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mreddie

Member
Oct 26, 2017
44,125
https://kotaku.com/why-king-of-fighters-dominated-latin-americas-fighting-1837707799

I always been hooked seeing KOF since funny enough, a trip to Mexico and seeing the KOF 96 intro and it grabbed me so cut to now, seeing the KOF scene be a underground league and the recent Kotaku article from John Learned explains why Latin America got hooked to KOF.

The-King-of-Fighters-96-Fighting-Game-KOF-96-Neo-Geo-SNK-Background-Stage-Sprites-Kagura-Stadium-Final-Battle.gif


What's the fighting game you remember the most from the arcades of your youth? Street Fighter II? Tekken? Mortal Kombat? If you're from Latin America, there's an excellent chance that the first game that jumps to mind wasn't any of those, and the game that defined your formative arcade experience was actually SNK's The King of Fighters.

"I would play every day after school," said Jose Ramon Navarrete, who grew up in Jiquilpan, about two hours south of Guadalajara in Mexico. "Sometimes I would skip school to play [King of Fighters]."

Today, at 32, Navarrete is better known as "kofROMANCE," a professional King of Fighters player who regularly appears at competitions like EVO. He now lives in Las Vegas, where EVO is held, and often hosts players from out of the country at his house during competitions. "We had Peru, Chile, Brazil, Colombia, and Mexico represented in the house, so we could share a lot of stories from back in the day," he said. What binds these players from so many countries together, he said, was King of Fighters.

It's well understood in the fighting game community that King of Fighters is a particular passion for many players from Mexico and other Latin American countries. Posts on larger fighting game forums like Shoryuken over the years have told many anecdotal accounts of the scene, and speculation as to why the franchise has proliferated in the region. According to the players, tournament organizers, and media personalities who spoke to Kotaku for this story, King Of Fighters has a curious ubiquity that has become part of the cultural identity for Latin American gamers.

Fighting game tournaments for KOF around the United States frequently have Latin American representation. The greater the size of the tournament, the higher likelihood of spotting players who traveled from Mexico, Chile, or Brazil. Fire up online emulation matchmaking software like Fightcade, and the location flags next to the majority of players are from these regions, too.

But why?

Getting to the bottom of fact versus assumed internet wisdom can be challenging, especially for something ingrained in genre circles since the early days of Street Fighter II's success. Taking to Twitter to find some answers, my mentions and inbox were flooded with responses. Dozens of players and tournament organizers from Mexico, Brazil, Argentina and more wanted to tell their stories. And nearly all of them told me the same things, with only incremental details shifting from one source to the next.

Largely, it boils down to the one thing it always does: money.
 

litebrite

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
21,832
As someone who frequented arcades in the 90's, from an American lens SNK fighting games came across as bootleg or lesser than compared to it's peers.

I think it's fascinating how different it was perceived through another lens from a different region.
 

RestEerie

Banned
Aug 20, 2018
13,618
And China/Hong Kong/Taiwan.

This may sounds unbelievable to the west but in the late 90s, King of fighters was the most played fighting game in the arcades, even overshadowing Street Fighter, with oddly KOF97 being the most popular followed by KOF98.
 

MrMephistoX

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
2,754
And China/Hong Kong/Taiwan.

This may sounds unbelievable to the west but in the late 90s, King of fighters was the most played fighting game in the arcades, even overshadowing Street Fighter, with oddly KOF97 being the most popular followed by KOF98.

Anecdotal from my 2 years living in China in the mid aughts: KOF and PES were everywhere on the grey market gaming scene...got halfway decent with Athena and Whip lol
 

litebrite

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
21,832
LOL. Not at all. It's just Capcom fighting games had already established itself as the king of 2D sprite based fighting games in America, in particular Street Fighter 2. Then Midway came with it's more violent and photo realistic (at the time) Mortal Kombat. Then the 3D fighters came starting with Virtua Fighter and then Tekken. SNK fighting games never really had a chance to capture the American Arcade goer's consciousness despite the arcade cabinets being there.
 

HardRojo

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
26,133
Peru
I started playing FGs and meeting people from the community later, during the SF4 days and man, the stories about KoF here in Peru over some drinks were always a delight to hear. There were a few KoF XIII tournaments where I got to feel the hype in all of its glory, it was great.
 
