• Ever wanted an RSS feed of all your favorite gaming news sites? Go check out our new Gaming Headlines feed! Read more about it here.
  • We have made minor adjustments to how the search bar works on ResetEra. You can read about the changes here.

Ithil

Member
Oct 25, 2017
23,392
Do you not understand what she's saying?

Trump is the con artist parasite that has invaded the White House and is wreaking havoc. That's why he should relate.
"Wreaking havoc" like... cleaning the house, tutoring the children and chauffeuring? Their great con was to become domestic servants, subservient to the Park family and still looked down upon. To compare this to Trump is to tell me either Dowd never watched the movie, or watched it through the most Wall Street eyes possible.
 

Nif

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
1,716
"Wreaking havoc" like... cleaning the house, tutoring the children and chauffeuring? Their great con was to become domestic servants, subservient to the Park family and still looked down upon. To compare this to Trump is to tell me either Dowd never watched the movie, or watched it through the most Wall Street eyes possible.

I mean...

they poison someone, tie her and her husband up in the basement, and eventually kill her.
 

Bjomesphat

Member
Nov 5, 2017
1,821
The whole thesis of the article is so innocuous. Are some of you being willfully obtuse or do you think the author's intention was actually to make a comment on the film?

Trump rambled about movies and Parasite, she then used the plot of the film to make a dig against Trump, while serving as a springboard to talk about Trump as a conman and the chaos he brings.
 

Rehynn

Banned
Feb 14, 2018
737
Wow, people completely misinterpreting a piece because it's in the NYT and they apply prejudice before they do reason?
I wonder where I've seen this before.

I mean...

they poison someone, tie her and her husband up in the basement, and eventually kill her.

They also
get the innocent driver fired so that the dad can take his place.
 

Crocodilelogic

Attempted to circumvent ban with an alt account
Banned
Oct 29, 2017
728
The whole thesis of the article is so innocuous. Are some of you being willfully obtuse or do you think the author's intention was actually to make a comment on the film?

Trump rambled about movies and Parasite, she then used the plot of the film to make a dig against Trump, while serving as a springboard to talk about Trump as a conman and the chaos he brings.

authors a centrist so by default they have awful intentions and are terrible people according to many here.

It's just the cool thing to hate centrist dems not that I disagree ( before y'all attack me) but this site is bordering self parody these days.
 

Aureon

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
2,819
Me implying some of us can be born likely to be evil does not imply that surround society and environment don't also play a roll dude.

This all stemmed from me quoting someone saying "people aren't inherently evil" which I say is false. Some of us are.
Evil is a post-hoc analysis of a culture-affected behavior, in both action and analysis.
The people classified "more likely to be evil" (eg. predisposition to narcisism, low empathy, etc) are as such because they're grown and judged in the current system - operate a different system, and it may be a different set of people.

In general, the main reason people are dogpiling you is because you're entering a thread about a movie which has a main theme "It's not people who are evil, it's the roles and pressures capitalism forces unto them that creates unnecessary pain and suffering" and going "but it's people who are predisposed to evil!"
 

Orb

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
9,465
USA
I mean it is literally about that though. Like, I understand that there are deeper levels to the movie. But saying "yOu DiDn'T gEt It!!!!!" is kinda pedantic.
 

Deleted member 1476

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
10,449
Just be quiet and subservient and you will be one of the good ones™ is a take I should've expected would happen when opening this thread.

Some of y'all showing your asses as usual.
 

Border

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
14,859
"Wreaking havoc" like... cleaning the house, tutoring the children and chauffeuring? Their great con was to become domestic servants, subservient to the Park family and still looked down upon. To compare this to Trump is to tell me either Dowd never watched the movie, or watched it through the most Wall Street eyes possible.
I think the havoc would be more stuff like the people they get wrongfully fired, the underage girl that is taken advantage of sexually, the woman they killed.....maybe the part where the dad stabs the head of the household.

It's kind of funny how people are so strangely willing to excuse so much of their wrongdoing.

"They're just doing what they have to do to survive!"
"In order to survive, did they have to throw a party in their employer's house while he was out of town?"
"They're allowed to have some luxury!"
 

Heromanz

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
20,202
Hi
Nope.

Ya'll get rid of capitalism and everything will be a ok.

No more bad actors.

No more bad people.

No more bad morals.

giphy.gif
Due to capitalism and severe class system inequality it causes that is what the movie is about. Like the family does all that shit just to get a jobs that pays them like shit.
 

Deleted member 38573

User requested account closure
Banned
Jan 17, 2018
3,902
The title and "This movie is a great Rorschach test to see interpretations from out of touch rich people" suggest otherwise.

