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Lance McDonald: "The PlayStation 5 can run all PlayStation 4 games without per-game whitelisting"

Plinkerton

Plinkerton

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Nov 4, 2017
6,058
Hasn't this basically been known since Cerny's thing in March? They said then they're testing 1000s of games to make sure they work?

They're never going to say "all games will work" because then even if there's just one obscure game that doesn't, they open themselves up to trouble. But it's been basically confirmed for a while that BC is going to be essentially complete for both PS5 and Xbox.
 
MrKlaw

MrKlaw

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Oct 25, 2017
33,029
oni-link said:
I wonder if they'll work exactly as they do on a PS4, or if they'll be boosted

Like, FFXV has an unlocked frame rate mode that normally hits 30-45fps. Will the PS5 push that to 60fps, or will it run the same as it does on a PS4?
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more likely straight PS4. I hope they have a boost mode option but probably not on by default. I don't want performance improvement to require apatch because that means lots of games won't get it
 
behOemoth

behOemoth

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Oct 27, 2017
5,606
Kenzodielocke said:
Yes, that's what I think is gonna happen. It will take the PS4 Pro profile, if there is none, it will take the PS4 profile.

And I assume the boosted clocks will help to smoothen frame rate and dynamic resolutions, plus SSD will have faster loading.
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Isn't that what Cerny basically said? There are PS4 and PS4 Pro legacy modes if the PS5 can't handle the game for whatever reasons.
 

Deleted member 43657

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Yeah, but can I play my PS1 classics on the PS5?

Probably not you say?

Well then I'm sticking with my PS3 until Sony makes it so the PS5 can play the same games that were downloadable titles of games from four generations ago on a console that is now two generations old.
 
pure

pure

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Jun 18, 2019
236
Germany
MrKlaw said:
more likely straight PS4. I hope they have a boost mode option but probably not on by default. I don't want performance improvement to require apatch because that means lots of games won't get it
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The only performance improvements to expect from a boost mode without a patch will be higher resoultions in dynamic resoultion games and higher framerates in games with unlocked fps or games which target 60 fps and don't hit it consistently (like Sekiro for example). Also you can expect loading times to improve. But games which are locked to 1080 30fps for example will require a patch to use higher resolutions.
 
mordecaii83

mordecaii83

Avenger
Oct 28, 2017
6,852
MrKlaw said:
more likely straight PS4. I hope they have a boost mode option but probably not on by default. I don't want performance improvement to require apatch because that means lots of games won't get it
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A quick update on backward compatibility – With all of the amazing games in PS4's catalog, we've devoted significant efforts to enable our fans to play their favorites on PS5. We believe that the overwhelming majority of the 4,000+ PS4 titles will be playable on PS5.

We're expecting backward compatible titles will run at a boosted frequency on PS5 so that they can benefit from higher or more stable frame rates and potentially higher resolutions. We're currently evaluating games on a title-by-title basis to spot any issues that need adjustment from the original software developers.
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The official information out there seems to disagree with your expectations.
 
Kolx

Kolx

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Oct 25, 2017
8,505
tulpa said:
PS4 and Vita didn't support physical BC. PS1-3 all worked this way. Vita had digital back compat only, but it worked with every game in the store.
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Games on the store is basically the games Sony tested and approved. I don't think we had full BC since the og ps3 before Sony took out the PS2 hardware.
pure said:
How are they different ? PS4 Pro has a mode to disable the extra CUs to behave like a PS4. PS5 has a PS4/PS4Pro mode to disable extra CUs. The hardware architecture is the same. RNDA has all features of the previous architectures. The clock speed difference for the CPU won't matter. Games aren't written for the bare metal architecture. Everything is abstracted by the OS and APIs.
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I know, but even then the PS5 is using a different architecture for both the CPU and the GPU. If it was 100% guarantee to work, Sony would have mentioned full BC from day 1 instead of promising to test thousands of games with no mention of how many games will be available day 1.
 
Dan Thunder

Dan Thunder

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Nov 2, 2017
13,990
Pretty much as expected but given the constant confusion about this I hope that Sony explicitly spells out BC at their next PS5 event as MS have been very clear that nearly all XB1 titles will run on Series X and it's been clearly welcomed by the majority of people.
 
