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signal

Member
Oct 28, 2017
40,183
Curious if any other western countries would adapt South Korea/China/Taiwan approach to track down individual's paces to contain the spread. China's model is the most extreme one.
For anybody curious about what China "new normal life" after lock-down is lifted is like right now. This is a vlog from Japanese reporter from Nanjing(outside of Hubei)


Ignoring issues about data collection and such, it's interesting to see how rapid and total Chinese societal transformation can be.
 

Chikor

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
14,239
VsRGu4p.jpg


:\

Edit: just to clarify, don't cough into anyone's face or really, anything but your elbow. This is a joke about how much of a joke it the testing in the US.
 

Feep

Lead Designer, Iridium Studios
Verified
Oct 25, 2017
4,596
Feeling really hopeless about all this tonight. My whole life was supposed to come together on April 1st. Now, we're all gonna be working from home, but I'm relying on an external source for funding, and who knows if it'll last? I spent years getting to this point, and I'm so scared it's all going to come crumbling down.
 

Alastor3

Attempted to circumvent ban with alt account
Banned
Oct 28, 2017
8,297
No large scale studies to support it, but I'd take it in a heartbeat whether for treatment or prophylactically when I go to the floor for work.
Thanks for the replies :)

Im rooting like hell for this drug lol
Im trying to be positive...but damn that Imperial College report fuck me up real bad...
twitter.com

Dr. Edsel Salvana on Twitter

“Please don't take hydroxychloroquine (Plaquenil) plus Azithromycin for #COVID19 UNLESS your doctor prescribes it. Both drugs affect the QT interval of your heart and can lead to arrhythmias and sudden death, especially if you are taking other meds or have a heart condition.”

Also, for people who need those drugs, it must sucks to be them if the drugs run out
 

xir

Member
Oct 27, 2017
12,559
Los Angeles, CA
So the ex has had a fever and fatigue for three days (we shared custody of the kid) and more I have a fever 101 , and I can feel it. Even with Tylenol. Honestly nothing but scared what happens to our 3 yo if we get sick with no family nearby
 

Vestal

Attempted to circumvent ban with alt account
Banned
Oct 26, 2017
2,297
Tampa FL
Curious if any other western countries would adapt South Korea/China/Taiwan approach to track down individual's paces to contain the spread. China's model is the most extreme one.
For anybody curious about what China "new normal life" after lock-down is lifted is like right now. This is a vlog from Japanese reporter from Nanjing(outside of Hubei)


My Software Engineer hat looks at this video and finds the whole system absolutely beautiful. Utterly impressive.

After I admired it for a brief minute or two, the reality of what it entails and the rights people give up.. TERRIFYING!
 

cb1115

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,347
Curious if any other western countries would adapt South Korea/China/Taiwan approach to track down individual's paces to contain the spread. China's model is the most extreme one.
For anybody curious about what China "new normal life" after lock-down is lifted is like right now. This is a vlog from Japanese reporter from Nanjing(outside of Hubei)


yeah...none of this would fly in the U.S. lol

well, except for the temperature checks. it's insane that we still aren't doing that at grocery stores and such.
 

zulux21

Member
Oct 25, 2017
20,344
Feeling really hopeless about all this tonight. My whole life was supposed to come together on April 1st. Now, we're all gonna be working from home, but I'm relying on an external source for funding, and who knows if it'll last? I spent years getting to this point, and I'm so scared it's all going to come crumbling down.

I hope things work out for you. You're an awesome person and deserve lots of success.
 

CrichtonKicks

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,181
It may vary by state, but the guy I watched said he has to test negative twice before they clear him.

Yeah it's important to realize there is distinction between "recovered" in the sense that a person may feel better and no longer display symptoms and "recovered" in terms of the virus no longer showing up in testing. The latter takes a lot longer, generally, but that's the statistic being used so it's going to lag very heavily.
 

Hoo-doo

Attempted to circumvent ban with alt account
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
4,292
The Netherlands
twitter.com

Dr. Edsel Salvana on Twitter

“Please don't take hydroxychloroquine (Plaquenil) plus Azithromycin for #COVID19 UNLESS your doctor prescribes it. Both drugs affect the QT interval of your heart and can lead to arrhythmias and sudden death, especially if you are taking other meds or have a heart condition.”

Also, for people who need those drugs, it must sucks to be them if the drugs run out

Thank you. The current wave of non medically trained rando's all of a sudden acting like chloroquine is super effective is going to lead to huge problems. Soon we'll have rich folks hoarding the stuff because they read this bullshit on Facebook, black market trading, supplies running out, etcetera.

Chloroquine is currently a drug that's only pragmatically used in COVID patients. It's unproven and can potentially have huge side effects. In my ICU we have every single patient on chloroquine since day one and guess what, most of them still deteriorate fast and end up on their stomach on the ventilator for weeks on end. This isn't a miracle drug and there is absolutely no need for laymen to start a narrative that it is.
 
