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LG's 2019 OLED TVs certified NVIDIA G-SYNC on 20 and 16 series. Force VRR over HDMI coming too.
- Thread starter TitanicFall
- Start date
Same feel bro.
I've been waiting for this feature for so long. And despite the fact that 10 series cards are entirely capable hardware-wise, Nvidia is software-locking the feature to it's newest cards.
Incredibly scummy.
Awwww shit. Not gonna say I regret the C7 I bought 20 months ago considering the use it has gotten, but... I'd sure make use of a trade up program. Wonder if my dad would be in the market for a C7 🤔
e: locking this to 16/20 series is bullshit. Give a good reason or get fucked, nvidia.
e: locking this to 16/20 series is bullshit. Give a good reason or get fucked, nvidia.
Looks like I'll be buying an AMD GPU next time. Fuck Nvidia.
This is game changing, but Nvidia only supporting RTX and GTX 16 series cards is bs.
There's no technical reason for them not to support Pascal and even Maxwell cards.
I really hope that this is another case of introducing a feature first for the newest GPUs, and later adding support at least to the previous generation, like they did with the "OC Scanner" feature (exclusive to 20 series cards at first, but later supported by Pascal GPUs).
There's no technical reason for them not to support Pascal and even Maxwell cards.
I really hope that this is another case of introducing a feature first for the newest GPUs, and later adding support at least to the previous generation, like they did with the "OC Scanner" feature (exclusive to 20 series cards at first, but later supported by Pascal GPUs).
More marketing BS/FUD by Nvidia. This is nothing more than standard VRR support (there's no additional change/work done by LG here it's all driver support on Nvidia's side) making the average Joe (99% of the potential consumer).. Artificially restricting this to Turing GPUs shouldn't surprise anyone... 🤔
Zero chance. That tech is still too new and complicated. If there is a micro-LED TV next year, you'll be paying crazy amounts (like 10k+ dollars)
I own a 2080ti, but someone should really start a petition on forcing Nvidia implement this on 10 and older cards as well
Why only LG? Samsung TVs had VRR before LG. Obviously this isn't about HDMI 2.1 because Nvidia doesn't have HDMI 2.1 in any of their currently sold GPUs.
And WTF... only 20 series. GTX 1080 Ti has HDMI 2.0b just like RTX 2080 Ti. Another asshole move from Nvidia, just like locking out 10 series from using integer scaling...
And WTF... only 20 series. GTX 1080 Ti has HDMI 2.0b just like RTX 2080 Ti. Another asshole move from Nvidia, just like locking out 10 series from using integer scaling...
I guess I will wait for the driver to clarify this. Is it bringing generic VRR (like generic VRR over Displayport) to HDMI? Or is it literally just for LG T.V.s?
I would obviously prefer the former as it allows you to "try" and get your VRR display to work with the NV driver, which generally does.
I would obviously prefer the former as it allows you to "try" and get your VRR display to work with the NV driver, which generally does.
Sounds like Nvidia is finally going to allow VRR(Gsync) over HDMI. That's great.
Walled garden for only LG and only RTX20 series. Not so great.
I was concerned they'd limit it to HDMI 2.1 displays for some insane reason, but:
No idea why it needs to be RTX or GTX 16 series only at this point, (like integer scaling) but damn I am happy about what ThereAreFourNaan just highlighted ^_^
Because LG is awesome and Samsung sucks
Yeah I'm actually getting tearing while playing rocket league so this would've been life saver.
I'll wait for impressions when this is implemented, but I think I will upgrade if it works as advertised
They should add it, but like, proportional response. Until today they hadn't signaled any intent to support VRR over HDMI, until this year they hadn't signaled any intent to support (Desktop) VRR outside of the G-sync module ecosystem. Whether or not they'll eventually port this back to older GPUs is hard to say, but 12 months ago people had more or less resigned themselves to the idea that there would be this vendor-monitor lock-in for the indefinite future, so we're making major progress on that front.
