My Playstation account just got permanently suspended for a credit card chargeback

Infinite Justice · Dec 8, 2020

JaseC said:
The only permanent change is the blacklisting of the payment account/method used; all of the other restrictions either auto-expire after nine weeks or are immediately lifted if you elect to reverse the chargeback (not my image):

Alright i stand corrected, its way better than i remembered

9 weeks and not being able to ever use the account/card affected is a small price to pay tbh.

RedMercury · Dec 8, 2020

I love when jerks write or call into our customer service department at my job and treat our agents terribly and threaten to charge stuff back, like go for it, you'll be banned immediately. They all get reviewed by a team to see if there was a legit reason to charge it back or not, if it was our bad the customer gets unbanned. I don't know that Sony does anything like that where they review chargebacks but they should, probably not.

GrrImAFridge · Dec 8, 2020

Xion_Stellar said:
This is why I try to not use my card on PSN if I can avoid it and also just a reminder that this is standard practice across the industry. So Microsoft, Nintendo and Steam can ban your account if you do a change back but Steam is the only one that won't immediately jump towards banning your account.

Repeatedly breaking the Steam ToS won't get you banned, but it will result in your account being permanently restricted in such a way that playing your existing games, minus VAC-protected MP titles, is literally all you can do. Bans these days happen only in particularly exceptional circumstances, such as the GAFer who hounded Steam Support and individual Valve employees for almost a year regarding a Steam Community ban he disagreed with and, near the end, was warned multiple times that if he didn't stop, he'd lose access to his account. In fact, as best I'm aware, that's literally the one and only account ban Valve has issued since implementing the restriction system in ~early 2012.

TechnicPuppet · Dec 8, 2020

RedMercury said:
I love when jerks write or call into our customer service department at my job and treat our agents terribly and threaten to charge stuff back, like go for it, you'll be banned immediately. They all get reviewed by a team to see if there was a legit reason to charge it back or not, if it was our bad the customer gets unbanned. I don't know that Sony does anything like that where they review chargebacks but they should, probably not.

That's just awful, utterly awful.

RedMercury · Dec 8, 2020

TechnicPuppet said:
That's just awful, utterly awful.

How so?

Huey · Dec 9, 2020

JaseC said:
The only permanent change is the blacklisting of the payment account/method used; all of the other restrictions either auto-expire after nine weeks or are immediately lifted if you elect to reverse the chargeback (not my image):

Yeah this is the way to do it. Strange to have such an aggressive group of posters suggesting otherwise. Limit the account, if the problem is solved, lift the restriction. There is no excuse for prohibiting a user from accessing games they have purchased.

TheKeipatzy · Dec 9, 2020

This topic was certainly something to read...

TechnicPuppet · Dec 9, 2020

RedMercury said:
How so?

You can immediately then decide if that should be the case, wtf.

Asriel · Dec 9, 2020

Swift_Gamer said:
LMAO, what? My credit card got cloned around 3 months ago and someone used it and spent more and $1000 on it and I only discovered when the bill came. I shouldn't have requested a charge back? Should I have paid, blocked the card and moved on? Do you people live in the real world?

Good Lord. A chargeback is not meant to be used in response to credit card fraud.

SpaceCrystal · Dec 9, 2020

TeenageFBI said:
If Sony permanently suspends your account because of a chargeback, what does that mean?

Can you redownload and play single-player digital games or are they lost forever?

If you ever get suspended or banned from PSN, you won't ever be able to access the PSN store or download anything that you've bought & downloaded, period.

entremet said:
Seriously? That's nuts and very anticonsumer.

Richter1887 said:
Damn that sounds scary as hell.

All the thousands of bucks you used, gone.

Edge said:
Ahhhh, the sweet sweet digital future again.

No matter if accidentally or purposely charged back, reading stuff like this always scares me to death, how easy it is to lose your account.

Just have one single problem, once, like someone went into your account to do shit, someone stole your credit card and idk maxed it out or so or you immediately shut it down even but a very badly timed psn purchases just went through, or you payed something via bank account and it wasn't enough money on it or any other error. One mistake, poof, gone.

Frightening.

That's one of the very reasons why you should never put all of your eggs in one basket on being digital only, especially on consoles.

night814 · Dec 9, 2020

xaosslug said:
honestly, you should *not* use a cc or paypal on your PSN account. Only buy PSN credit and use that. I used to use my paypal or cc account until I got a bunch of emails saying someone was trying to access my psn (his is pre-2fv) after that I stopped putting my cc and paypal on my account. I just by PSN credit from amazon or someone selling it cheaper on Era and use that.

