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Oct 26, 2017
13,606


Genius Sonority, a team formed by folks originating from Heartbeat who worked on Dragon Quest 6 and 7. Funny enough, the founder of Genius Sonority, Manabu Yamana, originated at Chunsoft and worked on Dragon Quest 1-3.

The team was apparently formed using money from Yamauchi's Q-Fund and would for a number of years work exclusively on Pokemon spin-offs. Most notably Pokemon Colosseum, XD, Battle Revolution, Trozei, Typing, Battle Trozei, and their last to date; Pokemon Shuffle.

Pokemon Colosseum was the debut of a Pokemon RPG for a Nintendo home console, and getting Dragon Quest veterans was a pretty... genius idea! Anyway, the game more or less was a follow-up to the EPD Kyoto-developed Pokemon Stadium games on the N64, but obviously had a different flavor despite using the same battle engine and like, 90% of the Pokemon models (with little to no changes).

Pokemon XD would basically be a more polished up sequel. Human characters were much better modelled and had better animations to boot, as well as fleshing out the Shadow moveset to be more than just Shadow Rush.

Pokemon Battle Revolution would be their only Pokemon project on Wii and instead of an RPG, they went back to a more Stadium-like model. Much of the models (but not all) got remade for the game. Likely due to the 2-year contract prohibiting the 4Kids actors from returning to the series (sans defects Kayzie Rogers and Jimmy Zoppi), Ted Lewis was replaced by veteran narrator Rodger Parsons as the announcer for PBR.

Pokemon Trozei would more or less become the current Pokemon puzzle games, debuting on the DS in 2005 in JP and 2006 in the west.

Then all of the sudden they would work on Dragon Quest again in the form of Dragon Quest Swords for Wii, apparently not just being credited in the Planning, but actually took a more direct role, with GS-veteran James Turner even being the Art Director, as he was in their Pokemon games. You may recognize his name. :P

But then something happened.

First in 2008 it was found out that Genius Sonority were apparently hiring for an original RPG for Wii. Hype as hell right? Too bad, it got canned. That same year, it seemed the team got heavily down-sized. A number of folks would join Game Freak (like James Turner), and some would form Tabot Inc. (now known as Appci Inc.).

During this troubled few years, they'd make some small DS games, including a TINKERBELL DS game of all things. Blew my fucking mind when I saw their logo on the back cover one day at a store out of curiosity. Their last DS game would be this bizarre Pokemon typing game that never even came out in NA.

Then on 3DS they'd have a semi-resurgence in the form of a new Pokemon spin-off again in the form of Pokemon Battle Trozei. It even featured the return of GS's trusty composer Tsukasa Tawada, who last worked with them on PBR. Pokemon Typing was composed by Basiscape. Speaking of, Genius Sonority finally got to make a new IP; The Denpa Men on 3DS, which was also composed by Basiscape. Funny enough again, Appci actually worked with Tsukasa Tawada to compose a number of the Natsume Harvest Moon games they made like the two on 3DS. So yeah, the connections never die! :P

Unfortunately after Battle Trozei and Denpa Men, Genius Sonority sort of remained on cruise control, releasing numerous sequels to Denpa Men, as well as Pokemon Shuffle on both 3DS and even mobile, which they'd kept the lights on for like 4 years at this point, with nothing new since then.

Hope's not lost. Manabu Yamana confirmed back in an interview for New Years 2019 that they would finally release their next project this year hopefully:


■ Genius Sonority

Manabu Yamana, President

Known for: The Denpa Men series, Pokemon Shuffle

"I'm sorry we didn't release any titles in 2018, but in 2019 we will definitely release something!"

... Well we're still waiting, but at least it's a blip on the radar again! They're long overdue for a Switch game. Hopefully another Pokemon game. Hell I'd take them assisting with Sword & Shield (which James Turner is the Art Director of, same as from his Genius Sonority days).

On a small note, Appci actually helped out with Pokemon Ultra Sun & Ultra Moon (credited as Tabot), so already we potentially had more former Genius Sonority folks involved with Pokemon again! :P Hopefully they're back for Sword & Shield as well.

The best scenario is a new Genius Sonority-led Pokemon game with Game Freak lending James Turner and other GS folks that may be there, and have Appci do the larger programming role and also have Yoshiaki Iwasawa who was Genius Sonority's Director of Development who's there back in the same role. The world needs a new Genius Sonority Pokemon RPG dammit! :P

What are your thoughts?
 

