They will write new songs but they will need to go through the estate to reuse or remix the classic stuff, which they definitely won't abandon. It would be like Star Wars abandoning the Main Theme or the Imperial March.
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Koichi Sugiyama, composer of Dragon Quest, has passed away (SEE STAFF POST)
- Thread starter Hayama Akito
- Start date
There were a few bans in this thread. I'm not sure what you're reading, but there was absolutely people in here who felt he wasn't a bad dude overall.
I don't really care if other people say RIP, but I also don't really care if other people dislike people saying that when Sugiyama has factually been an awful person. If they want to say RIP, they should own up to it when people disagree and call them out.
Hilarious lol.
Hoping people reuse your template in the future when there's other famous passings of unlikable bigots.
Fuck Karma. Shit people often get full luxurious lives while making others suffer and good people can get dealt the worst hand imaginable. This is just reality, and the belief that its all balanced out cosmically is just one more incentive to shirk responsibility and accountability. Humans only have each other.
ah, to be clear I initially meant to just quote the "hope the people saying R.I.P. meant Rest In Piss" line. I just don't think they need to own up to explaining their philosophical beliefs like I did just for saying R.I.P. though maybe I'm wrong.....it inherently means a lot of different things to a lot of different people, does not inherently imply empathy, or love, or anything of the sort, just like posting a dance gif does not inherently mean the poster loves hatin on dead people, maybe Im giving too much credit to people but idk
A person who I absolutely despised, felt was one of the worse people I've ever met, had physically fought in self defense, hurt so many people emotionally recently killed himself in my life and my very first reaction was still R.I.P. cause I assume the absolute of death is more peaceful then his horrible, horrible life. I just have a hard time believing anyone posting here are actually personal fans of a world war 2 war crime denier. Racists have their fans, war deniers have their fans, homophobes have their fans, but he was all of them, and this is a fairly liberal forum. Only the filthiest of filth would be saying R.I.P. because they where fans of his character and think he should go to heaven, not everyone believes in heaven so R.I.P. means something else entirely
Replying to say i was here for the birth of a new era meme.
This. This right here. Post of the year. This will forever be immortalized.
I grew up with Dragon Quest. I could not bring myself to finish XI. I could not separate the man from the music. Looking forward to XII. Hopefully he did not get to compose much for it yet.
I get that but I just dont think it is possible for those people to actually be happy. Many of the people I know personally as clientele are very wealthy but very very sad. Think about the kind of person you need to be to hit 100k annually and still not want to just settle down, enjoy your free time. A lot of them desire more control then anyone can with infinite time, only happy when making money, stuff like that. Not saying that they shouldn't be stopped if possible but upon death that is kind of a moot point, and I don't think you need hell to understand that they suffered in life whether self inflicted or not. If you think about hurting people all the time, judge people all the time, live in denial of reality at all times, fixate, chase, constantly fighting, ignore your body, ignore your mind let it rot, you are not going to be happy. Humans have each other and should treat each other well, that is good karma. You feel good being good to other humans, you get nothing being hateful unless you are already sick. Just how I see things, I understand if you disagree. I just don't think there is any chance that a homophobic war denier that goes through trouble to limit his art to foreign countries lived a life filled with joy though. It doesn't always pan out, he likely caused more pain in some ways then one man could suffer no matter how troubled is an argument surely, but karma is karma. Buddism has the concept of afterlives as opposed to heaven and hell because people want to feel that karma always hits some sort of equilibrium, I dont think it does. Some people just have more weight whether positive or negative in their lifetime than others and their impact effects many more then their one human life could pay. I do personally think suffering is suffering though, and upon death it ceases which should be a release everyone deserves. So in a sense, R.I.P. right?
The ties between socioeconomic disparity and suicide, standard of living etc are hard facts. I don't give a shit about anecdotes about how you know a sad rich person. Humans have the most control over this balance, but we have people like Sugiyama who used his wealth to attack some of the most at risk groups of people.
You're trying to imply that he was miserable because of the way he treated others? Some people are just scum or act on sociopathic tendencies to where they enjoy it and not feel bad in the slightest, not unlike some religious folks who feel good and justified when they tell others they're going to hell for being gay (This guy literally laughed about suicides). Sometimes humans are just shit like that, and the only pushback is from other humans who do care.
