Jedi Fallen Order - Next gen optimization update

[Joo]

Xbox Ones games in BC can be aware of the Series X hardware, while PS games don't. MS BC solution is simply more robust and flexible.

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I don't think that's exactly correct. There's several PS4 games that show extra stuff in options on PS5 that aren't showing when played on PS4.

Xbox has better BC in a sense, but I thought this whole thing was more because Sony's validation process for updates is a much bigger hassle than it is on Xbox. Like you'd need to release a new version of the game on PS5 to update it any more than what's possible when you crank the Pro version to max.

Like at least it has nothing do with Xbox BC performing better, as there are loads of examples where BC games perform similarly between SeriesX/PS5.

 

[arsene_P5]

This is incorrect. PS4 games in BC can be aware of PS5 hardware as well. The PS4 version of Ghost Recon: Breakpoint, when running on PS5, displays menu options that don't appear when running it on PS4 or PS4 Pro.

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My bad then and that's good to know. But the point still stands, PS BC solution is more limited than Xbox solution. Developers of rocket league talked about the 120FPS issue on PS5 for example.

Bönthö
As I recall the problem isn't with (just) the updating system. Xbox games run in a VM since Xbox One and that's the biggest advantage in case of BC.

 

[Joo]

As I recall the problem isn't with (just) the updating system. Xbox games run in a VM since Xbox One and that's the biggest advantage in case of BC.

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Yep you're correct. That seems to be the case.

 

[arsene_P5]

Like at least it has nothing do with Xbox BC performing better, as there are loads of examples where BC games perform similarly between SeriesX/PS5.

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I agree. The performance isn't the issue as both are usually close. Xbox solution just seems more flexible (case in point adding 120FPS support).

 

[Edge]

Xbox Ones games in BC can be aware of the Series X hardware, while PS games don't. MS BC solution is simply more robust and flexible.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but as far as I can tell Fallen Order on PS5 is doing what other games were doing, even though the resulting resolution may differ. It's basically running at the upper limit of the PS4 port dynamic resolution and at double the framerate. This applies to games like Days Gone aswell, although you are getting dynamic 4K and 60FPS. But the way this is achieved is the same (upper limit of dynamic res and double FPS).
Difference in BC on those consoles. For instance you need a few lines of code on Xbox to double the framerate (including 120FPS), while 120FPS in particular is impossible on PS5, unless the developers creates a new full native port.

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But, the PS4 version had the toggle before this patch. It doesn't make sense at all.
Yes I know the Series X can work better with BC games and upgrade them easier thanks to smart delivery, but that is a pointless fact when it comes to these toggles or options, there is no logical reason why certain games can't have a switch between quality and performance mode, something most games have since PS4 Pro.

 

[Micerider]

I had done 60% of the game on PS4 PRo, which was not horrible, but frankly blurry and not always satisfying in the game feeling due to the performance issues.

I had tested the game on Series X before this patch (thanks Gamepass) but was still not satisfied with Performance mode due to the 1080P making it very soft. Now, it's much better floating around 1440p at 60fps makes it both much better in terms of feeling, but also sharp enough to be pleasing to the eye.

So, I feel ready to go at it again

(And yes, Quality mode looks better still, but the game, with it's somewhat wonky animation and controls really doesn't play well with 30 FPS imho and 60FPS improves that a little bit).

 

[Amiablepercy]

Nice. Despite it's flaws it is in my top 3 Star Wars games of all time and one of my few platinums.

 

[arsene_P5]

Yeah, this is not the PS5. It's the developer. The PS5 has shown it can do much more with BC easily.

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Not really. If you look at games like Days Gone and God of War, then you notice the games never go above the dynamic resolution limit, which is ~1200p for the PS4 Pro Version of Fallen Order. So we can assume there is a limitation (software not hardware).

Zachary_Games, Guaraná, FlikBlueLightning and Kemono
There seems to be some limitation on resolution and framerate with PS5 BC. We heard developers talk about 120FPS and albeit nobody talked resolution limitations, there is no game that goes beyond the dynamic resolution upper limit. Of course the PS5 gets closer or stays at the limit, but a dynamic 1440p game isn't going to render at native 4K on PS5, even if the hardware would be capable of doing that.

Feel free to correct me, but I checked a few games in the incredible PS5 BC thread on here and there seems to be no game, including Sony exclusive, that increased the resolution beyond the limit set by the PS4 Pro port.

Will the PS5 need to be on the SSD or just a update and can still play off HDD?

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You can use the HDD, because this is a BC game. However I recommend using a SSD, because the game had some I/O related hitches in last gen.

But, the PS4 version had the toggle before this patch. It doesn't make sense at all.

Yes I know the Series X can work better with BC games and upgrade them easier thanks to smart delivery, but that is a pointless fact when it comes to these toggles or options, there is no logical reason why certain games can't have a switch between quality and performance mode, something most games have since PS4 Pro.