Ehhh. It turned out to be a good thread. NYT article isn't bad. I can't believe I made an account to read it tho, I had my knives out from the thread title.

Genuinely didn't think the director was trying to push an idealist message that "regardless of the system, people are inherently shit". Even if that's such a stunningly wrong take it's interesting to see
 

Blader

Member
Oct 27, 2017
26,623
"Wreaking havoc" like... cleaning the house, tutoring the children and chauffeuring? Their great con was to become domestic servants, subservient to the Park family and still looked down upon. To compare this to Trump is to tell me either Dowd never watched the movie, or watched it through the most Wall Street eyes possible.
I mean,
Kim murders Park because he was a dick who looked down on him.

Of course the film is about the class and systemic pressures that squeeze have-nots like the Parks into desperate situations, where they're more pitted against each other in tripping over themselves to win favor from rich people and move up the ladder in a way that is otherwise completely unattainable through 'normal' means. But that shouldn't gloss over the actual bad shit they do either! If the Kims were completely innocent it would be a less interesting story.
 

Haze

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,785
Detroit, MI
I really can't stress enough that none of this is bad faith. People are not "born to most likely be evil". Not on a gene level. People are raised up in structures that influence their morals and interactions with others. If you're born rich, you're more likely to treat the poor with disdain. If you're born white in rural Alabama, you're more likely to be racist. If you grow up in America, you're more likely to have an individualist sense of greed due to capitalist culture shoving it down your throat.

Calling it a genetic issue is ignoring the actual root cause of these problems.

White guy from Alabama here, this checks out.
 

Stinkles

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
20,459
"Wreaking havoc" like... cleaning the house, tutoring the children and chauffeuring? Their great con was to become domestic servants, subservient to the Park family and still looked down upon. To compare this to Trump is to tell me either Dowd never watched the movie, or watched it through the most Wall Street eyes possible.

Look, while Parasite is a movie about the shocking harms we do to those without the means to support themselves adequately - it doesn't shy away from the greed and venality that the broke con artist family is murderously carrying out with no regard to their hosts. In fact it goes to some lengths to show that they're amoral before they meet their hosts. Yes it's absolutely a movie that takes a turn to express how the rich family is just as greedy selfish and driven and unaware of the damage they're doing to the people who are literally under their feet.

It's not a movie about antagonists and protagonists - it's a movie about cycles of greed and despair and exploitation - a mobius strip of shit through which to squint at people's behaviors. So Dowd's pithy extract is absolutely fairly grabbing a single component of the film to point out an irony. I can guarantee you two things - Dowd is probably as hopelessly out of touch as the mom with regard to the struggles of real working people - but she is also 100% aware of the content of the movie and the not terribly subtle messages it contains.

She is in fact USING that irony and that focus on a fragment to point out the president's hypocrisy. It's a well-used rhetorical device, not her view of the movie in toto. This is also the NYT's fault in a sense, because it keeps propagating these reductive takes by proving time and time again as an institution, that it's completely out of touch with readers. But Dowd herself isn't that writ large.
 

Rookhelm

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,691
it's a literal description of the plot, not an analysis/critique of the messages of the movie. good lord
 

Rehynn

Banned
Feb 14, 2018
737
Ehhh. It turned out to be a good thread. NYT article isn't bad. I can't believe I made an account to read it tho, I had my knives out from the thread title.

Genuinely didn't think the director was trying to push an idealist message that "regardless of the system, people are inherently shit". Even if that's such a stunningly wrong take it's interesting to see

Oh, absolutely, I also appreciate that much of the thread is an in-depth discussion of the movie. Just not quite so sure about OP's intentions.
 

The Albatross

Member
Oct 25, 2017
39,046
Threads like these are usually a good le reveal magnifico for who hates free press.

Dowd's take is a mundane pointless quip about Donald Trump being a parasite on Amerca. Dowd wrote the tweet because Trump has been critical of Parasite winning an Academy Award. It's a try-hard lame quip about Donald Trump, it's not film commentary. Your favorite Twitter comedian probably has about 100 dumber jokes than this one in the last few weeks.
 

grand

Member
Oct 25, 2017
25,001
Legally nothing in the article is about Parasite besides the opening sentence: a typical essay hook. And even that one line could be interpreted both ways.

Either way, this is not a critique of Parasite or an attempt to summarize the plot. This is a rather silly premise for controversy.
 

Deleted member 8644

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 26, 2017
975
Threads like these are usually a good le reveal magnifico for who hates free press.

