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New Super Mario Bros. U is a TERRIBLE Mario game
- Thread starter Space Lion
- Start date
I probably agree. I personally prefer Super Mario World and the original Super Mario Bros, but I don't think that would be the case if I didn't grow up with the games. Nostalgia is a powerful thing.
I don't understand why you are saying all this when you only played the first world. Go play 3 or 4 more worlds of Mario U before concluding if the game is terrible or not. Until then, your opinion is worth nothing.
The game is good. Controls, visuals and levels designs are good. But as a Mario Bros game is below the NES/SNES games. The difference with the DS game is huge.
The game is good. Controls, visuals and levels designs are good. But as a Mario Bros game is below the NES/SNES games. The difference with the DS game is huge.
This is like declaring Bloodborne as being shit and then saying you only played chalice dungeons, not the campaign.
No, it absolutely would not have. Here's why.
Mario games are not just about "well designed levels." They are also about adventure. Part of the joy of the old Mario games was that we were constantly traveling to new places and worlds.
First, we traveled the Mushroom Kingdom in Super Mario Bros. 1. We entered a world full of pipes for traveling between the ground level and the underground sewers. We jumped atop giant trees and mushrooms. We crossed bridges beset by flying fish. We went underwater. We climbed beanstalks into the sky. We delved into castles full of traps. The sheer variety on display was fairly unique for a video game at the time; they were mostly scenes of largely black backgrounds.
Then, we dove into the bizarre dream world of Subcon. It was a world of lush green, of sandy deserts, of icy lakes where whales gather, and of great palaces in the sky. This was a world where verticality wasn't all about pipes and the occasional vine shooting up from a secret block. We could climb up and down via ladders and vines. We could travel over logs on waterfalls. We could enter doors and caverns. And we could summon secret doorways to a mirror world where hidden items and shortcuts lay. There were no Koopas or other familiar enemies in this world; all our foes were brand-new additions to the canon.
And in the next game, we went on a tour of other kingdoms. This expanded dramatically beyond just the in-level design; there was a world map to pick our way through, with hidden secrets of its own if you knew how to push its boundaries. And you could carve a path through this world with Luigi at your side; no longer were you on separate tracks through identical parallel adventures. We learned that the Mushroom Kingdom world had deserts of its own, with Angry Suns that would swoop down and attack you if you weren't careful. It had an icy tundra. And it also had bizarre lands like Giant Land, Pipe Land, and the barren, colorless Dark World lava land. Our enemies in this quest were the Koopalings, not just an army of fake Bowsers and his minions. They attacked with airships and tanks and magic spells.
Super Mario World took us to Dinosaur Land. To be fair, there were a lot of well-worn tropes here: grassy fields, underground caves, watery lakes. But we also entered haunted mansions, enchanted forests, chocolatey mountain ranges, and a haunted sunken ship. We did all this with a new friend, the Yoshi clan. And we ventured across a single, seamless overworld with a web of potential pathways.
NSMB DS was the first new game in the style of the older Marios in 15 years. It stuck mostly to well-worn tropes: grass, desert, water, ice, forest, mountain, sky, lava. There's a flagpole at the end of the level. There's a mid-boss fortress, maybe there's a Ghost house, and there's always a castle at the end of each land. But that was fine: this was the first new Mario game in over a decade, and it did a great job of bringing in new villains and incorporating the growing cast of Mario characters since 64.
The biggest sin of the NSMB games that followed is NOT their aesthetics. It's that their hooks were all centered on gameplay and on tapping the Mario nostalgia well and not at all on growing the universe of the games through new adventures to new places and worlds. Our adventures invariably start in Peach's Castle before taking us through the exact same biomes, maybe with some visual twists as we saw in 2 and U. We might encounter a new power up or two, but always against the backdrop of the familiar and now-throughly-unexciting Mario tropes.
Meanwhile, it's the 3D games that introduced us to Peach's Castle, to Isle Delfino, to far-off Galaxies, and to Mario's globe-spanning Odyssey across new kingdoms in the mushroom world (Bowser's Castle is now a Japanese style palace ffs!). All that wacky, unpredictable Mario-style creative energy is being put into the 3D games; the 2D games are gameplay and level design workshops built on top of classic worlds that aren't allowed to grow. (And they've sold us that workshop as its own product, too!)
That's why NSMBU isn't a timeless classic; it's simply an improvement on a game we already played three times. It's Nintendo acquiescing to what Miyamoto said about not wanting to make the same game again by deciding to make a 2D Mario game must be an exercise in making the same game again, not in crafting something bold and new.
you can boil this down to "aesthetics," but imo that's the problem. They aren't just aesthetics; they're the audience's experience of the world of these games. NSMBU definitely has the best level design since World, and I can see people liking its level design more, but there's just no way I can put NSMBU up there with those games on other vectors outside of that.
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Beside the dogshit aesthetic its a great game. Wish I knew about the abiltiy to disable the spin sooner. Why the fuck do they do shit like that?
OP
OP
Also, I don't see why people are saying I'M being elitist just because other people suggested I play Luigi U. It is what I was told.
NSMBU has better graphics than Mario World?
Better power how? Flying squirrel is better and more balanced than the cape in World but is not better than the racoon suit in 3. Bosses are basically the same as 3 with a twist and personally the game still doesn't control better than Mario World.
NSMBU has better graphics than Mario World?
Better power how? Flying squirrel is better and more balanced than the cape in World but is not better than the racoon suit in 3. Bosses are basically the same as 3 with a twist and personally the game still doesn't control better than Mario World.
The only issue with NSMBU is the awful NSMB music. The game is actually good compared to every other NSMB game being boring and/or bad.
New Super Mario Bros. U would have been much better received had it not come out months after NSMB 2.
