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Chris.

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,920
All three points should not be reasons for not counting a death. I don't understand their decision.
Could be so they can hit out with shit alone the lines of "UK government is best as we're handling it the best with less deaths"

All about saving face.

Is anyone surprised with the pricks we have in charge?

Now simply isn't the time to be playing politics or hiding figures. We should be in complete transparency with the numbers and methodology.
 

Xando

Member
Oct 28, 2017
27,316
Interesting read



Seems like deaths in the US are under reported because 1) lag in reporting and 2) no one is really working on post mortem testing and testing is shit in general.
 

eyeball_kid

Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,235
Iran is not being talked about enough. They have 2389 new cases today and 157 new deaths. 2,234 total deaths so far.
 

Malalaw

Member
Oct 25, 2017
671
Louisiana
2305 cases in Louisiana, up to 83 deaths. 510 new cases, 18 deaths today. Doubling the amount from yesterday. It's getting real bad here. I'm right above Lafayette and they jumped up to 30 cases today.
 

The Albatross

Member
Oct 25, 2017
39,035
this lifted my spirits, thats damn great! i can tell you its no picnic, i was on a ventilator for 11 days (non-Corona infection heh) and it fuuuuuucked me up. worst hallucinations ever, just a non-stop bad trip. if he ever opens up to you about the weird shit he experienced, dont look at him funny, apparently its very common. just batshit crazy visions, for example i thought i was there because i got hurt in WW3, and Tom Cruise was one of the doctors who wanted to experiment on me... etc etc. fun stuff like that, all felt 100% real.

I've had pneumonia twice, never needed to be hospitalized, but in both cases I had fever-dreams/hallucinations. Actually, the second time I had pnuemonia, I actually kinda knew it was pneumonia because I was hallucinating. The only times I've ever hallucinated from sickness was when I had pneumonia. Even the one time I had a bad bout of bronchitis, I did not hallucinate.

For me, I did not like either of those episodes. They weren't painful or distressing, both were fairly calm, but as a grownup with kids and responsibilties now, I don't care to think about them.

Iran is not being talked about enough. They have 2389 new cases today and 157 new deaths. 2,234 total deaths so far.

One reason for this is that they've banned the media within Iran from reporting on it and have threatened to jail medical personnel who talk to the press about it. Medical personnel can only talk to outside press under anonymity, and the risks might not be worth it for them.

www.nytimes.com

Iran’s Coronavirus Response: Pride, Paranoia, Secrecy, Chaos (Published 2020)

Iranian leaders once predicted the coronavirus epidemic ravaging China would not affect their country. Now Iran has among the most coronavirus deaths outside China, and Iranian medical workers have been told to keep quiet.
 

TorianElecdra

Member
Feb 25, 2020
2,513
Interesting read



Seems like deaths in the US are under reported because 1) lag in reporting and 2) no one is really working on post mortem testing and testing is shit in general.


Isn't that whats happening in Germany too? As in, if you die from covid but you were not tested before death then you don't become part of the stadistics?
 
Last edited:
Nov 13, 2017
9,537
My anxiety and fear has gotten to the point where reading this thread, reddit, or twitter makes me feel extremely lightheaded. As if I'm going to faint. I am in all honestly addicted to following the news and it's ruining my well-being. I need to find the strength to stop it.
 

Tya

Member
Oct 30, 2017
3,662
I wonder if I'm going to get screwed out of a check. I hadn't filed taxes the last few years because I haven't had an income and I only mailed in my 2019 return today. I could really, really use the money.
 

lt519

Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,064
Seems like deaths in the US are under reported because 1) lag in reporting and 2) no one is really working on post mortem testing and testing is shit in general.

Yeah, at this point in time there are more important things to do than test the deceased. Why spend resources on that when we're already short on everything else. Sadly this just won't make the numbers. Neither will the number of patients without Covid-19 that need ICUs but can't get them. An analysis on the whole thing after will be interesting, i.e. historical average deaths vs actual deaths during the outbreak. Accounting for the fact that flu cases will be lower due to social distancing will also be interesting. Going to be hard to untangle it all.
 

Gabe

Verified
Oct 25, 2017
200
Italy
no, no and again no. Who the hell is spreading this non-sense?