Dowd's take is a mundane pointless quip about Donald Trump being a parasite on Amerca. Dowd wrote the tweet because Trump has been critical of Parasite winning an Academy Award. It's a try-hard lame quip about Donald Trump, it's not film commentary. Your favorite Twitter comedian probably has about 100 dumber jokes than this one in the last few weeks.
Free press is never criticizing bad takes or really any media
 

Pendas

Member
Oct 28, 2017
4,656
My interpretation of Parasite is...

They're all Parasites. It shows how Capitalism creates a society where we all feed off each other to survive, instead of working together. The rich depend on the labor of the poor to keep their high quality of life, and the poor are forced to work for the rich because there is no other means of survival. In the end, this leads to use all consuming and literally killing each other to survive.
 

jviggy43

Banned
Oct 28, 2017
18,184
Person who works for NYT writes a kinda joke tweet about Donald Trump being a parasite, but it's kinda awkward and doesn't really land

"NYT is trash"
And this is attacking freedom of the press, how?

By your own logic the nyt writer was attacking free speech over something Trump said on twitter. I guess anyone who makes fun of his twitter account hates free speech too.
 

The Albatross

Member
Oct 25, 2017
39,046
NYT is bad and people are taking this bad take as an opportunity to remind everyone.

The New York Times is not bad. In fact, the NYT is the most reliable, most accurate, regularly published, fact-based news reporting outlet in the United States, and among the best in the world. It's not perfect, there are times when it deserves criticism and it's regularly pretty critical of itself, but the NYT should comprise one of many sources that reflect reality for any healthy-minded person.

But that's why I said threads like these are le reveal magnifico. They show people's colors who want to throw the baby out with the bathwater, get rid of free press, and ascent towards the same sort of post-fact existence that made it so easy for Republicans to nominate Donald Trump and have him hold a near 100% approval rating. The assault on truth that you see from the Right and from a smaller, though vocal, minority of the left, is what enables authoritarian power grabs. The Right has been doing this for decades, which is why it's so easy for them to nod along when someone finally comes to power and says that the NYT is the Enemy of the People, because for 10, 20, and 30 years the casually eroded the credibility that the NYT and publications like the NYT has. If there is no truth, no reflection of reality, it's just very easy to believe whatever reality the demagogue tells you to believe.
 

The Albatross

Member
Oct 25, 2017
39,046
And this is attacking freedom of the press, how?

By your own logic the nyt writer was attacking free speech over something Trump said on twitter. I guess anyone who makes fun of his twitter account hates free speech too.

I don't follow the logic that criticizing Trump's stupid tweets is an attack on free speech, or follow how "my own logic" makes that argument. That seems like as much of a stretch as Maureen Dowd's tweet.

But, I do believe that braindead hot takes about the New York Times ("NYT is trash," "NYT should retire," and other typical brainless mouth breathing broad condemnation of prominent newspapers whenever there's any sort of ... just dumb article or take by one of its writers) that are posted thoughtlessly and generally go unchallenged are part of a larger motive to break down the perceived integrity of the best American journalistic outlets, yes. The conservative right has been doing this for decades, which is why it's so easy for Donald Trump to go on Twitter and declare that the NYT is the enemy of the people, or that the Washington Post can't be trusted because it's owned by Jeff Bezos, or that any publication that writes critically of Trump is "fake news" or lying, or what have you. The Right has had an assault on truth for decades and it's given rise to a wannabe authoritarian who has taken over about 40% of American political ideology. I'm always happy to counter-balance brainless attacks on the left of the New York Times, because I don't want the same thing to happen to my political ideology in 5, 10, or 20 years.

In this community and some of the other communities I'm a part of (Reddit, Twitter, YouTube to an extent) saying "The New York Times is a good newspaper" is usually a more controversial take than "The NYT is Trash." I'm okay being that counter-weight.
 

Deleted member 6230

User-requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
6,118
Threads like these are usually a good le reveal magnifico for who hates free press.

Dowd's take is a mundane pointless quip about Donald Trump being a parasite on Amerca. Dowd wrote the tweet because Trump has been critical of Parasite winning an Academy Award. It's a try-hard lame quip about Donald Trump, it's not film commentary. Your favorite Twitter comedian probably has about 100 dumber jokes than this one in the last few weeks.
This is thread whining. The sky isn't falling because some nerds on a video game forum make a thread about a shitty NYT column.
 

Xaszatm

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
10,903
So what would one argue sociopath, narcissistic personality disorder and anti social behaviors as?

Eugenics was clearly used as a tool to argue for one's racial superiority and physical better. That is absolutey not even close to what I'm arguing.

