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Johnny Depp v Amber Heard's defamation trial is underway [UPDATE: Verdict reached. Johnny Depp won.]
- Thread starter WinFonda
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'Let's Remind You': Johnny Depp's Lawyer Presses Amber Heard on Late-Night Visit from James Franco Days Before Restraining Order
'Let's Remind You': Johnny Depp's Lawyer Presses Amber Heard on Late-Night Visit from James Franco Days Before Restraining Order
Far from a trivial detail of Hollywood gossip, James Franco's visit to Amber Heard's penthouse has become a focal point in Johnny Depp's defamation trial.
lawandcrime.com
Johnny Depp's Lawyer Scrutinizes Amber Heard's Sexual Assault Claims with Questions About MDMA, Carly Simon, and Clunky Rings
Johnny Depp's Lawyer Scrutinizes Amber Heard's Sexual Assault Claims with Questions About MDMA, Carly Simon, and Clunky Rings
Johnny Depp's attorney picked apart the most intimate details of that alleged incident in Australia during combative cross-examination on Tuesday.
lawandcrime.com
All I have to say after today is... Watching AH twist, and turn... Trying to manipulate the narrative... Never admit to being wrong etc... It was exactly like what my mum used to do...
I 100% believe JD and everything he has said... It's all creditable, it's consistent...
Edit: to be clear JD is far from perfect in this but he has at least admitted this... AH has not and today she stated directly or indirectly many different people are lying.... Not her.. this is the difference..
AH is framing herself as the victim... When she was imho the main (but not only) aggressor...
That doesn't mean all woman are lairs etc, and AH is doing real damage to DV and SA victims if she is lying... And it is not a good look right now.
I 100% believe JD and everything he has said... It's all creditable, it's consistent...
Edit: to be clear JD is far from perfect in this but he has at least admitted this... AH has not and today she stated directly or indirectly many different people are lying.... Not her.. this is the difference..
AH is framing herself as the victim... When she was imho the main (but not only) aggressor...
That doesn't mean all woman are lairs etc, and AH is doing real damage to DV and SA victims if she is lying... And it is not a good look right now.
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Amber Heard is definitely not winning in terms of public opinion right now, and she does seem to be the more toxic person in their relationship (according to the evidence shown so far) but the overwhelming support for Depp is absurd considering he's clearly a troubled and abusive individual himself.
Also the right wing seems to be capitalizing on this court case with regards to trying to reverse all the progress made by MeToo which is frankly disgusting -- this is why I think this zealous support of Depp should be kept in check because the prevailing narrative atm seems to be see all women are liars when it comes to domestic violence. There is a real chance women's rights could be affected by a huge popular culture phenomenon like this.
Also the right wing seems to be capitalizing on this court case with regards to trying to reverse all the progress made by MeToo which is frankly disgusting -- this is why I think this zealous support of Depp should be kept in check because the prevailing narrative atm seems to be see all women are liars when it comes to domestic violence. There is a real chance women's rights could be affected by a huge popular culture phenomenon like this.
So then maybe Heard shouldn't have invented this whole thing?
so you think all women should suffer because of one woman's (alleged) misbehavior, wtf?
By people replying to the thread; I think there's a silent party and the upheal battle this thread had is a clue along with past threads on the case and adjacent issues.
And I see a lot more people on Twitter, tens of thousands on tweets; not sizeable when compared to the mass support of Depp but significant in terms of where progressive rhetoric lies/is limited and in progressive spaces rather than just the mass of everyday folks; same in certain spaces on Reddit.
Every time I see a post like yours my support gets louder.
Absolutely not, but this case is a great example of why a man's (or woman's) name should not be so easy to smear with false allegations.
So the solution is to throw Depp to the wolves for the sake of the larger movement?
Because that's kinda what you're suggesting by these posts.
it probably would help if progressives weren't continuing to stick up and defend Heard. Doesn't exactly help your movement to publicly support an abuser. It also doesn't help that Heard specifically capitalized on the metoo movement for publicity.
To be honest, if a movement can't handle these kinds of challenges it was doomed to fail. A truly persistent movement can overcome bad actors, and I doubt that the MeToo movement will collapse just because Amber Heard was a psychopath.
