I was so happy when the Starfleet ships gathered during the battle in Discovery's premiere episodes included a USS Shran.
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Let's talk about Star Trek: Enterprise
- Thread starter Deleted member 61531
- Start date
I was so happy when the Starfleet ships gathered during the battle in Discovery's premiere episodes included a USS Shran.
Just watched this with my 14 yr old daughter last year (I guess she'd be 13 then huh).
I saw a big hunk of season 1 & I think 2 when it was airing on HDnet (there was very little available in HD at the time, and man did HD look nice downscaled on my 480p projector at 100". Was never super impressed.
On the rewatch, (we used a watch guide and skipped some of the "meh"), it wasn't bad. The show would have been way better if it was more in tone to Season 4 than Season 1's temporal coldwar junk. The Xindi arc could have been better. The episode where Archer takes the warp core from the people "in the name of the greater good" was interesting. They should have at least followed up with some attempt to return it to them, or find the remains of their ship.
So season 3 and 4 weren't bad, although the Xindi war stuff was good but also kind of heavy-handed allegory for 9/11...but then again, ST has always been that.
The "look at an excuse to see sexy T'Pol get rubbed down" (esp. in S1) was stupid. Also some troubling issues with how they attempted to handle T'pol's telepathic AIDS. One of the people I read about points out ST's conservatism WRT sex and relationships and they are very right (oh Reed totally needed to be gay, for fuck's sake, it's like they kept moving towards it but wussed out).
The main, large problems were inability to do anything with the cast, They couldn't seem to write for anyone but Archer, and T'Pol. Trip carries his weak writing on the strength of the actor and charming folksy-ness, but they could not figure out how to really effectively use Hoshi, Mayweather, or Reed.
I liked how, unlike Voyager, were you'd have this great episode and then they would backpedal at the last moment and nerf the whole point of the episode with cowardly/safe writing, Enterprise seemed to deliver the whole episode more often, when they had a good one. So like, the episodes that were good were REALLY good (anything with Shran, for example), but the bad episodes were just kinda boring/meh, and it seemed like they quickly gave up trying to write good Hoshi or Mayweather or Reed episodes.
Oh, and the last episode was a total fucking dumpster fire.
I saw a big hunk of season 1 & I think 2 when it was airing on HDnet (there was very little available in HD at the time, and man did HD look nice downscaled on my 480p projector at 100". Was never super impressed.
On the rewatch, (we used a watch guide and skipped some of the "meh"), it wasn't bad. The show would have been way better if it was more in tone to Season 4 than Season 1's temporal coldwar junk. The Xindi arc could have been better. The episode where Archer takes the warp core from the people "in the name of the greater good" was interesting. They should have at least followed up with some attempt to return it to them, or find the remains of their ship.
So season 3 and 4 weren't bad, although the Xindi war stuff was good but also kind of heavy-handed allegory for 9/11...but then again, ST has always been that.
The "look at an excuse to see sexy T'Pol get rubbed down" (esp. in S1) was stupid. Also some troubling issues with how they attempted to handle T'pol's telepathic AIDS. One of the people I read about points out ST's conservatism WRT sex and relationships and they are very right (oh Reed totally needed to be gay, for fuck's sake, it's like they kept moving towards it but wussed out).
The main, large problems were inability to do anything with the cast, They couldn't seem to write for anyone but Archer, and T'Pol. Trip carries his weak writing on the strength of the actor and charming folksy-ness, but they could not figure out how to really effectively use Hoshi, Mayweather, or Reed.
I liked how, unlike Voyager, were you'd have this great episode and then they would backpedal at the last moment and nerf the whole point of the episode with cowardly/safe writing, Enterprise seemed to deliver the whole episode more often, when they had a good one. So like, the episodes that were good were REALLY good (anything with Shran, for example), but the bad episodes were just kinda boring/meh, and it seemed like they quickly gave up trying to write good Hoshi or Mayweather or Reed episodes.
Oh, and the last episode was a total fucking dumpster fire.
