Jim Ryan on PS4 Japanese Launch Window: "... these days I do not think that was a good idea."

Jawbreaker · Jan 9, 2020

I think this deserves its own topic, so I'm splitting it off from the interview being discussed in this thread.

On the Japanese Release Window

Jim Ryan: "I cannot comment on the timing of release or launch markets. However, the three-month delay for the release of PlayStation 4 in Japan was a decision that I was deeply involved in. There was reasonable ground for that decision, but these days I do not think that was a good idea. It was a decision made after much debate, but there may have been other options."

I'd agree that it was a poor decision to treat their second largest market in this manner, especially with the resurgence of Japanese games this gen. Hindsight and all, but they didn't even have appealing software available for the PS4's Japanese launch.

I believe this is something Sony is set to rectify with the release of the PlayStation 5. I expect there to be software of interest for Japan and a day and date release.

Kalentan · Jan 9, 2020

Jawbreaker said:
I'd agree that it was a poor decision to treat their second largest market in this manner, especially with the resurgence of Japanese games this gen. Hindsight and all, but they didn't even have appealing software available for the PS4's Japanese launch.

At this point it goes US > Europe > Japan in terms of playstation market size, right?

ron_bato · Jan 9, 2020

I hope the same holds true for emerging markets. In the Philippines, the PS4 launched a good two months after the release of the PS4. So I'm hoping we get something closer to the NA release date as well this gen.

ILikeFeet · Jan 9, 2020

Launch timing is important but unless the price and games are there, it's not gonna help things

Velocity:Design:Comfort · Jan 9, 2020

Wait, the PS4 came out three months earlier than JP in the US? Why?

Lelouch0612 · Jan 9, 2020

Kalentan said:
At this point it goes US > Europe > Japan in terms of playstation market size, right?

Europe isn't a country nor a single market. There are a lot of differences between European countries.

DriftingSpirit · Jan 9, 2020

The more countries they can include for a simultaneous launch, the better. I think the show of support means more than pure numbers in Japan.

Jawbreaker · Jan 9, 2020

Velocity:Design:Comfort said:
Wait, the PS4 came out three months earlier than JP in the US? Why?

https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/...s-why-ps4-will-launch-in-japan-after-the-west

"Sony just wants to make sure that when PlayStation 4 launches in Japan there is a good line-up of titles for Japan," the console's lead architect and Knack creative director Mark Cerny said.

"That's definitely a major factor when we decided where to launch when," Yoshida said. "The readiness from the publisher standpoint, and consumers and the media - everybody was ready. We were constantly told we should release new hardware!

But then when you look at the launch titles in Japan, it was a really weak offering for the region. Hell, they bundled the console with Knack, which I'd argue was insult to injury.

To be fair though, Japanese devs were still reeling from the previous gen.

Cess007 · Jan 9, 2020

I don't think launching at the same time would have changed much in the long run, the market is simple too different now, but yeah, I am sure Japanese people interested in the console didn't like it much.

asmith906 · Jan 9, 2020

Considering that only handheld/Nintendo consoles sell any significant amount in Japan, I don't think it would have mattered at all.

Kalentan · Jan 9, 2020

Lelouch0612 said:
Europe isn't a country nor a single market. There are a lot of differences between European countries.

Obviously but SCEE was still a thing. Not like they had SCEUK or SCEF

erlim · Jan 9, 2020

Correct me if I am wrong, but isn't it pretty much impossible for Sony to keep up with whatever product Nintendo is supporting in Japan? Like doesn't Nintendo usually become the de facto game console in Japan no matter what? It is probably a better idea for them to focus on the US and Europe. Especially in the US where it seems like XBSX is going to be the clear cut beastly and bleading edge consumer friendly option,

CaviarMeths · Jan 9, 2020

PS4's launch window library was pretty dire in every market, not just Japan. Didn't stop PS4 from selling during the 2013 holiday launch in the rest of the world. Was always a weird decision to delay.

erlim said:
Correct me if I am wrong, but isn't it pretty much impossible for Sony to keep up with whatever product Nintendo is supporting in Japan? Like doesn't Nintendo usually become the de facto game console in Japan no matter what? It is probably a better idea for them to focus on the US and Europe. Especially in the US where it seems like XBSX is going to be the clear cut beastly and bleading edge consumer friendly option,

Kind of a self-fulfilling prophecy. Nintendo is the market leader because they're the only ones interested in making products that are appealing to Japanese consumers. Sony has already been focused on the US and Europe for years now.