Theswweet

RPG Site
Verified
Oct 25, 2017
6,404
California
I loved the idea of a Pokemon game built like a more traditional RPG, with an emphasis on double battles. Colosseum was far from perfect, but I'd love to see another game in the series like it - complete with a darker tone. XD was more polished but it lost a lot of what I really loved about Colosseum.
 

Zalman

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,896
I don't really think there's room for Genius Sonority Pokémon RPGs anymore. It was cool on the GameCube because that was all we had. And while the games had a unique tone, let's be real: They were also incredibly flawed.

I would much rather see them do something completely different. A new type of Pokémon spinoff maybe.
 

DocSeuss

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,784
Wish they'd do a new Colosseum game. I played idk, around 1000 hours of Shuffle. Loved that game.
 

Professor Beef

Official ResetEra™ Chao Puncher
Member
Oct 25, 2017
22,498
The Digital World
Col/XD were ok but man I hated the emphasis on double battles. With the games being how they are now, there's not really a need for that style of game anymore I guess.
 

Lukar

Unshakable Resolve - Prophet of Truth
Member
Oct 27, 2017
23,354
I hope they get a chance to do another Pokémon RPG at some point, though I doubt they will now that Game Freak is doing console games. Played a bit of Colosseum and XD recently for the first time since the GameCube days, and I really appreciated the differences in tone and aesthetic.
 
OP
OP
Hero of Legend
Oct 26, 2017
13,606
What the hell happened to the resurrection of Heartbeat?

Yeah, I meant to mention that. It just sort of.. never happened. Maybe it conflicted with Manabu Yamana's potential Nintendo-exclusivity if it was meant to be a multiplat dev? He likely couldn't run both devs in that case, or else why revive the name?
 

Oregano

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
22,878
Yeah, I meant to mention that. It just sort of.. never happened. Maybe it conflicted with Manabu Yamana's potential Nintendo-exclusivity if it was meant to be a multiplat dev? He likely couldn't run both devs in that case, or else why revive the name?

Yeah, I thought the whole reason it was being brought back was to do non-Nintendo stuff...
 

lvl 99 Pixel

Member
Oct 25, 2017
44,652
Colosseum and its followup were really not good games, and Battle Revolution was a huge waste of money. That said something like a free BR for people subscribed to the Pokemon Home service would be cool.
 

AzureFlame

Member
Oct 30, 2017
4,253
Kuwait
Some of the most hideous character designs in any jrpg and seemingly n64 Pokemon models. The entire game being this really desaturated palette is like the antithesis to what makes Pokemon an appealing franchise.

If you want to talk bad pokemon games there are some but will not agree with you on these, they were pretty good spinoff games for the franchise.
 

Big Yoshi

Member
Nov 25, 2018
1,806
Some of the most hideous character designs in any jrpg and seemingly n64 Pokemon models. The entire game being this really desaturated palette is like the antithesis to what makes Pokemon an appealing franchise.

don't really understand whyhaving a different take on the series is a bad thing, especially considering how Pokemon has basically stayed the same throughout 7 generations of games.

Especially when X&Y are so mediocre and Sword and Shield are getting flack for not simply porting models from the 3ds games.
 

lvl 99 Pixel

Member
Oct 25, 2017
44,652
don't really understand whyhaving a different take on the series is a bad thing, especially considering how Pokemon has basically stayed the same throughout 7 generations of games.

Especially when X&Y are so mediocre and Sword and Shield are getting flack for not simply porting models from the 3ds games.

I think you're mistaken. I love the spin-offs, sometimes more than the main games. Just really did not enjoy what they went for with Colosseum.
Linear rpgs with story that I don't really care for are why im never replaying Sun and Moon.
 

Big Yoshi

Member
Nov 25, 2018
1,806
I think you're mistaken. I love the spin-offs, sometimes more than the main games. Just really did not enjoy what they went for with Colosseum.
Linear rpgs with story that I don't really care for are why im never replaying Sun and Moon.

But all pokemon games are linear rpgs with bad stories? Maybe not 100% in Gold & Silver and Red & Blue but almost everyone does all the badges in about the same order.
am I missing something here? Is it that there is less story in the other pokemon games?
 
Jun 2, 2019
4,947
Colosseum and its follow up were good games.

No, they really weren't, not only they didn't reflect the GameCube's power with everything being modeled N64 style, the unconnected map and almost exclusivity of trainer battles made them a chore to play. They were also ugly as fuck and the Dark pokémon mechanic is only good on paper.

Let's not forget the 251 first pokemon literally asset flipped from the Stadium games.

Yes, I'm still pissed after all the hype.

