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The Krakoa Era of X-Men |OT| Mutant Massacre (Open Spoilers after issues drop)

Should there be a new OT for From the Ashes Era

  • Yes, and I will participate.

    Votes: 11 47.8%

  • Yes, but I probably won't participate.

    Votes: 6 26.1%

  • No. Keep the conversation here.

    Votes: 3 13.0%

  • No. I have no interest in From the Ashes.

    Votes: 2 8.7%

  • Let's just talk about it on the Comics Era OT.

    Votes: 1 4.3%
  • Total voters
    23
  • This poll will close: .
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Mr. Poolman

Mr. Poolman

The Fallen
Oct 27, 2017
6,975
BebopCola said:
As someone who has been a lifelong Apocalypse fan (thanks to the 90's cartoon), Dawn of X has been a feast.
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I have my issues with Apoc.
He is this "always a menace, never accomplishes nothing" kind of villain to me.
Cool postures, look and manner of speech, but this whole "the man with a plan" got old to me, as the plan never came.
Age of Apocalypse was very very fun, and probably my favorite version of the character.
But this new -A- is really becoming among my favorites, yesterday's issue added a layer of complexity that I really liked (a Hickman classic move), since his "survival of the fittest" takes on a whole different meaning now that we know WHY they have to be the fittest.

Kudos to Hickman for making an old boring villain, someone interesting!
 
The Adder

The Adder

Member
Oct 25, 2017
18,086
Apocalypse works so much better as well-intentioned, cooperative, but still dangerous and scheming. It lets him get wins that he's allowed to keep because he's ultimately on the heroes' side even if he's not acting in ways they approve. And a successful Apocalypse is an intimidating Apocalypse.
 
Stantastic

Stantastic

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,493
Apoc shot way the hell up there for me just with that "Theres nothing you can break that i cant fix" talk at the start of Excalibur.
Nothing sells survival of the fittest like good parenting.
 
BebopCola

BebopCola

Member
Jul 17, 2019
2,040
Mr. Poolman said:
I have my issues with Apoc.
He is this "always a menace, never accomplishes nothing" kind of villain to me.
Cool postures, look and manner of speech, but this whole "the man with a plan" got old to me, as the plan never came.
Age of Apocalypse was very very fun, and probably my favorite version of the character.
But this new -A- is really becoming among my favorites, yesterday's issue added a layer of complexity that I really liked (a Hickman classic move), since his "survival of the fittest" takes on a whole different meaning now that we know WHY they have to be the fittest.

Kudos to Hickman for making an old boring villain, someone interesting!
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Yeah I totally get it. I went from watching him on Fox where he like a force of nature in every episode, even to the point where he had almost gained control of time itself to reading his storylines where he doesn't really accomplish much and his personality goes from one extreme (the brutal but noble warrior who stood up to Loki on behalf of humanity) to the other (acting batshit insane as he flies around in space punching the High Evolutionary).

The vibe and pathos of him that he has been given by Hickman and Howard and the others has been stellar and he just WORKS as a character now.

Also I reread X-Cutioner's Song recently and discovered that Apocalypse is basically me now: if he gets woken up too early he's a grumpy old man with little to show for it, and will end up getting seriously injured if he can't go back to bed.
 
Palette Swap

Palette Swap

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
11,201
The Adder said:
Apocalypse works so much better as well-intentioned, cooperative, but still dangerous and scheming. It lets him get wins that he's allowed to keep because he's ultimately on the heroes' side even if he's not acting in ways they approve. And a successful Apocalypse is an intimidating Apocalypse.
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Totally agreed. If anything, he finally has the stature he was always meant to have.
It's Hickman and anti-heroes all over again, but that's where he really shines.
 
The Adder

The Adder

Member
Oct 25, 2017
18,086
As an aside, I really want the Vault story line to conclude with:

"Yeah, you guys sent a Wolverine and a dude who adapts to survive into a vault where generations pass in days. Long story short, everyone in there's a mutant now."
 
