Mid-generation console refreshes

[Dekim]

What will be the sell for mid-gen upgrades? Better ray tracing? For the XBX and Pro, it was higher resolutions (particularly 4K) during a time when 4K TVs started to hit their stride with consumers. The PS5 and the Series X already do 4K well enough. What's missing from the PS5 and Series X that people can easily point it and requires new hardware?

 

[Max A.]

Yeah I'm waiting for a PS5 Pro in a couple of years, the games will be $20, the kinks mostly fixed, a little more juice, probably a bigger SSD, super cheap 4K 120hz OLEDs, probably a cleaner redesign. Worth the wait for me.

 

[Tagyhag]

I'm personally waiting for the PS5 Pro.

If it ends up being just a slim, that's fine as well, at least games will be cheaper by then.

But overall I definitely think they'll do one. I think both companies realized it was a good way to offset generation fatigue with them.

 

[Bishop89]

Having owned both since day one the Pro was pretty rubbish and the 1X was a beautiful and fully featured piece of hardware that wasn't used its potential.

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I don't own either, but the impression I got over the years was this.

 

[Executive Taxi]

The circumstances surrounding this console generation (PS5, XSX) is much different than the previous generation. I feel like PS5 and XSX are more similar to the PS3 and 360 in that they are adequately spec'd to deliver a good experience for the entire generation without the need for high-end models like the PS4 Pro. I absolutely expect multiple refreshes to improve the design and add small things here and there but I think the likelihood of a high-end model like a PS5 Pro and Xbox Series X+ is very very slim.

 

[PersianPrince]

There probably will be a mid generation refresh, and that's what I will probably end up buying.

 

[MajesticSoup]

Arent we getting MCM gpus 1-2 generations from now? That seems like it could get messy if theyre radically different architectures.

My guess is that we just get 3-5nm slim models.

 

[RF Switch]

I consider this a mid gen refresh as well. I hope the upgrades keep coming

 

[John Frost]

Yeah I'm waiting for a PS5 Pro in a couple of years, the games will be $20, the kinks mostly fixed, a little more juice, probably a bigger SSD, super cheap 4K 120hz OLEDs, probably a cleaner redesign. Worth the wait for me.

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3-4 years you mean.

 

[Creepy Woody]

I hope there is, will get it day one, Pro was great, especially since I threw an SSD inside. Hard to go back to the original's now. Much more sluggish menu's, loading and 1080p or less looks much blurrier to me.

 

[Rune Walsh]

For people like me who buy consoles at least half-way through the generation I find it fantastic. I got a PS4 Pro for $200 and now I'm waiting for the new Switch version. If you are a day one console buyer I guess that sucks but you know what's going to happen.

 

[tusharngf]

Sony must be working on ps5 pro at this moment how they can increase the CU and make the box smaller. 5nm is what they should be targeting who knows. Extra Raytracing performance plus 20 more CU will change everything for the machine. Wonder what they will do with ps6.

 

[kamineko]

seems inevitable

whether upgrading will be worthwhile is tbd

 

[DanielG123]

I can see it happening, what with how fast tech advances and everything, so I can definitely see a Pro PS5 and even more powerful Series X come out to maybe push 8K more, or have more advanced ray tracing.

At the same time however, we haven't yet seen just what the new hardware are truly capable of, so it's too soon to really predict anything like that. We're not getting outdated and ancient systems right out of the gate this time; whatever compromises either may have seen pretty damn tiny, so let's just enjoy them for the time being, and see what they can really do.

 

[StrappingYoungLance]

I got by on my base PS4 and never really felt the need for a pro, especially since I was rocking a 1080p TV.

The base Xbox One was pretty underpowered though and I think Xbox One X was a smart decision on Microsoft's part, delivering the strongest place to play third party games where previously they lagged behind pretty bad. I think it was a good step in rehabilitating the brand.

