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Oct 27, 2017
6,960
Meh.

The expansion further made Expeditions worse. Good job, where is the bottom? Release one useless, one super-overpowered hero shutting down half of other champions. Nerf that 2/1 Sand Soldier caller to 1/1.

Landmarks still crappy, No Malphite Emote, Expeditions worse, Season Pass 3 weeks away...

Dont' want to go back to MTGA :(
 
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niaobx

Banned
Aug 3, 2020
1,053
They have the 4 mana 3/2 Draw a Champion and give it +2/+2. This is a strong effect and they also have Right of Calling. Combined with Predicts, Shurima is the most consistent region in the game at executing their game plans.

The new 1 mana -2 and Predict card is strong too. Quicksand is a high potential card and so is Hourglass. They have ability to disrupt similar to Ionia. They have potential Fearsome synergy in the future and the top tier Slay/Nasus package.

Then of course there is the Swarm package with Azir that works well in a couple of decks. There are high potential cards like Sivir and Ruin Runner that could explode in a mid range Shurima deck combined with so many ways to grant enemies Vulnerable (Shurima is pretty much the Vulnerable region now over Bilgewater). The space where they are lacking the most is the landmark stuff.

Are there some good cards and is it possible to make a good deck that includes Shurima? Absolutely. But the region as a whole is rather weak in my opinion. 4 mana 3/2 draw a champion and predict stuff is just too slow. You can predict all you want, in the time that you do it, the opponent just builds up their board or straight up kills you.

And even if I am wrong about the region's power level, there is no denying that Mono Shurima is bad, and if that's the case, then Sun Disc is a failed concept.

And yes, I am salty about it. I just want to reliably Ascend the Sand Gods in peace :(
 

cheesekao

Member
Dec 1, 2017
2,760
Are there some good cards and is it possible to make a good deck that includes Shurima? Absolutely. But the region as a whole is rather weak in my opinion. 4 mana 3/2 draw a champion and predict stuff is just too slow. You can predict all you want, in the time that you do it, the opponent just builds up their board or straight up kills you.

And even if I am wrong about the region's power level, there is no denying that Mono Shurima is bad, and if that's the case, then Sun Disc is a failed concept.

And yes, I am salty about it. I just want to reliably Ascend the Sand Gods in peace :(
I can get my sun disc off once every 2 or 3 games with a triple champ mono shurima deck. It's not top tier but I wouldn't call it bad as it still wins its fair share of games. You can also build a mono Azir deck right now with all the new countdown support. I ran into a few of them earlier and I was surprised at how they managed to activate their sun discs without much hassle.
 

Dahbomb

Community Resettler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,614
Sun Disc isn't top tier but it's playable. The concept does work. Shurima just needs some healing and better stall cards, then that deck could be great. Remember that we still have 1 more expansion plus a mini one coming to help out Shurima and every new Shurima tool they print also could help Mono Shurima.
 

Lumination

Member
Oct 26, 2017
12,461
Hm, I just lost a 7th expedition win because I couldn't cast Time in a Bottle without a landmark on the board, thus not able to proc Red Card for the 1dmg I needed. I can how see that makes sense. But I could 99% swear I saw someone do it on stream yesterday. Probably misremembered! On a related note, the 1m -2 atk spell goes through spellshield. That's definitely a reproducible bug.
 

jman1954goat

Linked the Fire
Member
May 9, 2020
12,414
On how to play it or what to craft first?
I am about to drop $10 to craft the full popular list.

I know people say don't spend money but I don't see the downside (besides having less money Obviously)

Looking for tips on how to play it.

what to mulligan for?
also what are the good and bad matchups?

stuff like that

any tips on playing it really.
 
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Dahbomb

Community Resettler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,614
I am about to drop $10 to craft the full popular list.
Looking for tips on how to play it.

what to mulligan for?
also what are the good and bad matchups?

stuff like that

any tips on playing it really.
You mulligan based on the match ups.

Against aggro you want Blighted Ravines, Ice Shards, Wails, Avalanches Vile Feasts etc.

You generally keep Lissandra in all match up since she is good even against aggro decks.