Kanhir

Kanhir

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,888
TheMadTitan said:
Admittedly, I forgot about Shogo. But at the same time, he's an infant. Doesn't really count; they're not going to kick out a baby.
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He's also a dragon right now. I'm sure it's only a matter of time before they come up with some retcon of a latent X-Gene that makes him transform in other worlds or something.
 
nitekrawler

nitekrawler

Member
Oct 28, 2017
312
The Summoner data blurb has changed.

The new one shows more current summoners than the one found in X-men #2. The body of the text has also changed but has similarities.

Are there two groups of summoners? Those from Arakko and those from Amenth? Looks like the Arakkii summoners are at a disadvantage if so.
 
Harpoon

Harpoon

Member
Oct 27, 2017
6,572
Folks here might be interested in picking up the Immortal She-Hulk one-shot next week, as it looks like it's got Al Ewing writing about Krakoa!

31k9pWj.jpg
 
deimosmasque

deimosmasque

Ugly, Queer, Gender-Fluid, Drive-In Mutant, yes?
Moderator
Apr 22, 2018
14,164
Tampa, Fl
Maligna said:
What's up with She-Hulk lately? I haven't been following.
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After being critically injured by Thanos she's more like the other Hulk. Actually she goes by Hulk only now. She has the madder she gets the stronger she gets thing and can also release gamma energy as an area of effect attack.

She can still transform at will though and is dating Thor.
 
Palette Swap

Palette Swap

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
11,201
Harpoon said:
Folks here might be interested in picking up the Immortal She-Hulk one-shot next week, as it looks like it's got Al Ewing writing about Krakoa!

31k9pWj.jpg
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People should read Ewing's Hulk anyway tbh.

Maligna said:
What's up with She-Hulk lately? I haven't been following.
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She was killed and replaced by a Cotati during Empyre. She came back because it turns out you can't kill a gamma powered person because when they die, they come back from a hellish gamma dimension. That's from Immortal Hulk.
 
Maligna

Maligna

Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,806
Canada
deimosmasque said:
After being critically injured by Thanos she's more like the other Hulk. Actually she goes by Hulk only now. She has the madder she gets the stronger she gets thing and can also release gamma energy as an area of effect attack.

She can still transform at will though and is dating Thor.
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Palette Swap said:
People should read Ewing's Hulk anyway tbh.


She was killed and replaced by a Cotati during Empyre. She came back because it turns out you can't kill a gamma powered person because when they die, they come back from a hellish gamma dimension. That's from Immortal Hulk.
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Haha. Oh, comic books.

Thanks for the update. :)
 
Sou Da

Sou Da

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
16,738
deimosmasque said:
After being critically injured by Thanos she's more like the other Hulk. Actually she goes by Hulk only now. She has the madder she gets the stronger she gets thing and can also release gamma energy as an area of effect attack.
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Actually to be a huge pedant here, she recovered from that grey Hulk state after being injured by Thanos because it was more of a mental thing like all Hulk related shenanigans. Jason Aaron bullshitted her being transformed by the Celestial body because he wanted Bruce on his Avengers team and wasn't allowed to get him.
 
deimosmasque

deimosmasque

Ugly, Queer, Gender-Fluid, Drive-In Mutant, yes?
Moderator
Apr 22, 2018
14,164
Tampa, Fl
Sou Da said:
Actually to be a huge pedant here, she recovered from that grey Hulk state after being injured by Thanos because it was more of a mental thing like all Hulk related shenanigans. Jason Aaron bullshitted her being transformed by the Celestial body because he wanted Bruce on his Avengers team and wasn't allowed to get him.
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You are correct I got my timeline messed up.
Rhaknar said:
why do the green skin bits become purple when she changes to human? and the blck bits become white whut
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Unstable Molecules.
 
just_myles

just_myles

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,453
Looks like things are starting to pay off a bit in the X-men book proper. Though, you may need to have picked up to Excalibur to see why. Kind of funny how these things tie in.
 
