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Seafoam Gaming

One Winged Slayer
Member
Nov 3, 2017
2,692
Just watch the fist few seconds of the video. He owns some of the rarest gaming items. E.g. the first ever Famicom and an actual Ultra 64.



Being rich with lots of money doesn't entitle you to free shit whatsoever. Especially if you want to get an early unit meant for FEEDBACK and REVIEW purposes. This is completely petty on his part and just screams of "ugh why didn't i get one i have high sub counts :(" which is a thing I almost did when I was starting out my website due to me thinking that giving feedback to games and being willing to play them entitled me to a code, and lemme just say as someone who's gotten tons of review copies and worked with lots of companies since fixing up my act and learning how not to start a review site, and learning the proper way of doing things: Fucking don't. PR companies won't tolerate your shit. They don't mind feedback, even negative, even companies whos games I blasted hard due to being unplayable messes, still let me write my review the way it is since I'm giving feedback. The only feedback they won't like is if it includes defamation and outright slander, which applies to pretty much anything. They're more than willing to work out with you, more than willing to understand delays in your review if you keep them updated often, more than willing to answer any questions you need, and more than willing to help.

They won't like it if you act entitled to review copies just because you're popular/big/get games from them often in the past, or even worse, ask for a bunch of shit at once, without covering the older games they sent you without any updates on where those reviews are. PR reps are human too, and thus they would almost certainly laugh at this guy's behavior and way of handling the situation, with him acting like "because I was a REALIST they DENIED me MY review unit!"

The point here isn't entitlement. He was actually offered one. The point is how he was asked to say certain things. I don't see entitlement to obtain free things in his attitude.

Where he may have been wrong was how he reviewed a copy of BotW that he managed to obtain through contacts days before any outlet was allowed to.

All reviews have terms and conditions. They're called embargoes. Even if it's as basic as "don't spoil the story or talk about ____ ___ or ___ before ___", they have to be followed, they don't compromise the review or score in any way. You can still express your honest opinion while following said restrictions, EASILY. And even, double check with the PR rep if you want to be super careful and have them look over your review if you're worried.

This is not true. This guy is a notorious liar. Having worked with Nintendo Australia for a long time (and having been one of the Australian outlets sent a Switch prior to launch), there was nothing of the kind in the embargo. It's utterly ridiculous and I can't believe people in this thread are even questioning that tbh.

My memory is that this guy obtained a Switch through other means prior to launch, and was then putting out content, which we all know Nintendo doesn't like.

Yeah I know a few switches leaked via early shipments and other means before the launch and that's what led to UI leaks and the like. Nintendo were very pissed about it. There was this youtube gameplay channel that posted gameplay of a lot of nintendo switch games, awfully handy at around the time reviewers would get their copies, or even often before the retail release date, which would at times be before the review copies went out.

It was later found out this youtuber just downloaded pirated dumped versions of a bunch of games the moment they hit file sharing sites, solely so he could be the "first" to make videos on the subject even if they predated review copies, (Since review copies are digital and not physical, physical leaks can predate digital codes) which led to him getting blacklisted big time.
 

soniko_

Banned
Jan 25, 2018
178
I don't get it why this is relevant at this point in time? It's already expected for all the reviewers of new stuff to write glowing reviews about their new product
 

Musubi

Unshakable Resolve - Prophet of Truth
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
23,611
If you actually watch the video it becomes clear its less him throwing a fit about not getting a free switch (he got two early without Nintendo's help anyways) and more just criticism about how every unboxing was just people regurgitating Nintendo's talking points rather than giving actual reviews.
 

Bing147

Member
Jun 13, 2018
3,689
Well that's the game right? Nobody is entitled to review a thing or get a console before launch just 'because i have a lot of games'

But they did offer him one if they hit the talking points.

This is how marketing works. All companies do it. "You want a nice new console before launch... we'll you gotta do something for us!"

Joel seems like a great guy and I like his channel, but this comes off a bit entitled.

