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Oct 27, 2017
6,960
Please be good emotes

All that matters

Strangely I got a Sivir champ in the vault, but it only said 1 Champion Card at the summary.

Edit: one champ from vault, another from Expedition capsule. Won 7 games, had this amazing defence turning the game around from what was surely a win in my opponents head. Today was a good day.

We really need a replay-saving fuction...
 
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Lumination

Member
Oct 26, 2017
12,447
Happy Vault Day to all the newbies! Hope you managed to hit lv10 vault for the champion wildcard. For some reason, there's been a bug that doesn't display the wildcard when you open it (I got two expedition tokens instead this week?) but the wildcard should be in your inventory regardless.
 

Won

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,426
I hope all trailers end with atrocity. That got a good chuckle out of me and I wasn't even aware how much the Nasus playrate spiked.
 

Dahbomb

Community Resettler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,612
When I first started the game, I thought Atrocity was the most broken thing in the game and was shocked that more people didn't complain about it.

Now over time I did learn to counter it and play around it so its not been that bad but it still feels bad losing against it. They generally have nerfed cards around Atrocity (Ledros, They Who Endure etc.) but never Atrocity itself. So curious to see what they do next patch if anything at all.
 

Lumination

Member
Oct 26, 2017
12,447
When I first started the game, I thought Atrocity was the most broken thing in the game and was shocked that more people didn't complain about it.

Now over time I did learn to counter it and play around it so its not been that bad but it still feels bad losing against it. They generally have nerfed cards around Atrocity (Ledros, They Who Endure etc.) but never Atrocity itself. So curious to see what they do next patch if anything at all.
Same. Atrocity has always had the solid design to be strong. It's a 6m finisher. Part of the problem is the attitude that if something isn't instantly meta, it's trash.

But if it does limit design space, maybe something needs to be done. Not sure, but leaning towards it's currently manageable.
 

Excelsior

Member
Oct 28, 2017
718
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Dahbomb

Community Resettler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,612
Man these new cards they released together is like a hodge podge of funky stuff.

Standouts include:

Freljord 9 mana Obliterate all and replace with Frozen Tomb. This is really powerful stall spell, perfect for current TLC decks. You can combo with Passage Earned or It That Stares for hilarity.

Cithria Lady of the Clouds: This card is both better and worse than it seems. 10 mana without Overwhelm or any other game winning keyword makes it look worse than it is. However, this is like the 10 mana Celestial card that can win games. Doubling stats an allies and giving them Challenger might not finish the game on the spot but it will finish the game in 1-2 turns there after because its hard for any board to deal with that. Its still 10 mana though and I don't recall Elites having any ways to cheat out expensive cards, that's the last piece of the puzzle they need.

Wings and the Wave: Staple SI Slay card. It's a choose effect, in that you get either a Butcher card or a double fodder body... both are situationally good in that deck.

Monster Harpoon: Can't believe they made this card. This gives Bilgewater a premium removal card and even at 6 mana it is fine. Remember that Grasp of Undying only deals 3 damage for 5, this deals 5 for 6 which is going to kill 90%+ threats in the game. Plunder is a big bonus too and will result in a huge tempo swing.

Bone Skewer: Also good but situationally so. This is pretty solid in Deep with big bodies plus repeatable effects.

Succumb to Cold: Another freeze effect. This probably belongs in a Frozen Thrall deck but I don't think you really need more Frozen Thralls in that deck to begin with. Probably won't be good but that deck doesn't exist yet so we don't really know for sure.

Thrashing Snapper: At first I thought this sucked but then I realized that this is a unique 1 mana Reputation enabler as it will usually hit for 5 damage against a unit. That's solid and might push Reputation decks more.

Incisive Tactician: This card seems weak even if you get the Reputation off. Way too slow and we already stuff like Citrus Courier in the game that barely sees play. Though I will say that Noxus makes much stronger use of Rally than BW, just check out the Marauder deck that uses cards like Shunpo and even Katarina.

Adaptatron 3000: I am assuming "Tech" means those Turrets. Definitely a good card for Assembly and Heimer decks but it remains to be seen if those decks are viable.

Chirean Sumpwork: Its alright, a bit meme-y. 4/2 Elusive with that effect is strong but you are basically spending 2 cards to summon a single OP card that gets removed by Mystic Shot.... I think you need stuff like Counterfeit Coins to make this work better because summoning a bunch of these is really strong.

