather old CPU (even though I play at 4k so the bottleneck is less of an issue) I use a 3970x with a rampage IV motherboard, pci 3.0 lanes basically.

Along with my SSD is this going to bottleneck the GPU in anyway?
 
gofreak

gofreak

Member
Oct 26, 2017
7,736
zombiejames said:
So much for the whole "developers will never design games around the PS5 SSD because PC ports will force them to scale down to regular hard drives"
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Well... it's unlikely multiplat devs wanting to target PCs will design for PCi 4.0 + RTX as a baseline any time soon.

But with more and more machines capable of high bandwidth (and, presumably, low latency) to gpu memory out in the market, it will at least make and increasingly strong case for the use of tech that scales some or other elements of quality along that axis.
 
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theAllseeingEYE

theAllseeingEYE

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Apr 4, 2018
4,514
Vancouver, BC
platocplx said:
yeah this is good stuff here. glad to see this is a standard across the industry this means SSDs on PC are a must going forward in new builds.
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Anyone who didn't already at least have an SSD on thier OS must have been going through rough times ;), but yeah, SSD is definitely a requirement if you don't want severe bottlenecks at this point.

I'd say, if you are building a new PC, having at least 500GB-1TB of fast NVMe is now ideal,if you don't want to bottleneck your system on proper ports from next-gen XSX games. Something that does at least 2.4GB/s, but hopefully price on the 4-7GB/s NVMes keeps dropping.
 
platocplx

platocplx

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Oct 30, 2017
36,072
theAllseeingEYE said:
Anyone who didn't already at least have an SSD on thier OS must have been going through rough times ;), but yeah, SSD is definitely a requirement if you don't want severe bottlenecks at this point.

I'd say, if you are building a new PC, having at least 500GB-1TB of fast NVMe is now ideal,if you don't want to bottleneck your system on proper ports from next-gen XSX games. Something that does at least 2.4GB/s, but hopefully price on the 4-7GB/s NVMes keeps dropping.
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yep good stuff all around its gonna be a fun generation for all gamers who take advantage. we definitely are going to get some amazing games.
 
Delusibeta

Delusibeta

Prophet of Truth
Banned
Oct 26, 2017
5,648
thepenguin55 said:
I'm a bit of a layman but if I'm understanding this correctly the one real advantage next gen consoles would've had over PC (the SSD tech) is now gone?
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As ever, the proof will be in the pudding, but if this is as advertised, then PC games suddenly have an I/O system that's close to PS5 and completely stomps on Xbox Velocity Architecture.
 
Magio

Magio

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Apr 14, 2020
647
All the PCMR people are about to change their minds on the importance of IO, aren't they?
 

LCGeek

Member
Oct 28, 2017
5,857
platocplx said:
Yes and it will be at least 2000 dollars or more vs a 500 dollar console. like pretty much are comparing apples to oranges here lol. you get a lot of value for what the consoles are giving and its great PC has an option now that frankly would last someone at least 7 years or more. which is great if they go for that card.
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I'm not having a price value proposition. Someone already said 3090 to be used at max is gonna need a hefty tv which is even bigger proposition. In 3 years consumers are going enjoy some insanely good lucking shit once mid range becomes accessible for that level of tech.

Either are great values considering where last gen were.

To see such jumps at all is very unexpected.

You can't compare pc extremes to consoles fairly.

Delusibeta said:
As ever, the proof will be in the pudding, but if this is as advertised, then PC games suddenly have an I/O system that's close to PS5 tier and completely stomps Xbox Velocity Architecture.
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Without a ramdrive setup it's close with one it will crap on consoles, but again effort and money are easily gonna start costing 4-6x to do it.
 
Madjoki

Madjoki

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,230
If games are 200GB, next gen consoles 1TB SSDs are really small.

Arex said:
You'll need the Ampere GPU + Pcie 4 SSD to fully utilize this yea?
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PCIE4 SSD definitely. RTX 2xxx series support could be there, but not confirmed.

platocplx said:
Yes and it will be at least 2000 dollars or more vs a 500 dollar console. like pretty much are comparing apples to oranges here lol. you get a lot of value for what the consoles are giving and its great PC has an option now that frankly would last someone at least 7 years or more. which is great if they go for that card.
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You aren't going to pair $1500 GPU with $500 CPU/MEMORY/SSD/MB/PSU. Easily another $1500.
 
platocplx

platocplx

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Oct 30, 2017
36,072
Madjoki said:
If games are 200GB, next gen consoles 1TB SSDs are really small.



PCIE4 SSD definitely. RTX 2xxx series support could be there, but not confirmed.



