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Oct 26, 2017
3,919
Having a good time with it so far, but I have two negatives:

1) This game doesn't lend itself to putting it down and coming back to it after a day or two. I've had a pretty busy week, so I've only managed to get hour-long play sessions in every now and again. Whilst the save points are numerous and easy to reach (which is great), I'm finding that it's incredibly difficult to remember exactly what I was doing or where I was going when I load up my save.

The chat history isn't particularly useful, and I find that the map is decidedly unhelpful. Although you can highlight certain icons, such as a powerup-blocked door (which can be helpful to show you your options), in order to do this you need to actively find one of the icons on the map. This can be rather tricky when you've already eliminated all but one of those blocking doors. It would be nice if there was just a list/index of icon types that you could sift through.

2) Those god-damn Metroid blocks. You know the ones. The ones that just look like normal terrain but can be destroyed/reveal a different type of block underneath. I hate these things so much because the signposting is all over the place. Sometimes there's a little growth which makes it an obvious point of interest, sometimes there'll be the glimpse of another room on the other side which gives another hit, but conversely sometimes you see a glimpse of another room and there arent any destructible blocks in the area. And then some of them you need to seem to have to hit with missiles whereas others can just be destroyed with the beam (I think thats only beam blocks). It's just such a pain. I know its a staple but they're just not good. I don't feel "clever" when I discover them because the progression is normally just "Reach dead end -> shoot every wall". Its not a puzzle, its just brute-force. I hope in the next Metroid game they find a way to make these more palatable.
 

Martinski

Member
Jan 15, 2019
8,424
Göteborg
That Chozo bot fight right after the long cutscene on Ferenia is straight bullshit. Why are like all fights in this game frustrating shit? You literally can't dodge the lunge attack and it can even hit you even if you are on a platform above it, straight shit. And it comes out in 0.000000000000000000000000000000000000005 seconds.
 

Fliesen

Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,254
As I realized what the game was doing pretty early on, I mostly gave up on going too out of the way, and just saved a lot of that for the end. At least Dread is kind enough to offer some pretty sick sequence breaks for those who do decide to pick away at their own path anyway.

Yup, the EMMIs (and some of the more obvious limitations with regards to survivability - i.e. hot and cold zones) are a great way of signposting "do the cleanup later" to the player.
Like, what's the most you'll be getting out of knocking your head against the wall and passing through a non-pacified EMMI zone multiple times ... 2 extra missiles? woop-dee-fucking-doo
 

FrakEarth

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,277
Liverpool, UK
That Chozo bot fight right after the long cutscene on Ferenia is straight bullshit. Why are like all fights in this game frustrating shit? You literally can't dodge the lunge attack and it can even hit you even if you are on a platform above it, straight shit. And it comes out in 0.000000000000000000000000000000000000005 seconds.
Have you tried air flashing? I just jump and flash across to their rear when they do the strong attack... Staying off the ground when needed and keeping distance using flash step got me through those fights just fine. There's one a little later where I did need to use another upgrade though storm missiles. Evade and keep hold of R to lock on. When you get to that fight you'll know what I mean.
 

MekaDragon

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
183
I loved the game, one of the best Metroids imho. It has really good gameplay, graphics, level design, sound design... but am I the only one utterly let down by the soundtrack? It's super forgettable. The only two good musics are from past games and only plays in cutscenes lol.
 

Tailesque

Member
Sep 28, 2021
1,206
Chicago
I loved the game, one of the best Metroids imho. It has really good gameplay, graphics, level design, sound design... but am I the only one utterly let down by the soundtrack? It's super forgettable. The only two good musics are from past games and only plays in cutscenes lol.

Nah don't worry, that's a pretty commonly held criticism. There are some ambient tracks that are admittedly pretty nice (Burenia depths comes to mind), but otherwise almost nothing sticks. And yeah, the older tracks used in cutscenes kind of hurt in a game with nothing as notable to boast itself.
 

VariantX

Member
Oct 25, 2017
16,890
Columbia, SC
That Chozo bot fight right after the long cutscene on Ferenia is straight bullshit. Why are like all fights in this game frustrating shit? You literally can't dodge the lunge attack and it can even hit you even if you are on a platform above it, straight shit. And it comes out in 0.000000000000000000000000000000000000005 seconds.