I absolutely expect we'll see mid gen refreshes, I think that planning is part of Microsoft's "Series" branding for Xbox.

What will be the sell for mid-gen upgrades? Better ray tracing? For the XBX and Pro, it was higher resolutions (particularly 4K) during a time when 4K TVs started to hit their stride with consumers. The PS5 and the Series X already do 4K well enough. What's missing from the PS5 and Series X that people can easily point it and requires new hardware?

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They'll be sold on things like "True 4K" (a concept that is easy to sell despite it being clear that there are alternate options that still result in an excellent picture) and raytracing without having to sacrifice frame rates, I'd imagine.

 

[Deleted member 68874]

For me it entirely depends on how these machines hold up. I cant even imagine playing on the base Xbox One for the past couple of years.

 

[Calvin]

I think if you are looking at what Microsoft is doing as mid-gen refreshes from this point forward, you are completely misunderstanding their strategy. There will absolutely be another XBox in 2-3 years. It may be more powerful, it may be less - but there will be a refresh. Microsoft has made it clear they want Xboxs to be like phones, iterated on whenever possible as a primary platform to drive their ecosystem. If you want to upgrade, there will be an option. If you want to play on PC, more power to you. If you want to spend less money but stream games - there will be an option.

I don't think Sony has any intention of going this route and will not until they start making much more money from PC ports (or start releasing them day and date to measure the economic impact). Regardless - I would also guess a PS5 PRO comes out in 3ish years. If it does not, that would strongly suggest to me that Sony intends on a much shorter generational lifecycle, likely moving to a full PS6 by 2025.

 

[exodus]

Xbox is done with generations. We might see a series X2/X3 or whatever down the road. But otherwise I think these systems have reached their peak in terms of features and architecture.

I'd wager the same for PS5 but that's less of a sure thing.

Die shrinks are also happening far less often now, and they're less substantial. 5nm likely won't be enough for anything but a very incremental bump. I don't think it would offer enough for a full mid gen refresh, but if 120Hz and VRRtake off, it could prove beneficial to promise higher than 60fps.

 

[Rocky Road]

I hope they do a mid-gen upgrade because I basically refuse to get a PS5 until then. Unless they turn that large brick into something that can actually fit around my TV area I won't be getting one and if they don't within the next three years I'll just get an Xbox.

 

[DarrenM]

People say they won't upgrade, but just wait for a big title to come out in three years and people will want to play the best possible version.

 

[ninnanuam]

The last few generations have gone on far too long. The half steps were a good compromise between progress and cost effectiveness.

 

[shadowsdarknes]

Another point of note is that these mid gen refreshes began to offer graphical settings in games that we largely did not see prior to these consoles.

We got higher native resolutions and higher frame rates and many games were left uncapped. Now the backward compatibility experience is greatly enhanced because of this.

It's not clear how this gen will pan out. But a mid gen refresh may continue to open up graphical options that greatly enhance the longevity and preservation of games.

 

[Jibbajabbawockky]

Eh, I like my PS4 Pro. But then again, I say that as someone who never bought a base PS4, so getting a PS4 Pro in late 2017 was basically me just getting a PS4 to play old PS3 and PS4 games I hadn't been able to play on PC like Last of Us Remastered, Bloodborne, Horizon, Uncharted and so on. Good deal at the time.

Since I have a newish PC and Gamepass, I don't feel compelled to get an Xbox. And PS5 right now at launch doesn't have anything too terribly interesting that I can't just wait another couple years for a hopefully smaller iteration for a PS5 Pro. And maybe by then they'll have the new God of War and some other exclusives out.

 

[CanUKlehead]

I went from base one to One X, never bothered refreshing PS4. This time around, if I get a console in the next year, it'll be the S, then wait for the refresh of the X.

PS5 I'm already resigned to skipping base and getting the Pro.

Holding back on getting the consoles now is really helped by not being interested in any of the exclusive games they offer, and Game Pass has kept me busy, and the pandemic making job security wobbly.