Its VRR over HDMI
"" If you don't own a LG TV, but do own a display or TV that only supports Variable Refresh Rates via HDMI, you can try enabling HDMI VRR when the aforementioned driver is released. As these displays and TVs haven't yet been through our comprehensive validation process, we can't guarantee VRR will work, or work without issue. ""
Make a video about it, use your journalism powers to embarrass them publicly and maybe they'll bring integer scaling and this support to Pascal and Maxwell, lol.
You need a HDMI 2.1 AVR or connect directly to the TV and use ARC for sound.
This is VRR over HDMI, right? I've been waiting for this since last year. Now all LG needs to do before I upgrade to LG OLED from my LG LCD is bring Apple TV to their 2019 range. I'm not sure why they are not on-board yet, when Samsung is, and LG has Airplay 2 integrated.
That's awesome!! I own a C9 and 2080Ti.
Well, awesome-ish anyway. It probably won't be much use to me as I play in 4k and the 2080Ti doesn't support HDMI 2.1 so I can't go over 60hz anyway at that resolution. Good for the next gen Nvidia cards though, and for the times I'm happy dropping to 1440p.
Well, awesome-ish anyway. It probably won't be much use to me as I play in 4k and the 2080Ti doesn't support HDMI 2.1 so I can't go over 60hz anyway at that resolution. Good for the next gen Nvidia cards though, and for the times I'm happy dropping to 1440p.
It sounds like this will be 1440p120 or 4K60 on current GPUs. Since it's mid-to-late cycle for these displays and GPUs, I'll be waiting for next year's TVs and GPUs before upgrading.
Hopefully next year's OLEDs will include the improved motion handling which was demoed and then cancelled at the last minute. And if I'm allowed to dream, they will have figured out a way to combine BFI with VRR, like ASUS have with their new ELMB-Sync monitors. ≤1ms MPRT combined with VRR is the next big thing for displays.
A distant #2 and #3 are that it can reduce latency by 2–3 frames (introduced by double/triple buffering) and does so without screen tearing.
It would provide a significant improvement for playing in handheld mode where performance is often inconsistent, and would have been amazing for NVIDIA to get G-Sync in that many people's hands.
Unfortunately, while Sony arguably have the best image processing in the business (or Panasonic if you care about slightly more accuracy over picture enhancements) they have (both) been falling behind when it comes to TV features. Their SmartTV OS is Android-based and really bad compared to LG's WebOS.
Panasonic have a number of features specific to their TVs which seem to be in practically all of their displays that other manufacturers overlook. I love using their "Hotel Mode" to always start the TV at a fixed volume and on a specified input, for example.
And Sony's image processing has yet to be matched in my experience (smoothest gradients in any source).
But LG is at the top of my list for new TVs right now due to how much better their OS and the support for their TVs is. Samsung seem like a close second now, but they don't sell OLEDs.
That means it's using FreeSync (VESA Adaptive-Sync) or HDMI-VRR, but support has been certified by NVIDIA.
The Xbox One X already supports both FreeSync and HDMI-VRR. The PS4 doesn't seem to have the hardware required for support -or Sony does not care to support it- but next-gen everything should be using it.
As for not seeing the benefits of G-Sync/FreeSync, there are two possibilities:
If you want "Windowed" G-Sync, you should use Kaldaien's SpecialK tool to force the game into DirectFlip mode, or hope that Windows 10's Full-Screen Optimizations are active in the game's Full-Screen mode.
AMD were able to implement FreeSync, and then FreeSync-over-HDMI, on much older products than NVIDIA were with G-Sync, and now FreeSync / FreeSync-over-HDMI / HDMI-VRR.
If I recall correctly, it was something like AMD being an early adopter of DisplayPort 1.2a vs NVIDIA staying at DisplayPort 1.2 for much longer. Until VRR displays, that difference didn't really mean anything.
It wouldn't surprise me if there's a similar limitation with NVIDIA's HDMI implementations.
eARC seems to require eARC-capable devices on both ends.
What eARC should have been, is a dedicated full-bandwidth output on the display that works with any existing HDMI audio device. Even HDMI 1.0 supported 8-channel LPCM - though realistically you'd probably not want to use anything older than HDMI 1.3 (TrueHD/DTS-HD support).
