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KUON

Member
Oct 30, 2017
134
Midgar
User Banned (2 weeks): Downplaying child abuse; ignoring staff post
99% of children who have ever lived have been physically disciplined by their parents. As long as it isn't part of a larger cycle of abuse, getting a smack and being called an asshole when they deserve it is not going to damage a child.

I agree with this. My upbringing was a huge cycle of abuse till I was a grown up. Even when I didn't deserve it I got physically punished/hit/abused.

A smack in 15 years is not abuse in my book.
 

Horp

Member
Nov 16, 2017
3,707
As a father of two let me tell you that sometimes they do some really bad shit, and you get so fucking frustrated that you... obviously still don't hit them. What's fucking wrong with you, stop hitting your kids you fucking monster.
 

Deaf Spacker

Member
Oct 26, 2017
3,024
United Kingdom
Makes sense. Deaf Spacker, I've been a dad for 7 years now -- you're totally right that physically removing the kid from dangerous or harmful circumstances or to stop them from doing something wrong is many times necessary. But surely you'd agree that smacking them or hitting them to get them to comply is not the only other option you have as a parent, no?

Of course I agree that smacking/hitting is not the only option, it shouldn't even be on parents radar.
 

OrangeNova

Member
Oct 30, 2017
12,626
Canada
99% of children who have ever lived have been physically disciplined by their parents. As long as it isn't part of a larger cycle of abuse, getting a smack and being called an asshole when they deserve it is not going to damage a child.
99% of children being smacked IS a larger cycle of abuse. How do you not see this?
 

lowmelody

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
2,101
Everyone that says "I was hit and I turned out fine so it's ok to do to my kids"

No you didn't turn out fine, because you're advocating hitting kids. It broke you and you will break them.
 

n00bs7ay3r

Attempted to circumvent ban with an alt-account
Banned
Aug 21, 2018
1,159
Seems like most people can't differentiate between physical violence and a smack.
Kids will not suffer from a smack or two in their childhood if the rest of the parenting is on point.
You are going to have to define what you mean by using the the term smack. My understanding is that it is hitting in order to cause pain which would be physical violence.
 
Dec 2, 2017
20,591
I think a little physical discipline does help some children. Including me when I was young.
No, because now you are advocating using violence on children.



My dad beat me till I was black and blue, broken bones, from when I was a small child till my mid teens. It did not help discipline me, or teach me lessons. All it did was make me afraid, and as another poster put it above me, broke me. It's never ever ok to physically assault children. Not a hit, not a smack, not a tap on the leg.
 

More_Badass

Member
Oct 25, 2017
23,622
I could be a little asshole when I was a kid (lying, forging parent's signature, etc) and I got the belt or the hanger a few times. Thankfully my father learned how to be a better father and my younger brother never got hit as a punishment.

Never hit your kids, and if you think that counts as "discipline", you're a disgusting person
 

kukubrew

Member
Nov 7, 2017
342
I imagine that there is a strong correlation between being hit while growing up and thinking that it's ok in the "right" circumstances to hit a child. I'm sure it's hard to get those things out of your head that you thought were normal, as our norms and morals form during childhood. I'm glad on a macro level things are trending in the right direction, but we obviously have a long way to go as a species.
 

More_Badass

Member
Oct 25, 2017
23,622
I imagine that there is a strong correlation between being hit while growing up and thinking that it's ok in the "right" circumstances to hit a child. I'm sure it's hard to get those things out of your head that you thought were normal, as our norms and morals form during childhood. I'm glad on a macro level things are trending in the right direction, but we obviously have a long way to go as a species.
Personally I'd like to imagine the opposite is true. Would make you resentful of such an approach and would want to be better for your kids if/when you have any
 

RDreamer

Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,102
Personally I'd like to imagine the opposite is true. Would make you resentful of such an approach and would want to be better for your kids if/when you have any
Abuse victims often internalize these things and blame themselves. They think they deserved it. Similar things can happen in spousal abuse victims too.
 

CrazyDude

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,727
So I'm guessing that all the people saying smacking your children is good for them must also think that smacking your spouse/significant other around when they do something wrong is also an acceptable reaction?

I am also guessing that the people who got hit only got hit once and never did a bad thing again because it is so effective as a deterrent.
 

Zombine

Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,231
My father threatened physical violence when I was a kid. He also hit me on special occasions and one time threatened to hit me on the head with a hammer and take an axe to my computer—all in the name of good, old school parenting.

He has tried to rectify this treatment now that I am an adult and I still don't give a fuck about him. Abusive parents are an absolute cancer to society.
 