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This. I don't want to step on anyone's beliefs, but there are plenty of shitty people out there who are successful, rich and powerful. At the end of the day, it doesn't matter if Jeff Bezos is secretly a super sad dude when his company treats his employees like shit while he's launching himself in space on phallic rocket. Or JK Rowling still making millions despite being a full blown TERF actively working to spread dangerous lies about trans people. No matter how much evil these people are doing, they're still powerful enough to keep putting other people in danger. You can't seriously look at this situation and think "Karma will take care of this" is enough.
Most of these people will only stop making the world a worse place when they die, because poetic justice will most likely never hit them. So let people be relieved when one of them bites the dust.
He lived a long and extremely privileged life, free of the burdens minorities in his country have to deal with. It's nice to believe horrible people are secretly not happy, I guess, but we have no reason to believe that's the case.
The biggest nah from me. He lived to the ripe old age of 90 spreading his hate. Maybe he will eventually have some degree of peace, if that's your belief system, but right now, let's stop coddling the dead bigot and let those he harmed celebrate a bit.
I'd say I'm glad he's rotting but I'd feel bad for the maggots feasting on his homophobic, war crime-denying corpse. Not even going to add a "It's a shame because he made good music." Fuck his music. That music got him the money he used to spread his hate. There's nothing but taint all the way down.
Apparently he's also donated over $75k to Shinzo Abe's campaigns. During the Olympics, Abe personally intervened to keep Sugiyama's music in, according to the Daily Beast.
It looks like he was pretty damn close to Abe. I hope people really start digging up the dirt on this asshole in the coming months/years.
Japan’s Ex-Prime Minister Is Behind This Hateful Olympic Scandal
Sources involved in planning the Games told The Daily Beast that an Olympic ceremony fiasco was basically Shinzo Abe’s favor to his homophobic, ultranationalist pal and donor.
www.thedailybeast.com
It looks like he was pretty damn close to Abe. I hope people really start digging up the dirt on this asshole in the coming months/years.
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Apparently he's also donated over $75k to Shinzo Abe's campaigns. During the Olympics, Abe personally intervened to keep Sugiyama's music in, according to the Daily Beast.
Japan’s Ex-Prime Minister Is Behind This Hateful Olympic Scandal
Sources involved in planning the Games told The Daily Beast that an Olympic ceremony fiasco was basically Shinzo Abe’s favor to his homophobic, ultranationalist pal and donor.www.thedailybeast.com
It looks like he was pretty damn close to Abe. I hope people really start digging up the dirt on this asshole in the coming months/years.
Ah, so that's where the "Nintendo pulled out of the Olympics due to Sugiyama" talking point came from. (Unless I missed something and it was already cited, anyway.)
I always just assumed it was optics from the Olympics taking place during COVID, although it could've been multiple factors.
Yeah same article but the part I mentioned has an actual anonymous source rather than someone speculating about Nintendo. And he's made no bones about how much he had given to Abe in the past.
I don't need to think for someone who had a great career for decades, lived till 90 with lots of political clout and money. If karma exists then it is his karma that we are all sitting here laughing and being happy that he has passed.
He sure did look happy when he laughed on TV about suicide rates among LGBT people.
As has been mentioned, you are not likely to see any sort of criticism from Japanese media or news articles. It's hard to come by that sort of criticism even when someone is alive, so the chances of seeing it when someone dies is pretty much zero percent. I've read through two Japanese articles, and they both only spoke of Sugiyama's achievements and what his career looked like. The articles also shared the words of gratitude from people Sugiyama worked with (who, of course, are also unlikely to publicly criticize the man and probably feel pressured to make some sort of statement regardless of how they feel about him).
As has also been mentioned, if someone publicly criticized Sugiyama in Japan in response to his death, they would be pounced on immediately, there's no doubt about that.
If I encounter an article where they even mention controversy, I'll be sure to share it because that's likely the best you'll get.
As has also been mentioned, if someone publicly criticized Sugiyama in Japan in response to his death, they would be pounced on immediately, there's no doubt about that.
If I encounter an article where they even mention controversy, I'll be sure to share it because that's likely the best you'll get.
I don't understand much about copyright laws, but does his death mean anything for the music in the Dragon Quest series?
Not particularly, unless his estate decides to go scorched-earth, which is extremely unlikely because they make BANK on royalties. It would be stupid of them to try to do that.
I wonder who will compose Dragon Quest XII now?
And of course will they re-use some of his old famous tracks of the series? like the main theme and some other recurring tracks like Final Fantasy does?
And of course will they re-use some of his old famous tracks of the series? like the main theme and some other recurring tracks like Final Fantasy does?