Blader

Blader

Member
Oct 27, 2017
26,604
Just so I have the lore down correctly (note I'm not reading Excalibur):
In early Earth days, you had one land of mutants: Orakko.

An event involving something called the Twilight Sword split land into two: Krakoa and Arakko.

Splitting the land opened the door to some hell world that monsters came out of (Amenth?). Apocalypse led that era's mutants (apparently the second generation, so there's an even older generation predating Apoc) to defend this world; but Arakko sank into Amenth?

Over thousands of years, the mutants in Arakko - led by Apoc's wife Genesis - defended themselves against the monsters of Amenth, until they were finally overrun by Annihilation, the god of Amenth, who killed Genesis.

Summoner made the pilgrimmage to Earth/Krakoa to recruit Apoc to help them rebuff Amend; they'd be waiting for years, he never showed up, so Summoner made the journey on a piece of land that popped up near Krakoa as an island - which Krakoa absorbed.

Not clear what ten swords have to do with any of this yet but probably related to the ten towers that had defended Arrakko? Or maybe "ten" is just a recurring motif in general.
Do I have that right?
 
The Adder

The Adder

Member
Oct 25, 2017
18,086
Harpoon said:
Folks here might be interested in picking up the Immortal She-Hulk one-shot next week, as it looks like it's got Al Ewing writing about Krakoa!

31k9pWj.jpg
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God damn love everything going on in the X-Men space right now and I love that the people writing it get this shit. Yeah, some stuff may pop off on Krakoa, it's comic books. But Krakoa as a concept isn't a problem.
 
blanton

blanton

alt account
Banned
Jul 28, 2020
1,576
Blader said:
Just so I have the lore down correctly (note I'm not reading Excalibur):
In early Earth days, you had one land of mutants: Orakko.

An event involving something called the Twilight Sword split land into two: Krakoa and Arakko.

Splitting the land opened the door to some hell world that monsters came out of (Amenth?). Apocalypse led that era's mutants (apparently the second generation, so there's an even older generation predating Apoc) to defend this world; but Arakko sank into Amenth?

Over thousands of years, the mutants in Arakko - led by Apoc's wife Genesis - defended themselves against the monsters of Amenth, until they were finally overrun by Annihilation, the god of Amenth, who killed Genesis.

Summoner made the pilgrimmage to Earth/Krakoa to recruit Apoc to help them rebuff Amend; they'd be waiting for years, he never showed up, so Summoner made the journey on a piece of land that popped up near Krakoa as an island - which Krakoa absorbed.

Not clear what ten swords have to do with any of this yet but probably related to the ten towers that had defended Arrakko? Or maybe "ten" is just a recurring motif in general.
Do I have that right?
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I believe that's right. To add some more detail related to Excalibur:

Apocalypse has been spending his time trying to set up Krakoan gates in Otherworld (home of Captain Britain, etc). There is some connection between Otherworld and Amenth - probably a magical connection since Apocalypse has become the "magician of mutantkind" in Excalibur.

Apocalypse has done all this because he apparently feels regret for abandoning his wife, Genesis, and his first horsemen. He has killed four of the Externals to open the gate to Otherworld to try and rescue his people, who are apparently in a cycle of death and resurrection for hundreds of thousands of years.
 
OP
OP
Dalek

Dalek

Member
Oct 25, 2017
38,901
blanton said:
I believe that's right. To add some more detail related to Excalibur:

Apocalypse has been spending his time trying to set up Krakoan gates in Otherworld (home of Captain Britain, etc). There is some connection between Otherworld and Amenth - probably a magical connection since Apocalypse has become the "magician of mutantkind" in Excalibur.

