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Senator Toadstool

Attempted to circumvent ban with alt account
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
16,651
www.npr.org

Democrats Unveil Legislation To Abolish The Federal Death Penalty

In an exclusive interview with NPR, Sen. Dick Durbin and Rep. Ayanna Pressley discuss their push to end capital punishment at the federal level as their party takes full control of Congress.

Illinois Senator Dick Durbin, the incoming Democratic chair of the Senate Judiciary Committee, and Rep. Ayanna Pressley, D-Mass., are unveiling legislation that would seek to end federal capital punishment, putting focus on the issue as their party prepares to take over complete control of Congress, along with the White House.

The Democratic proposal, shared first with NPR, comes as the party will have unified control of Congress after victories in two Georgia Senate races, a change in fortunes for Democratic legislative priorities. The legislation would end capital punishment at the federal level and require the re-sentencing of all federal inmates currently on death row.

"There are three lives that hang in the balance this week alone," said Pressley, speaking along with Durbin in an exclusive joint interview. "And this is why we reintroduced this bill this week and are urging Congress to act immediately to pass it. State sanctioned murder is not justice."

Former Attorney General William Barr announced in July of 2019 that the Justice Department would resume federal executions, ending what had been a nearly two-decade hiatus. At the time, Barr and Justice Department officials said that they were carrying out the will of judges and juries and providing justice for "staggeringly brutal murders."

The federal government executed 10 prisoners last year, more civilian prisoners than all the states combined over the same period. And more executions are scheduled for the final days of the Trump administration, before Biden takes office.

For his part, Biden has said that he wants to work with Congress to pass a law to eliminate capital punishment at the federal level, and to "incentivize" states to follow that example.

Last year, transition spokesman T.J. Ducklo told NPR that "the president-elect opposes the death penalty, now and in the future, and as president will work to end its use."

More at link.

This is exactly the right time to do this when BLM and trump's lawlessness is at the top of the agenda dems need to push bills like this that demonstrate how barbaric and unneeded this homicide is.
 

The Albatross

Member
Oct 25, 2017
39,038
Good, it's a shame that the Trump Admin has gone on a killing spree the last ~10 weeks.

Politically I think this will pass too depending on how it's written.
 

Deleted member 16657

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
10,198
It'll be funny to watch the party of "small government" wring themselves into a frenzy over why the government should be allowed to execute you
 

Steel

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
18,220
They need to use every second to get as much through as possible. They'll probably take a while to get a filibuster workaround, though.
 

Darryl M R

The Spectacular PlayStation-Man
Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,721
Let's see how the pro-life party will respond. Actually, let's not. Let's instead run up the scoreboard with good policies.
 

Tavernade

Tavernade
Moderator
Sep 18, 2018
8,633
They need to use every second to get as much through as possible. They'll probably take a while to get a filibuster workaround, though.

Is the Death Penalty that politicised? Like, I'm not wholly against it and I'm a Democrat, I'm sure there are Republican senators that can be swayed.
 

Richiek

Member
Nov 2, 2017
12,063
Makes Trump's rush to execute all the federal death row prisoners even more bloodthirsty.
 

Draconis

Member
Oct 28, 2017
568
I have mixed feelings about this.

On one hand, you have folks who get falsely accused or wrongly killed because of bs juries and corrupt prosecutors, etc

But then, you have horrific cases like This one right here.

And said individual is one of the ones about to be put to death, for the horrific and gruesome, heinous action they committed.

I don't really know what else to say. I wish this world was truly more fair and equivocal to all in that fairness. But some individuals, like the one in the link above, are just horrifying to think on. And it's difficult for me to not feel that they have reaped what they have sown.
 

