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Durante

Dark Souls Man
Member
Oct 24, 2017
5,074
All of Pillars of Eternity 2's (paid and free) DLC is now out, as well as patch 4.0.

They've greatly increased the game's polish, improved the UI and AI, balanced the classes and battles, and added a lot of additional content over what was already a very solid launch.

Personally, I paused playing the game a week or two post-release after ~25 hours so that I could complete it with all the DLC content (I generally don't re-play RPGs, and I like to play DLC like this during my playthrough and not afterwards) and I went back to it now with all the DLC being ready. I already loved the game when it was released, but I was surprised again at just how great it is when I returned back to it. I immediately lost several hours to it, and that's just not generally something that happens to me any more with single player games (unless they're made by Zachtronics).

Seriously, everything about this game is fantastic:
  • The setting is amazing. All the factions are believable, none of them are either totally Saturday-morning cartoon evil or beacons of morality.
    The region's as well as the factions' history is clearly very well developed, and its impact is realistically felt throughout the game.
  • Quests are incredibly varied, with many options for completing them. They could be focused on everything from a city-only spying mission over primarily exploring on the world map to dungeon crawling and battles. And their outcomes often aren't the usual binary "help this faction, now the other one hates me forever" deal, but a much more realistic approach where people will still act for their own self-interest in how the interact with you, even if you didn't do exactly what they wanted.
  • Systemic character growth (as in, leveling) and strategic planning are interesting, rewarding, allow for a great many options and playstyles, and are very balanced. The patches changed quite a lot here for some of the classes, and generally for the better -- and it was already pretty exemplary at launch.
  • The UI is the best that I have ever seen in any party-based CRPG. Everything is clearly signaled in and out of battle with smartly designed markers, it's highly customizable, and it has sub-string search in all cases where that makes sense. Seriously, ever since SkyUI demonstrated just how well that works in large-scale RPGs, it has seen far too little use. They go a step further in PoE2 and supply all items with tags that can also be used for search.
  • Talking about itemization, it's awesome as well. Lots of unique and Soulbound items, with great lore and even greater effects that play well with that lore background. And the tag system is amazing here again, where items can target specific subsets of tagged skills which allows very specific effects which in turn enable or greatly enhance the viability of some builds.
  • Skills are also awesomely varied within and across classes, and yet somehow still mostly balanced. Everyone basically has something tactically interesting to do at all times. And some changed introduced in the patches make this even more true, like the perk allowing you to scale the area of influence of spells per cast for increased (or reduced) effectiveness.
  • Since we're on the topic of variety, the pacing and gameplay variety in Pillars of Eternity 2 is one of its greatest strengths -- especially since this is an area where I feel many (especially longer) games fail. You have so many different types of gameplay, and you get the choice of how much to engage with each of them at any time: dialogue-based play primarily in cities and with party members, exploration on both the world map and in individual regions/dungeons, combat of course, choose-your-own adventure style segments (with skill and inventory tests -- I love these), the whole naval aspect, and of course strategic planning with items and character building.
  • The battle system is fantastic as well. Depending on the difficulty (in terms of both the global setting and the relative difficulty of individual encounters) you can always fluidly choose on how much or little to interact with the moment-to-moment gameplay, from highly controlled very difficult encounters to extremely quick cleanups (the latter of which I sorely miss in many other party-based RPGS). And the tactical possibilities are almost endless, and even more importantly quite different for almost every encounter, based on the relative positioning of enemies, your party, your remaining skills, and the geometrical layout of the area you are fighting in.
  • As you would expect from Obsidian, the writing is on point, despite the absolutely massive amount of it required to populate this large game. Characters and factions really come to live with it, and you notice how their background and disposition subtly (and sometimes not-so-subtly) influences the way they speak and frame different requests. It's not as heavy on the philosophical theming as some of my favourites in the genre, but in terms of grounded and thoughtful writing its excellent.
  • After all this, with a game so enticing on so many aspects, you kind of expect a letdown, right? It's a smaller-scale production, so maybe its graphics aren't anything to write home about? On the contrary, Pillars of Eternity 2 is a beautiful game. The rendered, then artistically improved backdrops integrate fabulously with dynamic elements and lighting, and the various locales all feature incredible detail. Spell and battle effects are suitably impressive, and weather and atmospheric lighting features elevate it far beyond what could be accomplished with this type of graphics setup before.

As a massive fan of these types of games, there is now absolutely no doubt in my mind that Pillars of Eternity 2 is the best game ever in the legacy of the Inifinity Engine CRPGs. (I still like PS:T more, but it's undeniable that PoE2 is objectively a much better game overall)
If you read everything up to this part, then you really really should play Pillars of Eternity 2.

 

Tibarn

Member
Oct 31, 2017
13,369
Barcelona
I have the game always on my mind (as well as a replay of the first game), and I was waiting for the game to be "complete".

Maybe during the winter holidays, I'll try it.

How long is a normal playthrough?
 
Oct 25, 2017
4,840
Keep in mind that there's a Steam sale coming this week, so this is probably the worst time to buy the game.
 

