i beat mega man 2 on my LG Chocolate
where's my hardcore gamer trophy
I beat Kingdom hearts 2 on an emulator using a keyboard, beat that dog!
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My kid is mortified that the final section of Cuphead can't be reached
- Thread starter Deleted member 13101
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I beat Kingdom hearts 2 on an emulator using a keyboard, beat that dog!
Comparing levels of literacy to game difficulty. What are we doing in this thread?
jUsT wAtCH THe EnDIng oN yoUTubE
Man I bought the game today and I'm glad I read this thread. Now I know that I need to play on normal, and I also know I'll never engage with the fanbase !
Man I bought the game today and I'm glad I read this thread. Now I know that I need to play on normal, and I also know I'll never engage with the fanbase !
It's funny you use Mortal Kombat, that had censored versions that turned the blood into sweat and toned down the fatalities haha
Of course there's a need to "gatekeep" things in video games. That's what progression is. It's the reason you typically have to play through parts of a game in order to unlock later content.
In the case of Cuphead and Nex Machina, both cases are reasonable. That Cuphead blocks off access to the finale unless you have beaten all bosses on the standard difficulty shows that simple mode - which simplifies boss fights, removing attacks and phases - is not the intended way to fully experience the game, and that Nex Machina asks you to 1CC the game on at least its (forgiving) standard difficulty serves as a guide, showing you that the intended way of experiencing the game is as a single cohesive whole that should be taken on in one full playthrough.
There's nothing outdated or unnecessary about this kind of design. Games aren't just aesthetics; they are their mechanics, their rules. This design choice shows that the developers of these games took them seriously, and they are clearly made with the hope that their players will choose to fully engage with the content instead of subverting it by choosing the chopped-up lower modes.
This isn't the Cuphead fan base, it's how bad this forum is.
I'm talking about the modern versions, where you get detailed slow-mo x-ray vision for all manner of bone-smashing and dismembering. I checked out after watching a couple of matches.
The classic MK games aren't really my thing either but they're more comedic in style than anything; you can't take it that seriously when someone explodes into a dozen separate ribcages.
Maybe they should've had a shortened version of the Devil fight for easy mode
And then they hit you with the equivalent of this post credits
You know I'm still a bit peeved by this, way to deflate my ending Sega!
And then they hit you with the equivalent of this post credits
You know I'm still a bit peeved by this, way to deflate my ending Sega!
The PS4 release reminded me that I never actually beat this game. Then got back to it, couldn't beat the carousel boss and reminded me why I said "fuck this game" a long time ago.
So tell your kid he's a lot better than an old geezer who plainly gave up on this thing.
So tell your kid he's a lot better than an old geezer who plainly gave up on this thing.
dunno what you are on about - "inaccessibility" is a fair criticism to apply to literature. Insufferable authors who think are they are dostoevsky need to learn that some people have families and don't have the time to read their 300,000 word "masterpiece".
Edit: I'm still bitter about Plok doing this exact same shit. I couldn't beat the end levels and the easy mode wouldn't let you get that far.
I'm all for making easier difficulties but this was pretty hilarious. I didn't even know they hid the ending behind normal. Shouldn't have bothered if they put in all the work to make a simple mode.
Also I'm ok with locking stuff behind harder difficulties as it does incentivize people who are seeking a challenge to try overcoming the challenge. However it's a bit unreasonable to hide the main ending of a game behind a whole different difficulty mode as was done here.
Also I'm ok with locking stuff behind harder difficulties as it does incentivize people who are seeking a challenge to try overcoming the challenge. However it's a bit unreasonable to hide the main ending of a game behind a whole different difficulty mode as was done here.
Ignoring that this is still a dumb equivalence, books have so many accessibility options and resources it's not even funny.
And those people are awful. So what does this have to do with game difficulty? Cause I think non-ironic "git gud" people are awful too.
They didn't hide it, the game plainly tells you that it will do that. The Op and/or their kid not seeing that isn't the same as it being hidden.
Yeah true but even then I don't think most reasonable people would be against a toned down version as an option for people like yourself who don't really dig the gore. or in the case of some movies a TV or PG version that tones down gore in horror movies. If it impossible to tell the story without it, I don't think it should be changed in that case but, bringing it back to games, regarding difficulty that doesn't seem to be the case with narrative stuff like a locked ending. There doesn't seem to be much reason to hold it back from people based on physical capabilities.
it is not a punishment, the game is teaching you: Bigger the risks, bigger the reward!