Yeah it needs to be shouted from the rooftops that people need to stop saving their CC or PayPal info on any kind of online store, if you must use those just put the info in everytime it hardly takes a minute to enter all your CC info for a one time purchase.

spman2099 · Dec 9, 2020

Caio Loco said:
If they do that, people would buy a game, play it, chargeback and keep doing, playing for free.

Or they freeze the ability for the account holder to buy new games and the problem is instantly solved. No more chance for fraud and no one is locked out of accessing the games they purchased legitimately. This is deeply strange policy to cape for, my friend.

RedMercury · Dec 9, 2020

TechnicPuppet said:
You can immediately then decide if that should be the case, wtf.

What I mean is, at my job we actually review chargebacks, we have a whole team for it so if the chargeback was for a legitimate reason, the customer gets their account back, I don't think Sony does this however. We don't actually ban them, it's an automated system because at least in my industry sector 9/10 times someone does a chargeback it's fraud and you can't just let someone order, do a chargeback, order, do a chargeback, repeat. You ban the account first and sort it out later or you're just losing money

CanUKlehead · Dec 9, 2020

SpaceCrystal said:
If you ever get suspended or banned from PSN, you won't ever be able to access the PSN store or download anything that you've bought & downloaded, period.

That's one of the very downsides of being digital only.

Can you still sign on to your console and play the games you have downloaded into your system, or you can't even access stuff you've already downloaded?

It's still shitty, and if you've a decade of PS Plus games that's extra shitty, but I'm more wondering if they can basically nuke your console from afar, or if you can still just coddle that console and hope it never dies lol

xxracerxx · Dec 9, 2020

TechnicPuppet said:
You can immediately then decide if that should be the case, wtf.

That's not what they wrote though...it goes through a review.

Seems like Sony has a way to restore the account at least:

How to reverse a PSN suspension for account debt

If your payment method has had a charge reversed on a PlayStation™Store purchase, this can result in your account being restricted from accessing PlayStation™Network (PSN).

www.playstation.com

grand · Dec 9, 2020

"I just called my mom'"

Is one of the most revealing yet hilarious statements I've seen on this forum lol

Serious Sam · Dec 9, 2020

Bonfires Down said:
I don't see any grey area here. It is unreasonable to lock all previous purchases because of a dispute over a single purchase.

100% this. Absolutely insane that you get locked out of your account permanently because of problems with one purchase (even if you yourself messed up). This is some early internet age wild west bullshit and should be illegal for companies to do.

Lock account from using credit cards and making new purchases for a while until issue is resolved is more than enough of a measure.

arcadepc · Dec 9, 2020

What they are doing is illegal and in Europe you can go to a respective consumer rights protection agency that will force them to unban you

Sony has lost a court case over its PlayStation Store refund policy | VGC

Firm fined $3.5m by Australian body for refusing refunds after 14 days or game is downloaded…

www.videogameschronicle.com

Asriel · Dec 9, 2020

Diablos said:
Kids use their parents' credit cards constantly for digital purchases. Not to mention families let people use cards for digital purposes for gift giving etc within families. Again, Sony needs to put in place a three strikes policy with dedicated support channels to assess how and why the chargeback occurred so they can best communicate to the account owner why they shouldn't do this and what steps they can take to make sure it doesn't happen again. It's not fucking hard.

I don't think people quite understand how serious chargebacks are for a vendor.

Chargebacks are a massive pain in the ass for vendors and can cause massive fees. And enough chargebacks can get vendor accounts terminated and blackballed.

Granted, Sony is a massive company, but this is why they're so quick to shutdown accounts that file them. Simply put, they should always be a last resort and shouldn't be used unless you're sure you never want to work with a vendor again.

Tigress · Dec 9, 2020

NarohDethan said:
Or anywhere, it will nuke your account.

You're left with nothing.

and this is one of the reasons l am stubbornly clinging to physical games. It's ridiculous a company can take away all that you bought from them for any reason they deem. I am not against them banning future purposes or use of online but I don't think it's right they can remove access to games you bought.

Deleted member 10629 · Dec 9, 2020

Tigress said:
and this is one of the reasons l am stubbornly clinging to physical games. It's ridiculous a company can take away all that you bought from them for any reason they deem. I am not against them banning future purposes or use of online but I don't think it's right they can remove access to games you bought.