Babbling Berg pulls out Matron always but you only want to use Matron for the Watcher OTK combo.

For the combo you need Ice Pillar from Trundle as well which means getting both Trundle and Lissandra, which is why Entreat is run in the deck. Against control/slower decks you want to have both Champions + Matron combo pieces.

The combo is play Lissandra, play Trundle, play Ice Pillar, Fading Memory on Ice Pillar, summon another one, this will flip Lissandra giving you Watcher, then use Matron on the Watcher for the "OTK". Sometimes you can get to the combo in other ways if Lissandra was already flipped.


The worst match up is definitely combo decks that can kill you before you get your combo off. The worst one being Lee Sin but you probably won't see it too much online. All the Freeze spells plus Three Sisters help against Lee Sin. The other bad match ups are board independent aggressive decks like Lucian Azir or some type of burn decks. Decks that can do damage even with few units on board through stuff like Emperor's Dai or over the top finishers. Beefy mid range decks also give Lissandra Trundle trouble as with only only a few Vengeance you can't remove the big units like a buffed Renekton or some of the Demacia units. Good match ups are board based aggro decks like Discard Aggro or any deck vulnerable to board sweeps. Also slower decks since with the Watcher combo you can kill them before they get their control condition online.


Another tip for the Watcher combo is that you want to use it when they don't have a Champion on board because even if they don't have a deck, then they can simply cycle their champion into their decks repeatedly. This doesn't come up that often but it is something to consider... Champion spells keep duplicating and putting Champions into the deck which become the champion spells on draws.

For play patterns you want to be playing as reactively and stall heavy as possible (in most cases). Use the Pass button aggressively, bank spell mana and always be the last one to make an action. This deck isn't easy to play and you will mess up a few times early on. Against aggressive decks, don't shy away from playing Fading Memories on smaller units like Sentry and Tavern Keeper to stabilize.
 

jman1954goat

Linked the Fire
Member
May 9, 2020
12,414
You mulligan based on the match ups.

Against aggro you want Blighted Ravines, Ice Shards, Wails, Avalanches Vile Feasts etc.

You generally keep Lissandra in all match up since she is good even against aggro decks.

Babbling Berg pulls out Matron always but you only want to use Matron for the Watcher OTK combo.

For the combo you need Ice Pillar from Trundle as well which means getting both Trundle and Lissandra, which is why Entreat is run in the deck. Against control/slower decks you want to have both Champions + Matron combo pieces.

The combo is play Lissandra, play Trundle, play Ice Pillar, Fading Memory on Ice Pillar, summon another one, this will flip Lissandra giving you Watcher, then use Matron on the Watcher for the "OTK". Sometimes you can get to the combo in other ways if Lissandra was already flipped.


The worst match up is definitely combo decks that can kill you before you get your combo off. The worst one being Lee Sin but you probably won't see it too much online. All the Freeze spells plus Three Sisters help against Lee Sin. The other bad match ups are board independent aggressive decks like Lucian Azir or some type of burn decks. Decks that can do damage even with few units on board through stuff like Emperor's Dai or over the top finishers. Beefy mid range decks also give Lissandra Trundle trouble as with only only a few Vengeance you can't remove the big units like a buffed Renekton or some of the Demacia units. Good match ups are board based aggro decks like Discard Aggro or any deck vulnerable to board sweeps. Also slower decks since with the Watcher combo you can kill them before they get their control condition online.


Another tip for the Watcher combo is that you want to use it when they don't have a Champion on board because even if they don't have a deck, then they can simply cycle their champion into their decks repeatedly. This doesn't come up that often but it is something to consider... Champion spells keep duplicating and putting Champions into the deck which become the champion spells on draws.
Thanks for such a detailed reply. you are so nice :)
 

jman1954goat

Linked the Fire
Member
May 9, 2020
12,414
First impressions of Lisandra/Trundle (does the deck have a more official name?) is that it's very fun (might be favorite deck so far still early.)

Haven't actually done the combo yet Messed up because I did not realize Spectral Matron summon would not allow you to replace a Unit. (no board space for watcher)

Still won that game because Your Nexus being tough is very powerful and Opponent did not have enough burn

It feels really nice to play Control.
 