I think you're comparing apples to oranges here. In the examples you gave, everyone is on an equal playing field, the only difference being how much time people are able and willing to invest in the game to satisfy the requirements to get the true ending. No one's being denied any essential content because of a lack of skill or ability.
In the case of Cuphead and so many other games where essential content is gated behind extreme challenge, there's a base inequality in terms of accessibility because it's not just a matter of being willing to put in the time; some people, such as little kids as well as older folks and people with certain physical and/or mental disabilities, aren't given a fair shake because they're handicapped by impairments the "git gud" assholes don't have to consider, and thus they're gated out of essential content through no fault or lack of commitment (time or otherwise) of their own.
I don't know who it was, but someone earlier in the thread mentioned Uncharted as a great example; imagine if each Uncharted game's ending was gated behind completing the game on Crushing difficulty. People would be pissed, and rightly so. Of course, the definitions of "essential content" and "extreme challenge" will vary from person to person, so I'm not saying there's one universal one-size-fits-all answer here or that my answer is the be-all end-all solution, but I absolutely do believe it is objectively true that greater accessibility and more options is always, always better than less. Games are for everyone, not just the git gud skill-check dickheads who have nothing more meaningful than video game aptitude to inflate their egos with. (Not saying that's you, by the way; just responding to your reply!)
The kid will grow up like me and know their natural boundaries (in addition that effort is needed to expand that) and be OK with it and not whine on message boards, demanding Player Bribery. I have faith.
The eternal battle between people that enjoy engaging with a game on it's own terms and content tourists that just want to see everything. In the case of this game it straight up explicitly tells you that you are opting not to collect the contracts you need to finish the game by selecting the easy mode every single time you choose to select it. It's not something that should have come as a shock as you mosey up to the end of the game. Personally I realize not every game is made for me and I don't demand that every game be made to suit my whims. If a game seems like something I would not enjoy engaging with I don't play it rather than get aggravated about it. There are more games available to play than any single person would ever have time to play.
A time investment is a time investment. I think a lot of frustration for some players just comes from redoing the same part over and over rather than a complaint about the time invested in the game itself. I brought up P5R simply because it is a game that makes you replay it, while already being VERY long, in order to "see everything".
How long is the average completion time for Cuphead versus Uncharted? The last Uncharted game I played through was 2, and on hard I think it took me 20 hours or there about. Cuphead took me maybe about 10 on normal?
I think your above points are overall fair for long, narrative based games. Cuphead really isn't that though. You're already losing content from the game due to the fact that easy significantly alters or flat-out removes certain encounters. There are plenty of other player concessions that are made in spite of it being pretty difficult that older games didn't have-- saving in between levels being one of the most crucial differences. Cuphead is easier than its primary source of inspiration (Alien Soldier) due to this. You don't have limited continues. By it's design, it is FAR easier than some of the other boss-rush run n guns-- I think on average people would have an easier time clearing Cuphead than, say, the western version of Contra: Hard Corps.
I don't disagree that greater accessibility options are great. I also don't think every game needs to be difficult. However, some games shouldn't really have to cater to "everyone".
does the difficulty options say that you are locked out of content for playing on easy?
if it's upfront with it it's easier for me to accept because they at least set expectations, but if you just hit a wall and the game is like come back on normal then that sucks
if it's upfront with it it's easier for me to accept because they at least set expectations, but if you just hit a wall and the game is like come back on normal then that sucks
Mortified?! Sorry can't help but lol at the use of that word! With that said I can't believe games to this day are still doing that locked end levels/ending stuff. Last time I encounterd that was with the original Nights game an I said ta heck with that and never saw the final boss of it. Its crap then an its crap now... BUT, going by posts in this thread, Cuphead a.) tells ya up front what you'll miss b.) you can change the difficulty any time c.) the whole basis of the plot revolves around getting those contract things which the game tells ya you can't get on easy. Its still lame as all heck but unlike old games its not a surprise "fuck you" to the player.
Agreed. It shouldn't be blocked.
Who cares if someone sees the end on easy mode. Let the masses experience the game.
