JJ Abrams on The Last Jedi

UltraMagnus · Dec 11, 2019

charmeleon said:
What planets are they shown to have conquered besides Star Killer base in TFA?

We see a total of what 1 star destroyer which is Kylo Ren's / Hux's and Star Killer Base from the First Order in TFA. Hardly some extremely powerful group in the absence of Star Killer Base.

TLJ is where they suddenly have a giant fleet and own everything, not TFA.

None of that in either movie to be honest really made sense to me. We get no context in the TFA as to how things are post-ROTJ, it would be like having a LOTR sequel 20 years afterwards and Aragorn and company are back trying to battle a new evil rising for Mordor that has a massive army already but there isn't really any discussion about what specifically happened from ROTK to now.

Draper · Dec 11, 2019

Regardless of how TLJ turned out, Rian seems like a pretty alright dude

Midramble · Dec 11, 2019

I guess I gotta stop reading these threads with all the sly replies about how the newest one is going to be divisive. People making me preemptively dislike a movie. Gotta stay out of this stuff to go in with an open mind and ignore all this public social baggage.

Lunar Wolf · Dec 11, 2019

blackw0lf48 said:
Someone said Last Jedi wasn't about myth but instead metanarrative.

The Last Jedi's central message is about the importance of myth. The end of TLJ ends on hope because even though the resistance is in shatters, the stories of their stand, and Skywalkers final battle and sacrifice, inspires others to join the fight. Evidenced by the final shot of the kid.

That's damn inspirational and made me nearly tear up in the end. Way more fascinating, and ultimately hopeful, then having hope hinge on super talented and gifted people:

There's a huge amount of Fridge Logic that sets in once you think about it.

Who spread these rumors? What stops the FO from spreading rumors that Luke died like a bitch and Supreme Leader Big Boss Badass Kylo Ren did it. How can they spread that fast when this is a galaxy of trillions? Was someone videotaping it all? etc.

Lunar Wolf · Dec 11, 2019

Burrman said:
Seriously you don't give up lol. You're really dedicated lol. Aren't you Lunar wolf also?

No, Gunslinger and I are two different people.

I don't think you're allowed to have two accounts on here.

Jesse_and_the_rippers · Dec 11, 2019

Gustaf said:
the movie is done and it is what it is.

and i actually like what they did.

let it go.

This sentiment is stifling to discussion and is really off putting.

charmeleon · Dec 11, 2019

UltraMagnus said:
None of that in either movie to be honest really made sense to me. We get no context in the TFA as to how things are post-ROTJ, it would be like having a LOTR sequel 20 years afterwards and Aragorn and company are back trying to battle a new evil rising for Mordor that has a massive army already but there isn't really any discussion about what specifically happened from ROTK to now.

TFA can kind of make sense if you think of the First Order as like some terrorist group. They spent almost all of their resources on a WMD and used it seriously damaging the republic but losing almost everything in return. It's still weird due to the lack of information though (yay prequels making politics taboo in star wars movies).

If anything, TLJ should have been the First Order on the run with their small fleet as the rest of the galaxy tries to hunt them down or something. Would have at least made some sense instead of them suddenly conquering the galaxy off screen out of nowhere with their giant fleet and like the biggest ship ever made.

blackw0lf48 · Dec 11, 2019

Commenting as I'm rewatching The Last Jedi.

When Holdo takes command she says . "400 of us on three ships. We are the last of the resistance. But we are not alone. In every corner of the galaxy the downtrodden and the oppressed know our symbol, and they put their hope in it. We are the spark that will light the fire that will restore the republic. That spark, this resistance, must survive. That is our mission. "

The mission was never about the current resistance being able to take on and defeat the First Order. But to be the symbol that will spark hope so that others across the galaxy will take up the mantle and fight.

spx54 · Dec 11, 2019

Rian should just ditch this franchise at this point, just make more great original content like Knives Out

UltraMagnus · Dec 11, 2019

charmeleon said:
TFA can kind of make sense if you think of the First Order as like some terrorist group. They spent almost all of their resources on a WMD and used it seriously damaging the republic but losing almost everything in return. It's still weird due to the lack of information though (yay prequels making politics taboo in star wars movies).

If anything, TLJ should have been the First Order on the run with their small fleet as the rest of the galaxy tries to hunt them down or something. Would have at least made some sense instead of them suddenly conquering the galaxy off screen out of nowhere with their giant fleet and like the biggest ship ever made.

It's an interesting idea, but that isn't really implied in the film though they basically just look like Empire 2.0, there's nothing about them that would point to them being some kind of rag tag terrorist group.

Everything they have looks very polished.

MadScientist · Dec 11, 2019

Gustaf said:
what problem exactly? Ben turning to the dark side? how the first jedi temple would have helped with that? a purifying machine?! i kyber crystal that absors the darkside?

what?

also RJ had to explain why the fuck, even after trillions of people died because of Starkiller base, he didnt show up at all.