Shake Appeal

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,883
Funny you made this thread, Durante, because I reinstalled and started playing it again on Sunday night.

How long is a normal playthrough?
My completionist, slow-burn playthrough, prior to the three DLCs being added, was something like 80 hours. But I did absolutely everything, and most of the game is "side" content.
 

jon bones

Member
Oct 25, 2017
25,978
NYC
Damn, you really are selling this well. I have been in the mood for a game with great writing and an ensemble cast of characters...
 
OP
OP
Durante

Durante

Dark Souls Man
Member
Oct 24, 2017
5,074
How long is a normal playthrough?
I haven't completed it, but at the current rate I expect my playthrough to take at least 90 hours.

Note that I am really really thorough though -- since I know I might not get a treat like this again for another decade.

Is it required to play the first game first?
After its respective DLC and patches, PoE1 is also an absolutely excellent game, just not quite as good in some aspects (like the obvious graphics, or the less obvious UI niceties) as PoE2.
I'd suggest first playing PoE1, but it's not absolutely necessary. PoE2 is a direct sequel, but in a completely different part of the world, with different factions and with mostly different characters.
 

Just Progress

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
131
I've beat this game already — is it possible to continue post-game to do DLC or do I need to load a save pre-ending?
 

Tibarn

Member
Oct 31, 2017
13,369
Barcelona
As one of the few users here that share my opinion that VC4 is one of the best games from 2018, I should trust Durante on this one.
 

Shake Appeal

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,883
Is it required to play the first game first?
There is a lot of dense lore, so it would definitely be worth doing; it helps that the first game is (largely) great. A huge number of your choices are also referenced or have real consequences in the second game, too. That said, you could probably watch a video or read a wiki page to get up to speed and then jump in with Deadfire.

I've beat this game already — is it possible to continue post-game to do DLC or do I need to load a save pre-ending?
You need to load a save pre-ending. But unless you deleted your saves, you will have one at the point of no return; the game saves automatically. Bear in mind you will be over-leveled for much of the DLC content unless you have All level scaling turned on.
 

CloudWolf

Member
Oct 26, 2017
15,580
Damn, you really are selling this well. I have been in the mood for a game with great writing and an ensemble cast of characters...
Should I complete Poe 1 first?
It's not necessary, although you do get a lot more of the backstory with PoE1 played (after all, you play the same character and a bunch of the companions are from the first game). Whether or not you've played PoE1, you still get to pick what happened in PoE1 at the start though and it uses that great annotations system from Tyranny to keep you up to date with what everything means. So you're not missing out on content if you haven't played the first.
 

texhnolyze

Member
Oct 25, 2017
23,145
Indonesia
Thanks for reminding me that I actually bought the game + season pass at launch. It probably is the perfect time to dive into the DLCs, I haven't played any of them after beating the game.
 

wellpapp

Member
Aug 21, 2018
464
Gothenburg
Got a backer key but never settled with my class, always stopped playing after reaching the main city. There's so much breathing room in how you want to customize it, almost a bit too much, with all the subclasses. Going to give it a real, new chance after the holidays. No more pauses, going to finish it.

I'd like a good build guide if anyone knows one.
 

OMEGALUL

Banned
Oct 10, 2018
539
I'll wait for the complete edition with the DLC included, paying 120 bucks for the whole package is nuts.
 

Shake Appeal

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,883
I'd like a good build guide if anyone knows one.
Try this thread on the Obsidian forums. You're looking for builds for version 3.0 or later, though. There have been a lot of balance changes that might nerf older builds.

Hm, should I play with level scaling on/off?
If you intend to play a lot of the content, especially the factional stuff (which is the meat of the game), I'd highly recommend turning it on. It's well-implemented.
 

Spence

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,119
Sweden
Nice writeup, I agree with everything you wrote, if you even remotely like CRPG games don't sleep on this game.
 

.exe

Member
Oct 25, 2017
22,206
Great read. After completing the Mass Effect trilogy, I planned on moving on to another RPG. Thought it was gonna be DoS II, but since I already own PoE, I think I'll go through that and the sequel. A better game than Planescape? Must really be something else then.
 

Annubis

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,654
Oh shit! I didn't even realize that the third DLC was out.
Thanks for the notice, time to get back into this =)
 

Philxor

Member
Oct 27, 2017
51
Coventry, UK
I could support this post more. Easily one of my favourite ever games and criminally overlooked from what I have seen. Managed to get through Beast of Winter and am now up to Seeker, Slayer and the game just goes from strength to strength. There is nothing quite like settling down with PoE2 and really taking the time to appreciate every minute detail. Every part of playing is so sumptuous. If you have any interest in RPGs at all, I could not recommend it more.
 

Pellaidh

Member
Oct 26, 2017
3,161
Did they ever improve the terrible load times? I remember picking this up at launch, and the loading times could take several minutes just to enter a small house, and then another couple of minutes to leave. It made exploring the first major city so painful that I had to drop it.