Doctors and the RKI

"The Italians test deceased persons who had specific symptoms and bring them into the statistics — we in Germany do not," said Dietrich Rothenbacher, a professor at the Institute for Epidemiology and Medical Biometry at Ulm University.

"It's a complex scenario," he said. Rothenbacher feels strongly that before any solid comparison can be made between countries, "the first step would be to obtain comparable numbers."

www.nbcnews.com

Why are so few Germans dying from the coronavirus? Experts wonder

"I would be happy if we can come back in two months' time and still be able to talk about what Germany did right," one expert said.

Like, i know this gets people upset somehow, but so far there seemed to be way more voices saying they don't test than the ones that say they do. I understand is a decentralized system so it may actually vary WILDLY based on areas and hospitals since it's not (as per RKI) mandatory.
 

plow

Member
Oct 28, 2017
4,650
Numbers in Germany Went Up a Lot today but i presume this is die Too more Testing being done
 

Xando

Member
Oct 28, 2017
27,316
Yeah, at this point in time there are more important things to do than test the deceased. Why spend resources on that when we're already short on everything else. Sadly this just won't make the numbers. Neither will the number of patients without Covid-19 that need ICUs but can't get them. An analysis on the whole thing after will be interesting, i.e. historical average deaths vs actual deaths during the outbreak. Accounting for the fact that flu cases will be lower will also be interesting.
This is flatout wrong though.

If you don't know someone died by the virus chances are very high the patient infected staff, you can't tell direct family to quarantine so they continue to spread the virus and have no data for your modells to predict the outbreak.

Testing is the most important thing right now.
 

Garchia3.0

Member
Dec 20, 2018
1,859
Doctors and the RKI

"The Italians test deceased persons who had specific symptoms and bring them into the statistics — we in Germany do not," said Dietrich Rothenbacher, a professor at the Institute for Epidemiology and Medical Biometry at Ulm University.

"It's a complex scenario," he said. Rothenbacher feels strongly that before any solid comparison can be made between countries, "the first step would be to obtain comparable numbers."

www.nbcnews.com

Why are so few Germans dying from the coronavirus? Experts wonder

"I would be happy if we can come back in two months' time and still be able to talk about what Germany did right," one expert said.

Like, i know this gets people upset somehow, but so far there seemed to be way more voices saying they don't test than the ones that say they do. I understand is a decentralized system so it may actually vary WILDLY based on areas and hospitals since it's not (as per RKI) mandatory.

There's the answer.
 

lt519

Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,064
This is flatout wrong though.

If you don't know someone died by the virus chances are very high the patient infected staff, you can't tell direct family to quarantine so they continue to spread the virus and have no data for your modells to predict the outbreak.

Testing is the most important thing right now.

You're right, I stand corrected. Ideally. I was imagining an overloaded hospital staff, already short on PPE and testing kits, that has to move on and tend to other sick. If they just assume its a Covid death it doesn't change their response. At that point its just for modelling. I don't know if we are there yet.
 

Xando

Member
Oct 28, 2017
27,316
Doctors and the RKI

"The Italians test deceased persons who had specific symptoms and bring them into the statistics — we in Germany do not," said Dietrich Rothenbacher, a professor at the Institute for Epidemiology and Medical Biometry at Ulm University.

"It's a complex scenario," he said. Rothenbacher feels strongly that before any solid comparison can be made between countries, "the first step would be to obtain comparable numbers."

www.nbcnews.com

Why are so few Germans dying from the coronavirus? Experts wonder

"I would be happy if we can come back in two months' time and still be able to talk about what Germany did right," one expert said.

Like, i know this gets people upset somehow, but so far there seemed to be way more voices saying they don't test than the ones that say they do. I understand is a decentralized system so it may actually vary WILDLY based on areas and hospitals since it's not (as per RKI) mandatory.
Your foreign media is wrong tho.

From RKI themselves in german:

Das RKI zählt laut Angaben einer Sprecherin als Corona-Todesfälle alle Menschen, die mit einer COVID-19-Erkrankung in Verbindung stehen.

Dazu gehören erstens Menschen, die direkt an der Erkrankung gestorben sind ("gestorben an"). Und zweitens Patienten mit Grundkrankheiten, die mit COVID-19 infiziert waren und bei denen sich nicht klar nachweisen lässt, was letzten Endes die Todesursache war ("gestorben mit").