Steel

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
18,220
Is the Death Penalty that politicised? Like, I'm not wholly against it and I'm a Democrat, I'm sure there are Republican senators that can be swayed.
Easier to find dems that support the death penalty than pubs against. I'm thinking Rand Paul might go to bat for this, not sure how much deeper than that you can go:
"My first thoughts aren't that forgiving for someone who would hurt a member of my family, but I also understand there have been times when we haven't gotten the right person," he told reporters. "And somebody who is distrustful of big government, like I am, is also distrustful of so much power being given to government to kill somebody, when there might be a mistake. A lot of eyewitness testimony has been shown over time not to be very good."
He's not wholly on board but I think he might be a yes to abolish.
I have mixed feelings about this.

On one hand, you have folks who get falsely accused or wrongly killed because of bs juries and corrupt prosecutors, etc

But then, you have horrific cases like This one right here.

And said individual is one of the ones about to be put to death, for the horrific and gruesome, heinous action they committed.

I don't really know what else to say. I wish this world was truly more fair and equivocal to all in that fairness. But some individuals, like the one in the link above, are just horrifying to think on. And it's difficult for me to not feel that they have reaped what they have sown.
It's simple. I'm not against the death penalty if the courts were perfect. They are not. So I am against potentially killing innocents to get vengeance on those that deserve it.
 

iamdelirium

Member
Nov 25, 2017
402
Good.

I have mixed feelings about this.

On one hand, you have folks who get falsely accused or wrongly killed because of bs juries and corrupt prosecutors, etc

But then, you have horrific cases like This one right here.

And said individual is one of the ones about to be put to death, for the horrific and gruesome, heinous action they committed.

I don't really know what else to say. I wish this world was truly more fair and equivocal to all in that fairness. But some individuals, like the one in the link above, are just horrifying to think on. And it's difficult for me to not feel that they have reaped what they have sown.
Those people can rot in jail then, for life.
 

Newlib

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,822
Is the Death Penalty that politicised? Like, I'm not wholly against it and I'm a Democrat, I'm sure there are Republican senators that can be swayed.

Sort of? It's mostly a blue states have abolished death penalty and Red states haven't but there is some notable exceptions (West Virginia/North Dakota are both reliably republican but don't allow executions while California is a blue state and only stopped executing in 2019)
 

Pirateluigi

Member
Oct 27, 2017
6,871
I have mixed feelings about this.

On one hand, you have folks who get falsely accused or wrongly killed because of bs juries and corrupt prosecutors, etc

But then, you have horrific cases like This one right here.

And said individual is one of the ones about to be put to death, for the horrific and gruesome, heinous action they committed.

I don't really know what else to say. I wish this world was truly more fair and equivocal to all in that fairness. But some individuals, like the one in the link above, are just horrifying to think on. And it's difficult for me to not feel that they have reaped what they have sown.

The number of people falsely executed is greater than zero. That's all I need to know.
 

Alvis

Saw the truth behind the copied door
Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,231
Spain
Good.

The death penalty cant even be proposed as an acceptable thing unless you can 100% guarantee that NO ONE will be wrongfully executed, EVER. (Even then, it's still unnaceptable IMO, but that's another matter entirely)

But that's impossible. So fuck the death penalty.
 

Deleted member 14312

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
220
I have mixed feelings about this.

On one hand, you have folks who get falsely accused or wrongly killed because of bs juries and corrupt prosecutors, etc

But then, you have horrific cases like This one right here.

And said individual is one of the ones about to be put to death, for the horrific and gruesome, heinous action they committed.

I don't really know what else to say. I wish this world was truly more fair and equivocal to all in that fairness. But some individuals, like the one in the link above, are just horrifying to think on. And it's difficult for me to not feel that they have reaped what they have sown.
What I find terrifying is the underlying bloodlust that would render the victims of injustice less of a concern than the handful of cases you look at to justify killing people.
 

ToddBonzalez

The Pyramids? That's nothing compared to RDR2
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
15,530
Good shit. Wrongful executions aren't as uncommon as people might think.
 

take_marsh

Member
Oct 27, 2017
7,283
Sadly, no matter how awful, disgusting, terrible a human being can be...

You can NEVER always, fully, 100% trust the courts to be able to carry out this kind of justice. Let's abolish this shit.
 