The timing on the big scrape attack is not consistent. Sometimes is near instant, others it's a long windup before it rushes in to scrape sparks everywhere. Theres at least 3 different versions of it. Same goes for the shots. Some times it fires three shots quickly an others it will stagger the shots. Best thing to do is try to maintain a consistent distance from it to give yourself time to see what it's doing and react accordingly all while constantly pelting it with missiles
 

Necromanti

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,550
Have you tried air flashing? I just jump and flash across to their rear when they do the strong attack...
I think that's the only way to do it, to be honest. Mainly because of the hitbox of the sparks.

But yeah, it's definitely overwhelming until you can recognize the tells.

Having a good time with it so far, but I have two negatives:

1) This game doesn't lend itself to putting it down and coming back to it after a day or two.
The chat history isn't particularly useful, and I find that the map is decidedly unhelpful.

2) Those god-damn Metroid blocks. You know the ones. The ones that just look like normal terrain but can be destroyed/reveal a different type of block underneath. Its not a puzzle, its just brute-force. I hope in the next Metroid game they find a way to make these more palatable.
That's a shame about point #1, because I actually found it pretty helpful to remind myself of my goal or go through ADAM's advice. It's a QoL feature I've definitely wanted in other Metroidvanias.

But anyway, without going into too much detail, your second issue should get addressed and become less frustrating later on in the game.
 
Oct 26, 2017
3,919
That's a shame about point #1, because I actually found it pretty helpful to remind myself of my goal or go through ADAM's advice. It's a QoL feature I've definitely wanted in other Metroidvanias.

I guess its more of a "I know I need to get to X, but I don't remember which avenues I've already explored".

To put it into context, I spent about 30-40 minutes dicking around last night because I had been to the room I needed to go to in order to progress, but I hadn't noticed the powerup-blocking element within it. So when I looked at my map on the subsequent load, I just had what appeared to be a "fully explored" (for my current region) map with no real indication of which room I should visit next. It wasn't like I could see the "Here's a door that you haven't gone through".

Good to hear about point two though
 

Creamium

Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,701
Belgium
This game is bad for my sleep. I could only start playing around 10 pm yesterday and I had to force myself to quit at 2.30 AM. I can't let go of the game, especially after the friendly Chozo/X got added to the mix and now I'm just itching to see how it all continues. I ended with the cluster/seeker missiles, the end of the EMMI is near

I wasted so much time doing one speed boost puzzle and then later saw after posting it on twitter that you could get to it easier from another side. Oh well, it was satisfying to finally get it
 

Necromanti

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,550
I guess its more of a "I know I need to get to X, but I don't remember which avenues I've already explored".

To put it into context, I spent about 30-40 minutes dicking around last night because I had been to the room I needed to go to in order to progress, but I hadn't noticed the powerup-blocking element within it. So when I looked at my map on the subsequent load, I just had what appeared to be a "fully explored" (for my current region) map with no real indication of which room I should visit next. It wasn't like I could see the "Here's a door that you haven't gone through".
The fact that discovered blocks stay on the map has been a huge improvement, but it definitely doesn't help if you haven't even found them. It's an interesting problem. I wonder if they could have had ADAM give hints on repeat visits. Or some sort of way to show on the map your last path (a la BotW) or a heatmap overlay on the map to show where you've spent the least time.

But yeah, both your issues are probably connected, so I'm definitely curious about how things go later on.
 

Neiteio

Member
Oct 25, 2017
24,137
This game is bad for my sleep. I could only start playing around 10 pm yesterday and I had to force myself to quit at 2.30 AM. I can't let go of the game, especially after the friendly Chozo/X got added to the mix and now I'm just itching to see how it all continues. I ended with the cluster/seeker missiles, the end of the EMMI is near

I wasted so much time doing one speed boost puzzle and then later saw after posting it on twitter that you could get to it easier from another side. Oh well, it was satisfying to finally get it
The only streamer I watch is Maximilian Dood, and it's funny how much this game has screwed up his schedule. He has stayed up past 6 a.m. in his timezone multiple nights now, getting 100% and clearing Hard Mode. It's his GOTY tied with Returnal. When he first hit the credits he gushed for 26 minutes straight, lol. It's heartwarming to see.
 

dean_rcg

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,270
1) This game doesn't lend itself to putting it down and coming back to it after a day or two. I've had a pretty busy week, so I've only managed to get hour-long play sessions in every now and again. Whilst the save points are numerous and easy to reach (which is great), I'm finding that it's incredibly difficult to remember exactly what I was doing or where I was going when I load up my save.

I'm in a similar position so I always leave Samus facing the door I want to go through next and try leave a marker for the destination.
 

Maculo

Member
Oct 27, 2017
320
Madrid, Spain
I know this happens with probably every game that is universally well received but...Why do the people that do not like them usually voice their opinions in a way that sounds like 'you peasants do not know what a good game is even if I spelt it out to you...'?