And then they go and screw up Battle Revolution reducing content and connectivity compared to Stadium 2, use a target render to announce the game instead of real gameplay and they Still reuse every asset they can

Well, at the very least online was good, and DS multiplayer was quick to set up, I had really good times taking my Wii to a friend's house and having our Diamond-Pearl battles over his house.

Especially when X&Y are so mediocre

But they aren't. Specially compared to Genius Sonority offerings and having the best multiplayer aspect in the whole series
 

Deleted member 8593

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 26, 2017
27,176
Dragon Quest Blades, which they worked on, might have one of the best DQ soundtracks in years and Pokémon Shuffle is extremely addictive but other than that I've always found their offerings to be pretty mediocre.
 

AzureFlame

Member
Oct 30, 2017
4,253
Kuwait
So you can judge me? sure. Pokken, Mystery Dungeon, the TCG, the original Stadium way back. Opinions are funny things.

No way, i was actually interested in what you liked.

Didn't play Pokken, i love MD alot, they are my favorite spinoffs, the TCG was really good too, i didn't play the orginal stadium but i did see it alot.

Didn't like Trozei, let's go and the ranger series too, i feel didn't give Ranger series the chance they deserve tho, Trozie is just the worst.
 

doodlebob

Member
Mar 11, 2018
1,401
Always felt like these were lesser spinoffs. To me, the best spinoffs are the Pokémon Mystery Dungeon games. The Genius Sonority games carry over ideas from the main series, but it's a weird halfway point with new ideas as well and they just don't blend together as well.

Battle Revolution is fine, though. It's good for what it is.
 

Deleted member 35077

Self-requested ban
Banned
Dec 1, 2017
3,999
I enjoy both games, more so Colosseum than XD, the latter story didn't hold my attention. But I like to bring up something, the expressive animations, people always bring the Stadium games but the Gamecubes gives them hard competition with the Hoenn pokemon.
Shame, the 3DS games never got close to that level.
 

Arithmetician

Member
Oct 9, 2019
1,983
Colosseum was one of the most disappointing games ever for me at the time. Today, I look back at it much more fondly. At least it was something different. I don't understand how in the year of our lord 2019 we are still doing grass/fire/water starters and 8 gyms. Why is 8 the sacred number? Why not 7 or 9?

Colosseum was good just by not being shackled to the same rigid old structure
 

Denryu

Member
Oct 27, 2017
860
Brazil
Im not thaaat big of a fan of Colosseum and XD but they both had kickass music and a few neat ideas like the battle bingo. Shuffle was one of my favorite pokemon spin offs tho!
 

jman0625

One Winged Slayer
Member
Dec 18, 2017
754
Yeah I second this, the music was the single best part of the game. Recurring characters like Mirror B, and a story that got rid of the gym /champion formula, kept the games special enough in my rose-tinted-nostalgic eyes
 

LunaSerena

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,525
I wish they had a new chance to make a Pokemon RPG. While Colosseum and XD weren't the best of the bunch, it was nice that they went for something different than the classic "newbie trainer goes on a journey to get badges and be the new League Champion".
I feel they had a lot of potential to improve on new entries rather than just be tied to stuff like Trozei.
 

CyberMonkey

Member
Jun 20, 2019
234
At least the Gamecube games tried something different. I really liked them when I was younger (not sure how well they would hold up today), despite the flaws. The story was slightly more dark/mature and the battle animations were pretty nice. I loved seeing my Pokémon from the GBA games in 3D, fighting in some of the challenging post-game colosseums.

Battle Revolution looked nice, but it was very bare-bones. It was allegedly extremely rushed in order to release in time for the launch of the Wii in Japan. The beta footage looked amazing, so I would have liked to see what they could have done with stronger hardware.
 
Nov 20, 2017
335
I'd love to see them have an Infinity Ward/Sledgehammer like relationship with Gamefreak, let both teams have a two year cycle to get better games.
 
OP
OP
Hero of Legend
Oct 26, 2017
13,606
I'd love to see them have an Infinity Ward/Sledgehammer like relationship with Gamefreak, let both teams have a two year cycle to get better games.

That'd be so cool. Get Game Freak to take charge of their games, with Genius Sonority taking charge of their own games, and both would take turns releasing games.

They can still share engines and such, but Genius Sonority can go for the more flair and spectacle route in animations and whatnot, while Game Freak do their usual thing. Most would be happy this way. Game Freak have a monopoly and that's NOT a good thing.
 

Deleted member 176

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
37,160
Battle Revloution was the best. Best looking Pokemon game to date, unprecedented online play for the time, and fashion 🤩
 

RingoGaSuki

Member
Apr 22, 2019
2,434
Colosseum/XD are some of my favourite games ever made (tied with Emerald for my favourite regular RPG Pokemon), I wish we got another game based in Orre, I'd preorder the minute that was announced without any thought.
 