Granted, this has been an ongoing issue with all games on this engine for me (I actually tried playing Tyranny on a relatively weak laptop that had no issues handling any part of the game except for the load times, which would legitimately take 5 to 10 minutes sometimes). But it was particularly terrible in PoE 2 for me.

Also, for those who played both, how does it compare to Pathfinder: Kingmaker? I'm currently playing that and am enjoying the whole kingdom building aspect and relative freedom the game gives you, but the writing leaves a lot to be desired. Given that they are both super long games, I might actually consider going with PoE2 instead. Assuming it would actually run halfway decently on my (non-SSD) machine.
 

Observation Platform

Alt-Account
Banned
Dec 4, 2018
76
But...but...the gameplay is so archaic and janky. I really want to get into this series after loving D:OS 1/2, but there is no way I can stomach more than a couple minutes of 90's-era movement and animations. Sorry OP. My loss it would seem.
 

jerfdr

Member
Dec 14, 2017
702
Durante
Have you tried Pathfinder: Kingmaker? I honestly liked it more than PoE2 (that said, I liked PoE1 with White March quite a bit more than PoE2 as well). It's still not completely polished though.
 

KorrZ

Member
Oct 27, 2017
797
Canada
I think ultimately the setting wasn't for me. I didn't really find myself enjoying the weird blend of traditional fantasy + Carribean pirate adventures. I lost interest somewhere near the end of the game when it first came out.

Pathfinder: Kingmaker while definitely a bit rough (though a lot better now) was way more interesting and fun for me personally.
 

Roytheone

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,135
It looks neat but I still need to play original sin 2 so I think I will prioritize that game first.
 

strudelkuchen

Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,042
Cheaper and DRM free on GOG.

poe2b0fw1.png
 

OneBadMutha

Member
Nov 2, 2017
6,059
What are pluses and minuses vs Divinity OS2? Just getting back into CRPGs for the first time in many years (since Balders Gate). The thing that doesn't grab me in DOS2 is the setting. Little bored of basic fantasy. Pillars unique setting make it seem more interesting at a distance. Heard that DOS2 was the go-to CRPG to jump back in but I'm tempted to switch over to Pillars for a go.
 

Facism

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,916
The game is 12pounds on cdkeys and season pass can be found for around d 15 on isthereanydeal
 

Hark

Member
Oct 29, 2017
1,161
Is this similar to Divinity 2?
I enjoyed that game but didn't finish it as my co op partners stopped playing. Is this single player only?
 

Fairy Godmother

Backward compatible
Moderator
Oct 27, 2017
3,288
I already got the game but I still need to finish Pathfinder first before I can get to it.
It's such a golden age for rpgs.
 

GazRB

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,796
I second this. I beat it before the DLC and patches, but I'm going back in soon.
 

R.T Straker

Chicken Chaser
Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,715
What are pluses and minuses vs Divinity OS2? Just getting back into CRPGs for the first time in many years (since Balders Gate). The thing that doesn't grab me in DOS2 is the setting. Little bored of basic fantasy. Pillars unique setting make it seem more interesting at a distance. Heard that DOS2 was the go-to CRPG to jump back in but I'm tempted to switch over to Pillars for a go.

There aren't that many.

D:OS2 is a far better game and the best CRPG in over a decade. While the setting like you said is a bit of generic fantasy, it does have fantastic world building and great locations.

I would highly recommand to give it a try first and it's even better if you got someone else to play with.
 

Nooblet

Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,621
Yea about this one. Honestly? This one was a huge disappointment for me. The game feels like a big whole load of nothing with an absurdly small main quest (it's like 7 quests in total), and I was told that it's the side quests/character quests that are the best thing about it but I found them to be extremely mediocre. The ship thing and overworked felt like where most of the budget went but even that felt very unfinished and half cooked.

Divinity Original Sin 2 is a much superior cRPG in every way and it had the definitive edition release in August this year. Infact that game is likely the best cRPG made in years.
 

Sarcastico

Member
Oct 27, 2017
774
I played about 10 hours of the original and I noticed that there was a lack of exciting loot. Should I expect the same with PoE2?
 

decoyplatypus

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,612
Brooklyn
This thread is a public service. Deadfire is excellent, and I hope everyone who likes RPGs at least considers playing it. One point I want to emphasize, because it draws together some of the virtues of the combat, character systems, and itemization, is that Deadfire is the sort of game where, whatever thing sounds interesting to you, you can build a character around it. You don't have to be an expert theorycrafter to join in the fun (although there are plenty of build guides out there, if you're interested). Obsidian has minimized non-viable builds (on most difficulty settings) even while dramatically expanding build variety.
 

Killzig

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,039
Bonus: you get to learn fantasy Italian.
ac. belfetto. nasanale!

To the OP's main point:
I didn't like the main story or Xoti very much, but Deadfire improves quite a bit on the first game. You absolutely do not need to play the first game. They do plenty of on boarding through the in game encyclopedia and dialog. You can also check out the gamepedia site for the first game, it's pretty well fleshed out.