We have to keep in mind the real victims in all this. Which are apparently people who are entirely unrelated to the case.
That is what everyone has said since her lies became evident: Amber Heard's case would be a disservice to all women who are victims of abuse. I've not seen a single person in this thread say that we should not trust women anymore or that "me too" was a mistake. This is a sad consequence.
You can't come here and say that supporting the victim is supporting attacks on women, Amber is to blame.
Right wing wouldn't be able to capitalize on anything if so many "progressives" hadn't decided that being "right" and winning the culture war was more important than their supposed goal of seeking justice for victims of abuse.
Turns out for some it's conditional support. If you aren't the right kind of victim you get the constant "he's no angel", "both sides" arguments you see constantly pop up in these threads to dismiss people's pain so they can continue to feel righteous.
I've seen and encountered my fair share of abuse, I'm not going to share any stories because I don't feel safe too. If someone as high profile and with so many receipts like Johnny can't overcome this, what hope is there?
Turns out for some it's conditional support. If you aren't the right kind of victim you get the constant "he's no angel", "both sides" arguments you see constantly pop up in these threads to dismiss people's pain so they can continue to feel righteous.
I've seen and encountered my fair share of abuse, I'm not going to share any stories because I don't feel safe too. If someone as high profile and with so many receipts like Johnny can't overcome this, what hope is there?
The whiplash of this is getting some traction with mainstream media and I'd argue that once more this is talked about, the #MeToo movement may actually come out of this strengthened because of it, not weakened. Heard is a bad actor that tried to take advantage of that movement to further her career by putting her in a good light. This reckoning is a good thing that is happening to Depp as an abuse victim, but victims in general imho. What happened here is the exception to the rule, not the other way around.
God forbid male victims of domestic abuse are actually believed.
that's not what I'm saying, I couldn't care less whether Amber Heard loses this case or not. I'm not even talking about posters in this thread because most of them they're not attacking all women.
I'm just saying is that there are nefarious parties trying to use this to set back women's rights and we need to be aware of that and not treat Heard like she's some sort of symbol of all women. it's unfortunate but there are many young men right now being radicalized by the zealous response to this court case, that should worry anyone who cares about the future.
Nobody said that.
The people doing the most damage to women's rights and the metoo movement in this situation are the ones who continue to demonize Depp and defend Heard in the face of all this evidence of her mental, emotional, and physical abuse. The people who can't ever admit that they were wrong about something. By showing that they prioritize their own egos and progressive brands over the suffering of male abuse victims they're giving MRAs a fuckton of ammo right now. Why the hell do you think so many of us are fucking pissed at their behavior?
The people who are happy that an abuse victim is being publicly vindicated after having been dragged through hell the last few years aren't the problem right now.
I think you are correct that many Red Pill type communities and people love this case and side with Depp.
But you also were insinuating that people should not side with Depp because of this, which I think is a poor take on this. Depp is a victim of abuse, whether or not far Right types are foaming at the mouth over this. We need to be on the side of justice.
These types don't need this trial to be angry or to be radicalized. They will always find something.
It is clear to me after watching this trial that Heard is a manipulative and lying abuser to Depp. It is also clear that Depp himself has his own issues, however, living with such a toxic person isn't going to make you at your best, you are in turn also going to be toxic especially with substance abuse issues.
In the end, I am going to side with Depp because it is the right thing to do, and I'm not going to not side with Depp just because doing so would make some MAGAts happy.
Nah forget these people; I always said this case was a slamduck event for progressive to prove unequivocally support for male victims and instead across the board by every conversation director/community it's been fumbled to an extreme degree.
I'm going to keep the focus where it needs to be as I've been following this case for years and waiting for the moment it was 24/7 coverage and I knew it would arrive; I've lost some followers over it, but it's been therapeutic for other friends who are survivors and maybe we'll push the discussion in a bit of a better direction.
That includes the people saying no one should care about it/take sides as It's like i'm actually continually being gaslit that there wasn't a massive social movement over the past decade predicated on the testimonies and advocacy of celebrities as a vehicle for discussing societal wide abuse that didn't necessitate fandom and didn't encourage victim blaming, that I supported.
Edit: From the beginning people obfuscating from the actual convo with talks of MRA's and " incels" have just harmed things.
