Love how 60fps and 120fps is pushed for consoles on next gen (Xbox Series & PS5). Farewell to 30fps

delete · Oct 13, 2020

I think at best it is to hope for optional 60fps modes for games.

Pickle · Oct 13, 2020

You just wait lol, 30 fps "cinematic" is coming

convo · Oct 13, 2020

Imo performance is always more worth it, but devs who want Ray-tracing and high resolutions will tank performance and take 30fps and higher resolutions.

P A Z · Oct 13, 2020

Timu said:
Really?=O

I'm not gonna say it's locked 60fps but it must be 60fps like 90-95% of the time now.

McFly · Oct 13, 2020

Options, as long as dev gives options to choose between high fidelity and high framerate then I'm good. Some games like Spiderman MM i don't mind playing in high fidelity mode with ray trace reflections. But i love that there are options to switch to high framerate mode if i need to.

DontHateTheBacon · Oct 13, 2020

Lol, it's not. But at least you'll have options. I think more people would pick resolution over performance, because they spent a pretty penny on their TV.

MrBS · Oct 13, 2020

30fps will be the standard next gen OP
Also nearly all mainstream TVs will have HDMI 2.1 and 120hz next year? I don't think we'll ever see your mainstream no name TVs have 120hz displays, ever. This has pipe dream all over it.

Tophat Jones · Oct 13, 2020

It's a real bummer that people are so certain that 30 FPS is definitely coming back. A 60 FPS mode should be a standard feature. The more games we get to play at 60 FPS the worse going back to 30 will feel.

I think it's a mistake.

Deleted member 5127 · Oct 13, 2020

PS4 also had cross gen and PS3 remasters that were 60fps, it doesn't mean anything yet.

eraFROMAN · Oct 13, 2020

Tophat Jones said:
It's a real bummer that people are so certain that 30 FPS is definitely coming back. A 60 FPS mode should be a standard feature. The more games we get to play at 60 FPS the worse going back to 30 will feel.

I think it's a mistake.

Judging by the DF look at Yakuza 7 on Series X, 60 fps is gonna come with sacrifices in places that some devs won't be willing to take. Going full spec with image quality is probably going to result in a decent chunk of 4K30 games with 1080p or 1440p 60 modes.

ThreepQuest64 · Oct 13, 2020

I don't see it being a thing completely of the past... devs rather push for the absolute maximum of graphics and try to rather maintain 30fps. They could have gone for 60fps this gen already if they wanted but they didn't. More options and more 60fps titles might be coming but it's definitely not gonna replace the 30fps ultra graphics approach because 30fps will still be seen as playable by the majority of the audience.

Butch · Oct 13, 2020

Tagyhag said:
What we're getting now is fantastic, but let's hold on to that hype until we get actual next-gen games.

Demon Souls isn't next gen?

Arulan · Oct 13, 2020

I think it's great that performance options (and 120 fps support!) are becoming more common on consoles, but at the end of the day the developer should have no say in this. You should be able to prioritize every option based on your own preferences. The vast majority of games show up on PC, and with this basic freedom. Developers can always set a default and warn you about the consequences of changing them. Why must players who prefer playing on console have to hope that the developers happen to prioritize settings based on their preferences? There have certainly been enough threads on this topic. You'd think having said freedom would be very important.

Tagyhag · Oct 13, 2020

Butch said:
Demon Souls isn't next gen?

Sorry, I should be more specific. Non-launch next-gen games. Historically, launch games have always had higher performance targets and the further we go into a generation the worse the framerates get (In general of course).

And even then, Demon's Souls can't even hit native 4K/60FPS, already, concessions are being made. And that's without some crazy ray tracing as well.

If we're already at that point, think about how much more sacrifices better looking and bigger games will have to make. We are going to reach games that are only 30FPS.

That all said, I think in general, we are going to see more 60FPS games than last gen thanks to the CPUs not being total shit, but we're not out of the woods just yet.

Palmersaurusrex · Oct 13, 2020

30fps has always been and always will be a choice for developers. Sure there might be more focus on options for higher frame rates vs resolution but the second a developer decides to target 30 fps in lieu of pushing graphical tech as far as they can then you're going see it come up again.

RivalGT · Oct 13, 2020

You haven't even seen 30 FPS final form yet, and where we're going there wont be any high frame rate modes.