'This game has really bad design'
'The art is awful and sterile'
'Gameplay is boring and repetitive'
...

You can read this kind of comments every few pages in this thread and it really puzzles me. ¿Are the people that are really enjoying the game and putting it on top of their GOTY really getting all wrong?
 

Mark1

Member
Oct 30, 2017
2,006
Not finished the story yet but really enjoying what I've played so far. Got the controls nailed down and Samus now feels like a joy to move with.

Can't believe Mercury Stream managed to pull off a successful Super/Fusion hybrid here.

This game really does not hold your hand in any obvious way at all.

This may be my GOTY for 2021.
 

Fendajaz

Banned
Oct 29, 2017
2,123
Just finished the game at around 9hrs 38min. Only picked up like 36% of items or some shit. Need to go back and get them all.
Have no idea how to get some of these items, theres one where you need to use speedboost but not enough room to activate it
 

Neiteio

Member
Oct 25, 2017
24,137
Just finished the game at around 9hrs 38min. Only picked up like 36% of items or some shit. Need to go back and get them all.
Have no idea how to get some of these items, theres one where you need to use speedboost but not enough room to activate it
You can carry a speed boost charge from another room, and you retain the speed boost or shinespark charge while wall-jumping and sliding. So look for a runway in nearby rooms.
 
Oct 26, 2017
3,919
The fact that discovered blocks stay on the map has been a huge improvement, but it definitely doesn't help if you haven't even found them. It's an interesting problem. I wonder if they could have had ADAM give hints on repeat visits. Or some sort of way to show on the map your last path (a la BotW) or a heatmap overlay on the map to show where you've spent the least time.

But yeah, both your issues are probably connected, so I'm definitely curious about how things go later on.

I think what would help a good deal would be something akin to "You're in the right region". I found myself travelling back and forth between the first three areas several times because I really didn't know which one was the one I should be making progress in.

This wasn't helped by the fact that we had to progress to the third area in order to "finish" the second one. (Note: By finish I mean destroy the Emmi). I got stuck after getting the Charge beam, and since the Game had established that I may have to leave an area before completing it I wasn't sure if I now had to kill the Second Emmi, or progress further into the third area, or even go back to the first one.

I appreciate that the game is difficult, and isn't just giving me waypoints that I don't even need to think about, but I feel like there should be some indication of the general area you should be focusing on. Sometimes they do this by physically locking you in a particular sub-area or subset of rooms, but yea, in that scenario it was a bit of a slog. I had to look up a guide in the end, and it turns out I just hadn't seen the door in the bottom corner of a new room I had opened up. Really frustrating.
 

Necromanti

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,550
You can read this kind of comments every few pages in this thread and it really puzzles me. ¿Are the people that are really enjoying the game and putting it on top of their GOTY really getting all wrong?
How much someone enjoyed a game definitely biases or colors how they view each respective element of it, for better or worse. People are often bad at precise critiques. I don't think either side is inherently more right or wrong than the other outside of communicating their feelings broadly.

The strangest complaint for me was one that said missiles were useless, though, since I used them the most.
 

Mark1

Member
Oct 30, 2017
2,006
How much someone enjoyed a game definitely biases or colors how they view each respective element of it, for better or worse. People are often bad at precise critiques. I don't think either side is inherently more right or wrong than the other outside of communicating their feelings broadly.

The strangest complaint for me was one that said missiles were useless, though, since I used them the most.
I think this game makes the best use of missiles 😂

More often than not I run out of missiles in the later boss fights 😂

It gives you even more of an incentive to go around and find more around the world map 🤷‍♂️
 

Martinski

Member
Jan 15, 2019
8,424
Göteborg
Another Chozo bot fight... this makes me want to rage quit this game. There's literally nothing that makes those fights fun or engaging.. they're just frustrating and boring to fight.
 

Red

Member
Oct 26, 2017
11,701
Another Chozo bot fight... this makes me want to rage quit this game. There's literally nothing that makes those fights fun or engaging.. they're just frustrating and boring to fight.
How many have you done so far? Because there are like 10 of these things. Sometimes you fight
more than one at a time
 

Martinski

Member
Jan 15, 2019
8,424
Göteborg
How many have you done so far? Because there are like 10 of these things.

1 and now another in a greener area. If there's 10 of these shitty fights i am dropping this game. It's controller throwing inducing honestly. They're the type of rage inducing enemey similar to Marauders in Doom Eternal and so on that are just irritating, boring and frustrating to fight. As you need to be nimble and dodge 4000 attacks while shooting it with 50 rockets.. is it fun? Noppe.
 

