Neon Genesis Evangelion on Netflix |OT| She Said, 'Don't Make Others Suffer by Posting Spoilers.'

MMarston · Jun 21, 2019

We need your seething hot new takes, new viewers.

Also, I'm already at Episode 6 in my rewatch and I just realized that I preferred the much updated Rebuild version of this segment because of how they went all out with that budget lol.

Disclaimer: I haven't re-seen the OG series in more than a decade now at this point.

SeroTyler · Jun 21, 2019

SArcher said:
EoE was done by Manga Entertainment, not ADV.

Ah yes. It's been a few years! I jest but in all honesty the original dub was fine other than EoE and a few nitpicky things. I remember something with

Kaji's death

being altered too though.

The new people sound great other than Asuka, but Tiffany Grant's performance stuck out to me even after switching to subs. I watched episode 22 to get a feel for the new Asuka and she just wasn't selling the emotion the same way, Grant sounded legit in hysterics at times during her big scene. To credit them and nitpick the old dub some more they finally fixed the

"Hi I'm Asuka" scene to have all the different voice actors read the line.

But the series being legally available to show people makes all the little issues worth it.

Kiria · Jun 21, 2019

kai3345 said:
if this has been asked before in this thread im sorry - if I've never seen this show before, is this new dub acceptable? should I track down the old dub and watch that instead? really want to avoid having to watch it subbed, but I'll do it if both dubs are garbage

Imo you can opt to watch the netflix one then watch the rebuild in dubbed to judge the performance of the respective actors in a much modern production

I mean I enjoyed the original dub and haven't really watch the new one except for certain key performance. Certainly i'm bias and I like the original cast better it would be nice to hear a newcomer perspective

Orb · Jun 21, 2019

First time watcher: I just finished episode 6, which is where someone said "a lot of people will drop off at this point and say it's generic" or something like that. So far I'm interested to keep going, and I assume some mind-blowing stuff is probably coming based on the way people talk about this series.

Orbit · Jun 21, 2019

SArcher said:
I always felt it ended on a hopeful note.

the original anime ending or the end of evangelion film? (i haven't seen the latter)

i dunno...it was pretty bleak, right? for the anime ending....

all of humanity synchronized or something right in that abstract shinji clapping party? i mean, i guess it's good everyone came together, but it seemed more like against the will of humanity...

Lukar · Jun 21, 2019

Never seen the show before, and was wanting to finally watch it with this release, but hearing that

a queer character has been de-queered in the new dub

makes me super second-guess my desire to watch it. Should I just hunt down the old version of the show instead of watching this one?

munchie64 · Jun 21, 2019

Orb said:
First time watcher: I just finished episode 6, which is where someone said "a lot of people will drop off at this point and say it's generic" or something like that. So far I'm interested to keep going, and I assume some mind-blowing stuff is probably coming based on the way people talk about this series.

Oh it's definitely not generic. I think the slow pace of episode 4 may scare some off though. Six is when things are exciting.

Kensation · Jun 21, 2019

Orb said:
and I assume some mind-blowing stuff is probably coming based on the way people talk about this series.

Yes.

Suede · Jun 21, 2019

Kyonashi said:
It's definitely there, I watched some on the train this morning around 9am.

Kittens McMittens said:
It's up. I had to search for it but I found it on the UK site.

I'll need to take another look, I was using my PS4 so maybe that was it. My friend did say that he could see it on his mobile app.

Deleted member 46958 · Jun 21, 2019

They took out the intermission countdown with the tango piece.

I.am.OUT.

This is all so weak. Don't care if that was a theatrical thing. I'll stick to my rips.

munchie64 · Jun 21, 2019

LukarWuff said:
Never seen the show before, and was wanting to finally watch it with this release, but hearing that

a queer character has been de-queered in the new dub

makes me super second-guess my desire to watch it. Should I just hunt down the old version of the show instead of watching this one?

I'd say watch. It's pretty obvious where the hole is, and you can always come in here to discuss what has been changed after your done.

Kensation · Jun 21, 2019

LukarWuff said:
Never seen the show before, and was wanting to finally watch it with this release, but hearing that

a queer character has been de-queered in the new dub

makes me super second-guess my desire to watch it. Should I just hunt down the old version of the show instead of watching this one?