Vagabond · Jan 9, 2020

The Japanese market is on a steep decline and Japanese games have more demand internationally when it comes to midsize and large titles. I can definitely understand why they made that decision. Perhaps they would have sold a few couple dozen thousand more if they launched in the holidays but it would mean less available consoles for the countries that are still buying consoles and games.

Jon Carter · Jan 9, 2020

erlim said:
Correct me if I am wrong, but isn't it pretty much impossible for Sony to keep up with whatever product Nintendo is supporting in Japan? Like doesn't Nintendo usually become the de facto game console in Japan no matter what? It is probably a better idea for them to focus on the US and Europe. Especially in the US where it seems like XBSX is going to be the clear cut beastly and bleading edge consumer friendly option,

The PS1 sold a lot better than the N64, the PS2 sold a lot better than the GameCube, the PS4 sold a lot better than the Wii U, and the Wii didn't end up selling a crazy amount more than the PS3 when all was said and done. Their handhelds are king though but the PSP was still extremely popular.

Jawbreaker · Jan 9, 2020

asmith906 said:
Considering that only handheld/Nintendo consoles sell any significant amount in Japan, I don't think it would have mattered at all.

I think launch absolutely matters. It helps perception and builds momentum. A strong launch with desirable games can snowball positive word of mouth going forward.

The PS4 has sold more in Japan than any other country outside of the U.S.

Deleted member 5604 · Jan 9, 2020

erlim said:
Correct me if I am wrong, but isn't it pretty much impossible for Sony to keep up with whatever product Nintendo is supporting in Japan? Like doesn't Nintendo usually become the de facto game console in Japan no matter what? It is probably a better idea for them to focus on the US and Europe. Especially in the US where it seems like XBSX is going to be the clear cut beastly and bleading edge consumer friendly option,

Japan is still Sony's second strongest market.

Strings · Jan 9, 2020

ILikeFeet said:
Launch timing is important but unless the price and games are there, it's not gonna help things

A lot of random smaller devs mentioned the PS5 in their New Year messages and Famitsu comments, so maybe they're trying to have an appealing launch there this time.

Price will definitely be a problem in comparison though :/

Chaos2Frozen · Jan 9, 2020

erlim said:
Correct me if I am wrong, but isn't it pretty much impossible for Sony to keep up with whatever product Nintendo is supporting in Japan? Like doesn't Nintendo usually become the de facto game console in Japan no matter what? It is probably a better idea for them to focus on the US and Europe. Especially in the US where it seems like XBSX is going to be the clear cut beastly and bleading edge consumer friendly option,

Load that bad boy up with FFVII and Monster Hunter and it'll fly off the shelves

SharpX68K · Jan 9, 2020

Velocity:Design:Comfort said:
Wait, the PS4 came out three months earlier than JP in the US? Why?

Yeah, PS4 launched February 22, 2014 in Japan.

November 15, 2013 in North America and November 29, 2013 in Europe.

asmith906 · Jan 9, 2020

Jawbreaker said:
I think launch absolutely matters. It helps perception and builds momentum. A strong launch with desirable games can snowball positive word of mouth going forward.

The PS4 has sold more in Japan than any other country outside of the U.S.

True, but launching earlier wouldn't have helped the game situation.

t26 · Jan 9, 2020

In US/Europe PS4 was going head to head with Xbox One. Xbox One didn't came out until almost a year later in Japan. It make sense to make sure there is enough stock

CaviarMeths · Jan 9, 2020

Chaos2Frozen said:
Load that bad boy up with FFVII and Monster Hunter and it'll fly off the shelves

PS4 has Final Fantasy, Dragon Quest, and Monster Hunter and still barely selling better than the PS3.

DriftingSpirit · Jan 9, 2020

Look at some of the Japanese game worldwide successes this gen

It is just important to show Japan is relevant and noteworthy. They shouldn't have to wait.