I really like this point and I think JJ put RJ in a tough spot! Luke would have for sure sensed all of those people dying. Would have felt the pain that Leia was in stress. Luke detaching from the force and going into hiding makes perfect sense. Hell, it's not the first time we've seen this happen. At the end of episode 3, Yoda was defeated and basically went into hiding.

Truant · Dec 11, 2019

People are talking like TLJ was a controversial film that suffered because of that, but those "controversial" elements were the absolutely strongest and most thought-out parts of the film. I loved everything in the main plot, with Luke and his idea of the Jedi not being special in terms of wielding the force, Snoke, the Rey/Kylo relationship.

The shitty aspects of TLJ were all the safe parts. The boring new characters, having the awesome black lead head up a novelization-level side quest because of reasons. You know the rest. I felt like Rian couldn't decide how bold he wanted to be, so he had half the movie be extremely different, and the other be the safest and dullest shit since the prequels.

Burrman · Dec 11, 2019

Lunar Wolf said:
No, Gunslinger and I are two different people.

I don't think you're allowed to have two accounts on here.

Aren't you another gunslinger tho? In one thread, you posted as gunslinger then when you edited your post it shows as Lunar wolf. I'm confused..... Unless you just changed your name

Ryan. · Dec 11, 2019

ZeoVGM said:
Well, The Last Jedi is trending and my entire Twitter feed is about it.

A couple tweets I enjoyed:

shhhh, you're going to make people here think

Desparadina · Dec 11, 2019

there's so many different sides to TLJ criticism it truly makes my head spin

Stinkles · Dec 11, 2019

Umbrella Carp said:
So why would Daisy say she "cried" when she heard JJ was back on? That seems a tad dramatic if things were really that smooth with TLJ

what if she likes JJ? Stretch I know but think about it. What if she's fond of the guy who gave her the breakout role for her career? Spitballing obviously and it's a wild idea.

sinny · Dec 11, 2019

Is the PR for this movie: "we know TLJ it's not a good movie, please watch this one"?

It's seems that way so far

Jesse_and_the_rippers · Dec 11, 2019

Truant said:
People are talking like TLJ was a controversial film that suffered because of that, but those "controversial" elements were the absolutely strongest and most thought-out parts of the film. I loved everything in the main plot, with Luke and his idea of the Jedi not being special in terms of wielding the force, Snoke, the Rey/Kylo relationship.

The shitty aspects of TLJ were all the safe parts. The boring new characters, having the awesome black lead head up a novelization-level side quest because of reasons. You know the rest. I felt like Rian couldn't decide how bold he wanted to be, so he had half the movie be extremely different, and the other be the safest and dullest shit since the prequels.

I've never seen a post I so wholeheartedly agreed with.

PeskyToaster · Dec 11, 2019

Isn't Daisy's quote more about Treverrow than Rian Johnson?

Yams · Dec 11, 2019

Umbrella Carp said:
So why would Daisy say she "cried" when she heard JJ was back on? That seems a tad dramatic if things were really that smooth with TLJ

It's not about Rian. It's about who was making the third one and how much everyone seemed to hate his script

MrBadger · Dec 11, 2019

I think I can relate to Boyega's reaction the most. I thoroughly enjoyed what TLJ did with Luke and Kylo, but it did not feel like a sequel to TFA, with the way it sidelined all of the new characters or reduced them to quick cameos. And how it didn't elaborate on a single plot point from TFA, or it outright discarded them. Good movie, bad middle-movie in a trilogy

UltraMagnus · Dec 11, 2019

spx54 said:
Rian should just ditch this franchise at this point, just make more great original content like Knives Out

I mean sure. At this point he doesn't need Star Wars, he's quickly moving on up into the A-tier of directors and he'll be able to pick and choose what he wants to do.

TheIlliterati · Dec 11, 2019

Duffking said:
Oh boy I can't wait for the discussion thread for this film to highlight just how pathetically toxic this forum truly is. It's like you all can't help yourselves when it comes to these movies.

I used to be a huge Star Wars fan until The Last Jedi....started to be discussed on the internet. Star Wars fandom is worse than Rick and Morty fandom.

Lunar Wolf · Dec 11, 2019

Yams said:
It's not about Rian. It's about who was making the third one and how much everyone seemed to hate his script

It's not about Colin's script. Daisy has talked about it being brilliant and how his script made her cry at the end.

jstevenson · Dec 11, 2019

spx54 said:
Rian should just ditch this franchise at this point, just make more great original content like Knives Out

making franchise movies is what enables directors like Johnson to make big bet movies on their new ideas.

see Nolan, Christopher

Goodstyle · Dec 11, 2019

Between JJ, Boyega, and Daisy, it's Daisy that has the most savage take down of Rian Johnson. Literally weeping from joy at the prospect of working with someone else... just... Christ. I feel bad for Rian.