Oct 27, 2017
5,364
Between Dragon Quest Swords, the Pokemon spin offs, and the Denpa Men games, Genius Sonority did a pretty good job making these really charming games on a low budget.

It's a shame that it doesn't seem like there's a place for developers like them in today's industry. Feels like spin offs are all but forgotten these days, seeing Project Resistance be a thing last month was so surprising honestly.
 

Dwebble

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
9,623
That'd be so cool. Get Game Freak to take charge of their games, with Genius Sonority taking charge of their own games, and both would take turns releasing games.

They can still share engines and such, but Genius Sonority can go for the more flair and spectacle route in animations and whatnot, while Game Freak do their usual thing. Most would be happy this way. Game Freak have a monopoly and that's NOT a good thing.
Genius Sonority are basically a skeleton staff nowadays. They certainly don't have the capacity or experience for flair and spectacle in a full-scale RPG (not that they ever did- Colosseum made swinging cuts to the scope of a Pokémon game, and looked simply terrible.)
 
Oct 27, 2017
5,364
Genius Sonority are basically a skeleton staff nowadays. They certainly don't have the capacity or experience for flair and spectacle in a full-scale RPG (not that they ever did- Colosseum made swinging cuts to the scope of a Pokémon game, and looked simply terrible.)

Feels like them and some other 3DS developers weren't able to make the next generational shift with the Switch.
 

Smartlord

Member
Oct 27, 2017
200
I totally get the criticism for Colosseum and XD, but I personally liked them both a lot. The Pokemon asset reuse was fine to me, considering the budgets they probably had, and I really liked the change in tone and setting. I really hope we get to see Orre again, though maybe with a proper world map rather than a fast travel overworld, and with a less rigidly linear structure. Other than those two things, I really liked the emphasis on double battles, and combining Pokemon's two main mechanics, trainer battles and capturing, into one combined snagging mechanic was very fun to me. The darker tone was cool as well, and I really like when Pokemon isn't afraid to embrace a little more darkness. especially since it's still very kid friendly. Shadow Pokemon were an interesting change of pace, and I really liked how in both Colosseum and XD they often had unique moves when purified that weren't normally available.

Also, I'm not going to go into it because I know it's a controversial shit show, but asset reuse made a lot more sense in the Gamecube gen for a much smaller budget spinoff title, than it does for the newer games's much bigger budget mainline title. A new Orre title very naturally fits the future path the series is taking, as it was already a series with a much smaller roster of Pokemon available.
 
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Scarlet Spider

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,743
Brooklyn, NY
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Had no idea this thread even existed. Despite some issues with the three games I may have, I find myself coming back to these games far more often after XY. I truly value everything Genius Sonority did during 2003-2007. The atmosphere and beauty of these games always captivate me even now. Especially XD. Battles were a blast, dynamic and full of personality and still gives me a sense of wonder when battling. Something sorely lacking from the static battles of the mainline games. At least for me personally.

Still a bit salty Michael wasn't Wes and Rui's son, he reminds me of both of them appearance wise.
 

Iride

Member
Oct 28, 2017
179
I have a real soft spot for the Orre games, though yes they're not without flaws. What comes to mind when I think of a flaw is the terrible level spike in Colosseum's endgame.

Something I do like about it is how, among the obtainable Pokemon, it wasn't only fan favourites and in early-mid game, they didn't have especially great stats, so it encouraged using different Pokemon than what most people are used to or would gravitate toward.
 

kodax_shc

Member
Oct 27, 2017
6,437
Southern California
Sorry to bump this from so long ago but I am in the middle of a replay of Colosseum right now. This is my first time playing the game since 2004, I was more excited for this game then anything else in life back then, spent more than 60 hours with the game according to my old save file. Also found some of my old prized pokemon hidden away safely in the PC.

Coming back to it has been pretty fun surprisingly. While the game is hideous and battles are really slow I still find myself enjoying the game. It's more challenging than any of the recent Pokemon offerings due in part to the limited roster and more so if you insist on catching all shadow Pokemon upon their first encounter. I love that everybody is super edgy, and the localization is questionable, the game is certainly a product from the "who are you?" era of Nintendo.

Will probably bit a while before I finish the game, only able to play about 3 hours a day right now. Like when I was a kid waiting to get out of school to go home and play here I am at work waiting to go home and play.

Not that I play but it would be neat to see some of these characters show up in Pokemon Masters someday. Would go a long way to legitimizing these games that the pokemon company often ignores.