EekumBokum · Jan 9, 2020

Feels like PS5 will get so much right, with all that they're saying

Inuhanyou · Jan 9, 2020

erlim said:
Correct me if I am wrong, but isn't it pretty much impossible for Sony to keep up with whatever product Nintendo is supporting in Japan? Like doesn't Nintendo usually become the de facto game console in Japan no matter what? It is probably a better idea for them to focus on the US and Europe. Especially in the US where it seems like XBSX is going to be the clear cut beastly and bleading edge consumer friendly option,

Nintendo dominates, but Sony still sells millions of HW over there and lots of software too. Considering Japanese devs are also important to their userbase, its always good to stay vigilant there.

CaviarMeths said:
PS4 has Final Fantasy, Dragon Quest, and Monster Hunter and still barely selling better than the PS3.

Considering how the Japanese market has changed up until this point, "barely selling better than the PS3" isnt something to scoff at. They are keeping interest in core gaming alive in Japan almost singlehandedly. PS4 also has sold a lot more software in Japan than PS3 did.

Dreamboum · Jan 9, 2020

My take is that the PS5 will sell better. The mobile boom will not keep forever. Players will not keep getting fleeced by mobile games forever. There is going to be bigger enthusiasm for more engaging experiences that asks for less money and less commitment. The market will open up some more

monketron · Jan 9, 2020

A PS branded, glorified tablet with built in controllers that supports PS NOW would be the only chance they'd have of reclaiming the Japanese market from Nintendo/Mobile users.

HomerSimpson-Man · Jan 9, 2020

In the end Japan despite being the "2nd biggest market" still is completely dwarfed by North America and Europe territories and Sony launching first there was the right call. Japan not even 10% of that 100+ million pie and nowadays the biggest first party titles are all Western studios too. Considering the games on hand at launch, it wouldn't seem to have helped for what amounts to a few months difference.

asmith906 · Jan 9, 2020

Dreamboum said:
My take is that the PS5 will sell better. The mobile boom will not keep forever. Players will not keep getting fleeced by mobile games forever. There is going to be bigger enthusiasm for more engaging experiences that asks for less money and less commitment. The market will open up some more

I don't know. Japanese market seem to love their Gacha games.

CaviarMeths · Jan 9, 2020

Inuhanyou said:
Considering how the Japanese market has changed up until this point, "barely selling better than the PS3" isnt something to scoff at. They are keeping interest in core gaming alive in Japan almost singlehandedly. PS4 also has sold a lot more software in Japan than PS3 did.

Sure. My point is that by doing the exact same thing that the PS4 did, PS5 isn't going to "fly off the shelves."

PS4 had the full weight of every AAA publisher in the world releasing all of their biggest hitters on it. Literally every non-Nintendo million seller IP this gen was released on PS4. It had some of the best software support in history. It pulled out every stop there was and will finish around ~10m lifetime in Japan. Releasing another Final Fantasy and another Monster Hunter on PS5 won't result in a drastic difference in performance.

Edit: Somehow I missed it the first time I read your post, but what is this "keeping interest in core gaming alive in Japan almost singlehandedly" complete nonsense lol. I've seen Nintendo "doesn't count" for many, many reasons over the years, but I think "Nintendo doesn't even count as core gaming" is definitely a new one.

Kuro · Jan 9, 2020

Sony should just put a console version of FGO out at launch and see a massive first month lol.

Neonep · Jan 9, 2020

All of this depends on the quantity of units they can make produce by the time they decide to launch. Remember, they sold 1 million units on launch day in the US.

Velezcora · Jan 9, 2020

Dreamboum said:
My take is that the PS5 will sell better. The mobile boom will not keep forever. Players will not keep getting fleeced by mobile games forever. There is going to be bigger enthusiasm for more engaging experiences that asks for less money and less commitment. The market will open up some more

I wish this would be true but it doesn't look like Japan is losing interest in this rpg lite experiences on mobile.

Pretty much everything built for the ps4 is aimed at the western market. It'll likely be the same for the ps5.

Deleted member 437 · Jan 9, 2020

Not a good idea back then, probably a good idea now.