A company trying to buy positive reviews is never okay. I've been reviewing games for 20 years and never seen such a thing. Maybe they treat influences and YouTube diffently from critics but if they're doing this its a problem
 

jdh96

One Winged Slayer
Member
Jan 25, 2020
1,705
This is not true. This guy is a notorious liar. Having worked with Nintendo Australia for a long time (and having been one of the Australian outlets sent a Switch prior to launch), there was nothing of the kind in the embargo. It's utterly ridiculous and I can't believe people in this thread are even questioning that tbh.

My memory is that this guy obtained a Switch through other means prior to launch, and was then putting out content, which we all know Nintendo doesn't like.
May I ask why the OP and many people in this thread are flat out ignoring this?
 

Vic20

Member
Nov 10, 2019
3,268
Yep, and at worst, those influencers will paint any kind of criticism like "while (feature) hasn't really been performing how I would normally expect, these things normally take time to smooth out, and I expect a future software update to smooth out the kinks ... otherwise, this new (product) is absolutely brilliant and I cannot wait to see more from it! Don't forget to likesubscribefollowsharescreenshotemailinstagramfacebook".
Are you talking about the ps5 lol
 

Deleted member 17388

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
12,994
This is not true. This guy is a notorious liar. Having worked with Nintendo Australia for a long time (and having been one of the Australian outlets sent a Switch prior to launch), there was nothing of the kind in the embargo. It's utterly ridiculous and I can't believe people in this thread are even questioning that tbh.

My memory is that this guy obtained a Switch through other means prior to launch, and was then putting out content, which we all know Nintendo doesn't like.
There it is.
 

Wafflinson

Banned
Nov 17, 2017
2,084
Meh. I thought it was pretty much understood that if you are receiving a free product there were some expectations on what you can say about it.

Wish the guy was more specific about what they asked him to say.
 
shancake's elaboration on PR reps not making such requests

shancake

Managing Editor ‑ Press Start
Verified
Oct 25, 2017
485
Can you clarify if the embargo specified that you must speak about the Switch being robust and compact?

Joel himself didn't use the word negative, that's my own word. He claims that he wasn't allowed to give his own opinion.

I can go as far as saying that I've never EVER been asked for a PR rep, big or small to say ANYTHING specific about anything ever.. If you think any outlet would let that slide, you're wrong.

Would would Nintendo ask anyone to say that a console is small or robust? Also, the Switch is small and robust.. Why would anyone need to be told they have to say that lol? Look at it in comparison to the Wii U tablet..
 

Decarbia

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,440
Yeah man, the Switch might just have made if they had played ball with this fucking rando.
 

Deleted member 49482

User requested account closure
Banned
Nov 8, 2018
3,302
Ended up watching the entire video and you have to love how Nintendo copyright flagged all of his videos just because he beat them at their own game. This guy is about the last person who would whine about not getting free stuff. He does own literally the world's largest video collection, which alone is worth millions of dollars.

I'm just not a big fan of companies using YouTubers as an unpaid extension of their marketing department. While the hype can be fun, it does lose some of its sheen when you know everything they're saying is bought, paid for, and run through the filter of a company directives.

I'd love it if more YouTubers pulled the curtain back on this, though we know most of them are too worried about losing their freebies and taking a hit to their revenue stream. But, it's also sort of hard for me to blame them when you see how a company like Nintendo reacts when you won't subject yourself to their demands.
 

SaberVS7

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,234
Well that's the game right? Nobody is entitled to review a thing or get a console before launch just 'because i have a lot of games'

But they did offer him one if they hit the talking points.

This is how marketing works. All companies do it. "You want a nice new console before launch... we'll you gotta do something for us!"

Joel seems like a great guy and I like his channel, but this comes off a bit entitled.

Well, you see, That's The Problem.

That's not how it works in other industries and mediums that currently have much more mainstream respect as Art. The Film and Novel scene respect Critics, the Games industry treats Critics as Marketing Tools.