I think they said that Sugiyama finished the soundtrack for XII before he died
Oh really ?
Interesting to see how far DQXII is in development since the soundtrack are done !
I think they are holding showing the game till after the release of FFXVI in 2022 maybe.
DQXI was released in Japan 2017.. and DXII were announced to be under development since 2019.. so hopefully 2023 for release date.
What? How? Didn't the game start development like super recently?
Iirc they finished all the CG for FFXIII very early on.
If it doesn't require the "game" part of it to have progressed at all ...
No, they said he was working on it when he died. There is no way he would have finished it because Sugiyama's process is to compose as he can play the game. Until he can see the game itself running, the soundtrack won't come together.
I was going along with what people were saying about the obituary that's online (it's still entirely in Japanese but it's on the official DQ site);
But if his composition process is like that, it wouldn't surprise me if they have another composer come in to finish up (even though the game has been in development since 2019, I doubt they got major sections coherent and playable yet for his purposes). But I also definitely see a fair amount of old DQ tracks or unfinished/unused tracks getting into the game on top of the stuff he likely was able to finish
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Yah, I think they will definitely have to get another composer to finish it up and handle arrangements and general music direction. No doubt it being Sugiyama's final work they will make that a selling point too, and there'll be plenty of nostalgia to tap into. We won't likely see a composer get to put their own mark fully on a DQ game until 13.
Yeah, the thread on r/games is pretty much the same as this thread on ERA. The mods there usually clamp down on anything similar, but it's very telling that they've allowed Sugiyama to be an exception to the rule.
He might be the only person in the entire gaming industry so far that will get this kind of public treatment. And it's for a very important reason. We're living in an age where more and more people are starting to wake up to the idea that using decorum as a defense is really just the ultimate admission that the subject being shielded by it has few redeeming qualities to begin with, and it's a tool to preserve a shitty status quo rather than anything borne out of good faith.
It's also worth noting that the whole 'separate the artist from the art' stuff kinda falls apart in this case when there's reasonable cause to believe that his politics have indeed seeped into his work - I wouldn't put it past him if it turns out that the reason why we got MIDI soundtracks overseas while Japan gets orchestral music was partly due to his ultra nationalistic tendencies.
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User Threadbanned - Continued Thread Derailment
It's okay, I respectfully disagree. You can be a sociopath and not feel explicit suffering but it isn't gonna be a fulfilling life imo... All modern studies I know of show that once you make enough to not struggle in America about 70k, it is a lot easier to be happy. That does not mean someone who is making 70k and has super good moral principles, a loving wife, does charity, goes to the beach, etc.....isn't probably a lot happier then someone like our recent president who idk if I'm allowed to bring up (?), who spent his days eating poorly, tweeting private citizens hatefully, no exercise, concerned about every word spoken of him, frustrated, grumpy, etc... I don't personally find it right within my own belief system to celebrate the death of people even if I do think certain things should be remembered, but I don't mind that some people do. Even if certain problematic actors on a global scale came to their passing I'd think "R.I.P. thank god the world can move on now".... Just think it'd be nice if people weren't getting upset about others simply saying R.I.P and tryna just say hey, everyones got different beliefs, if they aren't fighting the battle at this time it isn't a personal attack.... In my eyes if someone is laughing at the suffering of LGBT they likely are frustrated by the success and growth as well. I admitted that I dont believe in the reincarnation aspect of Bhuddism that they use to make karma equal, but karma is still karma. He negatively impacted more lives then he could suffer as one man, but now he is dead, his conscious, ego, and all are gone. No one can really punish him anymore, I think he punished himself and others in his life, but now he is resting. Super not here to tell people what is right and wrong and accept that is personal, just tryna communicate why not everyone who is saying R.I.P. is some apologist, don't think it is appropriate to police the tone of those comments either. That's all. The original post I was responding to was about a guy saying he hopes everyone saying R.I.P. means Rest in Piss and I think it's like cmon, let people say Rest in Peace without taking it personally you know? Gonna be my last comment in this thread 100% but yeah, R.I.P. isn't apologists, it's okay that's all I wanted to say. Some people just have different beliefs. Pretty sure everyone is on the same side here as far as the asterisk stating he was a terrible human that will forever be next to his works.
Why are you pushing this narrative to where he's the victim here? When did he punish himself and suffer? Why is that in the same sentence as the things he was doing to people? Making a wall of text to invent sob stories and providing armchair psychoanalysis to humanize shitty people is a bad joke. You think all bigots are hurting/suffering when they do what they do? That's a dangerous mentality and only really makes me think you're just trolling.