Ardent Tracker: Needs to be discounted 3 times at least to be good. That's possible in an Elite deck and you can often get it out for 0 mana. Not a bad tempo swing later into the game, I don't know if this is what Elites really needs.
 
Oct 27, 2017
6,960
I kind of want Demacia to pivot away from Elites...

Shyvana was kind of the failure, and Dragons is just another tribal set...

Come on, we need Sylas to give Demacia some magical spice :)
 

Lumination

Member
Oct 26, 2017
12,447
Not a fan of Bone Skewer. Anyone who played Monarchs in YGO knows that top of deck is possibly the worst thing you could do to a card. It's a recall + you lose your next draw. Only maybe Deep with Naut out would want it, but they don't need more Deep payoff in the first place.

The Wings and the Wave is interesting. I don't play slay decks, but I was under the impression they didn't need more fodder, otherwise, they'd run Aristocrat. There's something to be said about the Butcher side, but idk if people would pay 1m for 1hp. Butcher is strongest when used on a tapped out turn to add more pressure. Having to budget the 1m for it seems meh.

Buried in Ice seems great. It's a one-sided wipe and if they want to redevelop, they may have to overwrite their units. Never, ever underestimate one-sided aoe.

I have to assume more Tech cards will come out? A 1/3 with payoff after t5 (nobody's running that turret spam spell) just doesn't seem good. Any amount of loaded keywords on it still doesn't seem worth it. But add a little more support and it could be a premo 1 drop.

Sumpworker seems pretty meme but fun lol.
 
Oct 27, 2017
6,960
Not a fan of Bone Skewer. Anyone who played Monarchs in YGO knows that top of deck is possibly the worst thing you could do to a card. It's a recall + you lose your next draw. Only maybe Deep with Naut out would want it, but they don't need more Deep payoff in the first place.

If you haven't played support Pyke, it is the type of shitter champion who is kind of a coward scrub assassin that cannot 100%->0% someone. He strikes and teleports away, so this card is 100% made for him or his leveling.

But it might be a good card, I like Homecoming. Using a "dead" unit to assassinate someone and escape might be useful, even if you lose a draw.
 

Poodlestrike

Smooth vs. Crunchy
Administrator
Oct 25, 2017
13,489
Cithriaaaaaaa

She's gotta get a champ card at some point. It feels inevitable.

Bone Skewer would've been my pick for Pyke's champ spell, so I'm curious to see what they do there. I'm betting on a pretty powerful Cast/ETB effect; it'd have to be, to justify the topdecking.
 
Oct 27, 2017
6,960
Another Expedition, 7-wins with Yasuo Mono Ionia, champion in the capsule.

180k in the bank, almost 50 champion wildcards. How do I get any value from those?
 

Poodlestrike

Smooth vs. Crunchy
Administrator
Oct 25, 2017
13,489
agreed, she 100% needs to be a Champ

maybe a Kayle-style champ who levels up as the game goes on. have her hold a weak early game that turns into her being a monter late game
Man, I dunno. I get the idea, it's a good one, but Kayle barely functions like that. I don't think they want to introduce a second character in the same mold, lol.

I could see them going with the Silverwing Rider final form. We don't have a flying mount character, really. (Corki doesn't count 'cause it's a machine not a mount.)
 

Dahbomb

Community Resettler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,612
Lots of new countdown landmarks for Targon. Nothing with massive pay off that requires 4+ countdown or something.
 

Lumination

Member
Oct 26, 2017
12,447
They posted some fun stats on their facebook:



14.2M Unique players
Braum and Elise most used champs in both Plat+ and all ranks.
Vlad is the most used non-battle pass paid emote.
 

Sylvee

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,562
Watching a card-game tournament, so boring.

I thought those guys were good at this game, WHY ARE YOU SO DAMN SLOW?


Playing fast =/= Playing well. In pretty much every turn-based strategy game most players will use all of the time given to them to make their decisions because there's not much reason not to. They're also playing for actual money and there's no prize for playing quickly. I can understand not liking the slower game pace and maybe Riot could try and make some changes to incentivize players to play the less impactful turns quicker, but they're playing a very tricky game for money it's expected that they're going to think things through as much as possible.
 