Decarb

Decarb

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Oct 27, 2017
8,632
They still need to whitelist them to avoid shit like R6 Seige running at ungodly framerate on Pro in boost mode and overheating the system. But good to know it doesn't outright block them.
 
coma

coma

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Oct 28, 2017
3,573
Good if true. Though it should be the bare minimum at this point. Hopefully they figure out past-gens too.
 

Deleted member 44129

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I still live for the impossible dream of having a PS5 that would simply play all Playstation games ever by just popping the disk in. I would love that so much, but I dont think it's happening. They would have said it by now. At the very least, I'd like to access my whole digital library. Gimme dat upscaled PAIN from the PS3.
 
Napalm_Frank

Napalm_Frank

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Oct 27, 2017
5,727
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It could be like the PS4 pro boost mode where you can do it but they warn you it might not work. They will have a list of titles that are confirmed to work while still letting you launch all games.
 
Vonocourt

Vonocourt

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Oct 25, 2017
10,605
Plinkerton said:
Hasn't this basically been known since Cerny's thing in March? They said then they're testing 1000s of games to make sure they work?

They're never going to say "all games will work" because then even if there's just one obscure game that doesn't, they open themselves up to trouble. But it's been basically confirmed for a while that BC is going to be essentially complete for both PS5 and Xbox.
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It's the "essentially" part that people latched on to.

The messaging at the GDC talk was weirdly worded, but people read it to be as negative and confusing as possible.
 
tulpa

tulpa

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Oct 28, 2017
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Kolx said:
Games on the store is basically the games Sony tested and approved. I don't think we had full BC since the og ps3 before Sony took out the PS2 hardware.
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I think this is a bit ridiculous. No, every PSP game works on Vita if you have a modded system and want to load the files, but Vita never pledged physical BC for PSP games. I'm talking about their home consoles. PS4 didn't support back compat. All PS3s, including the slim models, had full disc back compat for PS1 games. Again, this is the way physical backwards compatibility has worked on every single PlayStation console.
 
erlim

erlim

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Oct 26, 2017
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God_Of_Phwoar said:
I still live for the impossible dream of having a PS5 that would simply play all Playstation games ever by just popping the disk in. I would love that so much, but I dont think it's happening. They would have said it by now. At the very least, I'd like to access my whole digital library. Gimme dat upscaled PAIN from the PS3.
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I would gladly take PS2 games in 480i and PS3 games in 720p if it meant any degree of compatibility on PS5.
 
pure

pure

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Jun 18, 2019
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Kolx said:
Games on the store is basically the games Sony tested and approved. I don't think we had full BC since the og ps3 before Sony took out the PS2 hardware.

I know, but even then the PS5 is using a different architecture for both the CPU and the GPU. If it was 100% guarantee to work, Sony would have mentioned full BC from day 1 instead of promising to test thousands of games with no mention of how many games will be available day 1.
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Sonys communication regarding BC is not very good, I'll give you that. If you watch Cernys presentation tho, it's obvious that 99% of games will work, excluding edge cases. That is of course my assumption, and I can be proven wrong, but I'm pretty sure that will be the case.
 
Eeyore

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S1kkZ said:
but its not "big". they already talked about it. it would be mostly a clarification. and there will be ps5 stuff (third party, indie), so a short "infomercial" about the backcompat should be possible.
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I just wouldn't bank on it. The expectations should be low considering how even the marketing team talked about the stuff tomorrow.
 
score01

score01

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Oct 27, 2017
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People really need to watch that part of the road to PS5 again. It was pretty clear that this was the case even though it lead to concern from certain individuals. It was the PS Blog that muddied the waters afterwards. A final clarifying statement from Sony would be good though.
 
nib95

nib95

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Kolx said:
Uhh that sounds very not Sony. I'd wait for official confirmation.
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Both the PS2 and PS3 had BC, so I don't know how this is not very Sony lol. The main reason the PS4 didn't have BC was because it was so architecturally different to the PS3 (x86 vs Cell/SPE's), that's not the case with the PS4 vs PS5.
 