Ok, back up, are you seriously suggesting that people with personality disorders are predisposed towards evil? Are you for real? Newsflash, tv shows and propaganda are not accurate takes on people with these personality disorders!
 

jviggy43

Banned
Oct 28, 2017
18,184
I don't follow the logic that criticizing Trump's stupid tweets is an attack on free speech, or follow how "my logic" makes that argument.

But, I do believe that braindead hot takes about the New York Times ("NYT is trash," "NYT should retire," and other typical brainless mouth breathing broad condemnation of prominent newspapers whenever there's any sort of ... just dumb article or take by one of its writers) that are posted thoughtlessly and generally go unchallenged are part of a larger motive to break down the perceived integrity of the best American journalistic outlets, yes. The conservative right has been doing this for decades, which is why it's so easy for Donald Trump to go on Twitter and declare that the NYT is the enemy of the people, or that the Washington Post can't be trusted because it's owned by Jeff Bezos, or that any publication that writes critically of Trump is "fake news" or lying, or what have you. The Right has had an assault on truth for decades and it's given rise to a wannabe authoritarian who has taken over about 40% of American political ideology. I'm always happy to counter-balance brainless attacks on the left of the New York Times, because I don't want the same thing to happen to my political ideology in 5, 10, or 20 years.

In this community and some of the other communities I'm a part of (Reddit, Twitter, YouTube to an extent) saying "The New York Times is a good newspaper" is usually a more controversial take than "The NYT is Trash." I'm okay being that counter-weight.
In both cases people are just being critical of the content of opinion. That does not indicate they are saying Trump or the NyT shouldnt have the right to express those opinions. Your logic seems to think so however but it seems its a bit inconsistent in that youre applying it freely to NyT while ignoring the very thing that started this conversation was doing that which youre accusing others of doing to them.
 

The Albatross

Member
Oct 25, 2017
39,046
This is thread whining. The sky isn't falling because some nerds on a video game forum make a thread about a shitty NYT column.

Is criticizing stupid takes thread whining? You can still make stupid threads or stupid posts if you want, I'd never want that ability taken away from you. Similar to how the OP says that Parasite is a Rorschach test for "out of touch rich people" I find posts that broadly condemn the New York Times for fairly unremarkable takes by people who work for the NYT as indications of their desire to discredit the rest of the good work the paper does ... I referred to it as "The Great Reveal." And, expectedly, defending the New York Times and other prominent American newspapers is usually more controversial in this community than discrediting them.
 
Last edited:

Deleted member 6230

User-requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
6,118
Is criticizing stupid takes thread whining? You can still make stupid threads or stupid posts if you want, I'd never want that ability taken away from you. Similar to how the OP says that Parasite is a Rorschach test for "out of touch rich people" I find posts that broadly condemn the New York Times for fairly unremarkable takes by people who work for the NYT as indications of their desire to discredit the rest of the good work the paper does.
lol you said people "hate free press"
 

excelsiorlef

Bad Praxis
Member
Oct 25, 2017
73,327
Is criticizing stupid takes thread whining? You can still make stupid threads or stupid posts if you want, I'd never want that ability taken away from you. Similar to how the OP says that Parasite is a Rorschach test for "out of touch rich people" I find posts that broadly condemn the New York Times for fairly unremarkable takes by people who work for the NYT as indications of their desire to discredit the rest of the good work the paper does ... I referred to it as "The Great Reveal." And, expectedly, defending the New York Times and other prominent American newspapers is usually more controversial in this community than discrediting them.

Does your Uncle work for the NYT or something?
 

Xaszatm

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
10,903
Is criticizing stupid takes thread whining? You can still make stupid threads or stupid posts if you want, I'd never want that ability taken away from you. Similar to how the OP says that Parasite is a Rorschach test for "out of touch rich people" I find posts that broadly condemn the New York Times for fairly unremarkable takes by people who work for the NYT as indications of their desire to discredit the rest of the good work the paper does ... I referred to it as "The Great Reveal." And, expectedly, defending the New York Times and other prominent American newspapers is usually more controversial in this community than discrediting them.

It's more "controversial" because being more critical of our news is a good things. We cannot pretend that our news structures are objective as even the framing of objective facts can have subjective biases weaved into them.
 