You should have honestly kept this shit to yourself. Nobody is interested in your beliefs, and certainly not in hearing about how Sugiyama was a victim.
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come on man, I'm clearly not trolling....... I think once it is over it is over, the suffering has ended, I'm not trying to pardon him, I'm trying to explain why it is kind of disrespectful to tell people saying R.I.P. that they shouldn't be saying that, acting like they are some LGBT hating secret agent here on era. Do you disagree?
honestly don't want to respond to this thread anymore but don't really appreciate the troll accusation when I feel like I've communicated my personal beliefs pretty respectfully, clearly you don't agree, that is fine. I'm going to try again and if you can't understand you can't understand, that is fine, if you think I am wrong, I don't but that is also fine.... I dont believe he is a victim in the since you are acting like I do, I've studied most religions and philosophies and lean towards Buddhism the most. One of the fundamental believes of Bhuddism and the first noble truth is that life is suffering, the other noble truths are about recognizing that suffering and what to do to alleviate that suffering. Just because someone has failed to even recognize their suffering does not mean they are not suffering, just my belief. I dont really see anyone as evil, I see them as ignorant, greedy, frustrated, wrathful, etc....and those things that are already unhealthy for them can be disproportionally unhealthy for the world, sure. Without the believe of reincarnation Bhuddism isn't very fair I guess but neither is life from my perspective. Because I do not believe in evil, I see his life more as an unfortunate event and his death as his time to rest, not gonna personally celebrate. I've chuckled at a lot of the memes in this thread despite myself, but it isn't personally what Ima put out there. Some people see it as a time to celebrate and I get that, I haven't judged or said anything negative about that.
Feel like a lot of people in here are super eager to hate and appalled not everyone is falling suit and I don't blame them he was a really gross man, but not everyone is going to be that way. Doesnt mean they are bad. Think each party needs to let the other be without taking it personal. I'm no mod, but that is pretty in line with what the mod had to say from what I can tell. Some people are here to respect life upon death and his music. You've accused me of inventing sob stories, arm chair analysis, my believes being a bad joke trolling.....all I've done is try to share how not every person wishing the man R.I.P. is some secret anti LGBT agent like I said. Havent attacked anyone man. To answer your question though yes, I think bigots survive on temporary highs and inevitably live a sad life because they are ignorant of themselves. It is okay if you don't agree just because some bigot owns a ferrari, can get some hot girl, whatever.....that is fine, that is your measure of success, you see that and think they must be pretty happy I want that. My life experience has taught me usually isn't the case. A lot of my personal measure of success and happiness is you know, being capable of genuine love and connection...... I can't possibly believe Sugiyama was healthy regardless of his age in that regard, and it is really besides the point. I say he rests in peace because that is what I think death is like.....period. That's all there is to it really.
He is "freed from his mortal coil" - wise words of Nioh 2. Not everyone is going to want to take it further then that, it just isn't in my belief system to celebrate death, it isn't in my families belief system, it isn't in a lot of peoples belief system. It is in a lot of others and I respect that. Not everyone saying R.I.P because they aren't telling him to rest in piss are hateful people themselves though, clearly not the case... I truly HATE as much as possible what Michael Jackson imo got away with and continues to get away with in a weird way, especially w how big a fan I was, but upon the time of his death, R.I.P. Clearly a troubled man no matter how much I hated him, at least he was now freed from having to be such a revolting human. Not everyone saying R.I.P. is respecting Sugiyama, it is somethin I personally say just because of my general views on life. Literally has nothing to do with Sugiyama. And those that are paying respect to his music should be allowed to imo without bein judged is all. Clearly not the place to be talkin about this stuff but I just wanted to try to communicate why I think it should be okay for people to say R.I.P. without some taking it as a personal attack, but clearly have failed so that's okay. Gonna let it go. Don't feel like arguing which is what this feels like it is becoming, just saying better to remain respectful in my opinion, not gonna respond anymore but I do hope you can understand at least a little bit that not every post saying R.I.P sugi loved your music is some attack, it isn't
I rarely have a bad thing to say about anyone. However, I'll make an exception.
Good riddance to this waste of flesh. I personally don't care how much of an impact his earlier bodies of work had in the music side of things for the video game industry. I have little tolerance towards those who participate in historical revisionism, laughed at those who committed suicide like it's a sick punch line, among other despicable acts.