Oct 28, 2017
8,071
2001
Here in America, Me and my friends were all about capcom fighters in the 90's. VS. capcom, VS. street fighter. VS. X-men. So many countless memories with those games. KOF is good but can't touch the glory days of capcom fighters.
 

selfReg

Member
Oct 26, 2017
2,792
fantastic stuff, thanks for posting!

it would be great to have an article like this for Asian regions like China and Taiwan. As an American who only really came to appreciate SNK works until the mid 2000s, it really is mind boggling to me how seemingly obscure franchises like King of Fighters and Fatal Fury are to the same people who lined up for Street Fighter II back in the day. I will defend to the death KoF '98 holding the crown.

also, just posting this mandatory bit of KoF action for people who have yet to see it. Recently went down in Taiwan. A match long in the making. Two regions, two gods.

 

ibyea

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,164
The main fighting game for arcades I remember back in Venezuela during late 90s early 2000s was Tekken. But then again, I used to hang out with a friend who played Tekken competitively, so my memory might be biased.
 

RestEerie

Banned
Aug 20, 2018
13,618
fantastic stuff, thanks for posting!

it would be great to have an article like this for Asian regions like China and Taiwan. As an American who only really came to appreciate SNK works until the mid 2000s, it really is mind boggling to me how seemingly obscure franchises like King of Fighters and Fatal Fury are to the same people who lined up for Street Fighter II back in the day. I will defend to the death KoF '98 holding the crown.

also, just posting this mandatory bit of KoF action for people who have yet to see it. Recently went down in Taiwan. A match long in the making. Two regions, two gods.



there were quite abit of articles and youtube videos on this but sadly most of them are not in english.

I would've posted alot of youtube videos on some of the unique perspective from Asian gamers but there were too much for me to translate.

if you guys are interested on this and don't mind using Youtube's 'auto translation', perhaps i can list some.
 

Sargerus

▲ Legend ▲
The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
20,849
Majority of arcade machines that still exists here in my city are all about KOF 97/98/2002
 

RestEerie

Banned
Aug 20, 2018
13,618
As someone who frequented arcades in the 90's, from an American lens SNK fighting games came across as bootleg or lesser than compared to it's peers.

I think it's fascinating how different it was perceived through another lens from a different region.

mate, if you frequent american arcades in the 90s, you should have noticed that SamSho 1 & 2 are kinda big back then. Not SF2 or MK big obviously (those are monsters altogether), but still popular enough.
 

selfReg

Member
Oct 26, 2017
2,792
there were quite abit of articles and youtube videos on this but sadly most of them are not in english.

I would've posted alot of youtube videos on some of the unique perspective from Asian gamers but there were too much for me to translate.

if you guys are interested on this and don't mind using Youtube's 'auto translation', perhaps i can list some.
by all means, post them. Maybe some posters who experienced the scenes there can chime in as well.
 

litebrite

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
21,832
mate, if you frequent american arcades in the 90s, you should have noticed that SamSho 1 & 2 are kinda big back then. Not SF2 or MK big obviously (those are monsters altogether), but still popular enough.
It was nowhere close to the popularity of SF or MK. Lol @ kinda big back then. Compared to what? Every Capcom fighting game was bigger than SamSho in America. Killer Instinct was way bigger in American arcades than any SNK fighting game.
 
OP
OP
mreddie

mreddie

Member
Oct 26, 2017
44,125
LOL. Not at all. It's just Capcom fighting games had already established itself as the king of 2D sprite based fighting games in America, in particular Street Fighter 2. Then Midway came with it's more violent and photo realistic (at the time) Mortal Kombat. Then the 3D fighters came starting with Virtua Fighter and then Tekken. SNK fighting games never really had a chance to capture the American Arcade goer's consciousness despite the arcade cabinets being there.
Does make sense, even during the PS2/XBOX era, mexican arcades were still a thing. Although I think the times were changing drastically once the PS3/360 era came and internet got cheaper.
 

RestEerie

Banned
Aug 20, 2018
13,618
Majority of arcade machines that still exists here in my city are all about KOF 97/98/2002

this is legit. The 'core' KOF gameplay didn't took shape until KOF96. KOF94 and 95's gameplay is archaic & stiff and completely different from the KOF most understand now (using the 'charging meter' later known as 'Extra' mode).

Starting from 96, the 'gameplay feel' started to takes shape and 97 add on to that with the 'Advanced' mode (non-chargable bar with 3 stock). 98 is basically 97 on steroids with more characters. 99 took a turn to the weird with 'strikers' (assist basically) and the weird 'offense/defense' mode mechanics. 2000, also the OG SNK's last KOF game, add on to 99's system with a much more freeform 'striker' system (you can basically call them in at any time) and a gobsmack of SNK fan service. KOF2001 is one of the series' least welcomed series, being developed by Eolith (as SNK technically went bankrupt) with some of the worst art of the game. KOF2002 somewhat redeemed by going back to the roots akin to 98 with a dream match structure and removing strikers altogether. 2003 is the last KOF game running on the NeoGeo system and it went on a major gameplay change, with a free tagging that divided the fanbase. Any future mainline KOF games were then developed on the Dreamcast based Atomiswave hardware....which admittedly this is where i fell off the series. So i'll stop my history recap from here.
 