CampFreddie

A King's Landing
Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,951
This shouldn't be hard. You don't hit your kids.
If they're about to do something dangerous or violent then you can physically restrain them, or even push them away from danger, but there should never be a need to hit them.

Kids don't always listen to reason and sometimes you have to physically stop them, but that doesn't mean you skip trying to reason with them and it doesn't mean you ever hit them.

And no, you definitely don't need to create an elaborate "what if there was no way to stop the trolley but there was a really fat man next to the tracks" type of scenario to try and justify it.
 

cameron

The Fallen
Oct 26, 2017
23,807
www.npr.org

The American Academy Of Pediatrics On Spanking Children: Don't Do It, Ever.

According to the AAP, research shows that spanking is harmful to child development in the long run. The AAP also says to avoid nonphysical punishment that is humiliating, scary or threatening.

www.nytimes.com

Spanking Is Ineffective and Harmful to Children, Pediatricians’ Group Says (Published 2018)

The latest research shows spanking does not teach children right from wrong and can have long-lasting, damaging effects.
 

Deleted member 388

User Requested Account Deletion
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
1,813
Chancletta throwing parents be like
c3TfmtJ.gif
 

BebopCola

Member
Jul 17, 2019
2,037
So as a kid growing up in hillbilly America, I was yelled at/spanked by my parents when I did something "wrong", and they often "playfully made fun of me" as they put it. Now I didn't have it 1% as bad as children who grew up in outright abusive homes, and my parents will tell you that I turned out fine as I have a successful marriage, family and halfway decent career, but I didn't. Not on the inside, anyways.

Because of that fear of violent punishment I grew to lowkey fear my father to the point where I withdrew from and avoided him until I was halfway through college. I also did my best to avoid any kind of attention from both parents as I learned quickly that if they were paying attention to me, there was a good chance I was going to be punished somehow either via "gentle mocking" or spanking/smacking, or being otherwise grounded for no reason. So I basically have an extremely weak connection to my parents now, who in their older age have mellowed out considerably and want to get closer to me and my wife/kids. But that foundation of trust/support that SHOULD be there isn't, and I don't think it ever will be now.

Their bad parenting has actually made me a better parent in the sense that I never want to put my kids through that. But when my kids fuck up and don't listen or get defiant (they aren't even in grade school yet) there is always that tiny urge to spank them because my parents conditioned me to believe that violence is a solution even though I know how fucked up it is.

Basically shit you do to your kid even when they are 3 or 4 can and will have long-lasting repercussions.
 

Deleted member 31104

User requested account closure
Banned
Nov 5, 2017
2,572
To be fair the only time I've ever came close to hitting my children was when my son broke his hand free from mine and made a beeline for a busy road, but frankly that was just fear and shock on my part and frankly my own fault for not properly securing him. Still didn't hit, but it shocked me for a second that I seriously thought about it. Kids tend to learn well enough if you take time to explain consequences to them, perhaps not the first time or even in some cases the first 10 times but they do learn relatively quickly. My kids might find it a tad redundant that most infractions end up with their ipad, tv or toy privileges revoked but it does work if you're consistent with it. I've found timeouts and naughty steps to be a bit hit and miss and mostly miss as they get older. Might work better with a single child, but with 3 of them it's harder to police
 

Goodlifr

Member
Nov 6, 2017
1,885
User banned (1 day) driveby trolling
Like I'm not for spanking kids, in anyway... but this thread is a bit, well, ehhhh.
You lot come across as perfect parents
 

fleet

Member
Jan 2, 2019
644
as both a provisional psych and a positive behaviour support worker?

dont fucking hit your children. dont do it. dont slap them. dont yank them (unless its literally out of the way of oncoming traffic).

not only because its abuse - but because as a strategy of teaching, it doesnt work. theres no evidence behind it. none at all.

as a parent, imagine if you heard that your babysitter/child care minder/teacher hit your child as a way of "teaching" or reprimanding. you would rightfully lose your shit and probably call the police. but for some reason people think parents are different and it's fine and cool to hit kids. it's not. don't do it.
 
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RDreamer

Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,102
Like I'm not for spanking kids, in anyway... but this thread is a bit, well, ehhhh.
You lot come across as perfect parents
Every parent makes mistakes but there's a difference in a mistake and defending plus perpetuating behavior that's been proven ineffective and damaging.

"Like I'm not for giving kids toys with lead paint but this thread is a bit, well, ehhh. You lot come across and perfect parents."

Same thing. It's damaging. Maybe at some point people thought it was fine and at that time I don't overly blame them or think they're monsters for doing it but now is not that time. We know better so we can be better.
 