I didn't for a while. I remember my local FOX station showing TNG, DS9, and Voyager in first run syndication. About mid way through the third season, they stopped showing Voyager. About two years later my local cable company started carrying UPN. Then I watched the last couple seasons of Voyager, but I missed a lot.
i mostly enjoyed the show. There was some stuff that didnt work but thats every show. The last season or two with all the multi-episode stories was great. Its probably time to do a rewatch honestly as i last saw it as it aired.
Enterprise is still my favorite Star Trek series. I was always so bummed that everyone hated it and it was canceled. Even today it feels like one of tv's greatest losts. Up there with other gems like Hannibal, Ash VS Evil Dead, Constantine, Surface, Invasion, Firefly and many other unique shows that were never really given a fair chance by people (opinion).
They should do one last Enterprise episode and at the end, Archer glows and the real Archer reappears. Then we realize it was really a Quantum Leap spin-off and the reason Archer was so bad at his job is because he was really Sam Beckett trying to make sense of the weird world he had been thrown into.
This is how Enterprise has always felt to me
Season 1 & 2: Racist, incompetent people IN SPACE!! Plus boobies.
Season 3: 24 IN SPACE!!
Season 4: Wait this show was actually Star Trek? Shame about that stupid last episode.
Season 1 & 2: Racist, incompetent people IN SPACE!! Plus boobies.
Season 3: 24 IN SPACE!!
Season 4: Wait this show was actually Star Trek? Shame about that stupid last episode.
Well for one thing the marketing for the time was bonkers. "Here is our Star Trek show, but we don't want to be associated with Trek so it's not about Trek, it has other themes, that's why it isn't called Star Trek". It really was only called Enterprise the first couple seasons.
The characters are crap. Outside the US I think Tucker was especially disliked and he seemed to get so many focus episodes or screen time. I swear I once read the finale was partly a response to that. S3 really leaned into sexualising T'pol and I remember Trek fans being all "WTF writers this is Trek stop going for cheap and sleazy views" so it was nipped in S4 but the damage was done.
Also, it's not the show's fault, but after TNG became a hit the 90s saw so many sci-fi TV shows that the genre was flooded. By time STE rolled around people either had their fill of sci-fi or just stuck to shows they already watching.
The characters are crap. Outside the US I think Tucker was especially disliked and he seemed to get so many focus episodes or screen time. I swear I once read the finale was partly a response to that. S3 really leaned into sexualising T'pol and I remember Trek fans being all "WTF writers this is Trek stop going for cheap and sleazy views" so it was nipped in S4 but the damage was done.
Also, it's not the show's fault, but after TNG became a hit the 90s saw so many sci-fi TV shows that the genre was flooded. By time STE rolled around people either had their fill of sci-fi or just stuck to shows they already watching.
This is because they brought in Manny Coto as a new writer in season 3 and then he became showrunner in season 4. Pretty much everything you hated about the show and in VOY is because of Rick Berman. Berman worked on Trek for years, but he didn't like franchise.
Honestly, despite what I just said this is fair. I honestly think if Enterprise had gotten until season 7 it would be better regarded.
Despite the 24 joke season 3 was at least, focused, interesting and seemed like there was a good idea in place. The Xindi war idea was good but like I said was aping 24 a bit to much at times. I did like that the Xindi was made up of some non humanoid races as well.
Season 4 was a real turn around and the Terra Prime and T'Pol's baby were great plot hooks that could have been running plots. The seeds for a good Star Trek show was laid. Archer and Tucker and Reid really improved as characters instead of just being one notes. The build up to the formation of the Federation would have been cool.
It's a shame it was cut short.
And Brennan Bragga. Don't give him a pass as he was very close to Berman by then.
Good point, I can't forget Bragga. Btw interesting tidbit, Bragga also wrote / co-wrote Star Trek Generations and Star Trek: First Contact.
I'm sure there's plenty of blame to go around. I know there was a *lot* of network interference with this show. And my favorite season is 3, which is still largely Berman and Braga.
It was alright and I enjoyed most of it. I didn't watch it until years after so I can kinda understand how it would have been a tough act to follow at the time after the other Trek series.
I liked the idea of the show. There were some clever episodes. That cast was alright. I didn't really care for the Xindi storyline. After the last season I was ready to move on. The show served a purpose to fill that part of the Trek timeline and did a decent job of it, but yeah, it's not the best Trek series.