Beignet

alt account
Banned
Aug 1, 2020
2,638
But then, you have horrific cases like This one right here.

And said individual is one of the ones about to be put to death, for the horrific and gruesome, heinous action they committed.

I don't really know what else to say. I wish this world was truly more fair and equivocal to all in that fairness. But some individuals, like the one in the link above, are just horrifying to think on. And it's difficult for me to not feel that they have reaped what they have sown.
It costs far more money to keep these kinds of people on Death Row than it is to lock them up and throw away the key. Do you really want to spend more taxes on these kinds of people? Not to mention that our system has killed more than zero innocent people. It needs to go. These matters should not be put in the hands of an imperfect state and imperfect justice system.
 

Draconis

Member
Oct 28, 2017
568
What I find terrifying is the underlying bloodlust that would render the victims of injustice less of a concern than the handful of cases you look at to justify killing people.

It's not bloodlust in my case. I genuinely do not like loss of life. Period.

Our system is not fair, and it's complete bullshit that that is the case. You have rapists getting off with a slap on the hand and others getting framed and thrown in for life because the color of their skin automatically prejudices the system against them. Which infuriates me to no end.

On the other hand, I do also want to believe in karma and that one's actions always have repercussions. For good or for ill. Rare though it is many suffer the extent of their evil against others.

This woman murdered a pregnant mother and cut her unborn child from her womb. Planned it out, long in advance. Tried to pass the child off as hers for completely selfish, evil reasons.


What does one say to that Woman's husband? Her Mother? Her extended family whom will no longer have her around?

I don't like the Death Penalty. At all. My feelings are intensely mixed on this because I genuinely believe this woman should face the consequences of her tremendous evil.

At the same time, I want all those who are falsely accused and framed freed from their prisons and their innocence brought to light.


I know many folks feel strongly about this. And I don't blame them. I won't even begrudge anyone their own anger or hate towards me for my own feelings on this.


But sadly, life is not as simple as many of us would like it to be. It's complicated, infuriating, and damned depressing at times. It also has it's high points.

If you get rid of this system, it still does not free those wrongly accused and jailed. Those who are innocent. It buys them, hopefully, more time to be freed when they are innocent.

The Death Penalty is just one symptom of the disease. Getting rid of it helps those who are innocent yes, to some measure.


But it is not a cure for the disease as a whole.

Sadly, I don't know what will ever be as we ourselves, humans, are at the core of that festering rot. And all of our prejudices, hatreds, and fears. And I know not what will cleanse it and make it work as a whole.
 
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brochiller

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
2,191
The number of people falsely executed is greater than zero. That's all I need to know.

800px-Ben-franklin-blackstone.jpg
 

Menchi

Member
Oct 28, 2017
3,143
UK
Yep, capital punishment has no place in the world. It needs to be eradicated, full stop.
 

steejee

Member
Oct 28, 2017
8,618
Good.

With Life in Prison there is always the chance a person could be exonerated and have some sort of life left to live.

With the death penalty, there is no take backs, no corrections.

I see life in prison as a greater punishment than death anyways.
 

Tavernade

Tavernade
Moderator
Sep 18, 2018
8,633
The number of people falsely executed is greater than zero. That's all I need to know.

That's the biggest problem with the Death Penalty for me. If we can somehow change the laws to make it basically impossible for an innocent person to be killed than I have no issue with it (assuming it's used for murderers/rapists). But obviously that's kinda a big sticking point.
 

Peebs

Alt-Account
Banned
Dec 16, 2020
119
It's not bloodlust in my case. I genuinely do not like loss of life. Period.

Our system is not fair, and it's complete bullshit that that is the case. You have rapists getting off with a slap on the hand and others getting framed and thrown in for life because the color of their skin automatically prejudices the system against them. Which infuriates me to no end.

On the other hand, I do also want to believe in karma and that one's actions always have repercussions. For good or for ill. Rare though it is many suffer the extent of their evil against others.