You aren't going to pair $1500 GPU with $500 CPU/MEMORY/SSD/MB/PSU. Easily another $1500.
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yeah i was being extremely conservative. if i were building def its about 3k or more. lol
 
JaggedSac

JaggedSac

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Oct 25, 2017
2,988
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gofreak said:
Well... it's unlikely multiplat devs wanting to target PCs will design for PCi 4.0 + RTX as a baseline any time soon.

But with more and more machines capable of high bandwidth (and, presumably, low latency) to gpu memory, it will at least make and increasingly strong case for the use of tech that scales some or other elements of quality along that axis.
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It also helps Sony first party in their porting efforts.
 
VorpalNonsense

VorpalNonsense

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Oct 25, 2017
14,651
thepenguin55 said:
I'm a bit of a layman but if I'm understanding this correctly the one real advantage next gen consoles would've had over PC (the SSD tech) is now gone?
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PC was never going to stay behind for too long. PC is usually ahead even.
PC innovation feeds into consoles and console innovation feeds into PCs.
But it probably won't be as affordable on PC as it will be on console right away.
And it will take time for all these new solutions to be supported across multiple platforms.
It's great to see all this new tech push the industry forward and create new standards.
 
platocplx

platocplx

2020 Member Elect
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Oct 30, 2017
36,072
VorpalNonsense said:
PC was never going to stay behind for too long. PC is usually ahead even.
PC innovation feeds into consoles and console innovation feeds into PCs.
But it probably won't be as affordable on PC as it will be on console right away.
It's great to see all this new tech push the industry forward and create new standards.
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couldnt have said it any better, and honestly this time around we are getting powerful ass consoles vs last gen and with these RTX monsters its all bodes well for the future iterations.
 
xem

xem

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Oct 31, 2017
2,043
Im really impressed with the prices. was expecting much more expensive
 
Gemüsepizza

Gemüsepizza

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Oct 26, 2017
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This seems like a software solution to the I/O problems current PCs have. Not sure if the picture shown by nvidia is all that accurate, because while the CPU won't be doing the decompression, it still might have to receive the data and send it to the GPU, which will introduce latency. PS5 could still have some advantage here, when it comes to how much new data is usable per frame. That the 3080 only has 10 GB VRAM won't help, too.

Regardless, this is a big step forward and maybe AMD / Intel will have an even better solution for their next CPU platforms to address this.
 
GhostTrick

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Oct 25, 2017
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As I said: People were talking about "catching up" for unreleased stuff.


Gemüsepizza said:
This seems like a software solution to the I/O problems current PCs have. Not sure if the picture shown by nvidia is all that accurate, because while the CPU won't be doing the decompression, it still might have to receive the data and send it to the GPU, which will introduce latency. PS5 could still have some advantage here, when it comes to how much new data is usable per frame. That the 3080 only has 10 GB VRAM won't help, too.

Regardless, this is a big step forward and maybe AMD / Intel will have an even better solution for their next CPU platforms to address this.
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emote.png
 
VanWinkle

VanWinkle

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Oct 25, 2017
16,095
This gives me hope that next-gen games will really push SSD tech to change game design. But then, would games have to require 3000 series cards to do so? Might be limiting. Interesting to think about, though.
 
gofreak

gofreak

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Oct 26, 2017
7,736
SolidJaum said:
This is only good news actually. Means that games can be designed around PS5 full speed earlier. It's very good that PS5 put the focus on SSD and not on a fancy GPU.
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I'd say it means that it opens up a path for PC games to also scale things along the I/O axis, to PS5 levels and beyond, and ultimately paves the way for games that can design around that as the tech becomes common later on. I don't think the latter will be immediate.

But both those outcomes are indeed good news for PS5. It would be bad news for PS5 if the rest of the landscape was stuck on 'small IO' or didn't recognise the need for big IO increases. But if, on the other hand there is a generally recognised trend, and if PS5 is best placed among the consoles to keep up with that, then its tech choices may look like bets well placed.
 
asmith906

asmith906

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Oct 27, 2017
27,405
LCGeek said:
Besides the Samsung and Sabrnet announcement seems all talk of the last few months is over blown.

Before news console showed up big standards are already in place.

A virtual ram based monster with a 3090 will shit on any console, period. 8 fucking k.
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I would hope so considering the price of the 3090 alone will be more than ps5 and xsx combined
 
theAllseeingEYE

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Apr 4, 2018
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gofreak said:
Well... it's unlikely multiplat devs wanting to target PCs will design for PCi 4.0 + RTX as a baseline any time soon.