It's considered Scandalous and a Black Mark on a film if the studio or distributor picks-and-chooses which Critics it lets have access to Press Screenings, or any other forms of Quid-Pro-Quo with intent of unduly influencing the reviews that come out before the film's release date.

The games industry's current practices are one of the medium's greatest barriers towards proper recognition as art. What's normalized behavior for game publishers and studios is taboo in other media.
 

RedOnePunch

Member
Oct 26, 2017
2,628
Reviews should never be considered marketing. If it is marketing, then it's not a review. More like a preview or some other sponsored content
 

Amiablepercy

Banned
Nov 4, 2017
3,587
California
Well, you see, That's The Problem.

That's not how it works in other industries and mediums that currently have much more mainstream respect as Art. The Film and Novel scene respect Critics, the Games industry treats Critics as Marketing Tools.

It's considered Scandalous and a Black Mark on a film if the studio or distributor picks-and-chooses which Critics it lets have access to Press Screenings, or any other forms of Quid-Pro-Quo with intent of unduly influencing the reviews that come out before the film's release date.

The games industry's current practices are one of the medium's greatest barriers towards proper recognition as art. What's normalized behavior for game publishers and studios is taboo in other media.

You clearly havr not worked in marketing and PR in other industries. I did for seven soul sucking years. The film industry especially does not respect critics. If yoy think otherwise you are delusional.

Anyway... This Australian dude is an entitled chowderhead. I am actually curious how he made his wealth actually.
 

purseowner

From the mirror universe
Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,444
UK
Reviews/journalism should not act as PR

NDAs on what you can't say? Sure.

But this is embarrassing.

Anyway, still watching so that's only me reflecting on the first bit on the unboxing rules
 

JFoul

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,783
Personally, I appreciate that he was able to give his honest opinion on the launch build quality of the switch.
 

Taco_Human

Member
Jan 6, 2018
4,225
MA
Whats the big deal? All I see is Nintendo acting like a jerk to some guy who posted opinions before launch. I think those criticisms are valid, cause they still affect the Switch now. Imagine if we all knew about joycon drift on launch? Damn, Ninteno would have reacted a little better than how theyre acting now.

Edit: Never seen those guys videos. Damn he owns an ultra 64? fuck. Still, I'd like to own anything rare. point stands
 
OP
OP
Combo

Combo

Banned
Jan 8, 2019
2,437
I can go as far as saying that I've never EVER been asked for a PR rep, big or small to say ANYTHING specific about anything ever.. If you think any outlet would let that slide, you're wrong.

Would would Nintendo ask anyone to say that a console is small or robust? Also, the Switch is small and robust.. Why would anyone need to be told they have to say that lol? Look at it in comparison to the Wii U tablet..

Thanks. Interesting points. I really don't know what to say.
 

Faiyaz

Member
Nov 30, 2017
5,256
Bangladesh
This is not true. This guy is a notorious liar. Having worked with Nintendo Australia for a long time (and having been one of the Australian outlets sent a Switch prior to launch), there was nothing of the kind in the embargo. It's utterly ridiculous and I can't believe people in this thread are even questioning that tbh.

My memory is that this guy obtained a Switch through other means prior to launch, and was then putting out content, which we all know Nintendo doesn't like.

Ok, this makes more sense.
 

ANDS

Banned
Jun 25, 2019
566
While you are right in saying that Nintendo doesn't owe anyone a review product - however we should be aware that when we watch embargoed reviews, there will be restrictions on criticism from the reviewers.

You are making a HUGE leap with this comment. Unless you know the contents of any embargo/review agreement between journalists this just reads as unfounded conspiracy theories a la Darksydephil.
 
OP
OP
Combo

Combo

Banned
Jan 8, 2019
2,437
You are making a HUGE leap with this comment. Unless you know the contents of any embargo/review agreement between journalists this just reads as unfounded conspiracy theories a la Darksydephil.

