13 Sentinels is a sci-fi visual novel + tower defence strategy game that has received a huge amount of critical acclaim.
Also, in the worst game you played in 2020 thread, a few posts cited 13 Sentinels. The common complaint is that the game contains problematic anime fan service, including the sexualization of underage girls.
If the problem is this bad, it should change how we discuss the game. We should refrain from recommending it and rather than being concerned it sold poorly, we should be glad and say it deserved it for continuing these tropes that are harmful to women.
I'm undecided on what perspective to take. I finished the game and I loved it, because it had an amazing sci-fi story. However, I've been consuming Japanese media for nearly 20 years. It's entirely possible that I'm so desensitized by seeing worse problems that I'm not a good judge of this game's content. I am willing to accept that I am totally wrong about this game.
So I'd like to see Resetera's opinion at large by presenting some examples for discussion.
Note All images in this thread are from a game rated T by ESRB. So nothing pornographic at least.
1) Nudity
Possibly NSFW, use discretion. These are 'high school' characters inside mechs. They are nude, although thankfully no 'explicit' parts are shown.
Thoughts? Are these images a problem?
2) Fan Service - adult character
Below is an adult character in the game.
The breast size and ass shot on the left are both clearly unnecessary. How bad do you think this is?
3) Fan Service - young characters
There is a brief panty shot when a character awkwardly falls down before covering herself. Here is the shot in question.
There is a character that is almost always wearing gym shorts.
There are a few other cases around a similar 'level'. Is this unforgivably bad?
My opinions
1) On nudity - I know the 'story reason' for this, but it could have been presented differently without harming the plot. The pigtail girl's portrait in particular makes me feel a bit awkward. However, I don't think the art is egregiously sexualized. I'd rather the game didn't have it, but this particular art didn't detract from my enjoyment.
2) On the adult fanservice - the game should receive criticism for the ass shot. It's unnecessary and detracts from the character. Thankfully it is not super common, and is an adult character at least.
3) On the young fanservice - The game shouldn't have this and Japan should move away from this legacy. The best thing I can say is that it's kept pretty minimal with, IIRC, 4 or so instances or so over the course of a 30 hour game as far as I recall. It still deserves to be criticized though as again, this should never have been a thing and Japan needs to get rid of it.
My predicament
The game, in my opinion, has an outstanding sci-fi story. Without going into details, I'd say you could make a case for it being best-of-genre in gaming. Not saying that's right, but you could make the case!
However, it has some issues with fanservice, and we shouldn't sweep them under the rug.
My struggle is, I want to praise this game for its strengths, because I think it deserves it. It deserves to be played to experience them, because it's clear a ton of talent and time went into weaving this complex tale. I also want to criticize it for what it does wrong. But I don't think I want to completely disregard everything good the game does because of those issues.
What do you think era? Based on these examples, do you think the game can be praised for anything else it does or would you say these are "unforgivable"?
Also, in the worst game you played in 2020 thread, a few posts cited 13 Sentinels. The common complaint is that the game contains problematic anime fan service, including the sexualization of underage girls.
If the problem is this bad, it should change how we discuss the game. We should refrain from recommending it and rather than being concerned it sold poorly, we should be glad and say it deserved it for continuing these tropes that are harmful to women.
I'm undecided on what perspective to take. I finished the game and I loved it, because it had an amazing sci-fi story. However, I've been consuming Japanese media for nearly 20 years. It's entirely possible that I'm so desensitized by seeing worse problems that I'm not a good judge of this game's content. I am willing to accept that I am totally wrong about this game.
So I'd like to see Resetera's opinion at large by presenting some examples for discussion.
Note All images in this thread are from a game rated T by ESRB. So nothing pornographic at least.
1) Nudity
Possibly NSFW, use discretion. These are 'high school' characters inside mechs. They are nude, although thankfully no 'explicit' parts are shown.
Thoughts? Are these images a problem?
2) Fan Service - adult character
Below is an adult character in the game.
The breast size and ass shot on the left are both clearly unnecessary. How bad do you think this is?
3) Fan Service - young characters
There is a brief panty shot when a character awkwardly falls down before covering herself. Here is the shot in question.
There is a character that is almost always wearing gym shorts.
There are a few other cases around a similar 'level'. Is this unforgivably bad?
My opinions
1) On nudity - I know the 'story reason' for this, but it could have been presented differently without harming the plot. The pigtail girl's portrait in particular makes me feel a bit awkward. However, I don't think the art is egregiously sexualized. I'd rather the game didn't have it, but this particular art didn't detract from my enjoyment.
2) On the adult fanservice - the game should receive criticism for the ass shot. It's unnecessary and detracts from the character. Thankfully it is not super common, and is an adult character at least.
3) On the young fanservice - The game shouldn't have this and Japan should move away from this legacy. The best thing I can say is that it's kept pretty minimal with, IIRC, 4 or so instances or so over the course of a 30 hour game as far as I recall. It still deserves to be criticized though as again, this should never have been a thing and Japan needs to get rid of it.
My predicament
The game, in my opinion, has an outstanding sci-fi story. Without going into details, I'd say you could make a case for it being best-of-genre in gaming. Not saying that's right, but you could make the case!
However, it has some issues with fanservice, and we shouldn't sweep them under the rug.
My struggle is, I want to praise this game for its strengths, because I think it deserves it. It deserves to be played to experience them, because it's clear a ton of talent and time went into weaving this complex tale. I also want to criticize it for what it does wrong. But I don't think I want to completely disregard everything good the game does because of those issues.
What do you think era? Based on these examples, do you think the game can be praised for anything else it does or would you say these are "unforgivable"?