Cranster · Dec 11, 2019

Timeaisis said:
Is it just me or has all this pseudo TLJ muckracking been a clever marketing ploy to appease fans who were disappointed by the last entry?

Disney is playing some 4d chess right now.

People are just looking way too much into it. This thread just shows how people try to low key diss TLJ when none of the directors and actors are dissing it.

blackw0lf48 · Dec 11, 2019

MrBadger said:
Boyega

Speaking of this, I saw some people on the other thread criticizing his character for fleeing. But rewatching he isn't fleeing. He has Rey's beacon and is flying somewhere far away so she doesn't get killed by coming back to what looks like a doomed situation.

That seems totally consistent with his character.

The Boat · Dec 11, 2019

"This doesn't matter" is a terrible take.

jstevenson · Dec 11, 2019

MrBadger said:
I think I can relate to Boyega's reaction the most. I thoroughly enjoyed what TLJ did with Luke and Kylo, but it did not feel like a sequel to TFA, with the way it sidelined all of the new characters or reduced them to quick cameos. And how it didn't elaborate on a single plot point from TFA, or it outright discarded them. Good movie, bad middle-movie in a trilogy

it directly followed the movie - it gave Finn a character arc about running away just with Rey (he also only went to Starkiller Base to save her) - and shows how he joined the Resistance and has his eye opened. Poe has a story-arc that matures him from hothead pilot to leader of the Resistance. Rey obviously has a huge story line.

What do you mean cameos? It has the best character arcs of a SW film since Empire.

The Emperor · Dec 11, 2019

Goodstyle said:
Between JJ, Boyega, and Daisy, it's Daisy that has the most savage take down of Rian Johnson. Literally weeping from joy at the prospect of working with someone else... just... Christ. I feel bad for Rian.

yeah tbh on reflection her comment sounds unprofessional lol

I think she worded it weirdly though. It must be more in the sense of being happy to work with JJ

UltraMagnus · Dec 11, 2019

jstevenson said:
making franchise movies is what enables directors like Johnson to make big bet movies on their new ideas.

see Nolan, Christopher

At this point though dude is going to have his pick of the litter. TLJ still made $1.3 billion and now Knives Out is going to be very profitable for its studio based on an entirely original premise. He's basically got it made.

Burrman · Dec 11, 2019

Lunar Wolf said:
No, Gunslinger and I are two different people.

I don't think you're allowed to have two accounts on here.

Can you help me understand why that happened ?https://www.resetera.com/threads/richard-e-grants-reaction-to-watching-the-rise-of-skywalker.156997/
In this thread

Vonocourt · Dec 11, 2019

Goodstyle said:
Between JJ, Boyega, and Daisy, it's Daisy that has the most savage take down of Rian Johnson. Literally weeping from joy at the prospect of working with someone else... just... Christ. I feel bad for Rian.

Why are you taking this as something towards Johnson and not Treverow, the person who was directing the film?

Valiant · Dec 11, 2019

Lunar Wolf said:
There's a huge amount of Fridge Logic that sets in once you think about it.

Who spread these rumors? What stops the FO from spreading rumors that Luke died like a bitch and Supreme Leader Big Boss Badass Kylo Ren did it. How can they spread that fast when this is a galaxy of trillions? Was someone videotaping it all? etc.

First of all you are asking how stories can travel across the galaxy... when people can literally get across it in seconds via hyper space.

Second of all maybe the FO did do this hypothetical counter story, but the story is being told by a slave kid in the end. Which story do you think they will tell?

Bor Gullet · Dec 11, 2019

Burrman said:
Can you help me understand why that happened ?https://www.resetera.com/threads/richard-e-grants-reaction-to-watching-the-rise-of-skywalker.156997/
In this thread

He got his username changed.

jstevenson · Dec 11, 2019

UltraMagnus said:
At this point though dude is going to have his pick of the litter. TLJ still made $1.3 billion and now Knives Out is going to be very profitable for its studio based on an entirely original premise. He's basically got it made.

that's not how hollywood works though. Even Chris Nolan had to basically do a Batman movie for every big movie he wanted to make.

Knives Out was a 40 million dollar movie, he can get those. But doing original 160-200 million dollar movies requires a bit more cooperation.

CloudWolf · Dec 11, 2019

I still maintain that I would like to have seen the movie Trevorrow had in mind. Just to see how balls to the wall dumb it would've been.

Mcfrank · Dec 11, 2019

Vonocourt said:
Why are you taking this as something towards Johnson and not Treverow, the person who was directing the film?