But with more and more machines capable of high bandwidth (and, presumably, low latency) to gpu memory, it will at least make and increasingly strong case for the use of tech that scales some or other elements of quality along that axis.
Click to expand...
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I can absolutely see developers building thier engines for scalable I/O. Unreal 5 already sounds like it does this. Devs have already been building games in a way that can scale texture sizes easily for years, I have to imagine it will be an extension of that with APIs like DirectStorage.

Having said that, we could realistically be looking at a future where your storage speed directly affects texture quality in a huge way. Perhaps standard SSD will be min-spec, while 5GB/s+ would be more like Ultra spec.
 

LCGeek

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Oct 28, 2017
5,857
asmith906 said:
I would hope so considering the price of the 3090 alone will be more than ps5 and xsx combined
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But an 8k tv is still more than all 3 combined and that isn't even discussing the well made ones to come. Since post crts this is moment I've been waiting for, still cheaper than arcade boards I've gone in on.
 
Raide

Raide

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Oct 31, 2017
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Will be interesting to see how PC devs use this and it should make those Series X ports much easier. Whatever MS do with Series X will be a massive boon to PC users.
 
Magio

Magio

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Apr 14, 2020
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VanWinkle said:
This gives me hope that next-gen games will really push SSD tech to change game design. But then, would games have to require 3000 series cards to do so? Might be limiting. Interesting to think about, though.
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Wouldn't be surprised if AMD had an IO coprocessor coming up too. By the time the consoles have been out for 3/4 years it's possible that lower end GPUs will have that stuff tooand that even run of the mill multiplat games will start to fully take advantage of these things at a game design level.

I'm gonna make one bet: GTA VI will require bonkers IO. Like, to the point where an XSX is the minimum spec IO wise for it.
 
theAllseeingEYE

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Raide said:
Will be interesting to see how PC devs use this and it should make those Series X ports much easier. Whatever MS do with Series X will be a massive boon to PC users.
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Absolutely.

I hope this also means AMD is working on a similar solution with thier new GPUs. Perhaps it's still possible AMD could try offloading that pricessing/cost to the motherboard, but hopefully it's also in thier GPU.
 
MP!

MP!

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Oct 30, 2017
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Why aren't computers running solely on GPUs yet?
as in ... why do we need CPUs still? Couldn't Everything be written for GPU architecture
 
score01

score01

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Oct 27, 2017
3,701
This is great to see similar I/O improvements heading to PC as we are seeing with the new gen of consoles - it can mean than making better use of it will happen sooner reather than later.
 
Sabin

Sabin

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Oct 25, 2017
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Gemüsepizza said:
This seems like a software solution to the I/O problems current PCs have. Not sure if the picture shown by nvidia is all that accurate, because while the CPU won't be doing the decompression, it still might have to receive the data and send it to the GPU, which will introduce latency. PS5 could still have some advantage here, when it comes to how much new data is usable per frame. That the 3080 only has 10 GB VRAM won't help, too.

Regardless, this is a big step forward and maybe AMD / Intel will have an even better solution for their next CPU platforms to address this.
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Im allways impressed how much uninformed information can be compressed into a single post.

Good job i guess?
 

Deleted member 57361

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gofreak said:
I'd say it means that it opens up a path for PC games to also scale things along the I/O axis, to PS5 levels and beyond, and ultimately paves the way for games that can design around that as the tech becomes common later on. I don't think the latter will be immediate.

But both those outcomes are indeed good news for PS5. It would be bad news for PS5 if the rest of the landscape was stuck on 'small IO' or didn't recognise the need for big IO increases. But if, on the other hand there is a generally recognised trend, and if PS5 is best placed among the consoles to keep up with that, then its tech choices may look like bets well placed.
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Yes. They couldn't keep up with gpu power anyway, so their focus in a faster I/O was way better to make PS5 future proof. Cerny's vision for PS5 is a vision that I agree for consoles, something accessible and immersive. Well, now I get why they said Project Athia was designed for PS5 SSD and is coming to PC too. Glad they can use all the power they need without comprise their vision.
 
JahIthBer

JahIthBer

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Jan 27, 2018
10,383
Direct storage being 100% confirmed for PC is good, i wonder how it will work though, i wonder if the NVME will have to be dedicated for gaming?
 
Mercury_Sagit

Mercury_Sagit

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Aug 4, 2020
333
disparate said:
They're putting out hardware that does this this year with the consoles. Why would they release GPUs two years later with this feature?
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I think only PS5 has an equivalent HW solution, XSX is using a SW solution (Velocity Engine). However considering the fact that MS also has a hand with Direct Storage in NVIDIA's solution, I wonder if they will attempt to do the same thing with AMD's GPU in XSX
 
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