I'd be more likely to replay it on the normal mode to perfect my skill if I didn't feel completely shafted at the end of the easy mode. Instead I just uninstalled it.
Who cares if someone sees the end on easy mode. Let the masses experience the game.
I'd be more likely to replay it on the normal mode to perfect my skill if I didn't feel completely shafted at the end of the easy mode. Instead I just uninstalled it.
The developers intent was to make a difficult video game. There's nothing wrong with that because that's the game, that's why they're called games to begin with. Cuphead requires skill and memorization that the developers intended to be a requirement for the games completion. They wanted the players of the game to over come these obstacles and feel rewarded. I firmly believe that all video game developers should be able to create whatever sort of game they desire, whether it be easy or hard.
Yeah there's zero reason to lock content behind a certain difficulty mode. People who want that meaningless feeling of achievement can do so by beating it on the higher difficulty still, and people who are unable to beat the game on higher difficulty can still experience it. There's no drawback.
So you're saying that a creator can't reward playing on higher difficulties with more content?
Whoa that's weird.
Why offer an "easy mode" if it's not the full game? Easy modes aren't just for people that don't have the time to fully learn a game's mechanics / layouts, they're also good for accessibility. This is disappointing to hear.
They could've accomplished something similar and more effectively by having a slightly different endings and/or rewards based on the difficulty (thus still allowing everybody the same base content at least, while encouraging multiple playthroughs for those that want to try for it).
Why offer an "easy mode" if it's not the full game? Easy modes aren't just for people that don't have the time to fully learn a game's mechanics / layouts, they're also good for accessibility. This is disappointing to hear.
They could've accomplished something similar and more effectively by having a slightly different endings and/or rewards based on the difficulty (thus still allowing everybody the same base content at least, while encouraging multiple playthroughs for those that want to try for it).
Not everyone is a hard core gamer and the art style is going to suck people in who are going to be dissappointed.
Alien Soldier is pretty much is THE technical showpiece for the Mega Drive/Genesis and also probably its hardest game.
And yet Treasure made Gunstar Heroes too, a game which Cuphead rips off directly for the Dice Maze, and it has difficulties from Easy to Expert.
Yeah there was a big stink about this when the game first came out.
OP's point is that simple mode for some people is just as hard as normal mode is for other people, especially if we're talking about children playing these games. I say that as someone who got all the soul contracts and beat The Devil.
OP's point is that simple mode for some people is just as hard as normal mode is for other people, especially if we're talking about children playing these games. I say that as someone who got all the soul contracts and beat The Devil.
I think the problem might be that they called it Simple mode. Should have gone with "Training" to make it more clear that beating bosses that way didn't count.
Short games like this are meant to be replayed and blocking off the last bosses behind it isn't the end of the world, but calling it Training mode would avoid this frustration.
However, as someone who wants every game to have a hard mode, it would be cool if all games also did the Celeste assist thing, even Cuphead. Again, not the end of the world, but nice to have.
Short games like this are meant to be replayed and blocking off the last bosses behind it isn't the end of the world, but calling it Training mode would avoid this frustration.
However, as someone who wants every game to have a hard mode, it would be cool if all games also did the Celeste assist thing, even Cuphead. Again, not the end of the world, but nice to have.
OP
OP
And "simple" offers unlimited ceramic-shattering deaths, and doesn't deny you any of that challenge or opportunity for continuous improvement, and will even offer you a grade for it (which would be pointless if it really was a "practice" mode as some have suggested, since it is not quite the "regular" level experience anyways).
Plus, telling kids today to go to youtube to "see the ending" shows a generational divide, since they first find out about these games from youtube, and they may have already seen it. They are more than "content tourists" in that they are on youtube for personality or community programming, not "I'll just watch the game instead." It's likely they've seen more of the game this way before playing than you or I have from previews and reviews, so then they just want to live some of that experience playing for themselves.
In a few short years these kids will be fully into the games and part of the zeitgeist of the next console generation. As it is, they have access to more games than anyone playing in '85 or '77 ever did at their ages, but still have the same amount of time to spend on them. They will decide where and how their game time is best spent, and which game designs are more worthy of their time.
He will get better at the game and appreciate the challenge as he gets older. Encourage him to stick with it.