 

[i hate cheaters]

i hope they don't need them this time

last gen was different because the launch ps4 & xb1 were some of the most outdated consoles ever made. you had everyone buying 1080p displays for over a decade and then the machines couldn't even run normal games at that resolution

the same thing will be true for 4K this gen, but most people aren't sitting close enough to 4K displays to really need that as a native res. they can offer upgraded devices that do it, but i don't think the launch consoles will be useless this time around

 

[RowdyReverb]

My plan is to upgrade every 3 years and switch sides each time, so Xbox One X > PS5 > Xbox Series X2 > PS6, etc.
Mid-gen refresh seems like a great opportunity to catch up on the other ecosystem's exclusives while keeping cutting edge for third parties

 

[Wubby]

Imagine if they had yearly refreshes like phones.

 

[Bunzy]

Sony and Microsoft both had successful Mid gen refreshes that kept their brands energized and made money. It 100 percent is happening again. Companies like to make money on sure fire things, this is one of them.

I'd like to also throw my prediction for ps5 pro- 3nm 72Cu gpu set up just like the ps4 pro was to the ps4.

 

[blitzblake]

Just by the sheer underpowered pos the Xbox one/s were, I feel like the one x was more needed. But I definitely got my money out of my PS4 pro and my 4k oled.

 

[Dead Man Typing]

I think they'll have a tough time getting people to buy in.

Developers don't want to make an Xbox Series S, Series X, Series XL, Series XXL, PS5, PS5pro and PS5 propro versions of games.

There's a limit. Last time, the consoles weren't equipped to deal with 4k. I dont see 8k being a big deal, even in 3 years time. Justifying a mid gen refresh will be really difficult this time.

 

[Deleted member 36708]

I hope there isn't anything like that this time around.

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Me too it's silly.

 

[LordBlodgett]

I purchased both, mostly because I wanted to take advantage of my new 4k TV in 2017. I do think both were needed, as the PS4 and Xbox One were underpowered from the get go. I do have to echo other users here though, the One X is one of the top consoles I have ever owned in terms of design, sound, and the upgrade it brought. The PS4 Pro was okay, but it wasn't nearly a big enough leap graphically, and mine has become insanely noisy so I don't appreciate it quite as much.

This gen both Sony and Microsoft went for pretty cutting edge hardware, so I can't see a mid gen refresh being needed as much. On the other hand, since Microsoft is taking the PC lite approach, I could see it happening anyway as soon as Graphics cards have seen major improvements

 

[JoJoBae]

The circumstances surrounding this console generation (PS5, XSX) is much different than the previous generation. I feel like PS5 and XSX are more similar to the PS3 and 360 in that they are adequately spec'd to deliver a good experience for the entire generation without the need for high-end models like the PS4 Pro. I absolutely expect multiple refreshes to improve the design and add small things here and there but I think the likelihood of a high-end model like a PS5 Pro and Xbox Series X+ is very very slim.

Click to shrink...

I feel like with the way hardware has been, these systems will actually hold up better than the 360 and PS3 did. We won't have the big hardware shift this time to where these systems are horribly outdated by generation's end I don't think.

 

[nihilence]

Revision, yes.
Refresh, probably. But the hardware isn't weak mobile shit this time.

 

[Fabtacular]

Harder to tell with Sony, but my guess with Microsoft is that from here on out they'll just iterate on their current consoles as quickly as the technology allows.

I think that as soon as die shrinks and what not allow them to get the current X down to $300, they'll release it as the S2. And simultaneously, they'll launch a new $500 X2. And then that cycle will repeat over and over.

 

[Mister_X]

I think Microsoft already mentioned that they are doing. I have to look for the article but I think it was pretty recent when it was mentioned. I would assume Sony will do it too.