AFAIK Steam just prevents you from purchasing anymore, the games are still playable.

bigmit37 · Dec 9, 2020

Why can't they just prevent him from future purchases?
It's kind of scary his entire account will be terminated.
This would make me hesitant to purchases expensive games or create a large collection my account.

@dedmunk · Dec 9, 2020

Yeah it's a shit thing Sony do, limiting you from accessing your previous purchases. I wish they would change that.

Kuosi · Dec 9, 2020

Like stated, companies need means against charge backs, Sony's just are worse than say Steams.

FrostweaveBandage · Dec 9, 2020

Chargebacks through a bank are a big fucking deal. They pretty much only do it in cases of fraud. It's hella abusable and it's why pretty much any case of identity theft means your entire bank account and cards get closed and you get issued new numbers. Because your old numbers are basically useless to other institutions.

If OP's parents saw a PSN charge and didn't know what it was, clearly no permission was granted to use said card, nor did OP tell his parents about the charge after.

FrostweaveBandage · Dec 9, 2020

bigmit37 said:
Why can't they just prevent him from future purchases?
It's kind of scary his entire account will be terminated.
This would make me hesitant to purchases expensive games or create a large collection my account.

I mean what good would his account be if he can't buy off the store? Might as well close it then.

FrostweaveBandage · Dec 9, 2020

Tigress said:
and this is one of the reasons l am stubbornly clinging to physical games. It's ridiculous a company can take away all that you bought from them for any reason they deem. I am not against them banning future purposes or use of online but I don't think it's right they can remove access to games you bought.

My thinking too. I own physical games. I'm just using a license for digital. One that can be revoked at any time for any reason.

bigmit37 · Dec 9, 2020

FrostweaveBandage said:
I mean what good would his account be if he can't buy off the store? Might as well close it then.

Suspend his account for a few months then.
Even if I can't buy off the store, if I had an account with 200 games, and it got closed I would be very annoyed.

Rosebud · Dec 9, 2020

Hopefully you can get your acc back paying the ""debt"".

Chargebacks are bannable everywhere, but they certainly need a better refund policy.

northnorth · Dec 9, 2020

Abylim said:
It's the return of violent Sony

One of my all time favorite things on this board. HAHA

Het_Nkik · Dec 9, 2020

Yeah, my brother-in-law charged back a payment that his son made on his card without him knowing so my nephew ended up with a banned account. It seemed like the fix was simple enough as contacting Sony and getting them their money back but with covid it was impossible to contact them via phone or through their online chat.

Had to make the kid a new PSN account. Kind of crazy that a huge company was 100% unreachable but I guess these are the times in which we're living.

LatteToGo · Dec 9, 2020

Serious question: how do microsoft handle this chargeback? Bannable too?

MrFox · Dec 9, 2020

(IANAL) A chargeback is literally declaring a credit card fraud. It's a very good and very necessary consumer protection, but it is very expensive to the vendor for ambiguous "there's no proof either way", which is where it can be abused. It's also a last resort for cases where the vendor acted fraudulently, or your credit card was stolen or cloned. Anyone who owns a credit card should know that.

I asked for a chargeback a couple times but it was real fraud, and my card was cloned. When you ask a chargeback, you are recorded on the phone for your statements for their investigation.You need to say that you never made that purchase, that you do not have an account with that company, and they also ask if it's possible at all that a family member could have made the purchase. They ask you to be sure it's not just because you don't remember. They repeat it's a very serious action. If you do have an account they ask you to resolving the charges with the vendor first.

Dinjooh · Dec 9, 2020

ZeroX said:
Didn't we have this thread a month ago, a few times actually

extremely vague OP
"I GOT BANNED FOR NO REASON"
"IT SAYS SOMETHING ABOUT A CHARGE BACK I DID NO SUCH THING"
"oh yes actually I did do a credit card dispute"

That pretty accurately describes my various jobs at support desks.

AIan · Dec 9, 2020

LatteToGo said:
Serious question: how do microsoft handle this chargeback? Bannable too?

Chargebacks are usually last resort options so Microsoft will probably ban, as will many other businesses.

nekkid · Dec 9, 2020

Jonnax said:
A chargeback is you effectively reporting that the merchant has defrauded or scammed you somehow.
They get charged a penalty for it.

You're supposed to contact the company's support first before filing a chargeback

A charge back is a last resort that essentially ends your relationship with that company.

The fact that you lose access to your account isn't good of course.

If you had to do a chargeback to a physical store they wouldn't come to your house and take all your other game discs. I think it's a policy that needs work, because it's indefensibly heavy-handed.

