-
Ever wanted an RSS feed of all your favorite gaming news sites? Go check out our new Gaming Headlines feed! Read more about it here.
LTTP Twin Peaks: Season 2 Sure Takes a Dive, Eh?
- Thread starter Heynongman!
- Start date
Fire Walk With Me and season 3 more than make up for it. Missing Pieces too, actually. Just sublime.
Last edited:
Recently did a rewatch of Seasons 1, 2 and FWWM, and finished The Return for the first time just the other evening. Stick with it OP. The Season 2 finale is incredible and The Return is some of the best damn television I have ever seen.
There's really no other show that dropped that hard in quality that fast. "Lonely Souls" is one of the best television episodes of all time and just three episodes later with "Dispute between Brothers" the show has become a complete shitshow. Even the episodes between that, like "Arbitrary Law", that many people, past me included, still kinda like are a far cry from where the show was previously, almost completely ruining the mystery the show built up before.
Since my last rewatch I don't even really buy the common consensus that the decline was inevitable after the mystery was solved, I really feel that they could have made something out of that, especially considering just how impactful the actual reveal is. They could have easily filled the rest of the season with dealing with the aftermath of that reveal, showing how it impacted the town, but they instead completely pivoted over to whacky sitcom antics, completely writing out any references to the palmer family. Just watch the contrast between laura palmers funeral scene and the funeral scene in "Dispute between Brothers", it is absolutely ridiculous just how incredible the first one is and how terrible the latter is. It is completely meandering, with no sort of narrative hook or any emotional resonance. Most of the characters get so bogged down in boring sideplots that there are whole episodes were literally nothing is happening. It is absolutely terrible with barely any redeeming qualities.
It does get somewhat better though, from episode 24 on, the show finds at least some narrative drive and the hijinks in the town become at least somewhat entertaining. It is still obvious nowhere close to the quality of the first half of the show, but at least it is actually enjoyable. Then the last episode is obviously incredible. From the very first second of it you know you are in for something good, the atmosphere is there, the characters are there, the mystery is there, it's literally all there again. The magic was back for just one fleeting moment.
Since my last rewatch I don't even really buy the common consensus that the decline was inevitable after the mystery was solved, I really feel that they could have made something out of that, especially considering just how impactful the actual reveal is. They could have easily filled the rest of the season with dealing with the aftermath of that reveal, showing how it impacted the town, but they instead completely pivoted over to whacky sitcom antics, completely writing out any references to the palmer family. Just watch the contrast between laura palmers funeral scene and the funeral scene in "Dispute between Brothers", it is absolutely ridiculous just how incredible the first one is and how terrible the latter is. It is completely meandering, with no sort of narrative hook or any emotional resonance. Most of the characters get so bogged down in boring sideplots that there are whole episodes were literally nothing is happening. It is absolutely terrible with barely any redeeming qualities.
It does get somewhat better though, from episode 24 on, the show finds at least some narrative drive and the hijinks in the town become at least somewhat entertaining. It is still obvious nowhere close to the quality of the first half of the show, but at least it is actually enjoyable. Then the last episode is obviously incredible. From the very first second of it you know you are in for something good, the atmosphere is there, the characters are there, the mystery is there, it's literally all there again. The magic was back for just one fleeting moment.
I mean it really isn't unexpected that the response to The Return is so varied. It's weird. And not weird in the same way that the original seasons were weird, or weird in the way classic Lynch was, or even weird in the way that later Lynch was. It is a completely different beast.
It really is telling that what probably is the most celebrated episode of the third season, episode 8, is also the most conventional of them all. Yes, the visuals are unconventional, but what it is trying to tell you is overall easily digestable. It's an origin story, just like in every superhero movie. With the rest of the show it is the opposite: The visuals are as conventional as they can be, but what it trying to tell you is almost completely incomprehensible.
I mean I loved season 1-2 even though there were definately some shitty episodes in the middle of season 2, but season 3 was terrible, I watched like the first 6-8 episodes before I gave up, this is not me "shitting" on season 3, just giving my opinion about it, I hope the OP loves it when he gets around to watching it, I know there's alot of people who apparently loved season 3.
OP
OP
So I just got to Josie dying and Coop seeing her turn into the knob on the end table.