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I hear you. My guess is that they deleted the option, because the game in resolution mode is already running at 60FPS. So changing to performance mode doesn't do much or anything at all, besides lowering the resolution. 120 FPS isn't possible without doing a native port.

 

[chandoog]

How does one find out if the game has been updated on the Series X OS level ?

I have the game installed but no way of finding out if I have this next-gen optimization patch installed.

Inside the game the frame rate toggles till has the old "Limit resolution to 1080p" message. No updated there.


The PS4 had such a handy little update history option for each game, I'm surprised something as simple isn't available on Series X (or even PS5 from what I've heard).

 

[Call of Duty]

How does one find out if the game has been updated on the Series X OS level ?

I have the game installed but no way of finding out if I have this next-gen optimization patch installed.

Inside the game the frame rate toggles till has the old "Limit resolution to 1080p" message. No updated there.


The PS4 had such a handy little update history option for each game, I'm surprised something as simple isn't available on Series X (or even PS5 from what I've heard).

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Even after the update, it will still say "limit resolution to 1080p."

I don't know the answer to your first question though.

 

[Deleted member 11008]

I tried the update, 60fps on Series S is nice. I have a potato TV so resolution doesn't matter for me lol

 

[digitalrelic]

Why not just go full hog and release a native "next gen" version update? I mean, if something like man-eater managed it...

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Maneater's "next gen update" looks and performance pretty poorly though. Who cares what it's labeled?

 

[Obi Wan Jabroni]

I wonder if there are plans to release a full-blown PS5/XSX version of the game, which is why they are only releasing optimized patches for the new consoles.

Regardless, the smooth FPS really irons out the jank. Although I could use some new textures for those Wookies:

 

[Desmond]

I have also had this.

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Kind of surprised me to be honest. That said, in gameplay the experience is almost flawless.


@above, yeah the Wookiee texture took me by surprise. Like Battlefront 2015 Chewie vibes bad.

 

[NeoGold123]

The PS4 had such a handy little update history option for each game, I'm surprised something as simple isn't available on Series X (or even PS5 from what I've heard).

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Ps5 still has the update history, it's only on the main screen though, not inside the library. So if your game is buried, you have to boot it to bring it up to the main screen, then press options on the tile. Don't know about Xbox though, unfortunately.

 

[Skulldead]

Ps5 still has the update history, it's only on the main screen though, not inside the library.

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Does it ? No you can see history update for Ps4 game on ps5 UI, but not for any Ps5 games... this is a really weird removal.

 

[Wesker]

Been looking forward to this patch, and hoped it would arrive someday.
I already played the game on PC but want to grab the achievements on my Series S.
Will jump in this weekend, I guess.

I wonder if there are plans to release a full-blown PS5/XSX version of the game, which is why they are only releasing optimized patches for the new consoles.

Regardless, the smooth FPS really irons out the jank. Although I could use some new textures for those Wookies:

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Ki Adi Mundi is like "What about the textures on the wookiees?"

 

[Barneystuta]

How is the Series X 60fps mode?

 

[NeoGold123]

Does it ? No you can see history update for Ps4 game on ps5 UI, but not for any Ps5 games... this is a really weird removal.

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Oh, my bad, forgot to say just on ps4 games. But yeah, weird they wouldn't keep that for ps5 games as well. I think even ps3 games had that too, right?

 

[dm101]

I keep putting off playing this. Maybe it's finally time

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Same here.

 

[Thera]

I wonder if there are plans to release a full-blown PS5/XSX version of the game, which is why they are only releasing optimized patches for the new consoles.

Regardless, the smooth FPS really irons out the jank. Although I could use some new textures for those Wookies:

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Wow, it looks like the dog from Ace Combat.
FMV level !

 

[bonch00ski]

How is the Series X 60fps mode?

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I just started a new game and I could swear I still get slowdown in the Bogano

 

[plagiarize]

I just started a new game and I could swear I still get slowdown in the Bogano

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There's definitely some hitching moving around the more open maps. Someone earlier in the thread mentions it occurs in the same fashion on the PC version, so it's possibly an engine limitation. These not being true next gen games mean they can't fully leverage the faster storage, as I understand it.

 

[Deleted member 19533]

Not really. If you look at games like Days Gone and God of War, then you notice the games never go above the dynamic resolution limit, which is ~1200p for the PS4 Pro Version of Fallen Order. So we can assume there is a limitation (software not hardware).

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So they're able to change frame rates, but not resolution? Not buying that. For the third time ITT, the Xbox version is also running at a low resolution when we know their BC allows change there. So, is that also PS5s fault?

They could add another option in the options if that were the case. Plenty of games already did that.