Good riddance to this waste of flesh. I personally don't care how much of an impact his earlier bodies of work had in the music side of things for the video game industry. I have little tolerance towards those who participate in historical revisionism, laughed at those who committed suicide like it's a sick punch line, among other despicable acts.
Nobody wants to hear about your anecdotes of how rich people and bigots are secretly suffering, or cosmic beliefs distracting from the gravity of what this man was doing. Its not hard.
We have no reason to believe he was suffering, period. You're choosing to believe that because that makes you feel better about your stance on him. There's no evidence, no correlation that proves that evil people are actually only evil because they're suffering. Most people who suffer aren't evil so it's a moot point anyway.
"Having a different opinion is not an attack" you said, as if denying war crimes and opposing minorities was just like preferring vanilla over chocolate, lol.
I think I might kinda get what you're saying about RIP. Personally I find it hard to make myself feel particularly angry or vitriolic towards the dead, but idk if I'd say 'RIP' beyond a formality because I don't really feel he deserves that. At the same time I'm not gonna go and, like, desecrate his grave or anything.
But my comparative apathy/exhaustion is possibly/likely because I have been fortunate to not really be the target of any of his bigotry (well except maybe foreigner stuff). The man had a tangibly negative impact on a lot of people and for them that suffering is far from over. To the contrary it may continue because of investments sugiyama made in pushing his heinous agenda. Because of that I both understand and don't begrudge anyone for absolutely despising the man even in death.
Its also not a good look to try and characterize the guy himself as suffering. It is purely speculative and detracts from a lot of 'confirmed' suffering as a consequence of his actions, and diminishes and reduces the conversation to a sort of 'both sides' kind of narrative.
People should be allowed to pay their respects to life and his music without people like you pretending they are some secret anti LGBT operation, it's not that hard man.
Where did I even mention the cosmos..... Rich people are all super super happy sure thing man. Being a bigot must feel great for their body yup, we all know how healthy spending time dwelling on hatred makes you feel so so good. Whatever my guy, have a nice life. I'm runnin out of patience so Im truly done, can't say it was a pleasure. If you want to believe every single person in here saying R.I.P. to Sugiyama supports his abysmal believes that is really just not my circus, not my monkey.
You're wasting your energy and stressing yourself out.
This thread is for rejoicing over Sugiyama's death, that's it. You can't change that and there's nothing to be gained from trying. Anyone who's familiar with the site and wants to drop a non-piss R.I.P. knows this isn't the place for it.
You know, I get that last part, it really wasn't my intent or what I was trying to communicate, it is simply my mechanism to let things go. Feel the same lack of vitriol toward the dead, it is just my personal coping mechanism to accept that there is literally no possible way for him to suffer further for his actions. I guess it is purely speculative but idk, to me it is like if someone called Donald Trump happy. I'd be like what? Why? He always says terrible things he can't be happy right? But maybe I do just need to accept that it justice is not always served. Still think it is a jump to think everyone saying R.I.P is being hateful in some way though, and I do think his death is probably more peaceful then his life ever was speculative or not. I didn't know the guy though you're right
Maybe I just don't understand the second part yet, I just assumed resetera is a generally liberal thread and felt bad for the people getting side eyed honestly. If there are a bunch of passive aggressive remarks in resetera to try to trigger people that is an aspect of the culture I just wasn't aware of. I'm willing to admit maybe I am wrong, because if that is the case it'd kind of explain why I feel so many people are jumpin down my own throat. Promise I'm not tryna trigger no one though, and if this isn't the place to say R.I.P., glad I got to listen to his music as a kid, then it just isn't and that is my bad for derailing. You're right I guess I'm probably off base here, it is a little weird to say R.I.P without saying at least "well his character was unfortunate but R.I.P." or somethin like that, maybe they are trolls I guess if that is the likely case I'm just surprised
Stay focused. Nothing I posted was about "RIP" in the first place. I questioned why the fuck you're in here painting bigots as poor unfortunate souls and the wealthy as more unhappy.
People aren't just bigots because they hate themselves, they're bigots because its been taught and normalized or it benefits them to be. They're not suffering from causing suffering, that's pure fantasy and not something anyone wants to hear when discussing one of the most notorious people in the industry.
Death being the great equalizer misses the point that his legacy of bullshit will long outlive him.
I don't know about all that, but sometimes you just read the room and keep it moving instead of trying to change it, especially if you're not all that invested in the first place.