And holy shit what a scene. I feel like the lead up to the end was some of the most soap opera melodrama, perfectly executed and then Coops vision just made my skin crawl - up until the knob thing, but it was so goofy and uncomfortable at the same time. I'm in it for the crazy shit like this tbh
And holy shit what a scene. I feel like the lead up to the end was some of the most soap opera melodrama, perfectly executed and then Coops vision just made my skin crawl - up until the knob thing, but it was so goofy and uncomfortable at the same time. I'm in it for the crazy shit like this tbh
The back half of Season 2 and all of The Return were some of the worst TV to watch live (S2) because it felt like absolutely nothing was happening week to week. It wasn't until I got older and was able to lean into the trashiness of it all that I was able to appreciate it. (S3) The worst part about The Return was that there wasn't even cheesy meodramatic soap plot happening. It was just entire episodes of Dougie doing something inane and then someone sweeping the floor for 5 minutes.
Probably hold up better in bingeing though, which is the only way I can imagine all of the S3 stans are watching it.
I do have more fond memories of S2, though. I always perked up when Laura's Theme would start playing, because that was a sign that plot was happening.
Best memory of The Return was when Sky Germany accidentally released episode 14 instead of 13, and instead of literally nothing we got Naido! Andy talking to the Fireman! Magic glove! Sarah Palmer eats someone! Diane and Naomi Watts are sisters! Lissi singing Wild West! Man, that was a tough episode to keep quiet for a week on.
Probably hold up better in bingeing though, which is the only way I can imagine all of the S3 stans are watching it.
I do have more fond memories of S2, though. I always perked up when Laura's Theme would start playing, because that was a sign that plot was happening.
Best memory of The Return was when Sky Germany accidentally released episode 14 instead of 13, and instead of literally nothing we got Naido! Andy talking to the Fireman! Magic glove! Sarah Palmer eats someone! Diane and Naomi Watts are sisters! Lissi singing Wild West! Man, that was a tough episode to keep quiet for a week on.
As a life-long Lynch fan S3 was a dream come true, I loved every minute of it (well I could do with a few less minutes of floor sweeping). It's imperative you come into it not expecting the soap-opera tone from S1 and 2, but rather unfiltered Lynch. Just let it wash over you even if it doesn't make much sense. Going on message boards after each episode back when it first aired was so much fun. It's up there with the best Lynch has done imo and that's saying something.
Trust me. I was a huge Twin Peaks fanatic. In 2011 I started the very first Twin Peaks podcast on the internet. I flew across the continent twice to go to the Twin Peaks festival in Washington.
Season 3 didn't feel like Twin Peaks at all to me. It had none of the charm. It was 1000% David Lynch weirdness. And that's fine if it's a Lynch film. I like most Lynch films. However Twin Peaks was a collaboration and that made it different than his other work. Season 3 is too different (yes, even from FWWM) for me to consider it part of the same Twin Peaks.
Last edited:
OP
OP
Quick status update: up to episode 20 and i have a few thoughts.
Windom Earle has been a fantastic addition. All the dumb side plots are resolved or MIA. And I'm pretty sure Heather Graham is gonna get got
Edit: oh shit, here comes Bob reaching through the spiritual plane
Windom Earle has been a fantastic addition. All the dumb side plots are resolved or MIA. And I'm pretty sure Heather Graham is gonna get got
Edit: oh shit, here comes Bob reaching through the spiritual plane
Watching people react to Twin Peaks is up there with watching people react to MGS2 and Evangelion as favorite activities.
That was definitely my favorite sub plot of the latter half of S2.
OP
OP
Consider watching The Missing Pieces after FWWM. It's all new or extended scenes and some of which have relevance in The Return.
i rewatched it to dust myself off for S3/return. took a deep breath and expected the worst but it was... okay? i guess
like obvs network execs were diving their heels in and there was plenty of bullshit but i dunno, it's watachable. 8/10 would buy from them again
like obvs network execs were diving their heels in and there was plenty of bullshit but i dunno, it's watachable. 8/10 would buy from them again
To call episodes 17-20 good is generous. VERY generous. Otherwise I sign off on this chart. lol
For episodes 10-20 I'd almost recommend putting those episodes on while you do something else (like play a podcast game or something), then whether you've been listening to this pod or not (though you should listen to it) listen to the Twin Peaks Rewatch podcast episodes for episodes 10-20, then resume watching the show as normal.
The entirety of the Twin Peaks Rewatch podcast is great but that show became an absolute godsend when I got to episodes 10-20 of season 2. Knowing that I at least had an episode of that pod to look forward to really got me through those episodes.