 

[arsene_P5]

So they're able to change frame rates, but not resolution? Not buying that. For the third time ITT, the Xbox version is also running at a low resolution when we know their BC allows change there. So, is that also PS5s fault?

They could add another option in the options if that were the case. Plenty of games already did that.

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Well no BC game on PS5 has increased resolution beyond the upper limit of the dynamic resolution of the PS4 Pro port. Not even Sony games increased the resolution like that iirc. What you get is a higher resolution within the boundaries due to the hardware capabilities. But no game as I recall did go beyond it. We don't know for sure, but considering no game ever did it, it's likely this is a restriction of the implementation. Case in point:

Source: https://www.resetera.com/threads/ps5-backwards-compatibility-all-ps4-games-with-benefits.322747/

You also need to remember that neither Xbox or PS are using RDNA2 features and basically run a 10-12TF GCN GPU in the BC modes. So don't expect the best results on these consoles. Having said that PS surely would be able to get close or match Xbox resolution, if there wouldn't be something going on.

 

[bruhaha]

I started playing this game on PS5 with performance mode last week before the patch and got 5 or 6 hours in. Played 3 hours more today with the patch and there are definite stuttering issues on Bogano outdoors. It wasn't perfect before the patch but the stuttering is worse now and nowhere near locked 60. I'm really wondering how they tested this patch and decided to remove the performance graphics option.

 

[RM8]

Crazy upgrade on the Series S, I actually want to play it now.

 

[wackojackosnose]

On XSX, I find this game looks really weird in the quality / 30 fps mode - almost like it's stuttering so it's really jarring when you compare it to the performance / 60 fps mode. The 30 fps mode feels / looks different in smoothness even compared to other 30 fps games (like Animal Crossing or the MHRise demo).

Oh, and I feel all consoles and pads should have a dedicated button to instantly change between graphic modes as I hate going through menus!

 

[Micerider]

On XSX, I find this game looks really weird in the quality / 30 fps mode - almost like it's stuttering so it's really jarring when you compare it to the performance / 60 fps mode. The 30 fps mode feels / looks different in smoothness even compared to other 30 fps games (like Animal Crossing or the MHRise demo).

Oh, and I feel all consoles and pads should have a dedicated button to instantly change between graphic modes as I hate going through menus!

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Yes, there is something in the animation and motion blur that makes it much worse than a lot of good 30FPS games I've played. Moving from Horizon, God of War, TLOU2 or even RDR2 to this makes it look "stuttery".

 

[Andromeda]

There is no optimization on PS5. They simply uncap the framerate of the Pro 30fps version and that's it. Maybe they didn't even removed the DRS and the game is never pushing the GPU enough in order to trigger it.

 

[inspectah]

How is the Series X 60fps mode?

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I played through the game before the patch and it was almost flawless.

 

[Musubi]

I started playing this game on PS5 with performance mode last week before the patch and got 5 or 6 hours in. Played 3 hours more today with the patch and there are definite stuttering issues on Bogano outdoors. It wasn't perfect before the patch but the stuttering is worse now and nowhere near locked 60. I'm really wondering how they tested this patch and decided to remove the performance graphics option.

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Yeah... it's bad now on PS5. Pre patch it was at least mostly stable. Kind of let down. Not sure what the issue is.

 

[pswii60]

Not sure why people expected 4k/60 from a minimal BC patch. On the Xbox One X it topped out at 1080p to hit 60fps, so with twice the GPU power of XSX (excluding IPC improvements) 1440p is about right - twice the number of pixels.

 

[BreakingARC]

Just to be perfectly clear, if I download it trough EA Play and play it on my PS5 it's going to be the optimised version? Or is it going to play the PS4 version?

 

[Gestault]

Just to be perfectly clear, if I download it trough EA Play and play it on my PS5 it's going to be the optimised version? Or is it going to play the PS4 version?

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Grabbing it on EA Play, you'll have the right one for PS5. Keep in mind all that exists is the PS4 version, which now has a patch to "sneak in" some next-gen improvements.

 

[BreakingARC]

Grabbing it on EA Play, you'll have the right one for PS5. Keep in mind all that exists is the PS4 version, which now has a patch to "sneak in" some next-gen improvements.

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Thanks! Guess I found my January game then.

 

[Gestault]

Thanks! Guess I found my January game then.

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It's really fun. I did my first playthrough like 2ish months ago.

 

[digitalrelic]

Not sure why people expected 4k/60 from a minimal BC patch. On the Xbox One X it topped out at 1080p to hit 60fps, so with twice the GPU power of XSX (excluding IPC improvements) 1440p is about right - twice the number of pixels.

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GPU power is not generally the measurer of resolution in regards to FPS. Framerate is much more dependent on CPU than GPU. If the Xbox One X was running 1440p/30fs in Resolution mode, the Series X shouldn't have any problem running this close to 4K/60.