Oct 25, 2017
895
Thank you. The current wave of non medically trained rando's all of a sudden acting like chloroquine is super effective is going to lead to huge problems. Soon we'll have rich folks hoarding the stuff because they read this bullshit on Facebook, black market trading, supplies running out, etcetera.

Chloroquine is currently a drug that's only pragmatically used in COVID patients. It's unproven and can potentially have huge side effects. In my ICU we have every single patient on chloroquine since day one and guess what, most of them still deteriorate fast and end up on their stomach on the ventilator for weeks on end. This isn't a miracle drug and there is absolutely no need for laymen to start a narrative that it is.
Has it seemed to have any beneficial effects?

As far as I know, the only in vivo paper on this has been that French one which was open label, non-randomized, and had several other serious issues. While I don't dismiss anecdotes, case studies, and professional observation, I am not optimistic about this right now, but I want to be.
 

Deleted member 19844

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 28, 2017
3,500
United States
Thank you. The current wave of non medically trained rando's all of a sudden acting like chloroquine is super effective is going to lead to huge problems. Soon we'll have rich folks hoarding the stuff because they read this bullshit on Facebook, black market trading, supplies running out, etcetera.

Chloroquine is currently a drug that's only pragmatically used in COVID patients. It's unproven and can potentially have huge side effects. In my ICU we have every single patient on chloroquine since day one and guess what, most of them still deteriorate fast and end up on their stomach on the ventilator for weeks on end. This isn't a miracle drug and there is absolutely no need for laymen to start a narrative that it is.
Are you saying it has not had any benefit? Why keep using it?
 

Halbrand

Member
Oct 27, 2017
19,615
In my ICU we have every single patient on chloroquine since day one and guess what, most of them still deteriorate fast and end up on their stomach on the ventilator for weeks on end. This isn't a miracle drug and there is absolutely no need for laymen to start a narrative that it is.
Are they put on it from day 1 of ICU? Because if so maybe that's the reason, people need the drug before it progresses to that point.
 

xfactor99

Member
Oct 28, 2017
728
I see this model being the future of physical retail, even after the pandemic tbh. covid 19 is reshaping everything, and it will never go back even after the vacine.

You know, I can see a surge in Apple/Samsung/Google Pay being used after this is over. Venmo too. This is whats gonna bring about the contactless payments revolution and less people using cash.
 

LOCK

Member
Oct 25, 2017
465
Feeling really hopeless about all this tonight. My whole life was supposed to come together on April 1st. Now, we're all gonna be working from home, but I'm relying on an external source for funding, and who knows if it'll last? I spent years getting to this point, and I'm so scared it's all going to come crumbling down.

I know how you feel. This is affecting my research big time. I developed a new protocol with using a CT scan and plants between NCSU and Duke but that's on hold till probably the fall. *cries in corner* And for the first time, in years, I was at a point in my life where I was actually starting to save a lot of money. I've always been burdened by debt from school or bills or helping family. But now....that's gone. I still have enough money to pay my bills till summer, but I won't have that huge savings anymore. Also my stocks have plummeted. I was hoping to finally get a real home and stop living in an apartment.

But I am thankful I don't have it as bad as some people. God this sucks.
 

HTupolev

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,419
Has it seemed to have any beneficial effects?
Are you saying it has not had any benefit? Why keep using it?
It's impossible to determine what the effect is when you're not doing a structured study, which in an ICU context would require *not* giving the drug to some patients, which poses extremely obvious and horrifying ethical issues.
That people are still deteriorating doesn't necessarily imply that the drug isn't useful, it just tells you that it's obviously not a miracle cure. In other words, the experience in the ICU doesn't prove anything either way.

Anyway, Hoo-doo's main point is that people should not go seeking out random pharmaceuticals just because some random dumbass on the internet (such as myself) said that there's some chance that they'll have some efficacy against this disease.
 

bye

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
8,419
Phoenix, AZ
Thank you. The current wave of non medically trained rando's all of a sudden acting like chloroquine is super effective is going to lead to huge problems. Soon we'll have rich folks hoarding the stuff because they read this bullshit on Facebook, black market trading, supplies running out, etcetera.

Chloroquine is currently a drug that's only pragmatically used in COVID patients. It's unproven and can potentially have huge side effects. In my ICU we have every single patient on chloroquine since day one and guess what, most of them still deteriorate fast and end up on their stomach on the ventilator for weeks on end. This isn't a miracle drug and there is absolutely no need for laymen to start a narrative that it is.

is hydroxychloroquine any better?

But yeah, I don't see why we are pinning all our hopes on this one when there's been like 4 potentially strong candidates. I guess maybe cuz it's the cheapest.
 