TimeFire

Avenger
Nov 26, 2017
9,625
Brazil
Being bopped by drunk 30 year olds on a KoF machine in a street bar is one of my first arcade-related memories. KoF was everywhere here in Brazil
 

AlexBasch

Member
Oct 27, 2017
7,312
You can't call yourself a mexican arcade player from the 90's if you don't know what "Iori Loco" is.
 

NSESN

▲ Legend ▲
Member
Oct 25, 2017
25,320
I think even nowadays it is easy to find an arcade with KoF 98 here in brazil, when I was a kid it was everywhere
 

Deleted member 30544

User Requested Account Closure
Banned
Nov 3, 2017
5,215
Believe it or not, our classism here is so awful that we even separated the KOF players from de Capcom players. If you were a KOF fan then it meant you were a "naco" (derogatory slang for a low class, poor people).
 

Iori Loco

Member
Nov 10, 2017
2,288
Dude, SNK is the king here in México, Metal Slug and Kof everywhere. Atomix, a méxican gaming magazine, interviewed some guys who worked with SNK at Evoga.

Here's the interview (in spanish), for the interested, at around 9:50 they mention México representing almost 40% of the market for SNK at some point.



Fun fact, Angel from KoF got her name from one of those dudes.
 

Xion_Stellar

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,286
Yep KoF was huge in my childhood/neighborhood back in Mexico City and we saw Street Fighter and Mortal Kombat as a lower quality game also Metal Slug was huge too. Literally every corner store in my neighborhood had an arcade machine or two and it was a 50/50 chance it was either Metal Slug or King of Fighters
 

Terrell

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,624
Canada
I always felt like I was missing out on something not getting that into KoF, but Neo Geo cabinets weren't that prolific, and if they were, it was usually operating a Puzzle Bobble cartridge instead of SamSho or KoF.
 
OP
OP
mreddie

mreddie

Member
Oct 26, 2017
44,125
Dude, SNK is the king here in México, Metal Slug and Kof everywhere. Atomix, a méxican gaming magazine, interviewed some guys who worked with SNK at Evoga.

Here's the interview (in spanish), for the interested, at around 9:50 they mention México representing almost 40% of the market for SNK at some point.



Fun fact, Angel from KoF got her name from one of those dudes.

I remember their Dragons game, that was a interesting game design wise and gameplay wise.
 

RestEerie

Banned
Aug 20, 2018
13,618
by all means, post them. Maybe some posters who experienced the scenes there can chime in as well.

Here's one for a start..i don't know how well Youtube auto CC can be, if it even can be done.



Here's one youtube channel i'll recommend.


The dude's analysis on Sekiro is uncanny (as he's a kendo practitioner)...but again, try the auto english cc if it's even possible.
 

Futaleufu

Banned
Jan 12, 2018
3,910
LOL. Not at all. It's just Capcom fighting games had already established itself as the king of 2D sprite based fighting games in America, in particular Street Fighter 2. Then Midway came with it's more violent and photo realistic (at the time) Mortal Kombat. Then the 3D fighters came starting with Virtua Fighter and then Tekken. SNK fighting games never really had a chance to capture the American Arcade goer's consciousness despite the arcade cabinets being there.

Nah, pure snobbery.

The fact that written piece puts "money" as the reason KOF got more play in latinamerica implies that, had the region been richer, they would be playing Capcom games, completely dismissing the idea that, maybe, SNK fighting games were better than the Capcom fighting games of the era.
 

MajesticSoup

Banned
Feb 22, 2019
1,935
I honestly dont remember seeing one KOF arcade in the 90s in canada. At the time I thought you had to be a rich kid with a neogeo to even play it.
Saw quite a few samurai showdown and that awful awful World Heroes game.
 

roflwaffles

Member
Oct 30, 2017
4,138
In my experience in my youth -

Capcom was the king of fighters in the arcade back in the day. Marvel was the hype machine and Third Strike was for the then-hipsters.

Tekken was second but there was still a wide gap in between.

MK was what you could get your white friends to play

No one cared about SNK.


But really though, nothing compared to DDR and Initial D.
 

litebrite

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
21,832
Believe it or not, our classism here is so awful that we even separated the KOF players from de Capcom players. If you were a KOF fan then it meant you were a "naco" (derogatory slang for a low class, poor people).
Damn. What country? it was never like that in the states, however I do think the perception of SNK fighting games looking second rate compared to Capcom fighting games did affect it's popularity, or lack of popularity in America.