The Albatross

Member
Oct 25, 2017
39,046
lol you said people "hate free press"

I think there's an ascent to hating the press on the left but in a smaller degree than there is on the right. The assault on free press from the right started this way, too. Soft attacks on prominent American news media have been present on the Right for 10, 20, 30 years (longer, for sure, but a national message about it really started to emerge on the Right after rebuilding from Watergate, which itself only took down Nixon because of newspaper reproting)... It's why Fox News -- "Fair and Balanced" -- is such a powerhouse for conservatives and why Donald Trump can lie some 10,000+ times since becoming president but no conservatives care, because the outlets counting the times he lies -- The NYT, WaPo, and a few others -- "can't be trusted." Over my lifetime they went from just having "a liberal bias" (or whatever the common argument might have been in the 80s, 90s, and early 2000s), to being "The Fake News media" and "The Enemy of the People." But they wouldn't be "The Fake News Media" or "The Enemy of the People" today without those small erosions 10, 20+ years ago, every day, the small droning on that you can't trust the NYT, the NYT is bad, the NYT is trash, etc, etc, etc., they're all part of the attack on the fourth estate.

On the right, today, there is no source of truth other than what comes out of Trump's mouth. And in threads where people, presumably of my political ideology on the left, broadly condemn the NYT for fairly milquetoast criticism of Donald Trump by a NYT journalist, then yeah, I'll usually come to bat for the NYT.
 

The Albatross

Member
Oct 25, 2017
39,046
Does your Uncle work for the NYT or something?

Nope, I really love their reporting though, and I care a lot about the idea that a free press is one of the best checks on abuse of power. I think it's really easy to cherry pick out bad articles that have been published in the NYT or dumb tweets by reporters from the NYT, and then make those small examples contribute to a larger narrative that the NYT (and other papers too, it's just most often the NYT because it's the most prominent paper in America) is unreliable and can't be trusted. And so I usually pay special attention to those posts contributing to that narrative, and make it a point of mine to try to counter-balance it. It's all a waste of time, of course, but what isn't.
 

Xaszatm

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
10,903
Nope, I really love their reporting though, and I care a lot about the idea that a free press is one of the best checks on abuse of power. I think it's really easy to cherry pick out bad articles that have been published in the NYT or dumb tweets by reporters from the NYT, and then make those small examples contribute to a larger narrative that the NYT (and other papers too, it's just most often the NYT because it's the most prominent paper in America) is unreliable and can't be trusted. And so I usually pay special attention to those posts contributing to that narrative, and make it a point of mine to try to counter-balance it. It's all a waste of time, of course, but what isn't.

Sorry, but this idea that NYT needs to be protected is dangerous. No media deserves to be inherently trusted. Everything needs a critical eye and an understanding that there are inherent biases in everything, even when trying to be objective. To pretend that the NYT is a bastion of objective news that should be protected from criticism is to misuse the idea of a free press. A free press means that they have the right to report what they want without the government interfering. It does not suddenly protect them from criticism or the people.
 

Deleted member 11413

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
22,961
www.sciencedaily.com

Some personal beliefs and morals may stem from genetics

Researchers found that while parents can help encourage their children to develop into responsible, conscientious adults, there is an underlying genetic factor that influences these traits, as well.

Again, eugenics is arguing certain people superior to others.

Here, I'm simply arguing some people may be born with a likelihood of being more "evil". Lower emotional IQ, less empathy less compassion.

I mean, we've already seen this happen with lead poisoning.
Jesus christ lead poisoning didn't make people 'evil', have you read any of the research on lead poisoning?

Edit: OK read the rest of your posts in this thread, you have no clue what you are talking about. Fascism is not something 'inherent' to certain people, we are all susceptible to negative thoughts, emotions, and beliefs and have to be self-aware in order to mitigate them. Something which is seemingly lost on you as you advocate for fascist crackdowns on people with mental illness.
 

LGHT_TRSN

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,139
TIL that pearl-clutchers can't tell the difference between superficial plot summary to make a joke and actual interpretive analysis.
 

Deleted member 7130

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
7,685
Ok, back up, are you seriously suggesting that people with personality disorders are predisposed towards evil? Are you for real? Newsflash, tv shows and propaganda are not accurate takes on people with these personality disorders!
Which, by the way, people with disorders and psychological issues were absolutely targets of eugenics.
 

jviggy43

Banned
Oct 28, 2017
18,184
Is criticizing stupid takes thread whining? You can still make stupid threads or stupid posts if you want, I'd never want that ability taken away from you. Similar to how the OP says that Parasite is a Rorschach test for "out of touch rich people" I find posts that broadly condemn the New York Times for fairly unremarkable takes by people who work for the NYT as indications of their desire to discredit the rest of the good work the paper does ... I referred to it as "The Great Reveal." And, expectedly, defending the New York Times and other prominent American newspapers is usually more controversial in this community than discrediting them.
You must not want video game forums to have freedom of speech since you are criticizing them