ViperViking · Oct 13, 2020

There's no doubt that many console games will, unfortunately, be locked to 30 fps. It's good to see that some devs will allow an option for higher frame rate vs resolution, but not all will (I'm looking at you Naughty Dog, give me back 60 fps option). But I agree, I hate 30 fps and it's hard to look at when I usually game with my PC with a 144Hz Gsync monitor and push 100+ fps on everything (especially after finally securing a 3080. Seriously, I haven't played a game that can't hit a solid 100fps.)

Eeyore · Oct 13, 2020

Tagyhag said:
Sorry, I should be more specific. Non-launch next-gen games. Historically, launch games have always had higher performance targets and the further we go into a generation the worse the framerates get (In general of course).

And even then, Demon's Souls can't even hit native 4K/60FPS, already, concessions are being made. And that's without some crazy ray tracing as well.

If we're already at that point, think about how much more sacrifices better looking and bigger games will have to make. We are going to reach games that are only 30FPS.

That all said, I think in general, we are going to see more 60FPS games than last gen thanks to the CPUs not being total shit, but we're not out of the woods just yet.

If people are banking either of these consoles are going to have great raytracing, I think they're going to be disappointed.

danhz · Oct 13, 2020

Just give me a 1440-1800 upscaled to 4k /60fps and leave native 4k for the 30 fps mode. That way everyone can choose what they want.

Timu · Oct 13, 2020

pazinyo said:
I'm not gonna say it's locked 60fps but it must be 60fps like 90-95% of the time now.

Ah, it's still an improvement at least.

Snake Eater · Oct 13, 2020

I can't imagine GTA6 being 60FPS, maybe the PS5 Pro version

Butch · Oct 13, 2020

Snake Eater said:
I can't imagine GTA6 being 60FPS, maybe the PS5 Pro version

If it targets 1440p30 I can see it having a dynamic 1080p60 mode.

Playboi Carti · Oct 13, 2020

Wait until those real next-gen games like GTA 6 and all of that start hittin', you'll feel those 30fps being injected into your veins

nStruct · Oct 13, 2020

Has there been any deep dives into how HDMI 2.1 VRR works with the new consoles? Is it going to be supported on a game-by-game basis, basically games that have an uncapped framerate option? I imagine games that are locked to 30 or 60 wouldn't take advantage of HDMI 2.1 VRR.

Even in games that won't hit 60fps it would be nice to let them go as far above 30 as they are able to.

Metalmucil · Oct 13, 2020

I think Ray tracing and 4k says otherwise...

But I do sincerely hope devs are able to implement a choice on most games.

60fps · Oct 14, 2020

Developers should take the Apple approach and just erase 30fps as a "feature" altogether. Apple is bold enough to discontinue or change established features when they consider them outdated, and 30fps should be seen as outdated in the long term. Make 60fps the minimum baseline for console game development going forward. Graphics, physics, overall fidelity will evolve no matter what, but keep the framerate at 60, period. Some customers will not be happy at first but they will adapt until eventually no one is missing 30fps and its added fidelity anymore.

It's better long term because unlike movies, where you have meticulously directed acting and camera movement, games are meant to be played (hence the term gameplay), and better performance objectively makes games play better.

Serious Sam said:
Nice FUD there. Sure, let's just ignore that pretty much every launch day game and launch period game is either 60+fps or has 60fps mode, even big open world games, which has never happened before on consoles. Also many games will have 120FPS mode (not just indies!) which also has never happened before on consoles. And did you mention Halo, the same Halo that's targeting 60FPS as a base, and 120FPS in multiplayer? Yes, let's ignore all that and spread some good old FUD.

Absolutely.

Thales Targaryen said:
PS4 also had cross gen and PS3 remasters that were 60fps, it doesn't mean anything yet.

And then PS4 Pro was released and we started to see "high framerate" modes for the first time on consoles. This shows developers are definitely aware that people care about performance.

finally · Oct 14, 2020

I prefer 1080p, 60 fps with ray tracing option, perfect settings for my TV

Bishop89 · Oct 14, 2020

Am I misremebering or did ps2 have A LOT of 60fps games?

horkrux · Oct 14, 2020

I can't wait for beautiful 30fps games that require an absolute monster rig to be pushed to 60.

It's gonna be amazing. Lots of gamer tears will be shed when you can't hit 60 on ultra anymore.