But again, I'm sure there's zero optimizations here. Probably just raised the dynamic resolution range and called it a day.

 

[Zachary_Games]

There is no optimization on PS5. They simply uncap the framerate of the Pro 30fps version and that's it. Maybe they didn't even removed the DRS and the game is never pushing the GPU enough in order to trigger it.

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Correct. arsene_P5, GoT and Days Gone ps4pro versions simply added dynamic 4K or upped the resolution and uncapped the frame rate. This has been the approach for ps4pro games in general.

The next-gen horsepower of PS5 pushes the uncapped framerate to 60fps since it is uncapped and power determinate. Dynamic resolution works similarly to uncapped framerates. This is the case with Fallen Order. Which makes their decision to remove quality mode jarring.

Respawn made a conscious decision to remove this mode. A simple way to verify this is for someone that owns a ps4pro and Fallen Order to check if there is no longer a quality mode.

I believe you are correct in your assessment that it is software not hardware related. It is impossible to say for sure why there is a difference without a developer's insight into these differences. My guess is MS has a different certification process from Sony that is more friendly for backwards compatibility.

 

[pswii60]

GPU power is not generally the measurer of resolution in regards to FPS. Framerate is much more dependent on CPU than GPU. If the Xbox One X was running 1440p/30fs in Resolution mode, the Series X shouldn't have any problem running this close to 4K/60.

But again, I'm sure there's zero optimizations here. Probably just raised the dynamic resolution range and called it a day.

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Firstly, it ran at 60fps on Xbox One X in Performance mode, so it clearly wasn't CPU limited.

Secondly, going from 1440p/30 to 4k/60 requires 4x the GPU power, not 2x.

 

[digitalrelic]

Firstly, it ran at 60fps on Xbox One X in Performance mode, so it clearly wasn't CPU limited.

Secondly, going from 1440p/30 to 4k/60 requires 4x the GPU power, not 2x.

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Like I said, FPS isn't directly correlated to GPU power gains the way resolution is. 4x the GPU as a requirement is inaccurate.

 

[EvilBoris]

Like I said, FPS isn't directly correlated to GPU power gains the way resolution is. 4x the GPU as a requirement is inaccurate.

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But the CPU is more than double the speed of Xbox One ....

 

[pswii60]

Like I said, FPS isn't directly correlated to GPU power gains the way resolution is. 4x the GPU as a requirement is inaccurate.

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All else being the same, it pretty much is. The CPU wasn't a limiting factor on XBO nor is it on XSX.

 

[prodyg]

What's concerning?

When god of war runs 4k 60 FPS unpatched, not to talk about Demon Souls remaster and Spider-Man having way better performance and graphics than this game.

but carry on, being concerned lol.

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its nice that those games run well but what does that have to do with Jed Fallen Order?

 

[thepenguin55]

So is the distinction here that this is a next gen optimization patch and not a next gen upgrade? So these versions aren't proper Series X and PS5 versions but rather resolution & frame rate bumped X1 and PS4 versions, right?

 

[Vashetti]

Firstly, it ran at 60fps on Xbox One X in Performance mode, so it clearly wasn't CPU limited.

Secondly, going from 1440p/30 to 4k/60 requires 4x the GPU power, not 2x.

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It certainly didn't, it had a 60fps target, sure:



That's CPU limitations in full display right there.

 

[TheKidObi]

its nice that those games run well but what does that have to do with Jed Fallen Order?

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"PS5 update has me concerned"

if your concerned bc of this update, it isn't any indication of PS5 not powerful enough to run the game at a higher resolution.

I pointed out those games to show the type of performance you can get on PS5.

We've seen other BC PS4 games run way better than this game and PS5 games looking way better.

The update it is what it is, nothing to be concerned about, but by all means if you want to stress, carry on.

 

[Deadly Cyclone]

Here's some footage of the intro I did. I could not play on visual mode anymore. I need that 60FPS.

 

[chidrock]

Like someone else earlier in the thread, I am trying to figure out if I have the updated version installed on my Series X.

The game's icon doesn't have the x/s logo on it and the file details say "Durango", which makes me think I still have the old version. I just don't know where to get the new version of the file. (if there is one)

Do I have to uninstall it and reinstall the game? (I own the disc version and I have game pass if that helps)

 

[FuturaBold]

Like someone else earlier in the thread, I am trying to figure out if I have the updated version installed on my Series X.

The game's icon doesn't have the x/s logo on it and the file details say "Durango", which makes me think I still have the old version. I just don't know where to get the new version of the file. (if there is one)

Do I have to uninstall it and reinstall the game? (I own the disc version and I have game pass if that helps)

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It's an optimization update not a full next gen update so you won't see the X/S. Jedi should auto update when you start it.
It obvious when you start playing at a solid 60 fps, and looks a little sharper as well.