It's fine, seems the spoilered bit is the only major major issue.

SteveWinwood · Jun 21, 2019

LukarWuff said:
Never seen the show before, and was wanting to finally watch it with this release, but hearing that

a queer character has been de-queered in the new dub

makes me super second-guess my desire to watch it. Should I just hunt down the old version of the show instead of watching this one?

it's kinda hard to explain without the context but it's not as straight (lol) forward as that

i would still watch it, and it doesn't so much seem to me like they completely removed it, just made it less explicitly stated

Bonefish · Jun 21, 2019

Bran-dono said:
They took out the intermission countdown with the tango piece.

I.am.OUT.

This is all so weak. Don't care if that was a theatrical thing. I'll stick to my rips.

Which one? The intermission between Death and EoE? I don't think that was ever even included in an English release before.

MMarston · Jun 21, 2019

munchie64 said:
Oh it's definitely not generic. I think the slow pace of episode 4 may scare some off though. Six is when things are exciting.

I barely remember much of the show at this point, and episode 4 is by the best one I've seen since I started.

LukarWuff said:
Never seen the show before, and was wanting to finally watch it with this release, but hearing that

a queer character has been de-queered in the new dub

makes me super second-guess my desire to watch it. Should I just hunt down the old version of the show instead of watching this one?

What I'm hoping is that despite some of the evident language change, there may be still enough subtext there once I see it. So I think it's still worth a shot, despite how kind of damning of a change it is out of all the other ones.

RedSwirl · Jun 21, 2019

Okay what's going on here? Suummation?

All I've got on me is the 2001 (I think) DVD set from ADV and I've always been confused about how the later ones were better or whatever. I think they just remastered the video and audio right? Before Netflix announced this I was gonna give these DVDs a rewatch but I was gonna do it on a CRT.

Language-wise I've never seen Eva from beginning to end in Japanese so I was gonna go subbed. I heard there was a new dub but now it seems like they actually retranslated everything including the subs. is Death(True)2 worth it if I didn't care much for Death & Rebirth? Personally my preferred ending is still ep 25 & 26.

Flipyap · Jun 21, 2019

airbagged_ said:

Actually, that's the official Evangelion 2.0 subtitle. Kinda weird that Anno omitted the "(not)" formula on that one, but at least he's being honest.

Lukar · Jun 21, 2019

munchie64 said:
I'd say watch. It's pretty obvious where the hole is, and you can always come in here to discuss what has been changed after your done.

Kensation said:
It's fine, seems the spoilered bit is the only major major issue.

SteveWinwood said:
it's kinda hard to explain without the context but it's not as straight (lol) forward as that

i would still watch it, and it doesn't so much seem to me like they completely removed it, just made it less explicitly stated

MMarston said:
What I'm hoping is that despite some of the evident language change, there may be still enough subtext there once I see it. So I think it's still worth a shot, despite how kind of damning of a change it is out of all the other ones.

I'll just watch the Netflix version then, and keep in mind that that aspect was changed. Thanks all.

munchie64 · Jun 21, 2019

MMarston said:
I barely remember much of the show at this point, and episode 4 is by the best one I've seen since I started.

It and two are my early faves for sure.

airbagged_ · Jun 21, 2019

Flipyap said:
Actually, that's the official Evangelion 2.0 subtitle. Kinda weird that Anno omitted the "(not)" formula on that one, but at lest he's being honest.

LMFAO

Deleted member 46958 · Jun 21, 2019

Bonefish said:
Which one? The intermission between Death and EoE? I don't think that was ever even included in an English release before.

Could have sworn it was but I could be misremembering. But it adds so much flavor and anticipation.

Did they take out Tumbling Down? Scrubbing through EoE and I don't hear it.

Fjordson · Jun 21, 2019

LukarWuff said:
Never seen the show before, and was wanting to finally watch it with this release, but hearing that

a queer character has been de-queered in the new dub

makes me super second-guess my desire to watch it. Should I just hunt down the old version of the show instead of watching this one?