Dphex

Member
Oct 27, 2017
12,811
Cologne, Germany
I don't understand your reasoning here. The article you posted says patient zero was thought to be from Hubei. Wuhan is in Hubei. And we know that wet markets are core breeding grounds for such viruses, and that the largest cluster of the virus began there. It seems pretty damn likely

nope, first cases had no connection to the market.

www.livescience.com

1st known case of coronavirus traced back to November in China

A 55-year-old individual from Hubei province in China may have been the first person to have contracted COVID-19, the disease caused by the new coronavirus spreading across the globe.

it is more likely that someone had it, gone to the market and from there it spread wider
 

eathdemon

Member
Oct 27, 2017
9,643
You know, I can see a surge in Apple/Samsung/Google Pay being used after this is over. Venmo too. This is whats gonna bring about the contactless payments revolution and less people using cash.
honestly it would have happend faster if everyone wasnt trying to manage their own, and it was a open api, but atleast its happening now.
 

GeoNeo

Member
Oct 26, 2017
1,447
Finally Australia implementing lockdown. Good.

Still sub-par lock down most people are taking the piss. QLD council elections still going ahead with god knows how many people lining up.

I hope Australia tightens the lockdown further this week.

Another Italy must not be allowed to happen here in Australia.
 

Forerunner

Resetufologist
The Fallen
Oct 30, 2017
14,568
Seems like I'm not out of the woods yet. I'm still having chest pains and a cough, even though I do feel better from a couple of weeks ago. Today, I got pretty tired and decided to lie down. Within a few minutes my right arm went completely numb, my heart started to go crazy, and I had the most intense pain in my head. I went straight to the ER. They tested me this time around. Swab, blood test, and x-ray. Blood and x-ray came back negative. However, the swab takes 1-2 days for results. So they sent me home and I'm on a 14 day self-quarantine.
 

bye

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
8,419
Phoenix, AZ
nope, first cases had no connection to the market.

www.livescience.com

1st known case of coronavirus traced back to November in China

A 55-year-old individual from Hubei province in China may have been the first person to have contracted COVID-19, the disease caused by the new coronavirus spreading across the globe.

it is more likely that someone had it, gone to the market and from there it spread wider

while I don't excuse that theory, it seems to good to be true that it didn't originate from a wet market and instead was just spread at a wet market (a place where zoonotic diseases are also spread), lol.
 

The Emperor

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,790
780 dead in Italy in one day...good god

Western Australia has also closed borders for interstate travel.
Guess only a matter of time before Queensland, New South Wales and Victoria do
 

HTupolev

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,419
is hydroxychloroquine any better?
In terms of Hoo-doo's point, that's irrelevant: misuse can still have terrible consequences, so it's in the exact same boat of "only use it if a medical expert says to do so."

But yeah, I don't see why we are pinning all our hopes on this one when there's been like 4 potentially strong candidates. I guess maybe cuz it's the cheapest.
I don't see why anyone would be pinning all of their hopes on anything, regardless of cost or however many candidates there are. We literally don't know whether anything exists that is worthy of having a surfeit of hopes placed on it.
 

Takuhi

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,305
If South Korea has a 10 minute test why is the 30 minute test being developed by the Canadian government significant?

For reasons I cannot begin to fathom, most countries are developing their own tests independently. I'm not entirely sure why: some combination of national pride, graft, intellectual property laws, different standards of quality, manufacturing logistics, availability of ingredients...?

The CDC officially claims that the Chinese tests had too many false positives and were not up to their standards, and to be fair, the CDC did move quickly and develop a functional test in the very early days of the outbreak. But it doesn't sound like they were considering any foreign alternatives even as it became apparent that all the tests they'd produced were contaminated and that they wouldn't be able to mass produce them to meet demand.
 

TTG

Banned
Apr 16, 2019
1,631
Was just walking home, a guy down the block behind me was coughing up a lung. This ample supply of masks can't get here soon enough. We're all used to stupid drivers, now it's gonna be stupid pedestrians and I have a feeling there will be a lot more of those.
 

Chanser

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,003
Curious if any other western countries would adapt South Korea/China/Taiwan approach to track down individual's paces to contain the spread. China's model is the most extreme one.
For anybody curious about what China "new normal life" after lock-down is lifted is like right now. This is a vlog from Japanese reporter from Nanjing(outside of Hubei)


If only the west would do this temporarily.
 

MidweekCoyote

Member
Mar 23, 2018
860
And in the middle of the corona crisis, we got hit by an earthquake in Zagreb in the last hour.

potres111.jpg


Considering we're close to Italy, we've been handling it only barely as is so far...
 

Minilla

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
3,514
Tokyo
Nope, but people won't let that get in the way of a good conspiracy theory.
A lot of westerners who live in Japan are loathe to say that Japan does anything right on any topic.