Red

Member
Oct 26, 2017
11,701
1 and now another in a greener area. If there's 10 of these shitty fights i am dropping this game. It's controller throwing inducing honestly. They're the type of rage inducing enemey similar to Marauders in Doom Eternal and so on that are just irritating, boring and frustrating to fight.
There are other, similar bosses I'm including in the count. But those ones specifically, I can think of at least 4 off hand 🤔

Honestly if the one-off bots are giving you this much trouble, you are going to have a bad time with the bosses coming up.
 

Maculo

Member
Oct 27, 2017
320
Madrid, Spain
How much someone enjoyed a game definitely biases or colors how they view each respective element of it, for better or worse. People are often bad at precise critiques. I don't think either side is inherently more right or wrong than the other outside of communicating their feelings broadly.

The strangest complaint for me was one that said missiles were useless, though, since I used them the most.
You can never have too many missiles lol

Anyway, I'm guilty of not knowing how to communicate my opinion correctly, I'm not that good with words. But saying categorically "the game has bad design" (when the majority is praising it) instead of saying "I'm not liking the game design or I prefer the game design of 'insert game' (for whatever legitimate reason)" just 'baffles' me a little bit ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
 

giapel

Member
Oct 28, 2017
4,600
Ok, I've played enough now to make this statement. I don't like that ZL brings the morph ball when static. I would 100% prefer a slide in the direction Samus is facing. Is there any shinespark acrobatics that require this mapping?
 

giapel

Member
Oct 28, 2017
4,600
1 and now another in a greener area. If there's 10 of these shitty fights i am dropping this game. It's controller throwing inducing honestly. They're the type of rage inducing enemey similar to Marauders in Doom Eternal and so on that are just irritating, boring and frustrating to fight. As you need to be nimble and dodge 4000 attacks while shooting it with 50 rockets.. is it fun? Noppe.
These are what I consider filler content and could easily been culled or skipped. If you've run out of time creating mini bosses then maybe just skip them. The game has enough content already.
Having said that, the game give you enough mobility options to basically run circles around them and a single counter can refill half your energy anyway.
 
Oct 26, 2017
4,897
User Warned: Antagonizing Fellow Member
That Chozo bot fight right after the long cutscene on Ferenia is straight bullshit. Why are like all fights in this game frustrating shit? You literally can't dodge the lunge attack and it can even hit you even if you are on a platform above it, straight shit. And it comes out in 0.000000000000000000000000000000000000005 seconds.
1 and now another in a greener area. If there's 10 of these shitty fights i am dropping this game. It's controller throwing inducing honestly. They're the type of rage inducing enemey similar to Marauders in Doom Eternal and so on that are just irritating, boring and frustrating to fight. As you need to be nimble and dodge 4000 attacks while shooting it with 50 rockets.. is it fun? Noppe.
I mean the game is deffo not designed for lil babies throwing controllers - so yeah maybe drop it? The enemies do require you to behave differently to others, because you need to be proactive w/ positioning - which is usually the reason we see "omg this Is bullshit posts!!" with similar enemies in other games.
 

Spring-Loaded

Member
Oct 27, 2017
19,904
The EMMI zones are welcome skill checks on traversal in my experience. This game has the best core traversal mechanics and controls of any Metroid, and these parts are great for pushing those abilities to their limits while still being small enough w/close checkpoints to keep them from getting frustrating.

By the end of most metroidvanias, you get to be so powerful it trivialises most enemies, so it's nice to still feel vulnerable at times.

If you don't like it that's fine, but laying out a statement like this isn't it either. Those games are just different from the tight level design Metroid offers

In a way, they're right that Metroid is a relic though …

it's the Rosetta Stone for all games in the genre!

Does the game not save when you reach a new area? I had started the third area so I assumed it must have saved when I entered and I closed the game to finish something else. Now I'm returning to the game and I'm back in a save room in the second area, with 4% of items discovered even though my save file says 6%…

The game displays overall percent completion on save select screen, and then it shows percentage for each of the game. That might be the difference you're seeing.

The chat history isn't particularly useful, and I find that the map is decidedly unhelpful. Although you can highlight certain icons, such as a powerup-blocked door (which can be helpful to show you your options), in order to do this you need to actively find one of the icons on the map. This can be rather tricky when you've already eliminated all but one of those blocking doors. It would be nice if there was just a list/index of icon types that you could sift through.
While the feature isn't perfect, you can still highlight objects/doors/blocks even after they've been opened or destroyed, and once you select "highlight all" you can see all of them, with the unlocked/unbroken ones bracketed in yellow.

a list of all icons you can flit through would be a really nice addition though.
 