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Lumination

Member
Oct 26, 2017
12,461
First impressions of Lisandra/Trundle (does the deck have a more official name?) is that it's very fun (might be favorite deck so far still early.)

Haven't actually done the combo yet Messed up because I did not realize Spectral Matron summon would not allow you to replace a Unit. (no board space for watcher)

Still won that game because Your Nexus being tough is very powerful and Opponent did not have enough burn

It feels really nice to play Control.
Glad you're enjoying it!

Another good classic control deck is Zoe/Aurelion Sol. This one is the more traditional generate resources out of a toolbox until you have a finisher. It loses to TLC (the official name of your deck), but wins against the new Irelia/Azir aggro style since your dragons grow by +1/+1 every time they kill a blade or sand soldier. You can replace Zoe with Shyvana too.
 

Dahbomb

Community Resettler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,614
Been playing with both Frozen Thralls and Mono Shurima.

Both are much improved decks with tier 3 potential. Thralls is a very potent anti control, anti greed deck that I expect to see some competitive play as a counter line up. Mono Shurima still needs an edge but at least you can have more fun with it and it's more consistent. The 3 mana 4/3 Vulnerable/Fearsome, Clockhand and Soothsayer are big for it.

Both of these decks get beat badly by the Irelia swarm decks however this is just a temporary meta state that will resolve and soon we will be seeing more anti aggro decks on ladder.


Side note: Even in a heavy Landmark deck like Thralls... Taliyah is horrendously bad. Promised Future is a better Taliyah in that deck. And so are thr Grumpy Rockbears, the 5 mana advance follower and that 1 mana spell advance. These cards need buffs badly.

Renekton getting that 3 mana is so huge for him too. The Freljord Shurima Overwhelm deck now feels complete.
 

Sylvee

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,562
Turn 8 of a close game vs Irelia Azir, I'm on Dragons and am close to turning the corner. He plays Irelia with no Inspiring Marshal or Azir, I drop Solari Sunforger after basically blanking his turn 6 attack with one. Instant concede. Was laughing for a good 5 minutes after that.
 

Dahbomb

Community Resettler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,614
Stats are out on Mobalytics now.

Irelia + Azir best deck right now with both highest win rates and play rates.

Thresh Nasus right next to it.

A lot of the usual aggro decks like Spider Burn, Pirate Burn and Discard Aggro still doing well. Same for Liss Control, Ez Draven and Ashe Marauders also holding well. Very few Targon decks right now.

Big surprise is tier 1 win rate on Renekton + Darius, updated Shurima + Noxus aggro deck. That Merciless Hunter doing work. Chirean Sumpwork Burn deck also coming in hot on the stats.

Zilean and Malphite huge flops right now. Best Zilean deck is an adjusted Nasus deck which is a weaker version of existing Nasus decks and Malphite has sub 40% winrates across the board. Taliyah nowhere in sight.
 

cheesekao

Member
Dec 1, 2017
2,760
Starting to see some cancer cells Fioras popping up again. I hope it stays minimal so that I don't have to bust out my removal spam deck.
 

Lumination

Member
Oct 26, 2017
12,461
Ironically, Shurima's own new 3m 4/3 vulnerable card will be what suppresses Zilean the most. Zilean definitely has the type of evergreen design that will pop up SOMETIME. I'm not even entirely sure he's out for the count in this mini-exp. Nice to see Azir and Renekton getting a bit more spotlight after Nasus had been hogging it all (which NO ONE saw coming, which is cool in and of itself).
 

Poodlestrike

Smooth vs. Crunchy
Administrator
Oct 25, 2017
13,489
Yeah, I remember the dead certainty on Nasus being marginally playable at best. Always nice when something like that happens.
 

Dahbomb

Community Resettler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,614
Have to admit that out of the 3 Ascended, I thought Nasus was the weakest one initially although playable in a SI deck due to Atrocity.
 

Lumination

Member
Oct 26, 2017
12,461
tfw it's a mono-teemo deck at 6 wins draft. Had to let him double the shrooms once and then Aftershock one and Homecoming the other. That's 8m for 2m. But I only did it because I knew I could win with one more turn.