I think this is a fair point as well. Ignoring the abuse of men and always siding with women regardless of what happened, is exactly what these types claim the metoo movement does. By ignoring the obvious abuse and lies about it coming from Heard, many people are just giving them more fuel for their narrative honestly.
In the end, no matter how "the left" responds to these types of issues and situations, these types are always going to twist it in their favor so how about we worry less about what they want.
And this problem is made worse by popular left media either doubling down on supporting Herd or no longer covering the case when the evidence has piled up for Depp. It means that those nefarious parties get to control the narrative and gain eyes they never would have if people had not dug in their feet about herd. We have seen it here with some of what has been linked
There's only one terrible person in all this and that's Amber Heard. If there's anyone who is setting back women's rights and the Meetoo movement it's Amber Heard. As a woman, I find it disgusting and vile that Heard has made it so much harder for women to be believed. It's vile that she used a movement meant to empower women for her own selfish reasons and to destroy a man because she could - 'Tell the world that I johnny am a abuse victim and see who believes you!'.
Sexual assault/rape TRIGGER WARNING!!!
I find it disgusting that she then added rape with a bottle to his crimes. I had to take a break from this trial for a few days when she was talking about that because it's so utterly vile, it's all a game to her to tell all these lies. When there are real people who have suffered these crimes and will not get justice because of the precedent she has set.
She's a narcissistic monster and I want her to go to jail, I am so angry
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Actually there really isn't much evidence to support he is an abusive/ violent person, outside of the occasions where she apparently engaged him in physical altercations that -she- was seeking and might have resulted from him trying to get away from her.
The far right trying to coopt this case to damage MeToo is obvious and expected, but should not lead to sacrifice a victim on the altar of "the greater good".
If anything, what is coming out of this is Believe Women should actually be Believe Victims. All victims.
The whole thing is kind of genius from his teams perspective. It is a defamation case. She never flat out named him directly in any of her articles. They would probably lose the case anywhere else, especially in LA. But they chose to hold it in Virginia....that's more in their favor. And they chose to publicly stream the entire thing. Even if Depp loses. Heard's career is done. She will forever be known as "The Bed Pooper".
Also the whole #JusticeForJohnny crowd is crazy. In my opinion, they seem to both be pretty horrible individuals. The whole thing is just sad.
Also the whole #JusticeForJohnny crowd is crazy. In my opinion, they seem to both be pretty horrible individuals. The whole thing is just sad.
The road for making legit female victims of DV heard and vindicated shouldn't be paved with the suffering and condemnation of innocent men.
Any decent person should agree with that.
To say otherwise only reveals the bad faith actors.
This whole "BUT THE RIGHT WILL HATE WOMEN" is just concern trolling. The right will hate women anyways, that shouldn't be the focus of this case.
Any decent person should agree with that.
To say otherwise only reveals the bad faith actors.
This whole "BUT THE RIGHT WILL HATE WOMEN" is just concern trolling. The right will hate women anyways, that shouldn't be the focus of this case.
Hey another one for the "they are both bad" argument, awesome.
I think the big divide on this is between people who think that watching the trial gives them some kind of privileged information (which then allows them to assert confidently that Depp is a victim) versus people who won't watch the trial because they think it's a sham. For those of us not watching the trial, reading this thread is quite odd because you've got people in here who seem very certain that Depp is the victim even though their entire understanding of the dynamic between these two people comes from evidence elicited in the context of this trial. They might be correct, they might not, but because we don't trust the evidence we don't trust the result.
Meanwhile, it's hard to ignore the signs that reinforce the notion that something much more insidious is going on here. The first time I stepped into a thread about this subject on this forum I saw a pretty nasty post generalizing people with BPD, and I've since seen more. I also saw someone write that Amber Heard has set #MeToo back more than any other individual, which is pretty ridiculous because the only way that can be true is if you assign a ton of value to this trial, which you shouldn't. On that note, I also see tons of reference to demeanor evidence in this thread without anyone coming in and pointing out that demeanor evidence is hot garbage and is specifically implicated in producing wrong results in DV trials.