RulkezX · Oct 14, 2020

I'll take 30fps and all the bells and whistles all day long 🤷‍♂️

Edit: ideally games just ship with multiple performance profiles.

Tailzo · Oct 14, 2020

Bishop89 said:
Am I misremebering or did ps2 have A LOT of 60fps games?

You're right. Dreamcast had a lot too. It was a huge thing, coming from PS1, N64 and sega Saturn.

4 Wheel Thunder
Airforce Delta
Alien Front Online
Alone in the Dark: The New Nightmare
Atari Anniversary Edition
Bangai-O
Bomberman Online
Bust-A-Move 4
Buzz Lightyear of Star Command
Caesars Palace 2000
Cannon Spike
Capcom vs. SNK: Millennium Fight 2000
Carrier
Charge 'N Blast
Chu Chu Rocket
Coaster Works
Confidential Mission
Conflict Zone
Crazy Taxi 1
Crazy Taxi 2
Daytona USA 2001
Dead or Alive 2
Death Crimson OX
Demolition Racer: No Exit
Dynamite Cop
EGG: Elemental Gimmick Gear
ESPN International Track & Field
F355 Challenge
Fatal Fury: Mark of the Wolves
Floigan Bros.
Frogger 2: Swampy's Revenge
Giga Wing
Giga Wing 2
Gunbird 2
Heavy Metal Geomatrix
House of the Dead 2, The
Illbleed
JoJo's Bizarre Adventure
KAO the Kangaroo
King of Fighters '99: Evolution, The
King of Fighters: Dream Match 1999, The
Last Blade 2: Heart of the Samurai, The
Legacy of Kain: Soul Reaver
MagForce Racing
Maken X
Mars Matrix
Marvel vs. Capcom: Clash of Super Heroes
Marvel vs. Capcom 2
Maximum Pool
Midway's Greatest Arcade Hits Vol. 1
Midway's Greatest Arcade Hits Vol. 2
Mortal Kombat Gold
Mr. Driller
Ms. Pac-Man: Maze Madness
Namco Museum
NBA 2K
NBA 2K1
NBA 2K2
NBA Showtime: NBA on NBC
NBA Hoopz
NCAA 2K2
NFL 2K
NFL 2K1
NFL 2K2
NFL Blitz 2000
NFL Blitz 2001
NHL 2K2
Ooga Booga
Outtrigger
Pen Pen TriIcelon
Plasma Sword
POD SpeedZone
Power Stone
Power Stone 2
Project Justice
Psychic Force 2012
Rayman 2
Razor Freestyle Scooter
Ready 2 Rumble Boxing
Ready 2 Rumble Boxing: Round 2
Reel Fishing Wild
Rippin' Riders
Re-Volt (Enter your name as FLYBOY)
Samba de Amigo
San Francisco Rush 2049
Sega Bass Fishing
Sega Bass Fishing 2
Sega Marine Fishing
Sega Rally 2 (w/ cheat code. At the title screen press Up, A, Down, Down, Left, Right, B, B, Down)
Sega Smash Pack (Most but not all games)
Silver
Sno-Cross Championship Racing
Sonic Adventure 2
Soul Calibur
Soul Fighter
South Park: Chef's Luv Shack
South Park Rally
Spawn: In the Demon's Hand
Sports Jam
Star Wars Demolition
Star Wars: Episode I: Jedi Power Battles
Street Fighter III: 3rd Strike
Street Fighter III: Double Impact
Street Fighter Alpha 3
Super Magnetic Neo
Tee Off Golf
Tennis 2K2
Test Drive V-Rally
Tokyo Xtreme Racer
Tokyo Xtreme Racer 2
Typing of the Dead, The
UFC: Ultimate Fighting Championship
Unreal Tournament
Vanishing Point
Vigilante 8: 2nd Offense
Virtua Athlete 2000
Virtua Fighter 3tb
Virtua Striker 2
Virtua Tennis
Virtua Tennis 2 (Tennis 2K2)
Virtual-On: Oratorio Tangram
Wetrix+
Who Wants to Beat Up a Millionaire
World Series Baseball 2K1
World Series Baseball 2K2
Worms Armageddon
Worms World Party
Zombie Revenge