The new script was translated in-house by Studio Khara (creator Hideaki Anno's studio) and not by Netflix. Changes like that are likely just attempts to bring it closer to the original Japanese script. They seem to have gone fairly literal with the new dub / subs.

Just my opinion here, but I'm actually not sure the new translation loses all of its queer context anyway, though that could be the result of having the original version of that scene in my mind for so many years.

munchie64 · Jun 21, 2019

I just realised... have they completely cut out the English episode titles? I loved some of them.

JB2448 · Jun 21, 2019

munchie64 said:
I just realised... have they completely cut out the English episode titles? I loved some of them.

No, the English title cards are still in from what I've seen. They just didn't translate the Japanese title cards.

Ashby · Jun 21, 2019

Can someone please spoil me on the de-queering? I've seen the show numerous times.

MMarston · Jun 21, 2019

munchie64 said:
I just realised... have they completely cut out the English episode titles? I loved some of them.

Aren't those the ones that appear after the commercial break?

SArcher · Jun 21, 2019

We need a threadmark post with all the known changes listed I think.

RedSwirl said:
Okay what's going on here? Suummation?

All I've got on me is the 2001 (I think) DVD set from ADV and I've always been confused about how the later ones were better or whatever. I think they just remastered the video and audio right? Before Netflix announced this I was gonna give these DVDs a rewatch but I was gonna do it on a CRT.

Language-wise I've never seen Eva from beginning to end in Japanese so I was gonna go subbed. I heard there was a new dub but now it seems like they actually retranslated everything including the subs. is Death(True)2 worth it if I didn't care much for Death & Rebirth? Personally my preferred ending is still ep 25 & 26.

The 2001/2002 DVD set uses masters from the original VHS releases and does not include director's cuts of episodes 21-24 whereas the later Platinum sets are based on remastered Japanese DVDs ad do include the DCs..

Death(True)2 & Death and Rebirth are the same thing aren't they? First half is a recap of the series and the second half is the first half of the End of Evangelion. In short, it is entirely skippable.

Mars People · Jun 21, 2019

LukarWuff said:
Never seen the show before, and was wanting to finally watch it with this release, but hearing that

a queer character has been de-queered in the new dub

makes me super second-guess my desire to watch it. Should I just hunt down the old version of the show instead of watching this one?

No they just corrected a bad translation from all that I see.
He never said 'I love you' in the original just that 'I like you'. The homoerotic inplication is there but subtle.

MMarston · Jun 21, 2019

Ashby said:
Can someone please spoil me on the de-queering? I've seen the show numerous times.

Basically changed Kaworu/Shinji language from "I love you" to "I like you" and stuff like that

EDIT: Though as dan mentioned above, this also a translation issue too

munchie64 · Jun 21, 2019

JB2448 said:
No, the English title cards are still in from what I've seen. They just didn't translate the Japanese title cards.

MMarston said:
Aren't those the ones that appear after the commercial break?

Ah, have been mostly skipping around so I must have missed them. Glad to hear.

Pitou · Jun 21, 2019

thread is going about just as expected.

snausages · Jun 21, 2019

dan2026 said:
No they just corrected a bad translation from all that I see.
He never said 'I love you' in the original just that 'I like you'. The homoerotic inplication is there but subtle

I was going to ask this, given NGE's heavy Christian subtext it makes sense. It could be speaking to how a God loves someone.

But I still prefer the overtly homoerotic version. 😢

ChasingANiche · Jun 21, 2019

The more I hear of this Shinji the more I'm convinced this is my definitive version. What an inspired choice.

Lord Vatek · Jun 21, 2019

dan2026 said:
No they just corrected a bad translation from all that I see.
He never said 'I love you' in the original just that 'I like you'. The homoerotic inplication is there but subtle.

"I like you" has completely different non-romantic connotations in English. It's a translator's job to show meaning and they completely failed.

MMarston · Jun 21, 2019

ChasingANiche said:
The more I hear of this Shinji the more I'm convinced this is my definitive version. What an inspired choice.

Yeah, the Shinji dub here is fantastic so far.

Ashby · Jun 21, 2019

"I like you"

"I'm the lowest of the low."

No "Fly Me to the Moon"

I was so excited to finally show my fiancé this but now I'm just bummed out.