This woman murdered a pregnant mother and cut her unborn child from her womb. Planned it out, long in advance. Tried to pass the child off as hers for completely selfish, evil reasons.


What does one say to that Woman's husband? Her Mother? Her extended family whom will no longer have her around?

I don't like the Death Penalty. At all. My feelings are intensely mixed on this because I genuinely believe this woman should face the consequences of her tremendous evil.

At the same time, I want all those who are falsely accused and framed freed from their prisons and their innocence brought to light.


I know many folks feel strongly about this. And I don't blame them. I won't even begrudge anyone their own anger or hate towards me for my own feelings on this.


But sadly, life is not as simple as many of us would like it to be. It's complicated, infuriating, and damned depressing at times. It also has it's high points.

If you get rid of this system, it still does not free those wrongly accused and jailed. Those who are innocent. It buys them, hopefully, more time to be freed when they are innocent.

The Death Penalty is just one symptom of the disease. Getting rid of it helps those who are innocent yes, to some measure.


But it is not a cure for the disease as a whole.

Sadly, I don't know what will ever be as we ourselves, humans, are at the core of that festering rot. And all of our prejudices, hatreds, and fears. And I know not what will cleanse it and make it work as a whole.

If you understand the bolded then why are you arguing in favour of the death penalty? Don't even know what the underlined is meant to be.

What do you say to that woman's husband? You say I'm sorry for your loss but our justice system is inherently flawed so we can't risk irreversible sentences that don't achieve anything.

And that's ignoring the reality that they'll spend years in jail on death row anyway, and that there are countless countries getting along just fine without the death penality.
 

Neece

Member
Oct 27, 2017
9,201
It's not bloodlust in my case. I genuinely do not like loss of life. Period.

Our system is not fair, and it's complete bullshit that that is the case. You have rapists getting off with a slap on the hand and others getting framed and thrown in for life because the color of their skin automatically prejudices the system against them. Which infuriates me to no end.

On the other hand, I do also want to believe in karma and that one's actions always have repercussions. For good or for ill. Rare though it is many suffer the extent of their evil against others.

This woman murdered a pregnant mother and cut her unborn child from her womb. Planned it out, long in advance. Tried to pass the child off as hers for completely selfish, evil reasons.


What does one say to that Woman's husband? Her Mother? Her extended family whom will no longer have her around?

I don't like the Death Penalty. At all. My feelings are intensely mixed on this because I genuinely believe this woman should face the consequences of her tremendous evil.

At the same time, I want all those who are falsely accused and framed freed from their prisons and their innocence brought to light.


I know many folks feel strongly about this. And I don't blame them. I won't even begrudge anyone their own anger or hate towards me for my own feelings on this.


But sadly, life is not as simple as many of us would like it to be. It's complicated, infuriating, and damned depressing at times. It also has it's high points.

If you get rid of this system, it still does not free those wrongly accused and jailed. Those who are innocent. It buys them, hopefully, more time to be freed when they are innocent.

The Death Penalty is just one symptom of the disease. Getting rid of it helps those who are innocent yes, to some measure.


But it is not a cure for the disease as a whole.

Sadly, I don't know what will ever be as we ourselves, humans, are at the core of that festering rot. And all of our prejudices, hatreds, and fears. And I know not what will cleanse it and make it work as a whole.

The feelings surrounding this issue are complicated, but the legality should be clear. The state should not have the authority to carry out killing people. Corruption and bias in criminal justice alone should make this a very black and white issue.

On the matter of justice for the families...

Even now with the death penalty in place, families of victims often don't feel the catharsis or sense of justice that comes with the murderer being on death row for 20-30 years, going through countless appeals, and reliving the details of the case over and over and over again for decades, only for someone that was 25 when they murdered someone to finally be put to death when they are a frail 55 year old that barely resembles the person they were physically when they committed their heinous crime, let alone where they are mentally decades later.

The system in place now feeds bloodlust and that is about it.
 
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