That way buying an HDMI 2.1 display would have upgraded the audio with any device which is currently hooked up via ARC or S/PDIF.
The way HDMI should always have worked, is that you plug your sources directly into the TV, which then outputs audio to the receiver.
Receivers should never have been video switchers or processing devices to begin with.
As it is now, I'm hoping there will be inexpensive adapters to connect regular HDMI audio devices up to displays with eARC support.
There's no reason that anyone with an HDMI 2.0 audio device should have to replace it with an HDMI 2.1 device just for improved video pass-through.
The question is whether this is only HDMI-VRR support, or also FreeSync-over-HDMI, as I believe the specs are slightly different and are not compatible with one another. Hopefully it's not just HDMI-VRR, and FreeSync-over-HDMI monitors will also be supported by this update.
I'm very glad that my old topic on the GeForce forums actually did result in a new feature being implemented, though I'm unable to actually try it out since I have a 1070.
I have since found that my preference is to use integer scaling to the nearest integer (or +1) and then use linear scaling to fit the display though. This retains most of the sharpness of "true" integer scaling but without the black bars if it's not a perfect fit.
Hopefully next year's OLEDs will include the improved motion handling which was demoed and then cancelled at the last minute. And if I'm allowed to dream, they will have figured out a way to combine BFI with VRR, like ASUS have with their new ELMB-Sync monitors. ≤1ms MPRT combined with VRR is the next big thing for displays.
The #1 benefit of VRR technologies is that it eliminates stuttering with variable frame rates, since the refresh rate is now synchronized to the frame rate.
A distant #2 and #3 are that it can reduce latency by 2–3 frames (introduced by double/triple buffering) and does so without screen tearing.
I said it from the start, but the Switch should have included a G-Sync display.
It would provide a significant improvement for playing in handheld mode where performance is often inconsistent, and would have been amazing for NVIDIA to get G-Sync in that many people's hands.
They buy panels from LG and use their own processing/design. They are not "rebrands".
Unfortunately, while Sony arguably have the best image processing in the business (or Panasonic if you care about slightly more accuracy over picture enhancements) they have (both) been falling behind when it comes to TV features. Their SmartTV OS is Android-based and really bad compared to LG's WebOS.
Panasonic have a number of features specific to their TVs which seem to be in practically all of their displays that other manufacturers overlook. I love using their "Hotel Mode" to always start the TV at a fixed volume and on a specified input, for example.
And Sony's image processing has yet to be matched in my experience (smoothest gradients in any source).
But LG is at the top of my list for new TVs right now due to how much better their OS and the support for their TVs is. Samsung seem like a close second now, but they don't sell OLEDs.
This is not G-Sync, it is "G-Sync Compatible".
That means it's using FreeSync (VESA Adaptive-Sync) or HDMI-VRR, but support has been certified by NVIDIA.
The Xbox One X already supports both FreeSync and HDMI-VRR. The PS4 doesn't seem to have the hardware required for support -or Sony does not care to support it- but next-gen everything should be using it.
They're already 120Hz.
As for not seeing the benefits of G-Sync/FreeSync, there are two possibilities:
- You don't seem to notice stuttering in games caused by variable frame rates.
- You're using G-Sync in windowed mode and not full-screen mode.
If you want "Windowed" G-Sync, you should use Kaldaien's SpecialK tool to force the game into DirectFlip mode, or hope that Windows 10's Full-Screen Optimizations are active in the game's Full-Screen mode.
It's probably a hardware limitation.
AMD were able to implement FreeSync, and then FreeSync-over-HDMI, on much older products than NVIDIA were with G-Sync, and now FreeSync / FreeSync-over-HDMI / HDMI-VRR.
If I recall correctly, it was something like AMD being an early adopter of DisplayPort 1.2a vs NVIDIA staying at DisplayPort 1.2 for much longer. Until VRR displays, that difference didn't really mean anything.
It wouldn't surprise me if there's a similar limitation with NVIDIA's HDMI implementations.