Yeah, it's strange. Hospitals here are not strained at all yet. Japan also has most hospital beds per 1000 people out of G7 I believe.

However, seems like Osaka is starting to get a bit more worried. Few hotpspots turned up
 

Resilient

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,418
Shit just got real into Australia.
Borders between States look to be closing in the next 48 hours. Schools and non essentials closing. Bout to get rough. Stay safe people.
 

SRG01

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,014
There's a Japanese NYT reporter who has been chasing this story. Basically Japan is covering up their numbers because they're doing everything they can to make the olympics happen.

It's impossible to realistically hide the numbers because their hospitals, by now, would've been overwhelmed by pneumonia cases given the time frame.

Case in point: Wuhan when they actually ignored the virus.

It comes back to extensive screening. Pockets of infections in China, Korea, and Japan are still happening, but they don't make the news anymore because they screen early and quarantine quickly.
 

Miletius

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
1,257
Berkeley, CA
Yeah, it's strange. Hospitals here are not strained at all yet. Japan also has most hospital beds per 1000 people out of G7 I believe.

However, seems like Osaka is starting to get a bit more worried. Few hotpspots turned up

The truth is we don't know, but current evidence suggests that Japan is doing something right. If the situation was out of control it would be very difficult to hide it. People would either be in the ICU or dying in their homes, neither of which could be concealed given the magnitude of the disease.

I think it's fair to be skeptical of the Japanese government, especially given Fukushima, but as of this moment we cannot say the situation in Japan is out of control. And I firmly believe that the Olympics will be postponed anyways, have believed that for a while, actually.

Edit: Western governments have to come to terms with the way they are handling the outbreak, and I think a lot of people are hand wringing and wondering why SK, Japan, Taiwan are doing much better than their own governments. Things could still change, of course, but for now it seems like these countries are doing much better.
 

HTupolev

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,419
If South Korea has a 10 minute test why is the 30 minute test being developed by the Canadian government significant?
Different methodologies, different sensitivities/specificities.
Yeah. No test is perfect, and there are a lot of different ways to characterize how "good" a test is.

For example.

Suppose you're developing a test to see whether a person has some condition. Let's say that it miraculously never gets a false negative, but it has a false positive rate of .1%. In other words, if you don't have the condition, there's a 1-in-1000 chance that you test positive for it anyway.
This sounds like a pretty good test, right?
BUT.
Let's imagine that the population that we're going to test has 1,000,000 inhabitants, and there are 7 people who actually have the condition. When we test those 1,000,000 people, the 7 people who test positive all come up positive... but so do about .1% of the other 999,993 people, which comes to around 1,000 false positives. So you've got somewhere around a thousand positive results, only seven of which are correct. Depending on what the test was trying to figure out, this might be useful, or it might be a total catastrophe.
 

SRG01

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,014
The truth is we don't know, but current evidence suggests that Japan is doing something right. If the situation was out of control it would be very difficult to hide it. People would either be in the ICU or dying in their homes, neither of which could be concealed given the magnitude of the disease.

I think it's fair to be skeptical of the Japanese government, especially given Fukushima, but as of this moment we cannot say the situation in Japan is out of control. And I firmly believe that the Olympics will be postponed anyways, have believed that for a while, actually.

Some were theorizing that, despite the conventional wisdom that the masks don't help, they actually are helping because they reduce the chance of infection just enough to make a difference.

edit: Moreover, it helps prevent prodromal/subclinical people from infecting others prior to detection.
 

eathdemon

Member
Oct 27, 2017
9,643
Some were theorizing that, despite the conventional wisdom that the masks don't help, they actually are helping because they reduce the chance of infection just enough to make a difference.

edit: Moreover, it helps prevent prodromal/subclinical people from infecting others prior to detection.
or it could be distancing is alrady a thing in asain culture, where its not in western culture, and masks are more a symbol of that.
 

Minilla

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
3,514
Tokyo
The truth is we don't know, but current evidence suggests that Japan is doing something right. If the situation was out of control it would be very difficult to hide it. People would either be in the ICU or dying in their homes, neither of which could be concealed given the magnitude of the disease.

I think it's fair to be skeptical of the Japanese government, especially given Fukushima, but as of this moment we cannot say the situation in Japan is out of control. And I firmly believe that the Olympics will be postponed anyways, have believed that for a while, actually.

Well, yeah, Olympics will be postponed for sure.

And the low spread so far is probably down to their social culture being very diffrent than the West and the high rate of mask usage. Things are also much quieter around the town during weekend. So guess people are staying at home a bit more than usual anyway

That's not to say they have stemmed it, but it shit does hit the fan and government says lockdown, then the public is pretty well trained in disaster management, so I imagine they would get a handle on things quicker than other countries.