Last edited:
OP
OP
I thought they were pretty good, especially compared to the nonsense of the previous episodes
OP
OP
Coming back to this post, that part of the pic is extra weird considering Coops relationship with Annie
Season 2 is basically three seasons combines into one. First third is terrific, second part is average and final third starts building up to a terrific ending with the actual ending being absolutely insane. It's a shame that the series went the direction it went, but still the people that made the series outside of the writers did amazing stuff with what they got. Also it's absolutely hilarious that you immediately notice when Lynch is back, because everything goes from 0 to 1000 within the time span of that one episode. And that ending! Honestly, it's a shame that Lynch clearly did not feel much for the entire Windom Earle story line and you notice that very clearly. It was a long buildup with a terrific payoff, but Lynch went 'Nope!' and he wipes that story line out in one go.
Season 3 is something else, I absolutely love it for how insane it is. But as an actual season 3 following up the original series? Nah, not to me personally for the most part. It's honestly fine if you do not like that season though, it's basically Lynch being given a budget without any limitations within the Twin Peaks show, and it shows.
And absolutely watch the film, it's so good and I honestly always feel very dirty afterwards. Such an amazing film!
Season 3 is something else, I absolutely love it for how insane it is. But as an actual season 3 following up the original series? Nah, not to me personally for the most part. It's honestly fine if you do not like that season though, it's basically Lynch being given a budget without any limitations within the Twin Peaks show, and it shows.
And absolutely watch the film, it's so good and I honestly always feel very dirty afterwards. Such an amazing film!
i'm fine with them dumping the audrey romance (though i can't imagine damsel in distress would have been much worse than what we got), but i don't believe for a second maclachlan fought against the idea for any other reason than him getting it on with flynn boyle.
OP
OP
OP
OP
That was something else. The extended sequence in the velvet room was insane. I now have way more questions than answers lol
Just push on through. S3 is some wild fucking shit. I still don't know if I liked it or not, but there really is nothing else like it in television.
OP
OP
OP
OP
Entertaining little aside (not that it's uncommon knowledge or anything).
Back in the later 90s when TP ran on AMC in reruns, they filmed additional segments featuring the Log Lady introducing each episode. Well worth checking out if you want to wring a little more footage out of that original timeframe.
Back in the later 90s when TP ran on AMC in reruns, they filmed additional segments featuring the Log Lady introducing each episode. Well worth checking out if you want to wring a little more footage out of that original timeframe.
OP
OP
Thank you for sharing this. I'll have to settle for these while I figure out how the hell I'm gonna watch Season 3.
A 7 day showtime trial might do the trick but I almost want to buy the blu ray set for the whole series cause I'm a psycho
NP. Thanks for this thread. Reminded me that the wife and I were gonna finally do The Return this October.
Sidebar. As others have said, before you move on to S3, you should watch Fire Walk With Me if you haven't. It's a massive emotional bummer, but is necessary. And while I have avoided Return plot points, my understanding is that it informs a lot.
OP
OP
His character's name was FBI Special Agent Phillip Jeffries, in case that ever comes up again...
Nah, not a good determining factor. The two are nothing alike. Loved FWWM, hated S3.
OP
OP
It's worth watching all of Twin Peaks. It's better going in knowing that S2 gets real rough and at times laughably bad about half-way in, but it sticks the landing. I honestly didn't care for FWWM that much, but it wasn't bad. I just felt like I didn't need to see some of that stuff. Season 3 is incredible.
S3 didn't feel like Twin Peaks because I'm not convinced that Lynch's heart was in the project. I honestly don't think he wanted to make another season of TP. I think he decided to exploit the cult-hit TP brand he helped create so many years ago as a means to finally get a lot of difficult, non-TP sketchbook ideas he had accumulated over the years "on film". This seems to me pretty clearly supported by the fact that the parts of S3 which move the furthest away from the established TP universe--such as in the monster in the glass box sequence, or the stunningly trippy ep. 8--feel the most vigorous and inspired. By contrast, nearly every scene which places us back in the old town, with so many of the old, worn-down characters rolled past like a waxworks parade float, feel so tired and flat. Typical for the director, the season relies heavily on Lynch's trademark off-kilter, interlude-like humor, immortalized in the original series, Blue Velvet, Lost Highway, Mulholland Dr., and other classics of his. However here, his technique seems ossified and static. Lynch feels very old here--not at all a perplexing outcome for one of the most audacious and spontaneous filmmakers in cinema history being forced to retrace familiar steps.
I honestly feel S3 was a mistake for Lynch. That said, it's practically criminal that he has had to resort to prostituting himself to his own legend in order to have his startlingly original visions realized these days.