58DcRvL.png


Getting a absolutely farmed by azir.

Wouldn't be so bad of it wasn't almost 50% of my games.
Yeah, TLC has basically 0 tools to deal with 1/1 spam. There's The Box and that's it. It's gonna be one of the most polarized matchups you see. The dragon flavor of control I mentioned earlier will be better since they have actual board presence, they can tank 1/1s for free, and Demacia eats Azir alive.
 
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Greenlock

Member
Oct 3, 2018
69
Have been playing casually since beta but never really tried ranked or gauntlets for real. Tried one now though and got 4 wins in the gauntlet. Got a prime glory, thats nice :) Gonna try again next week and possibly in the last chance tournament as well. Really liking the best of 3 format in gauntlet, feels like I can plan more.

jJKrGmj.jpg
 

jman1954goat

Linked the Fire
Member
May 9, 2020
12,414
I got a prime glory as well

Went undefeated 8-0 in my first ever Guantlet.

I Used TLC, Pirate Aggro,and Deep.

My opponents usually only had 1 really strong deck which I was able to Ban.

Is there mmr in Guantlet? My run seemed almost too easy so I wonder if I was being matched with other noobs like me or was I just lucky?
 

Dahbomb

Community Resettler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,614
LOL @ Swims Swole Squirrel tech in this meta.

True genius.
 
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Dahbomb

Community Resettler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,614
clips.twitch.tv

Twitch

Twitch is the world's leading video platform and community for gamers.

Most hilarious moment on stream right now.
 

Lumination

Member
Oct 26, 2017
12,461
Have been playing casually since beta but never really tried ranked or gauntlets for real. Tried one now though and got 4 wins in the gauntlet. Got a prime glory, thats nice :) Gonna try again next week and possibly in the last chance tournament as well. Really liking the best of 3 format in gauntlet, feels like I can plan more.

jJKrGmj.jpg
I got a prime glory as well

Went undefeated 8-0 in my first ever Guantlet.

I Used TLC, Pirate Aggro,and Deep.

My opponents usually only had 1 really strong deck which I was able to Ban.

Is there mmr in Guantlet? My run seemed almost too easy so I wonder if I was being matched with other noobs like me or was I just lucky?
Congrats!! I don't believe there is MMR matching, just simply # of wins matching to promote allowing everyone to realistically participate, but don't quote me on it. Always see a few silver/bronze players qualify for the seasonal open which is cool tbh.
 

Dahbomb

Community Resettler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,614
Man why are so many people playing that awful Cithria + Matron deck? Must be speaking to people's inner Timmy summoning a HUGE Cithria.
 
Oct 27, 2017
6,960
Meh, why cannot we have skins?

Project Renekton: new level-up animation, voice lines and card art.
This decorative magician Tahn Kench thing.
Anime girl Leona

I would do what LoL peasants do: play the champs we have skins for.

58026.jpg

223011.jpg

iu


(available for shards uwu)
 
Oct 27, 2017
6,960
skins are coming but LOL at buying them with shards

Trade Offer:
• Riot games gets 10k shards
• I get Project Yasuo skin

No, I know there is no way shards are worth anything cosmetic. Though I hope that the skin price will cap at sub-1000RP. $5 for the artwork change, $10 for the new audio/level-up/effect skin.

Also, I have the best ESO tip: Don't.
 
Oct 27, 2017
6,960
I'd have a hard time buying literal PNGs. Hope there's more to skins than just that.

Cannot expect all champs to get "Ultimate" skins. From the amount of work that is like 0% right now, and there is probably a limit on space storing those audio effects and shurima movies.

I would rather take a mix of cheaper artwork-only, and premium skins. Alt-art skin for everyone in the near future, with the drip-feed of premium skins.

(alt-art skins for shards)
 
Oct 27, 2017
6,960
Why am I the only one shitposting here. Where are the leaks or announcements about the new event or skins. WHERE IS MY MALPHITE EMOTE?

Poodlestrike how many shards would it cost to unban zerox. 10k? You could buy a Project Renekton next month!
 