I liked the idea of the show. There were some clever episodes. That cast was alright. I didn't really care for the Xindi storyline. After the last season I was ready to move on. The show served a purpose to fill that part of the Trek timeline and did a decent job of it, but yeah, it's not the best Trek series.
Like Voyager, it squandered the premise of being a prequel AND it had absolutely no continuity because they were afraid to write anything serialized.
EARTH IS ATTACKED HOLY SHIT
20 episodes of generic Star Trek episodes
WE NEED A CLIFFHANGER REMEMBER THE XINDI?!?!
For two seasons. They totally missed the Lost train, which was hilariously seen again when CBS gave Braga a big-boy prime time network TV show and he totally faceplanted it.
I'm also someone who really dislikes season 4 because it became official fan-fiction - who cares how the Klingons lost their forehead ridges? - but I think by that time Star Trek was also pretty much dead.
EARTH IS ATTACKED HOLY SHIT
20 episodes of generic Star Trek episodes
WE NEED A CLIFFHANGER REMEMBER THE XINDI?!?!
For two seasons. They totally missed the Lost train, which was hilariously seen again when CBS gave Braga a big-boy prime time network TV show and he totally faceplanted it.
I'm also someone who really dislikes season 4 because it became official fan-fiction - who cares how the Klingons lost their forehead ridges? - but I think by that time Star Trek was also pretty much dead.
I'm not sure why anyone would hate the first two seasons, it's perfectly fine by the numbers Star Trek.
Season 3 tho...LETS MAKE STAR TREK ABOUT WAR. Way to miss the point guys.
Season 3 tho...LETS MAKE STAR TREK ABOUT WAR. Way to miss the point guys.
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Viewer fatigue, similar storylines and people making obviously burned out but not wanting to give up a cushy gig.
Enterprise is not bad, but it's fairly middling. It has some main characters so dull that even Voyager wouldn't have them in small walk-on bit parts. Trying to replicate Seven by having a Vulcan woman in a tight costume, but not as good. There's a reason that you've rarely heard from anyone outside of Scott Bakula.
also decon. Simultaneously the very best and worst thing in a Star Trek series.
Voyager and Enterprise hold up well enough if you watch them in isolation and not alongside better Trek shows.
Enterprise is not bad, but it's fairly middling. It has some main characters so dull that even Voyager wouldn't have them in small walk-on bit parts. Trying to replicate Seven by having a Vulcan woman in a tight costume, but not as good. There's a reason that you've rarely heard from anyone outside of Scott Bakula.
also decon. Simultaneously the very best and worst thing in a Star Trek series.
Voyager and Enterprise hold up well enough if you watch them in isolation and not alongside better Trek shows.
Archer had 2 emotions, angry and cocky. Sometimes both at the same time.
Mayweather, Hoshi and the British guy I can't even remember his name were background props. They had no character at all.
T'Pol was frequently reduced to fan service and/or rape plots.
The Doctor was a sociopath.
Trip surprisingly (along with T'Pol) was the best character.
Most plots went something like this:
Archer: "We're gonna go here/do this"
T'Pol: "that's not a good idea, it's really dangerous or unethical"
Archer: " Don't tell me what to do, you dumb Vulcan"
*Proceeds to endanger and/or kill the lives of his crew and hundreds/thousands of other innocents*
Archer:" hmm, that didn't go as I expected. Maybe I should learn from this?"
*Learns nothing. Repeats exact same problem next episode*
Mayweather, Hoshi and the British guy I can't even remember his name were background props. They had no character at all.
T'Pol was frequently reduced to fan service and/or rape plots.
The Doctor was a sociopath.
Trip surprisingly (along with T'Pol) was the best character.
Most plots went something like this:
Archer: "We're gonna go here/do this"
T'Pol: "that's not a good idea, it's really dangerous or unethical"
Archer: " Don't tell me what to do, you dumb Vulcan"
*Proceeds to endanger and/or kill the lives of his crew and hundreds/thousands of other innocents*
Archer:" hmm, that didn't go as I expected. Maybe I should learn from this?"
*Learns nothing. Repeats exact same problem next episode*