Oct 27, 2017
6,960
Playing fast =/= Playing well. In pretty much every turn-based strategy game most players will use all of the time given to them to make their decisions because there's not much reason not to. They're also playing for actual money and there's no prize for playing quickly. I can understand not liking the slower game pace and maybe Riot could try and make some changes to incentivize players to play the less impactful turns quicker, but they're playing a very tricky game for money it's expected that they're going to think things through as much as possible.

You take so much time, you forget what you were thinking about in the first place.

But perhaps it is a tactics, take super long turns and perhaps you opponent will zone-out forgetting his own plan.

edit: People going into the "negative" time, again. I wasn't serious about complaining how players incapable being fast, of course you will take all your time when there are stakes. However, the game/Riot should tighten-up the timings and make it an actual competitive trait. Completing your moves without taking long-pauses is a skill, despite this not being a real-time game.

Dunno what to do with slow decks like Targon, but at the moment, there are faster decks that still being pushed to the negative time. A lot of the decks/cards are very reactive, and it just happens to be a slow game all the time, where no player wants to strike proactively because it is a bit disadvantagious to do so.
 
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jman1954goat

Linked the Fire
Member
May 9, 2020
12,410
Watching a card-game tournament, so boring.

I thought those guys were good at this game, WHY ARE YOU SO DAMN SLOW?
The fact that they are good is the reason they are so slow.

I've not watched runeterra matches before but in hearthstone esports you also see people play slow because theres so much to think about when it comes to playing optimally.

You have to hand read and predict turns you and your opponent will make multiple turns into the future it's all very complex if you're making the best play possible.

I would be less interested in a strategy Esport if players where just throwing cards will nilly.

Edit: strategizing is the main goal of strategy games. The most fun I have watching twitch streamers are ones slowly talking through turns and the reasons they play what when.

For Esports thinking through all the possibilities with both players is really neat and slow matches dont bother me at all. (haven't watched runeterra yet but many hours of Competative hearthstone)
 
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Oct 27, 2017
6,960
Dis is how I win Expeditions: insta-moves. Moving so fast my opponent loses confidence in himself.

Teemo guy lost :( Rooting for: Anything but Lisandra or Celestials.

No women, no crazy looking people, sitting in from of the cam without any theatrics. Have to root based on decks as opposed to the character. Many don't even have a cam.
 
Oct 27, 2017
6,960
The winner of EU is glorious. Yeah he had Soraka/Kench, but all those shitters with Nasus or Trundle lost :)

Mogwai casting makes those long games ok. There is a genuine surprise and hype in him, contrary to the Asian tournament where the casters were boring.
 

Dahbomb

Community Resettler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,612
More stun stuff in Targon with Malphite?

Ah yes gimme that Yasuo COPIUM!!

At the very least, Malphite's champion spell is really good and usable standalone.
 

cheesekao

Member
Dec 1, 2017
2,757
Huh, looks like we're not getting any big boy landmarks with Malphite. I wonder what's the 8 mana unit for then. Frozen Thrall meme decks?
 

Dahbomb

Community Resettler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,612
It has to be either Frozen Thrall or Sun Disc. The 8 mana unit is solid in Sun Disc deck because it allows you to get the Sun Disc without leveling up Renekton which is the biggest hurdle in that deck. It also allows you to cut the Renekton support cards for something that will actually help stall the game or draw into the win condition. It's still a meme deck but between Sooth Sayer and Clockhand, it's at least more consistent.

Most of the cards introduced are just significantly worse than Draklorn Inquisitor for Frozen Thrall stuff. It could work but its fairly difficult. The standard TLC Watcher control deck should be better than it.

In either case, all of those initial landmark synergy cards they introduced don't do much for Malphite at all. You don't really care to have long countdown landmarks in a Malphite deck, you just need to spam out a few landmarks. Remember that Roiling Sands is considered a 2 mana card so using the card that summons two of them plus draw two of them counts for 4 mana for Malphite by itself. I still don't think Malphite is that good though.
 

cheesekao

Member
Dec 1, 2017
2,757
I feel like you pretty much have to run malphite with shurima and the landmark acceleration cards. You'd auto lose to aggro if you simply spit out landmarks and let the countdown naturally happen.
 

Dahbomb

Community Resettler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,612
I feel like you pretty much have to run malphite with shurima and the landmark acceleration cards. You'd auto lose to aggro if you simply spit out landmarks and let the countdown naturally happen.
I think you lose to aggro no matter what. This package lacks any real forms of ways to beat aggro. Unless you lean heavily into the Targon heal/lifesteal package in which case you are better off playing the Asol Demacia decks.