Poodlestrike

Smooth vs. Crunchy
Administrator
Oct 25, 2017
13,489

Lumination

Member
Oct 26, 2017
12,461
Starting my climb earlier this season. Knowing that people want to play Nasus and Irelia makes my deckbuilding easier, but after 6 games, I saw neither lol.
 

Dahbomb

Community Resettler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,614
Played like 25-30 games of Yasuo Malphite yesterday and the day before.

While I won most of the games, it was mostly off of the back of the value Targon cards. Mainly the deck did not feature ways to consistently close out games. With something Yasuo + Swain, Yasuo would control the mid game and Swain would be the finisher. Malphite is supposed to be a "finisher" but he can't finish the game by himself even when flipped. It also lacks hard removal when Yasuo isn't on the board and there aren't consistent ways of pulling Yasuo from the deck.

There have been times where I have had a flipped Malphite in hand but no good opportunity to play him. Sometimes even when played with Yasuo on board, it takes a few turns to actually finish the game. I had a match against an Asol Dragon player that went to like turn 20 or something.

In general I feel like the game has power crept beyond most of these stun deck concepts. We have a lot of "midrange" decks in the meta and Yasuo decks used to slap midrange decks but the "midrange" decks these days have a fairly low curve and aggressive curve (like Nasus Thresh with the Keeper Butcher non sense). Yasuo requiring 5 stuns to level up also feels too slow these days with champs leveling up within a turn of being played on curve. I am also still waiting for a Yasuo tutor card.

But Yasuo is still a much, much better card than Malphite. Yasuo literally has to carry Malphite on his back in this deck.

And can we talk about how terrible this card is?

04MT009.webp



I never used this card of course but while playing this deck all I could think of was how worse it would have been if I played this card in the deck.


Raphterra's version of Matron Cithria is actually legit and consistent:

w4kqhu3muwy61.png
 
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Mars

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,988
I know I am late, but I am gonna have to eat crow —was not expecting Azir/Irelia to blow up and reach 0 tier status. I figured it would taper off and end up in tier 2 at most after refining and folks return to using "staple" decks. Gonna give it a go myself, I haven't played since the day the expansion dropped.
 

Dahbomb

Community Resettler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,614
It ended up being that even if you countered the deck on paper, nothing stops the deck when they draw the nuts.

More importantly though, the deck has annihilated most slower control decks in the game. That's more problematic overall as the only decks allowed to thrive are decks that can do well into Irelia/Azir.

Will definitely be expecting a couple nerfs coming. Not only because of its power level but due to how popular it is on ladder as well. I think Azir himself is the best candidate for a nerf, should go down to a 1/4.

Dune Keeper I been saying should be a 1/1. It's a 3 of auto include in all the tier 1 decks right now. I also think that the token generated card from Irelia and the Return cars should be 2 mana at least. That would slow down the deck considerably.
 
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Dealan

The King of Games
Member
Oct 28, 2017
348
I was very surprised by the swim video calling it a tier 0 because I saw very little of that deck while climbing diamond this past week. I wonder if there is a non-negligible difference between play/winrate between servers (I'm EU). Unfortunately seeing stats by server is a prenium feature at mobalytics.
 

Dahbomb

Community Resettler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,614
I was very surprised by the swim video calling it a tier 0 because I saw very little of that deck while climbing diamond this past week. I wonder if there is a non-negligible difference between play/winrate between servers (I'm EU). Unfortunately seeing stats by server is a prenium feature at mobalytics.
EU has been very control oriented throughout LORs history. On NA that deck is all over most ranks. The stats on it (playrate) probably the highest we have seen for a singular deck in LoRs history as well.

Tier 0 is presumptuous though and the deck is still counterable especially in tournament line ups. But the deck probably needs addressing for the health of the game.

Like this is concerning for Riot's balancing team:

Screenshot_20210515-124339_Chrome.jpg


A deck with such insanely high playrate and also high winrate.
 
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SkullHydra

One Winged Slayer
The Fallen
Feb 20, 2018
898
The worst thing about Azir/Irelia right now, is when you face one in Expeditions and get stomped on. Expeditions are for playing lower powered games, not facing tier 1 shit. Lol.