 

[Twister]

Got a PS4 Pro and I completely regret it. It didn't offer me anything noticable over my old PS4 and was just louder and larger, making it way more annoying. Constantly regret buying it and will not be purchasing anymore "Pro" versions of any console other than the Switch if that happens, as it is my main platform. I don't really care if they release a PS5 Pro or not, the option would be nice for those who want it, but I will never fall for this again.

 

[Nintendo]

I'd love it for better ray tracing capabilities alone. RT tech should be much more mature in 3 years.

 

[Deleted member 11008]

Both PS5 and Series are pretty powerful. I think they will have smaller/cheaper models in a few years.

 

[Linus815]

The circumstances surrounding this console generation (PS5, XSX) is much different than the previous generation. I feel like PS5 and XSX are more similar to the PS3 and 360 in that they are adequately spec'd to deliver a good experience for the entire generation without the need for high-end models like the PS4 Pro. I absolutely expect multiple refreshes to improve the design and add small things here and there but I think the likelihood of a high-end model like a PS5 Pro and Xbox Series X+ is very very slim.

Click to shrink...

you are misremembering last gen then because the last few years of the 7th gen was pretty awful in terms of framerate and resolution. So many games ran below 720p and struggled to maintain 30 fps. I remember playing far cry 3 on ps3 and then on PC and thinking it's basically a generation apart. And it was, the gap between consoles and pc was absolutely enormous in the early 2010's, where even a budget build could offer a NOTICABLY better experience than consoles offered.

While the base XB1 definitely isnt holding up well anymore, with quite a few games running poorly and having awful IQ, the PS4 held rather well, much better than the PS3 did.


Also, ray tracing is going to demand as much power possible, there is easily room for mid gen refreshes.

 

[FusionNY]

I was pretty happy with the jump form PS4 to the 1X. I'm down for another mid gen refresh if they're worth it.

 

[Phendrana]

Aren't Sony and Microsoft taking pretty substantial losses on each of the new consoles sold?

They sure as shit aren't doing that for a Pro console. I think it would be way too late in the generation for the right balance of power and price to be feasible this time.

 

[azfaru]

I skipped the PS4 Pro cos I got my OG PS4 like pretty late in the generation, maybe like a year or two after launch.

Was actually wondering today if it's a good idea to just wait it out for the eventual PS5 Pro. Been meaning to upgrade my PC with the latest graphics card, so that'll tide me over and play non-exclusive games. Then I'll get the PS5 Pro to play all the Sony exclusives I've missed.

 

[Wet Jimmy]

I hope there's another mid-gen refresh. An incremental beef upgrade is fine with me - a few more frames, a few more sparkles, a revised chassis, it's all goodness.

Bring it on.

 

[Paper Wario]

I was initially very lukewarm on the mid-gen refreshes but I eventually caved for a One X when RDR2 released a year later. Totally worth it and I am definitely down for another one this gen as long as it's substantial enough.

 

[Parcas]

based on xbox strategy of already having two very different next gen updates i am sure we will get some refresh in 4 years or so. It worked well and to be honest i love they do it.

 

[Zeal543]

definitely needed, generations used to be ~5 years long, now they're about 7 years. A mid gen refresh is greatly appreciated, the last few years of gen 7 were painful.

 

[Black Mantis]

I loved the 1X. Games like Gears 5, FH4, RDR2, and the various X-enhanced BC titles really made it worthwhile. I don't see either company doing the same this new-gen though, as I think their respective successors will be out in 5 years, especially Xbox.

 

[TheMadTitan]

Consoles can't swap out a GPU mid cycle, so it makes sense. This current gen is likely on track to end in 2028; seven years is a long ass time without an update.

They're going to do hardware revisions with spec bumps. Or the gen will be artificially short with a PS6 and Xbox Continuity X taking over in 2024.

 

[J2C]

Seems to appease graphic nerds, while allowing the normies to still have console generations. Im excited about the PS5 leap, and backwards compatibility improved performance for so many titles.