Man, I still don't know what the hell Nintendo was thinking releasing both of these games so close to each other. It doesn't help that NSMB 2 was thoroughly average. People were just burnt out of the New series by that point.
Anyways, I'm glad you liked it, TC. I also couldn't finish Luigi U because of how it played. I just don't like it.
You reminded me of a thread I made years ago, about how Super Mario World was worse than 3. You're right.
Man, I still don't know what the hell Nintendo was thinking releasing both of these games so close to each other. It doesn't help that NSMB 2 was thoroughly average. People were just burnt out of the New series by that point.
Anyways, I'm glad you liked it, TC. I also couldn't finish Luigi U because of how it played. I just don't like it.
You reminded me of a thread I made years ago, about how Super Mario World was worse than 3. You're right.
Honestly NSMB wouldn't in general had as many problems had they not released 3 of them in 3 years with 2 and U coming out the same year. Like there are still issues with repetitive motifs, reused music, and ideas... But like, the longer you go between NSMB games, the easier it is to enjoy the experience.
That also said, Luigi U is also the best one because it just goes crazy with a concept and builds the whole "game" around that idea.
That also said, Luigi U is also the best one because it just goes crazy with a concept and builds the whole "game" around that idea.
The only thing it's really missing is in terms of presentation. It's not just the artstyle itself and how the models lack any emotion, but simply the lack of the charm and details that most of the 3D and RPG entries have. With SMB3 it felt like you were travelling around different kingdoms since you rescued their monarchs, but the castles in NSMB have no purpose other than to house the koopalings. Having some sort of mini-story for each world would change the perception a lot, even if they are short sequences with little dialogue.
Even the ending credits felt like they didn't even care:
In terms of gameplay it was a good entry from what I remember, and I had a good time finding the Star Coins. That said, I wish the levels were a bit more open ended with alternative routes reached by using different powerups everywhere. A couple of my favourite things with the originals were thinking about every brick and pipe as a possible hidden path, and how in SMB3 you could explore areas "out of bounds" when running as the racoon.
Imagine being a "Mario Veteran," and not being able to decide for yourself which Mario game to play, when you've already bought them... Then complaining on a forum about it. Mario U is great, and probably the best of the "New" games. It's also fine to dislike it.
The complaint about Luigi's control comes across like you just don't like change and adapting, especially when you go off about "this is the way a platformer should control" rant. Different character handling and controlling different doesn't make it bad. It's new challenge by giving a character strength in one area and weakness in other, at least relative to other characters.
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I liked the Wii version more, but U is a great platformer, even if the series was getting tired at that point. Also... Super Luigi U is... not great in my opinion. Better off sticking with Mario. I'm not sure what you were expecting from the first world of that game, it obviously gets much better and more difficult in the later worlds, as all Mario games (and uh, every platformer pretty much ever).
But if you were literally able to beat NSMB DS without dying once on your first go (which I'm not sure I believe to be honest), I'm not sure you'll get much challenge out of it anyway.
But if you were literally able to beat NSMB DS without dying once on your first go (which I'm not sure I believe to be honest), I'm not sure you'll get much challenge out of it anyway.
Seeing as how you weren't clear at all about what you meant by NSMBU being "between" 3 and SMW, not sure why you're acting so smug.
For the triple jump, you press jump after landing and for the enemies, you said yourself that you keep B pressed. I agree that the control decision is baffling, but I do not see myself running into many issue because of that (though I of course will never buy NSMBU on Switch, because fuck ports).
Smug isn't the tone I attempted to imply, sorry. But you talked about the precision of the physics; I replied to that.
I like it well enough, but the NSMB series is definitely the one where I started to wonder if Mario's physics are actually not that great. It just never felt very responsive to me.
I think the OP is right. NSMBU is a pretty terrible Mario game.
....but a terrible Mario game is like an 8/10.
....but a terrible Mario game is like an 8/10.
OP
OP
That's fair. I'm probably in the wrong, and biased by the tons of experience I have with SMB3.
I thought you we're being an elitist with your original posts. But honestly, I've seen a lot of people over the years suggest trying Luigi U over the normal game because it's harder too. So I see why you'd do that. I did the same years ago.
I don't think the NSMB Wii U games are bad. But I think they're a far cry from SMW and SMB3. The controls and levels in those games were way more well developed. I thought that SMW was more of a joy to control and play.
SMB3 is actually more slippery than NSMB (greater run startup, longer skids on stopping), but you wouldn't be the only one surprised to learn that. There's something about the NSMB art/animation that causes people to perceive it as slippery; this can be evidenced by perceived differences between themes in Mario Maker, when there's in fact none (they're all NSMB).
OP
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Backfire? You think I made a thread shredding a Mario game expecting no reprisal?
Honestly, most of the responses feel exceedingly butthurt.
People love to be edgy in NSMB threads, or jump in the bandwagon and hate on it because it's a forum staple. Then you point out it did level design and variety better than World or pretty much any other 2d mario game and they get very defensive because they like those games.
Luigi U is very obviously the worse version of the two. I'm tired of people on the internet thinking harder = better... at least most people in this thread seem to agree that Mario U is superior. Better level design by far imo
I imagine most, such as myself, meant it was the best of the New series, and even then it doesn't get real good until maybe the last two or three worlds.
i've been playing mario games since 1988 and i loved the shit out this game. it's one of my favorites in the series
The level design in this game is absolutely stellar
The level design in this game is absolutely stellar
This post probably highlights why I didn't like NSMBWii that much. It felt like I was going through the same places over again after NSMB for DS, and it got boring. NSMB 2 and U just looked like the same game over and over, and it's why I skipped them. The context for these games did not motivate me to experience them. Super Mario 3D Land is just as bad. It's New Super Mario Bros. in 3D.