Yeah, switch sales have absolutely dwarfed ps4 sales. And ps4 got MH world and draqon quest. Shit doesn't matter. In the end, they go back to switch.

No point making a game for the Japanese market, where you can make a game for the rest of the 90% market.

Delay it there, make sure the rest of the world that is actually clamoring for Ps5 consoles get stocked, then once they are fulfilled, bring it to Japan.

"DualShockers - Nintendo Console Sales in Japan Were Higher Than Ever in 2019"

Reinhard · Jan 9, 2020

There is no need to simultaneously launch in Japan if there are mostly just third party Western titles at launch, especially if stock is rather limited in the US and Europe and will sell out. Of course if there is some sort of Dragon Quest or Monster Hunter title ready near launch, they had better have Japan ready to go. The most likely situation, though, is that there will be 0 launch titles that will interest in the Japanese audience beyond the typical Call of Duty game. Having enhanced PS5 ports of PS4 games I doubt will help that much, but a new MHW expansion could work wonders.

Jawmuncher · Jan 9, 2020

I don't think there's room these days to launch consoles with such delay in major markets. It's never a good look to essentially go "You're not as important" to any consumer, but definitely not to big regions if it can be helped.

Cordelia · Jan 9, 2020

What's wrong with you people wanting Sony to delay console release in a region?

Delayed release is so fucking sucks you know?

Deleted member 21709 · Jan 9, 2020

I forgot this happened. It definitely sends the wrong signals.

Richter1887 · Jan 9, 2020

Hopefully a Gravity Rush 3 to go with it!

Neonep · Jan 9, 2020

What do you guys think should the solution be because they can only make so many consoles for launch. Either it is launched at different times in different regions or there is an international launch and the units are going to be way harder to get a hold of at launch and for a good time after.

NSESN · Jan 9, 2020

I think at this point there isnt much Sony can do about Japan. They already have the support of most 3rd parties and it still wasnt enough

SinCityAssassin · Jan 9, 2020

Neonep said:
What do you guys think should the solution be because they can only make so many consoles for launch. Either it is launched at different times in different regions or there is an international launch and the units are going to be way harder to get a hold of at launch and for a good time after.

That's not how any of these logistics work at all.

Yasumi · Jan 9, 2020

Even with the delay, the PS4 was awful for Japanese games for at least 1.5 - 2 years. They need to get dev kits out to smaller Japanese A and AA teams ASAP.

Deleted member 437 · Jan 9, 2020

Neonep said:
What do you guys think should the solution be because they can only make so many consoles for launch. Either it is launched at different times in different regions or there is an international launch and the units are going to be way harder to get a hold of at launch and for a good time after.

80% of consoles sold in Japan in 2019 are Nintendo.

80%

I doubt Japan is clamoring for the next playstation when they aren't even bothering with the one they have now.

Thought they would delay it, but looks like Sony won't.

MistaTwo · Jan 9, 2020

The launch lineup here was already pretty bad for the local market, even with the 3 month delay so I always assumed it was because of product supply constraints to be honest.

Neonep · Jan 9, 2020

SinCItyAssassin said:
That's not how any of these logistics work at all.

So how does it work then, explain?

Estarossa · Jan 9, 2020

Unless Ms Sonya launches the PS5 at 199 a simultaneous launch won't help. They have neither the IPs or brand loyalty to carry them throughout next gen. Maybe they will luck out and something sticks, but that's highly unlikely. MH, FF etc. will only help them in the short term. I say, delay the Japan by a year if it helps their launch lineup.

MysticGon · Jan 9, 2020

It doesn't matter when you launch, just have reasons to buy it like a decent launch line-up

Nanashrew · Jan 9, 2020

One big issue about that 3 month delay for Japan is that the PS4 completely missed the holiday season.

Inuhanyou said:
Considering how the Japanese market has changed up until this point, "barely selling better than the PS3" isnt something to scoff at. They are keeping interest in core gaming alive in Japan almost singlehandedly. PS4 also has sold a lot more software in Japan than PS3 did.

Singlehandedly???????

Jim Ryan on PS4 Japanese Launch Window: "... these days I do not think that was a good idea."

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