Japanese Releases
Border Down
Capcom vs. SNK: Millennium Fight 2000 Pro
Capcom vs. SNK 2: Millionaire Fighting 2001
Chaos Field
Cool Cool Toon
Cosmic Smash
Fighting Vipers 2
Fire Pro Wrestling D
Guilty Gear X
Ikaruga
Karous
King of Fighters 2000, The
King of Fighters 2001, The
King of Fighters 2002, The
Nettou Golf
Pro Yakyu Team Tsukurou & Asobou!
Psyvariar 2
Radirgy
Rent-A-Hero #1
Samba de Amigo Ver. 2000
Shikigami no Shiro II
Super Puzzle Fighter II X
Super Street Fighter II X: Grand Master Challenge
Triggerheart Exelica
Trizeal
Twinkle Star Sprites
Under Defeat
Vampire Chronicle
Zero Gunner 2

Hyun Sai · Oct 14, 2020

"But Consoles are not PC and shoudn't give the option"

Was always ridiculous and will always be.

Tedmilk · Oct 14, 2020

I think the best we can hope for is a *few* titles might jump to 60fps and a *few* more titles might have a 60fps option in their settings. I'll take any improvement in this area I can get.

PeakPointMatrix · Oct 14, 2020

640K is more memory than anyone will ever need.

Kazuma Kiryu · Oct 14, 2020

When will people learn?

Hermii · Oct 14, 2020

I do think 60fps will be a lot more common next gen, as these are really powerful systems with no obvious bottlenecks holding them back like last gen Jaguar.

However 30fps will still be very common.

Rivyn · Oct 14, 2020

I am fine with 30fps as long as it is consistent. There are too many games in the end of each generation that has trouble keeping the framerate there.

VG Aficionado · Oct 14, 2020

Bishop89 said:
Am I misremebering or did ps2 have A LOT of 60fps games?

I may be off explaining this, but PS2 had a lot of CPU power when it came out, relative to what games were using anyway. As the CPU could keep up, the two vector units could also render graphics very fast (i.e. 60 fps) for the target they had. It also featured 4 MB of fast eDRAM where the framebuffer was stored, independently from the main 32 MB RAM. They did something similar with the Xbox 360 although some developers argued that the eDRAM should have been 12 MB instead of 10 MB to be fully independent, as the former couldn't hold a full 720p framebuffer with AA or similar, if I'm not misremembering, and would have removed bottlenecks.

That said, PS2 was a notoriously hard system to develop for.

Weltall Zero · Oct 14, 2020

Samusaran said:
30fps is finally a thing of the past

This has been said every single gen since sub-60 FPS was introduced, and here we still are.

Z-Brownie · Oct 14, 2020

you should not say "goodbye" so soon

Ocean · Oct 14, 2020

It won't last. Devs will continue going for SHINY REFLECTIONS OMG instead of making games feel good to play.

ApeEscaper · Dec 16, 2020

I was wrong they said

YuriLowell · Dec 16, 2020

Ocean said:
It won't last. Devs will continue going for SHINY REFLECTIONS OMG instead of making games feel good to play.

This right here.
30fps with heavy RT is coming soon. This is just a 60fps honeymoon.

Uzupedro · Dec 16, 2020

Samusaran said:
I was wrong they said

It's still too early tho.

Transistor · Dec 16, 2020

I'm totally fine with 30 FPS as long as I have a 60FPS option as well.

Moreso, I would prefer companies aim for that 1440P / 60hz / RT sweet spot that Insomniac hit with Miles Morales

Radec · Dec 16, 2020

60fps is only good if resolution doesn't drop 1080p.
Sub 1080p nowadays is giving me headache on a big screen.

Decarb · Dec 16, 2020

Samusaran said:
I was wrong they said

Well this next-gen ended pretty quickly.

j.zed · Dec 16, 2020

Will more games have a 60 fps performance mode than lest gen? Yes.

Will most big games use a 30 fps image quality mode (potentially with ray tracing) as a baseline for their marketing and trailers? Absolutely. Better looking images and videos still sell games more than a smooth framerate. I don't see this changing in the coming few years.

abady-25 · Dec 16, 2020

"Farewell to 30fps"
if you are only a PC player lol

kambaybolongo · Dec 16, 2020

Samusaran said:
I was wrong they said

It's December and there are barely any next gen games out

Love how 60fps and 120fps is pushed for consoles on next gen (Xbox Series & PS5). Farewell to 30fps

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