convo

convo

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Oct 25, 2017
7,364
This is one of those legal things when Sony has to write out their disclaimers on the box or instructions that need to state that not all PS4 games will run flawlessly, remember when some dude sued Sony for Killzone SF stating the game runs at so and so resolution on the box but i think they sued based on a DF analysis, it was dismissed but a court case still costs money no matter how stupid it is.
 
pbayne

pbayne

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Oct 27, 2017
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Thatd be a good thing to mention in the state of play tommorow, "hey and remember all those exciting upcoming ps4 games can be played on ps5" etc
 
ZeroX

ZeroX

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PS2 and PS3 both had open backward compatibility that broke with certain titles folks

there was even a weird case of some PS1 discs not working on PS3 Slim onward but the digital versions worked
 
dlauv

dlauv

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Oct 27, 2017
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Kind of like you can boot any PS2 game in an emulator but you're not sure what would work. Looks like their solution is pretty reliable.
 
Mooksoup

Mooksoup

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Oct 27, 2017
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I like Lance and his videos, he does good work.... but why would he have this kind of insider information?
.. interesting.
 
Seijuro

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Oct 25, 2017
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oni-link said:
Maybe all PS4 games will work, and the PS5 will treat them as if they were PS4 games, but Sony will actively whitelist games and give them boost patches on their own schedule
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Yes, this is what they intended to say from the very beginning. The boost mode has to be tested (that was the infamous "top 100 games"), everything else will run as it did on PS4 (Pro).
 
Mikch85

Mikch85

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May 12, 2018
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I don't want to be greedy, but I sure hope not only every PS4 game will run on PS5, but also way better. 60 fps for FF7R and TLOU2 please. Xbox One X is pretty fantastic on that regard.
 
oni-link

oni-link

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MrKlaw said:
more likely straight PS4. I hope they have a boost mode option but probably not on by default. I don't want performance improvement to require apatch because that means lots of games won't get it
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I always assumed the reason a lot of PS4 games had an unlocked frame rate mode was to future proof them as more powerful hardware would allow them to be pushed up to 60fps

PS4 games that aim for 30 but have drops, tend to be locked to 30 on the Pro for example, so I was hoping the same would be true of PS4 games on PS5

FFXV having an unlocked frame rate mode makes no real sense, as you can lock it to 30 in 1080 or aim for higher resolution and have 30 with drops/minor stutter

The unlocked mode gives you the worst of both words on a PS4 or a Pro, but if a PS5 could basically offer a boost mode, then suddenly the unlocked frame rate mode becomes a 60fps locked mode
 
RestEerie

RestEerie

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Aug 20, 2018
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nobody in the world will claim 100% compatibility of anything..not even microsoft. There will always be some extreme fringe case of something not working.

Even alcohol wipe claims to only destroy 99% of bacteria and germs.

99% is the most any company can ever promise. Claiming 100% will just open yourself for potential liable damage claims.
 
Ryengeku

Ryengeku

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Oct 26, 2017
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I just want official confirmation on being able to play all of my niche games that most certainly will not be in that 100 top played list starting out that Sony mentioned in the past.

What exactly could fail/go wrong with putting an untested (niche)PS4 game in the beefier PS5? Glitches making it unplayable? A good portion of them are slower turned based games with AA or less graphical fidelity.
 
Richter1887

Richter1887

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Oct 27, 2017
39,143
The PS3 could run every PS1 game even though they were never tested. I could see this happening.

PS3 Fat that had PS2 compability also did the same but some games got glitches here and there because they were never tested.
 
ItchyTasty

ItchyTasty

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Feb 3, 2019
5,907
This is great! I own many titles I wanna take with me to the new console.

Now I'm just wondering if they're gonna get free performance upgrades or if we'll have to pay for them, though I guess that depends on the publishers
 
Corralx

Corralx

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Aug 23, 2018
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London, UK
That's what I always assumed?
I doubt they would block some titles.
They just won't officially support all titles or claim they will all work without issues.
I expect a list of "plays best on PS5", and for everything outside of it you're on your own and won't receive support if it doesn't work for w/e reason.
 
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