You are right. I should have made my statement conditional. If what Joel said is true then we should be aware of the implications that the embargoes have, otherwise we cannot make such claims.
 

wrowa

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,372
They did send us a free Switch and my review turned out to be rather negative.

Which is funny considering it ended up becoming one my favorite platforms of all time eventually.
 

BaconHat

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,098
Considering the responses by reviewers in this thread saying they could do a negative review, and the poster talking about hopking lying, some of the posts thay keeps appearing in this thread, taking about something that looks to be already debunked, are really weird to read.
 

mariodk18

Member
Dec 27, 2017
1,501
Can you clarify if the embargo specified that you must speak about the Switch being robust and compact?

Joel himself didn't use the word negative, that's my own word. He claims that he wasn't allowed to give his own opinion.
why are you so trusting of this guy? I have never heard of this guy and this is the first claim of its type in nearly 4 years since the switch's launch
 

zashga

Losing is fun
Member
Oct 28, 2017
4,192
Why does this guy feel like he needs a free Switch in the first place? Doubt this had anything to do with a principled stand on his part and more to do with his name just not being on Nintendo's list.
 
Oct 25, 2017
7,141
seems kinda comical to give the switch a bad review at all tbh when it's so obviously dope. the only negative is the joycon stick
 

Haint

Banned
Oct 14, 2018
1,361
I can go as far as saying that I've never EVER been asked for a PR rep, big or small to say ANYTHING specific about anything ever.. If you think any outlet would let that slide, you're wrong.

Would would Nintendo ask anyone to say that a console is small or robust? Also, the Switch is small and robust.. Why would anyone need to be told they have to say that lol? Look at it in comparison to the Wii U tablet..

Are you Australian and did you work with Nintendo Australia on the Switch?
 

SageShinigami

Member
Oct 27, 2017
30,458
Even if the guy is lying, it's worrying that so many people here are fine with the idea that a company can just ask you to be blindly positive. I wouldn't mind if you sent the product to someone who tends to BE positive, but asking someone to focus on positives makes me itchy. Even if it didn't happen, you shouldn't have been alright with that in the first place.
 

Kibou

Member
Nov 4, 2017
89
I'm just not a big fan of companies using YouTubers as an unpaid extension of their marketing department. While the hype can be fun, it does lose some of its sheen when you know everything they're saying is bought, paid for, and run through the filter of a company directives.

This is not true. I've been getting review codes from Nintendo and other publishers for a couple of years now for my channel (though not consoles) and I have *never* been asked to say anything specific about the game, be that positive or negative. At most, whenever an embargo is in place, it's something like "please don't discuss these certain plot points" or "please don't mention this event past this other event" and while it is annoying sometimes, it doesn't affect that much what my reviews end up saying. I can also just not publish when the embargo ends and wait until launch so those things don't apply.

I *can* believe, though, that Nintendo didn't like it if he obtained the console prior to launch by other means. If they already had a relationship, it's a business relationship and you have to be professional about it.
 

Haint

Banned
Oct 14, 2018
1,361
I think this might be their equivalent review shancake ??



On one hand it seems pretty clear cut, but on the other I'm not following what a collector with seemingly endless wealth stands to gain "exposing" Nintendo with a total fabrication 3 years after the fact. He doesn't even seem to produce the type of content where controversy would be beneficial.
 

shancake

Managing Editor ‑ Press Start
Verified
Oct 25, 2017
485
Wait, he imported a Switch before launch? It launched everywhere on March 3rd, 2017.

This is a huge point and one that a lot of people are missing. Again, he got the console through ways that he shouldn't have, and Nintendo tried to gag him. He's obviously still holding a weird vendetta years later.
 

shancake

Managing Editor ‑ Press Start
Verified
Oct 25, 2017
485
On one hand it seems pretty clear cut, but on the other I'm not following what a collector with seemingly endless wealth stands to gain "exposing" Nintendo with a total fabrication 3 years after the fact. He doesn't even seem to produce the type of content where controversy would be beneficial.

I can't believe I have to even say this, but what he stands to gain is literally this thread lol.