Lulu · Jun 21, 2019

Lord Vatek said:
"I like you" has completely different non-romantic connotations in English. It's a translator's job to show meaning and they completely failed.

This. You're wrong dan2026

munchie64 · Jun 21, 2019

ChasingANiche said:
The more I hear of this Shinji the more I'm convinced this is my definitive version. What an inspired choice.

Definitely my fav of the dub so far. Helps that she has good screams. No Megumi. but who is?

Kittens McMittens · Jun 21, 2019

dan2026 said:
No they just corrected a bad translation from all that I see.
He never said 'I love you' in the original just that 'I like you'. The homoerotic inplication is there but subtle.

Love/Like is very tricky to get right when translating from Japanese. The consensus on that line for a long time has been that love is the correct translation because he's saying it as one would say to another close friend. It's not explicitly gay, but in many ways the Shinji / Kaworu relationship could be said to have queer coding. The changing of that line doesn't really change the overall tone of their relationship, but it's understandable how queer fans feel aggrieved by the change.

Starviper · Jun 21, 2019

Ashby said:
Can someone please spoil me on the de-queering? I've seen the show numerous times.

From what i've read in this thread all that is really changed is a line where they say "I like you" instead of "I love you" - the show isn't significantly changed in any way, and FWIW it sounds like it may simply be translation errors rather than an intentional queer erasure thing like some are making it out to be. The scenes and everything beyond that are still all the same.

Like I get it, the impact of the wording is lessened, but some of you really make it seem like a way bigger deal than it is; when it gets to the point of people questioning whether they should watch it or not, go ahead and watch. It's still the same show, no scenes are missing.

kai3345 · Jun 21, 2019

thanks for the responses everyone. guess new dub it is. can't wait to dive in this weekend

Fjordson · Jun 21, 2019

My Japanese isn't great so I may get owned here by someone more knowledgeable, but I feel like if it was always meant to be so overt the Japanese script would have used something stronger than "suki". To me "I like you" more accurately keeps some of the ambiguity that the original line had (oddly, even ADV's original subtitles used like instead of love). And all the subtext surrounding it is still there.

Scavenger · Jun 21, 2019

Twitter response from the translator:

Mars People · Jun 21, 2019

Fjordson said:
My Japanese isn't great so I may get owned here by someone more knowledgeable, but I feel like if it was always meant to be so overt the Japanese script would have used something stronger than "suki". To me "I like you" more accurately keeps some of the ambiguity that the original line had (oddly, even ADV's original subtitles used like instead of love). And all the subtext surrounding it is still there.

My opinion exactly.
If they had wanted him to say 'I love you' they would of used 'Aishiteru'. But they didn't so I think its a mistake to assume intentions.

The translator is right. It is subtle. Where as translating it as a straight 'I love you' is not.

Astral · Jun 21, 2019

Wait there's new English cast? Spike Spencer isn't Shinji? I don't think I'm ready for that. Why the change?

Zero315 · Jun 21, 2019

Bran-dono said:
Could have sworn it was but I could be misremembering. But it adds so much flavor and anticipation.

Did they take out Tumbling Down? Scrubbing through EoE and I don't hear it.

Komm Süsser Tod is still there.

Kirblar · Jun 21, 2019

Scavenger said:
Twitter response from the translator:

I always saw that relationship as

a deliberately confusing conflation of "I, aspect of God, love you" and "I, another guy, love you"

and I'm not sure that the exact translation really matters as long as that's maintained.

Kiria · Jun 21, 2019

dan2026 said:
My opinion exactly.
If they had wanted him to say 'I love you' they would of used 'Aishiteru'. But they didn't so I think its a mistake to assume intentions.

The translator is right. It is subtle. Where as translating it as a straight 'I love you' is not.

But I don't think anyone would use suki casually to the same sex person. If they didn't mean beyond like

Chaotic-Strike · Jun 21, 2019

So I keep hearing for the later episodes there's a director cut version? What exactly is the difference between the original and the DC cut?

diakyu · Jun 21, 2019

I never gathered the love thing when I first watched the Japanese version years ago. I mean it certainly can be seen that way, and the new version can be seen like that too.

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