I have a law degree; I study legal systems for a living. You can decide for yourself how much that's worth to you - I don't really care. I just know that for myself nobody will ever be able to convince me that they learned anything valuable from watching this trial. I know too much about trials to think that anything useful is happening here. One good sign of this is that this is a defamation case and yet we're all talking about who abused who. It's actually almost completely irrelevant to the disposition of the trial whether Amber Heard abused Depp, and the singular focus of this element in the coverage ought to appear to you (as it does to me) like a big flashing sign that reads "THIS IS A CIRCUS".
Meanwhile, it's hard to ignore the signs that reinforce the notion that something much more insidious is going on here. The first time I stepped into a thread about this subject on this forum I saw a pretty nasty post generalizing people with BPD, and I've since seen more. I also saw someone write that Amber Heard has set #MeToo back more than any other individual, which is pretty ridiculous because the only way that can be true is if you assign a ton of value to this trial, which you shouldn't. On that note, I also see tons of reference to demeanor evidence in this thread without anyone coming in and pointing out that demeanor evidence is hot garbage and is specifically implicated in producing wrong results in DV trials.
I have a law degree; I study legal systems for a living. You can decide for yourself how much that's worth to you - I don't really care. I just know that for myself nobody will ever be able to convince me that they learned anything valuable from watching this trial. I know too much about trials to think that anything useful is happening here. One good sign of this is that this is a defamation case and yet we're all talking about who abused who. It's actually almost completely irrelevant to the disposition of the trial whether Amber Heard abused Depp, and the singular focus of this element in the coverage ought to appear to you (as it does to me) like a big flashing sign that reads "THIS IS A CIRCUS".
you're putting a victim of abuse in the same catagory as the abuser and you see nothing wrong with that? really? REALLY!?
Tldr; I have a law degree, I don't need to watch the trial to know more than you do.
I agree. His attitude over this whole thing has been very revealing of his true nature. It's not just him saying "the wrong things", it's the ways in which he has doubled, tripled down on it.
I don't expect anything to happen to him being platformed on this site, though. The Xbox Game Studios thread is already salivating for the next Grubb insider info drop just earlier today.
So you think the trial is a sham then? Why?
What does this even mean? Something insidious is happening on Era in regards to this case?
User Banned (2 Weeks): Condescending thread derailment in a sensitive thread over multiple posts, previously actioned for similar behavior
This is about how well I would expect someone who didn't read my post to sum it up.
In any event, the discourse in this thread doesn't exactly inspire confidence re: posters knowing more about trials than I do
I don't want to be mean Fugu, but saying this in a thread where ppl have opened up about past abuses and how this case makes them remember how they were said that ppl would not believe them, by saying how this is a circus that ppl do not look at the technical points of the trial, and there's something insidious going on... it's really uncomfortable to read.
User Banned (5 Days): Thread-derailment and trolling
Okay...I'll make different categories.
Overall Horrible Person in general: Amber Heard
Horrible at Parties: Depp
the only thing your post did was say anyone who disagrees with you because of you being a lawyer but your ignoring evidence for your own bias.
Yep.
The Law related subreddits on Reddit/a few other professional based subreddits seem to believe all Depp supporters are ignorant layman improperly assessing the UK and giving into manipulation/anti-feminist rhetoric and have positioned themselves as the enlightened centrists who are truly nuanced/not black and white thinking, unlike his support base/those that are anti-Amber Heard.
That comment is right out of said playbook.
You are basically telling us to ignore the trial which is the only chance that both Depp and Heard have to lay all their evidence before us and do what?
So all those audio recordings where she admits to hitting him and chasing after him as he tries to escape the abuse is a sham? You don't trust these audio tapes?
Others will prolly come in at various levels and I'm genuinely not interested in an extended argument.
Putting aside the material evidence (of which there is a vast amount one side and a dearth on the other), I doubt very much whether the reactions you seem so concerned with reach beyond the context presented.
To sum up, your first paragraph asserts a position which denies and downplays the existence of material evidence, your second restates that while essentially telling people not to believe things on first blush, and your third is just appeal to authority stuff.
I learned by watching the trial that much more material evidence exists than I had thought (audio, photos) and learning this, and more, I changed my position.
I genuinely believe your concern about how mental health and how victims are treated to be concern trolling.
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