No kidding. People are seeing what they want to see in that quote, when she most likely just meant "I loved working with JJ so I was super happy when he came back"

jstevenson · Dec 11, 2019

Goodstyle said:
Between JJ, Boyega, and Daisy, it's Daisy that has the most savage take down of Rian Johnson. Literally weeping from joy at the prospect of working with someone else... just... Christ. I feel bad for Rian.

To be fair, she could just be happy it was JJ instead of Colin, instead of JJ over Rian....

PennyStonks · Dec 11, 2019

MadScientist said:
I really like this point and I think JJ put RJ in a tough spot! Luke would have for sure sensed all of those people dying. Would have felt the pain that Leia was in stress. Luke detaching from the force and going into hiding makes perfect sense.

Litearlly takes two seconds to explain away and it is already in the movie. Luke stops interacting with the force.

Kurdel · Dec 11, 2019

CloudWolf said:
I still maintain that I would like to have seen the movie Trevorrow had in mind. Just to see how balls to the wall dumb it would've been.

Just checked, he still has a story credit, so some of the very stupid stuff can still be his idea who knows!

Mcfrank said:
No kidding. People are seeing what they want to see in that quote, when she most likely just meant "I loved working with JJ so I was super happy when he came back"

Yeah that is also how I read it.

Don't think some nerds on here have much real life experience if their first idea is the notion she was relieved someone else would write the script lol

Randomly Generated · Dec 11, 2019

Cranster said:
People are just looking way too much into it. This thread just shows how people try to low key diss TLJ when none of the directors and actors are dissing it.

Their comments are so apolitical in the context of promoting a new entry in a franchise that it seems like they're trashing TLJ, even if that wasn't their intent.

Valiant · Dec 11, 2019

jstevenson said:
that's not how hollywood works though. Even Chris Nolan had to basically do a Batman movie for every big movie he wanted to make.

Knives Out was a 40 million dollar movie, he can get those. But doing original 160-200 million dollar movies requires a bit more cooperation.

I don't want to see a Rian film that requires more cooperation than TLJ.

I do hope he gets his own trilogy to do whatever in whatever time in the star wars canon.

UnpopularBlargh · Dec 11, 2019

freshlysqueezed said:
This is my main criticism of the film. Rian took all the plot threads introduced in TFA and threw all that shit out the window because that's not what he wanted to write about. Then proceeded to setup literally nothing for the next director to build off of. That's how we get shit like undead Palpatine. Cause what else is JJ supposed to do?

Literally none of this true. Rian didn't toss anything JJ setup aside. At most you can rgue that Finn's role was diminished compared to TFA. Also they literally setup the main conflict of the third film at the end. JJ could and should have focused on Kylo as the main big bad in TROS instead of bringing back Palpatine.

Jesse_and_the_rippers · Dec 11, 2019

jstevenson said:
it directly followed the movie - it gave Finn a character arc about running away just with Rey (he also only went to Starkiller Base to save her) - and shows how he joined the Resistance and has his eye opened.

Speaking for myself, I was underwhelmed that a mainline episodic Star Wars movie still had a character working on their arc from the first movie. One that I felt had a satisfying conclusion - he no longer ran away from the First Order. Would be like if Rey still wanted to go back to Jakku despite everything that happened to her.

I just had high hopes where they'd take Finn's character, and seeing him go from co-lead to C plot was pretty disappointing.

Amiablepercy · Dec 11, 2019

sphagnum said:
Remember when Greg Grunberg said JJ liked TLJ so much that he wished he directed it?

JJ is the only reason it is possible for Grunberg to be able to pay his mortgage. I'm sure he would say anything for and about the dude.

Yerffej · Dec 11, 2019

Truant said:
People are talking like TLJ was a controversial film that suffered because of that, but those "controversial" elements were the absolutely strongest and most thought-out parts of the film. I loved everything in the main plot, with Luke and his idea of the Jedi not being special in terms of wielding the force, Snoke, the Rey/Kylo relationship.

The shitty aspects of TLJ were all the safe parts. The boring new characters, having the awesome black lead head up a novelization-level side quest because of reasons. You know the rest. I felt like Rian couldn't decide how bold he wanted to be, so he had half the movie be extremely different, and the other be the safest and dullest shit since the prequels.

It's my personal favorite but I don't disagree with a word of this.

Deleted member 35631 · Dec 11, 2019

PlanetSmasher said:
Spoilers, Boyega - JJ didn't know where it was going either.

That's false! JJ made an outline of the entire trilogy and gave it to Rían but he decided not to use any of it and instead write everything from scratch (expectation subversion!)

JJ has said it as well as Daisy Ridley. Please look it up, you'll find it easily

J_Viper · Dec 11, 2019

sirap said:
I have no love for TFA or TLJ (both were competent but disappointing movies to me), but I'm really looking forward to seeing where the conversation shifts once this trilogy is wrapped up.

If you thought the shitposting was bad now, you better buckle up

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