This is why I am so frustrated at the way eARC is implemented in HDMI 2.1.
eARC seems to require eARC-capable devices on both ends.
What eARC should have been, is a dedicated full-bandwidth output on the display that works with any existing HDMI audio device. Even HDMI 1.0 supported 8-channel LPCM - though realistically you'd probably not want to use anything older than HDMI 1.3 (TrueHD/DTS-HD support).
That way buying an HDMI 2.1 display would have upgraded the audio with any device which is currently hooked up via ARC or S/PDIF.
The way HDMI should always have worked, is that you plug your sources directly into the TV, which then outputs audio to the receiver.
Receivers should never have been video switchers or processing devices to begin with.
As it is now, I'm hoping there will be inexpensive adapters to connect regular HDMI audio devices up to displays with eARC support.
There's no reason that anyone with an HDMI 2.0 audio device should have to replace it with an HDMI 2.1 device just for improved video pass-through.
They said it may work with other displays but is only certified for these OLEDs right now.
The question is whether this is only HDMI-VRR support, or also FreeSync-over-HDMI, as I believe the specs are slightly different and are not compatible with one another. Hopefully it's not just HDMI-VRR, and FreeSync-over-HDMI monitors will also be supported by this update.
My understanding is that scaling is provided by fixed-function hardware in everything prior to Turing, which is why it is not supported on older GPUs.
I'm very glad that my old topic on the GeForce forums actually did result in a new feature being implemented, though I'm unable to actually try it out since I have a 1070.
I have since found that my preference is to use integer scaling to the nearest integer (or +1) and then use linear scaling to fit the display though. This retains most of the sharpness of "true" integer scaling but without the black bars if it's not a perfect fit.
Something tells me that has to do with their low latency in gaming with 13.7 ms.
I am very happy that I bought a C9 this year, the only thing which makes my head scratch is, if this works, if you use an AVR,
basically G-Sync plus AVR usage, or if you have to go the direct way, I know that my Marantz supports ALLM, but does not have HDMI 2.1.
Console is where a variable refresh rate could shine at best, so I really hope next gen will be fully compatible with it, we need this.
That can't be the reason because Samsung VRR TVs have ALLM and all these VRR bells and whistles. These aren't LG exclusive.
I am not sure, it was just a guess, not sure why exactly LG got the deal with nVidia.
I am suprised as well. Could've been Sony, Panasonic or even Samsung.
Never thought LG would be the first with G-Sync support.
The limiting hardware factor would be if the 10 series cards didn't include HDMI 2.0b, but they do just like the 20 Series cards.
How good are these TVs for lag/input delay for fighting games, and how much do they cost? If the cost is reasonable and the price right, I could get this as a monitor.
the 2020 version of the C9 sounds the time to upgrade to OLED finally (hopefully has VRR for consoles as well as gysnc), that said I am waiting for good OLED to be under £1k. Though do use a receiver (for my surround sound) so need to find one of those that supports VRR pass through.
It's almost like LG knew I've been looking into buying the C9 the last few days and are doing their best to tip me over the edge haha
Fucking hell. Gsync, not Freesync?
Edit: My god the 55" is only $1399. I wonder what I could sell my B7 for? Still going to wait to see reactions from people, but I'm tempted.
Same deal here. I'll wait a bit longer to see how it pans out and then likely sell my B7 and pick this guy up when they're affordable.
Edit: My god the 55" is only $1399. I wonder what I could sell my B7 for? Still going to wait to see reactions from people, but I'm tempted.
Range will be whatever individual TV supports. In your example that would be 48-120FPS, yes.
Nope, just get a long HDMI cable (has to be quality stuff though to support full HDMI 2.0b bandwidth over long distance).
We actually already have it on console right now, Xbox has it.
Fantastic news. I play many of my PC games on my TV already. I will buy another TV just for this feature.
This is great news. I am not in the market for a new TV and my current TV is VRR at 4K in the 48 to 60 range, or at 24 to 120 at 1440p. It works great with certain Xbox One X titles.
They support eARC which will get you audio to the receiver with the console plugged into the TV.