Außerdem können, der Sprecherin zufolge, Verstorbene, die zu Lebzeiten nicht auf COVID-19 getestet worden waren, aber in Verdacht stehen, an COVID-19 gestorben zu sein, post mortem - also nach ihrem Tod - auf das Virus untersucht werden.


According to a RKI spokesperson people count as corona-deaths when they are connected to a COVID-19-infection
Included in this are people that die directly by the disease and secondly patients with preexisting conditions which were infected with COVID-19 where they can't necessarily proof death by COVID-19.

Also according to the spokesperson diseased which could not be tested while alive, but were suspected to be infected with COVID-19 would be tested post mortem - so after their death - for the virus

www.br.de

#Faktenfuchs: Wie werden Corona-Todesfälle gezählt?

Wenn bei einem Verstorbenen eine Corona-Infektion nachgewiesen wurde, dann gilt er dem Robert Koch-Institut zufolge als Corona-Todesfall. Auch wenn er möglicherweise wegen einer anderen Ursache gestorben ist. Was genau bedeutet das aber?

If you continue to stand on this fakenews i can even provide you video of the president of RKI saying the same thing. Maybe then you will stop spreading this fake.
 

Gorgosh

Member
Oct 26, 2017
957
edited because of Xando 's better source, thank you!

There are MANY other good reasons why the death rate is lower in Germany than in other countries:
- Way younger median age of infected
- Better ICU capacity (more than Italy, Spain and France combined)
- More testing (Spahn said today that currently there are 300.000 - 500.000 tests weekly, on a population of 80 Million!)
- We probably are one of the countries that are "closest" to the real number of infected people.

These has been said so often in this thread it is getting tiresome, I don't know why some of you seem to "want" a higher death rate in Germany. There are so many logical reasons it is not that high.
 

Kyougar

Cute Animal Whisperer
Member
Nov 3, 2017
9,359
Isn't that whats happening in Germany too? As in, if you die from covid but you were not tested before death then you don't become part of the stadistics?

that was corrected several times by the german CDC (RKI) already. If the death was corona related it will be counted. If they suspect the person died of corona, it will be tested and counted.
And generally, our hospitals are not at capacity yet, if you need hospitalization, you will get it, there is no reason to die in your own home unless the person has given up on life and decides to not call an ambulance.


Let's stop with the misinformation and conspiracy theories unless we have reputable sources (like the Italian mayor who said the death count in his city is 3 times as the official numbers) or official communication from the Government or CDC.
 

Astandahl

Member
Oct 28, 2017
9,011
Is true that Germany and Holland said no to the "Corona bonds" ?

If that is the case the EU is a real and complete shitshow.
 

Dr. Mario

Member
Oct 27, 2017
13,873
Netherlands
I saw something on Twitter saying the person behind the Imperial College model has come out saying there won't be as many deaths and this won't last as long? Any truth to that? I can't find an article that looks truthful
Apparently there was an article on FT where the statisticians speculated already 50% of the UK had the virus, that it was way more virulent than people thought. That would be good because it means it's less deadly than thought and herd immunity happens sooner. I say apparently, because it's behind a paywall so I can't verify.

I also wouldn't believe it however, because I feel like Italy would have plateaued off a lot sooner if that was the case.
 
Oct 25, 2017
27,846
Apparently there was an article on FT where the statisticians speculated already 50% of the UK had the virus, that it was way more virulent than people thought. That would be good because it means it's less deadly than thought and herd immunity happens sooner. I say apparently, because it's behind a paywall so I can't verify.

I also wouldn't believe it however, because I feel like Italy would have plateaued off a lot sooner if that was the case.

I found a thread on what actually happened



Essentially, the model now has actual data to use and it now shows that social distancing and increased capacity in the UK should work to prevent the system from overloading
 

BassForever

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
29,938
CT
Interesting read



Seems like deaths in the US are under reported because 1) lag in reporting and 2) no one is really working on post mortem testing and testing is shit in general.