Apocalypse has done all this because he apparently feels regret for abandoning his wife, Genesis, and his first horsemen. He has killed four of the Externals to open the gate to Otherworld to try and rescue his people, who are apparently in a cycle of death and resurrection for hundreds of thousands of years.
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This is true as well- and I'm not sure what Saturnyne has to do with this as well. I'm not well versed in Captain Britain and older Excalibur knowledge.
 
Digital Dinosaur

Digital Dinosaur

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,028
Rita Repulsa's Moon Palace
I kinda got the idea that Otherworld is, in a fairy realm sort of way, a crossroads between many supernatural dimensions. Amenth looks like a demonic plane. As with all dimensions, there's probably many ways in and out of it. But with the size of the gate -[A]- created, it makes me think he wants to bring the entirety of Arakko out using Otherworld as a wide path. Not just rescue its inhabitants through human size portals.
 
TheBlackMarvel

TheBlackMarvel

Member
Oct 26, 2017
3,326
Kai Dracon said:
I kinda got the idea that Otherworld is, in a fairy realm sort of way, a crossroads between many supernatural dimensions. Amenth looks like a demonic plane. As with all dimensions, there's probably many ways in and out of it. But with the size of the gate -[A]- created, it makes me think he wants to bring the entirety of Arakko out using Otherworld as a wide path. Not just rescue its inhabitants through human size portals.
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I think that's been pretty much stated.
 
blanton

blanton

alt account
Banned
Jul 28, 2020
1,576
Dalek said:
This is true as well- and I'm not sure what Saturnyne has to do with this as well. I'm not well versed in Captain Britain and older Excalibur knowledge.
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Saturnyne is likely making a move on Krakoa/Arrako seeing as a large magic source linked to the Otherworld just opened up.
TaleSpun said:
AL MOTHERFUCKING EWING

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I thought this was obvious after Ewing's Empyre Aftermath issue. Looking forward to Brand telling Hank to get fucked.
 
deimosmasque

deimosmasque

Ugly, Queer, Gender-Fluid, Drive-In Mutant, yes?
Moderator
Apr 22, 2018
14,164
Tampa, Fl
blanton said:
Saturnyne is likely making a move on Krakoa/Arrako seeing as a large magic source linked to the Otherworld just opened up.

I thought this was obvious after Ewing's Empyre Aftermath issue. Looking forward to Brand telling Hank to get fucked.
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Are you kidding? Brand is probably the one person who sees what Hank is doing as an improvement. He has basically embraced her "pragmatism as the only morality" mindset.
 
Jodez99

Jodez99

Member
Jan 1, 2018
3,595
All the Apocalypse talk in here, arr they changing his survival of the fittest to being about battling demons? I liked his whole connection to the Celestials and trying prepare Earth for judgment.
 
deimosmasque

deimosmasque

Ugly, Queer, Gender-Fluid, Drive-In Mutant, yes?
Moderator
Apr 22, 2018
14,164
Tampa, Fl
Jodez99 said:
All the Apocalypse talk in here, arr they changing his survival of the fittest to being about battling demons? I liked his whole connection to the Celestials and trying prepare Earth for judgment.
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His creation as the being Apocalypse was for the Celestials. I think this is more a side project.
 
OP
OP
Dalek

Dalek

Member
Oct 25, 2017
38,901
blanton said:
Saturnyne is likely making a move on Krakoa/Arrako seeing as a large magic source linked to the Otherworld just opened up.

I thought this was obvious after Ewing's Empyre Aftermath issue. Looking forward to Brand telling Hank to get fucked.
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Empyre was so good but the last pages of those Aftermath issues had me 👀
 
Vic_Viper

Vic_Viper

Thanked By SGM
Member
Oct 25, 2017
29,028
That SWORD lineup is so good. Love that look for kid Cable. And I really like that X logo on their outfits.

Hope the series gets a reveal at the end of tomorrow's X of Swords Creation. At least a better look at that cover lol.
 
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