And what do you do with your landmark acceleration cards? Play the Grumpy Rock landmarks, then curve into the 5 mana 4/4? I mean that's not even that strong of a power play.. mostly because those cards individually are poor so you are having to run two poor cards in order to have a decent play.

I do agree that you kinda have to run Targon + Shurima if you want to run Malphite... which is why I used Rock Hopper/Roiling Sands as an example. You also definitely will be using Preservarium in that deck. Maybe you use Starry Peak as well, I don't know. This one is a tough nut to crack, tougher than even Mono Shurima.
 

niaobx

Banned
Aug 3, 2020
1,053
So much for Reddit folks being sure that Malphite is going to be a landmark lol. Looks rather weak though

All the landmark stuff is kinda bad imo, can't see what's the plan for all these cards in devs minds
 
Oct 27, 2017
6,960
So much for Reddit folks being sure that Malphite is going to be a landmark lol. Looks rather weak though

All the landmark stuff is kinda bad imo, can't see what's the plan for all these cards in devs minds

The only way to make landmarks work is to print more landmarks/landmark-focused cards. And if they don't work, it is a digital game, balance is very hands-on at the moment, buff them.

Malphite looks a bit too clunky. The lack of built-in Overwhelm is also a problem. Still going to pick him in Expeditions. But he is boring, he only fits in landmarks decks, yet he doesn't really do anything with them. Level-up on countdown and going from sleeping to a raging mountain would have been cool.

And... NA is down, the highest "production value" stream is the least reliable.
 
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Sylvee

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,562
Man, across the 4 regions there were 12 unique champion combinations across the 12 winning decks. There was a Zoe Asol and Shyvana Asol, which are fairly similar. And two Shurima+Freljord Overwhelm decks with one running Renekton Sivir Sej whereas the other just ran Renekton Sej. But post that pretty much all the decks represented were completely unique archetypes. And of those decks there was no real burn, no Ashe, and no Trundle Lissandra. I don't think I've seen any card game that's even come remotely close to this level of deck diversity at the highest level of play.
 
Oct 27, 2017
6,960
Gave another chance to Talyah...

What a weak champion: her spell disappears if you remove her. If you don't have landmarks, she is a below-vanilla in terms of stats. All those bears are far too weak, and should they ever return to your hand, it is a 5-mana unit compared to Yetis who are easy to re-deploy.

Malphite + Zilean for landmarks, NO EXCEPTIONS!
 

Mars

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,988
Yeah, even with the introduction of this new landmark focused expansion, I still don't think Taliyah will be that impactful and there will be much more suitable champs to replace her with in any deck.
 

cheesekao

Member
Dec 1, 2017
2,757


Yasuo copium slowly turning into hopium?

Also, if the 5 mana landmark works how I think it does, it's a 10 mana progress towards Malphite's level up, which would be really good. You won't have to run a whole lot of landmarks anymore.
 
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Dahbomb

Community Resettler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,612
Yeah game diversity has been swell for most of thr game's lifespan. One of its finer elements.



Yasuo copium slowly turning into hopium?

Also, if the 5 mana landmark works how I think it does, it's a 10 mana progress towards Malphite's level up, which would be really good. You won't have to run a whole lot of landmarks anymore.

so_good.png
 
Oct 27, 2017
6,960
That elusive looks like someone forgot it is a 1-drop

Isamaru-tier

LoR is so much better than MTG. Jesus christ can you imagine like 30-40% games being lost/won just because one of the players couldn't draw mana right? Omegalul
 
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Dahbomb

Community Resettler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,612
Dancing Droplet enables turn 2 Zed with Retreat/Return lol!

Man that card is just nutty but I guess this is the type of stuff Ionia needs to have true Ionian decks and not just "other region deck but use a Champ + Deny cards from Ionia".
 

jman1954goat

Linked the Fire
Member
May 9, 2020
12,410
Is there a good replacement for Leblanc in midrange Frostbite?

I have 3 ashes.

First I was thinking Zed since I have 3 of him and he is similar in total stats and ability but then I realize Leblanc is important for having 5 attack more than quick attack.

Edit: Zed is ionia anyway I thought he was noxious lol.
 
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