I want to say "if testing units are limited focus on testing the living", but I can't help but be skeptical that deaths are being under reported to try and make this pandemic not seem like a big deal to push this "back to work asap" nonsense.
 

iyox

Member
Oct 25, 2017
360
I found a thread on what actually happened



I mean these people keep playing chicken with reality; "Coronavirus is just the flu!", "Coronavirus is locked down", "Coronavirus is a democrat hoax", "It will all be over soon". I can see why they are going the "sacrifice Grandma for the economy" route, pretty soon they will be saying, "You didn't love your family that much anyway". The study is probably flawed, but the death toll is going to continually increase. Maybe they will try to act like the these people simultaneously died from something else and it was China's fault.
 
Oct 28, 2017
3,650
Your foreign media is wrong tho.

From RKI themselves in german:






www.br.de

#Faktenfuchs: Wie werden Corona-Todesfälle gezählt?

Wenn bei einem Verstorbenen eine Corona-Infektion nachgewiesen wurde, dann gilt er dem Robert Koch-Institut zufolge als Corona-Todesfall. Auch wenn er möglicherweise wegen einer anderen Ursache gestorben ist. Was genau bedeutet das aber?

If you continue to stand on this fakenews i can even provide you video of the president of RKI saying the same thing. Maybe then you will stop spreading this fake.
Looking forward to the next page in this thread where someone starts once again with "Isn't the death rate in Germany so low because they don't test dead people???"

I guess the mods are busy in certain other topics...
 

Chikor

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
14,239
Interesting read



Seems like deaths in the US are under reported because 1) lag in reporting and 2) no one is really working on post mortem testing and testing is shit in general.

You also without a doubt going to have people who die at home because they can't afford to go to a hospital.
We have seen some anecdotal reporting on that already, I have no idea how to estimate that stuff, but I have little doubt we will never know the real death count from this virus.
 

Johnny956

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,930
Interesting read



Seems like deaths in the US are under reported because 1) lag in reporting and 2) no one is really working on post mortem testing and testing is shit in general.



The lag in reporting is happening at my wife's hospital and we are still in single digits in my state in deaths. Patient at my wife's hospital died on a Sunday and it wasn't reported by the county until Tuesday
 

neemmss

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,214
My hands are starting to crack and bleed from washing them so often. Any suggestions? Is lotion the only thing that I can do?
 

lunarworks

Member
Oct 25, 2017
22,166
Toronto
You also without a doubt going to have people who die at home because they can't afford to go to a hospital.
We have seen some anecdotal reporting on that already, I have no idea how to estimate that stuff, but I have little doubt we will never know the real death count from this virus.
This is gonna be a real thing in the rust belt and rural areas. Unreliable access to health care is gonna kill so many people.
 

Muad'dib

Banned
Jun 7, 2018
1,253
Iran is not being talked about enough. They have 2389 new cases today and 157 new deaths. 2,234 total deaths so far.

Because no one cares, I've been the only to post stories and updates about Iran, it's just no one cares and no one wants to admit that US sanctions are making the pandemic in Iran ten folds worse.


One reason for this is that they've banned the media within Iran from reporting on it and have threatened to jail medical personnel who talk to the press about it. Medical personnel can only talk to outside press under anonymity, and the risks might not be worth it for them.

www.nytimes.com

Iran’s Coronavirus Response: Pride, Paranoia, Secrecy, Chaos (Published 2020)

Iranian leaders once predicted the coronavirus epidemic ravaging China would not affect their country. Now Iran has among the most coronavirus deaths outside China, and Iranian medical workers have been told to keep quiet.

What? Practically every local news channel and paper is talking about the virus, you have doctors and nurses posting spreading awareness on telegram, whatsapp and twitter. If there's a ban that's the first I've heard of it.
 

Deleted member 21411

Account closed at user request
Banned
Oct 28, 2017
4,907
How long does this test take, my uncle got tested last night who lives here we still haven't heard back and after telling my supervisor I'm still working. So I'm very on edge until results show up

I'm essential goverment and I have no symptoms, if he tests positive I'll still need to be quarantined
 

TAJ

Banned
Oct 28, 2017
12,446
This may be the first time I've ever actually looked forward to Arizona's 110-120 degree Fahrenheit summers. Hoping that does *something* for us (besides help keep people the fuck inside)

It's consistently been in the 90s in the Philippines. I think they hit 104 one day a while back.
Doesn't seem to be helping much.
 

HockeyBird

Member
Oct 27, 2017
12,589
My cousin just posted on facebook that her daughter's former teacher died from the virus last night in Virginia.