Also this article is great. I think you could make a really good documentary on KoF's popularity and why in Latin America.

Nah, pure snobbery.

The fact that written piece puts "money" as the reason KOF got more play in latinamerica implies that, had the region been richer, they would be playing Capcom games, completely dismissing the idea that, maybe, SNK fighting games were better than the Capcom fighting games of the era.
You act as if Americans knew anything about KoF's popularity in Latin America to be snobbish against it. LOL. People in Arcades played what was most flashy and stuck around if it was good. Unfortunately to the average American arcade goer, SNK fighting games looked like bootleg Capcom fighting games by comparison. I don't think many people would agree that SNK fighting games were better than Capcom fighting games. However they were good fighting games in their own right that I'm thankful didn't get ignored by Latin America and whose enthusiam for these games have inspired many Americans, including myself, to revisit them.
 
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Maxflier

Member
Nov 22, 2017
842
Louisiana
Funny timing for me with this thread as I am in Mexico right now on vacation and just yesterday was wondering if KoF was popular here because I was looking for any type of game shops in the area trying to find a PS3 copy of XIII.
 

品川駅

Banned
Aug 15, 2019
526
Tokyo, Japan
As a Peruvian, in my school kof was something "for the poor kids" who couldn't afford to use 6 buttons and play the way more popular SF.

Even nowadays KOF has the fame of the fighting game of the poor along with Bloody Roar by a lot of people. But SNK being cool again is changing that image tho.
 

MistaTwo

SNK Gaming Division Studio 1
Verified
Oct 24, 2017
2,456
I obviously had nothing to do with the development at that time, but from my discussions with devs and players in the community I think a lot of it boils down to SNK's approach to character designs, especially when compared to the other mainline franchise in Street Fighter.

There was a little bit more nuance, for lack of a better term, given to the character designs and lore when compared to fairly one dimensional ethnic caricatures you see in Street Fighter.

That is just my personal take from all of the stories I have heard over the years.
 

Leo-Tyrant

Member
Jan 14, 2019
5,095
San Jose, Costa Rica
2D wise:

Here in Costa Rica, at least in the late 90's and early 00's KOF was seen as the "cool one". The character art, the different playing styles, the combos, the backgrounds, the year after year progression, etc...

Street Fighter and other Capcom fighters were also liked but KOF was the mature, deep one.
 

Deleted member 35077

Self-requested ban
Banned
Dec 1, 2017
3,999
Fun fact, Angel from KoF got her name from one of those dudes.
To add in, Angel as a whole happened because SNK got salty they lost a friedly match with the Evolga devs that they challenge them again but now on their home turf with the requisite that the winner gets to design a character that appears on the loosers game.. Full story below:
Because of the physical appearance and Mexican roots of Angel, it's often mentioned that she was created because of a bet, what can you tell us about this?

This is a great story, so i will be brief:

The first time we traveled to Japan, they took us to some arcades called NEO GEO LAND

The main objective of this was to challenge some members of the SNK Staff in KOF 98.

The sad thing about this is that SNK Staff got bodied very hard and people at SNK got annoyed.

We went to Japan a second time and at the end of a meeting where the development of Rage of the Dragons for SNK was decided. Angel Torres, EVOGA's CEO and the one that won against the Staff of SNK, was challenged to KOF 98 (again) and a bet was made: if he lost he would have to let SNK make a character for our game ROTD plus our then head would have to pay the sum of $ 5,000 USD to BrezzaSoft president.

In the end the fight was made, but they weren't the same players that Angel defeated in NEO GEO LAND, this time they brought 2 KOF's programmers and the official designer of KOF 2001, they were the best 3 KOF players at SNK back then.

How did the fight end, well ... you tell me, there is a character who debuted in KOF 2001 under the name of Angel, is Mexican and likes tacos (hahahaha).
 

selfReg

Member
Oct 26, 2017
2,792
To add in, Angel as a whole happened because SNK got salty they lost a friedly match with the Evolga devs that they challenge them again but now on their home turf with the requisite that the winner gets to design a character that appears on the loosers game.. Full story below:
simply amazing bit of history right there lol.
 

Futaleufu

Banned
Jan 12, 2018
3,910
I don't think many people would agree that SNK fighting games were better than Capcom fighting games.

People today cant tell the difference between a good fighting game and a mediocre one. I wouldnt expect a casual fan of the genre 20 years ago to have the knowledge or criteria to discern what makes a fighting game good or mediocre.