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Br3wnor

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
4,982
Is the game 8 hours long like How Long to Beat says? Just weighing in if I can afford it at the moment.

Ive heard in the 7-10 hour range is pretty common but the clock doesn't count restarts apparently and I die a lot so it's gonna be longer than that, I think it's absolutely worth $60 in terms of value
 

Berordn

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 26, 2017
9,746
NoVA
Is the game 8 hours long like How Long to Beat says? Just weighing in if I can afford it at the moment.
if all you're doing is beating the final boss, 8 hours seems to be where people clock their first playthrough. getting 100% items can add a few hours onto that though, and there's a hard mode and some speedrun incentives
 

Spring-Loaded

Member
Oct 27, 2017
19,904
Is the game 8 hours long like How Long to Beat says? Just weighing in if I can afford it at the moment.

I'm generally seeing 8-14 hours for peoples' first run. The game doesn't record time between checkpoints and game overs, and it doesn't count when looking at the map, so the time displayed is usually a low estimate.

I finished with %100 at ~13-14 hours, but I easily spent 1.5x that time playing.
 

Anteo

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,099
Anyone have an idea - I went through the right door after coming out of the green teleportal and then did a Shinespark puzzle to get a Missile+ pick up. Now I'm stuck at the bottom right area of Burenia with seemingly no way to get back.

Reading online, all the walk walkthroughs said I should have gone left to get the
Gravity Suit.

Congrats, you figured out almost all of the steps for early gravity suit by yourself. Thats why guides do not work for you, you are performing a sequence break. Instead if you want a visual guide go to youtube and search for "early gravity suit"

The thing you were missing was after picking up the missile expansion and going through the wall, you needed to go up to destroy the top of that room using charge shoots and the grapple which in turn destroys the bottom of the room and unlocks the path to the gravity suit.
 

SunBroDave

Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,162
Is the game 8 hours long like How Long to Beat says? Just weighing in if I can afford it at the moment.
Most people that have been sharing their total playtime have been using the number that the game shows you when you hit credits, but that timer doesn't include time lost due to deaths. As a result, most people are reporting beating the game in 7-9 hours, but if they're anything like me, there will have been a lot of extra time spent dying against bosses. Like, even a couple hours spent just fighting the last boss.

I'd expect the playtime to be somewhere between 10-25 hours total, depending on how much optional content you do.
 

Neiteio

Member
Oct 25, 2017
24,137
My in-game clock for 100% said 13 hours, but that clearly wasn't counting the 2,000 times I got Game Over, lol
 

Spring-Loaded

Member
Oct 27, 2017
19,904
Congrats, you figured out almost all of the steps for early gravity suit by yourself. Thats why guides do not work for you, you are performing a sequence break. Instead if you want a visual guide go to youtube and search for "early gravity suit"

The thing you were missing was after picking up the missile expansion and going through the wall, you needed to go up to destroy the top of that room using charge shoots and the grapple which in turn destroys the bottom of the room and unlocks the path to the gravity suit.

That's right—I forgot about that part.
 

Neiteio

Member
Oct 25, 2017
24,137
1 and now another in a greener area. If there's 10 of these shitty fights i am dropping this game. It's controller throwing inducing honestly. They're the type of rage inducing enemey similar to Marauders in Doom Eternal and so on that are just irritating, boring and frustrating to fight. As you need to be nimble and dodge 4000 attacks while shooting it with 50 rockets.. is it fun? Noppe.
They chase you from platform to platform, right? And they have to land before they can begin to attack. So just dash over them from one platform to the other, and shoot missiles when you land -- your missiles will then hit them as *they* land. They won't even be able to touch you doing this.

As for future ones, you will have new abilities that chew through them.
 
Oct 26, 2017
3,919
While the feature isn't perfect, you can still highlight objects/doors/blocks even after they've been opened or destroyed, and once you select "highlight all" you can see all of them, with the unlocked/unbroken ones bracketed in yellow.

a list of all icons you can flit through would be a really nice addition though.

Yea, thats what I've done a few times, problem is once they've been opened it becomes very hard to actually find them again via the map
 

Spring-Loaded

Member
Oct 27, 2017
19,904
OP
OP
Kindekuma

Kindekuma

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
4,732
I'm gonna try again for a sub 4 hour run. Might have to look into sequence breaks so I can keep the time down. Like bombs before Kraid and perhaps early screw attack and super missiles.