Wise · Dec 9, 2020

Evolution of Metal said:
Hey, speaking about backfiring threads, where is TheGreatJordan with his update, he said he is charging back on 7th. Troll or not, I want to know the end to the saga.

I got £800 pounds back yesterday at 10pm :)

monketron · Dec 9, 2020

I'm not sure any large company would allow you to issue a chargeback on a purchase out of the blue and not sanction your account, why are you getting so defensive over this? just contact support, tell them what happened and pay the amount due. Yes, they're busy as hell atm given Covid + new console launch + Christmas period, so you're gonna have to just wait in line.

Hayeya · Dec 9, 2020

rpm said:
90% of the time when someone makes a thread about getting banned for no reason, it's for a reason

That's inception level of Deep.

Check your card history OP.

Deleted member 50374 · Dec 9, 2020

I think it is worth pointing out that using someone else's card is often against the terms of use and if they don't give their explicit permission, could even be fraud and/or identity thief. I don't share my c/c with anyone, not even my SO, and I don't save anyone else's c/c anytime I do use them (it happens when parents ask to buy online something). Better be safe than sorry.

PSOreo · Dec 9, 2020

Guys it's anti consumer that I used my parents old credit card and they disputed the charge because I didn't bother telling them.

PonyStation · Dec 9, 2020

@dedmunk said:
Yeah it's a shit thing Sony do, limiting you from accessing your previous purchases. I wish they would change that.

By doing a charge back you're telling the bank that Sony committed a fraud crime and that you're ending all business with them. In order to protect themselves, Sony will of course ban you from using any of their services, in this case is their network.

They won't change anything, because there's no need to. Don't accuse a company of a major crime and expect the company to keep letting you use their services.

Kolx · Dec 9, 2020

Op, nobody here can help you. Ask your mother to reverse it, and only then after it's reversed call PS support and explain the situation. They hopefully can lift the ban. And yeah, never use that card again, or better still never use any card on PSN. Just use prepaid PSN cards to avoid situation like this (and better in case you get hacked too).

Zephon · Dec 9, 2020

Not sure if this is slightly off topic but speaking of payments on PSN I've also always come across many people saying not to use paypal as payment option on PSN, why is that?

RomanticHeroX · Dec 9, 2020

Literally every thread about an account for something being closed/banned/suspended always reveals it's for a very clear and justifiable reason. It's like clockwork.

Deleted member 46804 · Dec 9, 2020

Some of the things being said in this thread and how the OP was treated by multiple users is truly insane. Be nice to people.

cw_sasuke · Dec 9, 2020

Messed up but sadly the standard across pretty much every digital stores.
Backcharge = you are done and cant be trusted no more

Henrar · Dec 9, 2020

LatteToGo said:
Serious question: how do microsoft handle this chargeback? Bannable too?

Chargebacks will result in a ban in most stores. Microsoft bans for it, Apple bans for it, Valve bans for it.

PSOreo · Dec 9, 2020

RomanticHeroX said:
Literally every thread about an account for something being closed/banned/suspended always reveals it's for a very clear and justifiable reason. It's like clockwork.

Don't forget to get accused of being a "boot licker" by random members for explaining how a standard company policy works when potential fraudulent action has taken place.

@dedmunk · Dec 9, 2020

PonyStation said:
By doing a charge back you're telling the bank that Sony committed a fraud crime and that you're ending all business with them. In order to protect themselves, Sony will of course ban you from using any of their services, in this case is their network.

They won't change anything, because there's no need to. Don't accuse a company of a major crime and expect the company to keep letting you use their services.

Don't be obtuse 'Fraud' isn't the only reason for a charge back.

Taken straight from the Department of Commerce in my Country

You may be able to seek a chargeback from your card provider when things go wrong. Common situations include:

when goods or services delivered are not as described;

when goods or services have not been supplied within the agreed timeframe;

for duplicated or fraudulent transactions;

when charges are made without your agreement;

insolvency.

The first and second points could easily be disputed in some cases and even the fourth, and I personally have had Sony incorrectly charge me 3 times for a PSN renewal, all within seconds of each other.

If Sony's refund policy wasn't complete trash and easy to use chargebacks could be avoided in most cases.

My Playstation account just got permanently suspended for a credit card chargeback

Blue Venus

ONE THOUSAND DOLLARYDOOS

Blue Venus

One Winged Slayer

Blue Venus

Unshakable Resolve

Unshakable Resolve

Unshakable Resolve

Two Pieces

One Winged Slayer

VFX Rendering Pipeline Developer

alt account

User requested account closure