I don't believe I have a moral obligation to help a video game do well financially, I really don't.
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Nintendo sends a cease and desist to insider that has leaked pretty much every E3 2019 announcement
- Thread starter Atheerios
- Start date
That is just a tragedy. To get back at the company, they made people lose their jobs.
Not really answering my question there. In case you wanted it repeating, it's the "do you care about the impact that leaking has on developers?" bit.
"Marketing for AAA publisher games in the gaming industry"
Fixed that for you.
The leaking of commercials is literally a problem with a very small group of folks who also just happen to be the worst offenders in the industry.
So we're going whataboutthem now. Especially when no one mentioned abusive condition of companies relating to leaks.
As someone who does work in marketing for an industry directly related and comparable to video games, this person has no clue what they're talking about.
They're only here to spread the "marketing is evil, the industry is toxic" vitriol.
I do think that more transparency in the industry is good to a degree. For example, I would personally enjoy knowing the budgets of video games. How much does a game need to sell for it to REALLY make profit? All we get is revenue at best, but never budget. I wanna know how much games like BotW, JRPGs like Xenoblade 1-X-2 and Persona and Final Fantasy, and massive games like CoD and GTA cost to really make.
At the same time though, Sabi is clearly being an idiot here. I don't have any sympathy for leakers in general, but she takes the cake here. Like holy shit, what the fuck was she thinking.
But I do think there can be nuanced discussion on letting companies loosen up and divulge a slimmer bit more information without people getting mad. Companies are 100% allowed to reveal however they want in the end of course, but some secrecy can end up feeling unneeded, which is why SOME (not all) leaks could end up being beneficial in the long run if done through actual journalism. Leaks like Sabi are not journalism.
Unfortunately, the past 28 pages have, uh... not been the greatest with people completely dismissing actual sources of developers being hurt by leaks.
At the same time though, Sabi is clearly being an idiot here. I don't have any sympathy for leakers in general, but she takes the cake here. Like holy shit, what the fuck was she thinking.
But I do think there can be nuanced discussion on letting companies loosen up and divulge a slimmer bit more information without people getting mad. Companies are 100% allowed to reveal however they want in the end of course, but some secrecy can end up feeling unneeded, which is why SOME (not all) leaks could end up being beneficial in the long run if done through actual journalism. Leaks like Sabi are not journalism.
Unfortunately, the past 28 pages have, uh... not been the greatest with people completely dismissing actual sources of developers being hurt by leaks.
Lol. Literally "a game that was eventually released was CANCELLED BECAUSE OF LEAKS!"
Totally. I believe it. Sucks that Splatoon never released. Damn shame.
"Leaks" is a good excuse and not, maybe, "making games on the Wii U is no longer profitable but we need a scapegoat".
Name one other non gaming entertainment industry that does this.
Yes but the entertainment industry as a whole works off of a "toxic hype machine" as it was described earlier and I believe that's what they were alluding to. Yes, it works slightly different depending on the medium, but for the most part the entertainment industry as a whole is a toxic hype machine.
Every single thing they've said so far for E3 has been correct, zero incorrect "spoilers". Not sure why you feel this way if you've read everything for their E3 info.
Employment in the games industry is broken and toxic so leaking games doesn't matter is certainly a take.
I wonder if this is another mode like Chimera or another game 🤔 I'm gonna go with another mode.
Gotta prove the financial damage.
"They didn't buy our game because someone leaked our commercial" is a specious argument.
Its my fault corporations treat their employees like cattle. I better shape up and buy without questioning
The best part about this is that it practically validates that Secret fo Mana 3 will be finally translated to English as Trial of Mana.
Leaking games don't matter and pointing to them as some type of catalyst for a problem is sticking your head in the sand and looking for a scapegoat.
This isn't about. 'care if a game ad campaign is as effective as it can be'. This is about respecting the hard work that went into making that campaign and the people who make the games for those campaign. You don't respect the work of these people when you dismissed people leaking their stuff for no real reason other than fame. You undermine the work of the marketing team, who are made of people, and the developers right to show off their work on their terms after they spent years working on the project.
And this isn't about 'limiting speech'. Especially when breaking your contract that you sign to spill the beans to someone on Twitter, you don't get to hide behind 'free speech'.
Yeah, Conflating reporting on toxic work environments and leaking the work of said people for e-fame is already a galaxy brain take. Who honestly believes these are the same things?
I think I am, but let me try it again, more explicitly -
I don't believe that what devs want and what would make them sad is an overriding moral principle I must adhere to, they may have some requests that I think are reasonable, they may have some that aren't.
I am more than happy to discuss about whether or not this particular request is reasonable, but what I'm really talking about here is that idea that the fact that people worked hard on something and will be sad is not a good enough reason on its on to limit our speech.
Some of you are desperately tring to make it sound like someone dropped the executable on a torrent and that this wasn't just someone posting the title of a video game on twitter before it was announced.
How ruined would Endgame have been if you knew the subtitle a week early
Are you being dense on purpose? Especially when Splatoon wasn't leak.
so true. there is no debate even posible as is just repeating "the good news" and ignoring counter arguments
So none of you have ever said a game is bad before then yea? Or does the morale stop at the dollar sign
I'm telling you that "this game was cancelled because of a leak" is a specious argument, especially when that game's overall concept and goal was eventually realized and the game was released.
Movie concepts, stories, cast, and etc are known for years and I am not aware of any movie ever being cancelled because the trailer for it was leaked a week before a convention.
You can respect a video game by buying one you're interested in and then advocating for it.
"Watching the commercial" has absolutely nothing to do with "respect".
Some of these leaks are more significant than the subtitle to a movie which we already knew the plot of. You're throwing context out of the window here.
People in this thread forget that there's a non-partial judge in a civil case and and judges are rarely stupid when it comes to law.
It's not just a specious argument, it's just impossible to prove legally.
The only thing I could see is proving that leaking all the E3 made you spend a lot of marketing money for nothing. IF you can prove it was for nothing.
How ruined would it have been if you knew it before Infinity War came out?
Point is, they try to time the information for a point where it will have the most impact. Provide information and get people excited alongside the appropriate creative to sell the story.
A week before isn't a huge deal, but the point is that they're trying to sell their story with the right timing and info.
People lost their jobs over leaks. That's happened. Or in your words, "they got sad". Is that a good enough reason?
You got it better than marketing people who aren't even human in this thread.
Yes but they had to cancel an original game (lost $$$$), people probably lost their jobs (especially contracted workers), then make an all new game out of it (more $$$$).
The game concept eventually releasing only really affects the consumer and that's not who were talking about here.
Why did Endgame fans disrespect the movie crew so terribly by knowing about the film before it was revealed?
That's a false equivocation. There being a new Avengers movie would've been huge. Not the subtitle. There being a new FROM game is huge. The title is a big part of it. This is just straight up a false equivocation.
As for your first part - the right to first publish regards announcements as well. Being first to tell the market about something is actually important, and is a right reserved to the author.
What? What are you trying to say here?
I don't understand what "respecting the hard work" means here, outside "not saying that one thing" which I donno, seem pretty damn similar to limiting speech.
And just so we're clear here, I'm not a free speech radical and I think there are quite a few cases where limiting speech is justified, but that's still what you're talking about.
Games get cancelled and reworked all the time for a litany of reasons.
Nintendo, especially, is very vocal about this practice. Usually it's "a bad game is always a bad game if it is released, so we keep working on it until it is good". I've never heard them say "A good game would be released had it not been for those pesky leakers".
Nonono gaming is different and special because reasons!!!
Sabi would have spoiled Nintendo's entire E3 right before it even happened and people would have made threads about every leak she said.