PontyfaxJr

Member
Oct 28, 2017
533
Ireland
I don't have kids, but I was hit lightly on the arm by my mother sometimes, usually because my little brother had pushed her into being angry and I caught the brunt of it.
The only stand out memory I have though is when I was about six and my dad grabbed a noisy toy laser gun from me and yelled shut up and smashed it off the ground. He's a big 6'5" guy and I was afraid of him for a long time after that.

I sometimes break stuff when I get mad so that's something I worry about a little when it comes to potential eventual kids, but I hope being aware of it would help me avoid it.

People don't know how to communicate with kids and aren't great at dealing with anger and stress.
 

Deleted member 46489

User requested account closure
Banned
Aug 7, 2018
1,979
Obviously 99% is not intended to be a scientific figure. But this viewpoint that parents can never touch their children to punish them is a completely modern and frankly Western-centric approach. At least in my experiences, and the experiences of the people I grew up with, we were all spanked at least once in our lives, and it didn't damage our relationships with our parents at all.
You don't agree with the "western-centric" approach? Let's talk about that. I grew up in India, where hitting children is commonplace. I've been hit by both my parents all through childhood. I've been slapped and beaten by teachers all through my school life. I grew up in an atmosphere where this was all considered normal. So allow me to share my "eastern-centric" opinion here-

IT'S NOT OKAY TO HIT KIDS. THAT'S CHILD ABUSE. DON'T HIT YOUR KIDS. NOT EVEN A SLAP.

There. Now we have some thoughts from the other side of the world to balance the opinion of these "ignorant" westerners.
 
Oct 27, 2017
12,281
the same arguments get repeated over and over and over. i got hit a little as a kid, nbd, don't see it as a problem. and then they in turn do it to their kids and the cycle repeats ad nauseam without anyone realizing that the fact that the cycle repeats is inherently the problem until someone realizes... "shit, maybe hitting small children isn't good, actually"
 

cameron

The Fallen
Oct 26, 2017
23,807
Like I'm not for spanking kids, in anyway... but this thread is a bit, well, ehhhh.
You lot come across as perfect parents
Your standards for perfect parenting are super low.

Some parents have posted in this thread and have explained their reasoning for not hitting their children. I doubt they believe they are perfect parents.
 

gutter_trash

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
17,124
Montreal
corporal punishment does not work,
it breeds anxiety and at worse it teaches the kid that physical violence gets things done. then the kid one day thinks it is okay to be physically violent towards others and can carry on into adulthood
 

Rivenblade

Member
Nov 1, 2017
37,118
I don't advocate for violence against children and have two of my own. Sometimes they do drive me up the wall when I'm tired and I wonder if yelling at them in anguish or anger isn't just as bad as hitting them. I'm trying reeeaaally fucking hard to end the cycle of violence (dad whacked me with a wooden spoon), but it's not been a perfect journey.

"Stop! Do you like making papa upset? COME ON! PLEASE! I'VE ASKED YOU FIVE TIMES ALREADY! JUST GO TO THE BATHROOM AND TAKE A SHOWER!"

Literally been reading books on stoicism to control my reactions and trying to keep the mentality that while I can't control the behaviours of others, I can control my own reactions. That works when you're not on two or three hours of sleep and are in your right mind, but sometimes it's really really hard to not just put your face in your hands and complain to your kids about how they're making you angry.
 
Aug 12, 2019
5,159
Freeman has always kind of had this old guard type energy to him from what I remember and believe has made some choice comments in the past that did not reflect him in the best light. It's disappointing to see him talk so casually about this, but not really surprising (maybe more surprising that he didn't think about the optics of it more specifically and brought it up at all).
 

RDreamer

Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,102
I'm not apologising.

Just the whole "you should sit down and explain to them" etc etc
I don't get it. Sure parents don't always succeed and can make mistakes but stating as a goal that you should sit down and explain, etc, doesn't make you some elitist perfect parent. As a parent I know patience is hard to come by when you're sleep deprived and exhausted so yeah sometimes the response wouldn't be a perfect calm explanation. But that doesn't mean the alternative is to hit them. Or that advocating not hitting them makes us too perfect.
 

Zulith

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,738
West Coast, USA
Never followed him closely but I did like him as Bilbo quite a lot. However, in the behind the scenes features they point out that he was constantly flipping people and the camera off during the entire production as some kind of joke, which seemed kind of bizarre to me. And then news like this comes out... I dunno, something about him seems off. What a stupid thing to openly admit to being a celebrity in 2020. Glad he did though, since this could be a positive development for his kids with people knowing about this.

Elijah Wood remains the best Hobbit of all time.