Thank you.
For the part I bolded, I can believe that. The estimated BOM is less than Series X. But MS can take a bigger loss, sell a cheaper console....and don't care about console sales....
It doesn't add up.
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Jason Schreier: something PS5 related will be happening by early-mid June
- Thread starter Kolx
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For the part I bolded, I can believe that. The estimated BOM is less than Series X. But MS can take a bigger loss, sell a cheaper console....and don't care about console sales....
It doesn't add up.
PSN is far more profitable than XBL is. Both can afford losses if needed. Neither probably want to though. There's a lot more to it than MS just have more money.
Doubt it and not consistent with how MS has priced their other hardware, or indeed in the game space.
I didn't quote you.
That SSD on the PS5 isn't going to be cheap either . It's why I expect both to be $499
It also makes zero sense for Sony to take a loss on hardware and not Microsoft.
Doesn't Sony have even more overhead with more studios and also overhead trying to sell VR?
So how do you explain the price difference of the Ps4 an Xbox one when Sony was hit hard by the expensive PS3 and didn't have so much revenue from PSplus?
Or Xb1X costing 100 doller more than the pro and arriving one year later?
If the Series X cheaper than the PS5, what is the point of Series S?
The PS5 will cost 500$ max. The Series X as well or a bit more
I'm mean Pac is a nice guy but sadly rarely right.
I would prefer for both of the consoles to cost 400 so I would buy both. PS5 for the imo superior games and Series X for the the better BC and game pass
Which I think is a completely hypothetical. There is nothing to suggest they will do that. Whereas Sony has with the PS4 and PS4 Pro. I think the PS5 won't deviate that much beyond the price of the PS4 Pro, although events may have changed that course. Also, the wider business isn't as relevant as you think to pricing with a particular component of the company. Xbox hasn't played much of a role in terms of the overall profitability of MS, so why would they take loses to undercut their competitor with two products, when their strategy seems to be (1) stratified (2) a platform which will also be available on PCs?
Didn't think I needed your permission to respond to your post.
But it's cool. Because the folks you did quote basically said what I said. lol
No ones talking about no loss at all, but a bigger loss or the biggest.
MS will have the more expensive console to make, but will take a bigger loss is what's up for debate. While also selling another cheaper console.
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Lmao I love this.
Microsoft: WE HAVE EVENTS EVERY MONTH. MAY. JUNE. JULY. WE HAVE IT ALL. DO YOU WANT IT ALL? WHO CARES WE HAVE IT ALL. GAMES. TRAILERS. TERAFLOPS.
Sony: <Wired article>
Industry Insider: idk i think Sony might be sayin something in a month or something like that who knows
Microsoft: WE HAVE EVENTS EVERY MONTH. MAY. JUNE. JULY. WE HAVE IT ALL. DO YOU WANT IT ALL? WHO CARES WE HAVE IT ALL. GAMES. TRAILERS. TERAFLOPS.
Sony: <Wired article>
Industry Insider: idk i think Sony might be sayin something in a month or something like that who knows
please be a real event in June, please
Yeah, I'm trying to explain to that poster they may be creating narratives in this thread out of thin air....
lol this conversation is going in circles I just posted a video with interesting opinions in large part based around Peter Moore's experiences. I really don't care about breaking down BOM of every consoles. The fact is Sony isn't in a position to offer you a $399 machine, these cost more. MS has invested in one system that has likely a higher cost than that of Sony's, but also potentially a cheaper model too. MS can absolutely take some adventurous hits to their bottom line across hardware and services due to how good things are for their profitability right now. Whether they will or won't do something / likewise with Sony, is anyone's guess, and the video expresses precisely that. I really don't care what the prices are, I'm not getting either. I'm fascinated by how they approach all this, and interested to see how this affects everyone. That's all
You are still implying that Microsoft is now set in stone with it's $499 consoles because of Xbox One and Xbox One X. Nothing is set in stone which is why Phil said two things about price,
"We're going to make sure that we stay agile on our pricing and that we have a good plan going into launch."
and
"I would say a learning from the Xbox One generation is we will not be out of position on power or price"
Sony has also hinted,
"I believe that we will be able to release it at an SRP [suggested retail price] that will be appealing to gamers in light of its advanced feature set."
It's your own narrative, you are still convinced it will cost more to make a Series X than a PS5. Thefore it will be on Microsoft to either take a bigger loss or not. The PS5 controller will cost more, the SSD will cost more. That's why I fully expect each to be $499.
Ok, you lost me now.
....we are going off the Bloomberg BOM articles....
That's not my narrative.
My opinion, narrative, whatever, is that both will be 499. I don't expect MS to take a bigger loss while also selling Lockhart.
No Lockhart, maybe. The narrative I see is that MS doesn't care about console sales.
So its either they do or they don't.
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If they are announcing it before The Last of Us 2 and Ghost I think they have almost an obligation of making them crossgen, or at least guarantee improved graphics via backward compatibility. Id rather get a simple back compatibility than having them port the game and release it this early in the gen.
PS5's SSD patents specifically mention reduced manufacturing costs as one of the aspects to it.
Also, the assumption that XSX will cost more than PS5 I think originated from when the chip size was being calculated a while back. It's believed (last I heard) that the XSX chip is larger than the PS5 chip, which means lower yields, thus a higher cost. How much higher? Who knows, but we don't even know what the official (afaik) chip sizes are yet so it's all theory at this point.
I think just from a general standpoint of XSX having higher clocked CPU and more CU's in their GPU than PS5, and PS5 seemingly being engineered for maximum efficiency alone is what leads me to believe PS5 will be cheaper to make than XSX, but that says nothing about what they'll price retail units at. I think it's silly to assume PS5 will be more expensive at retail at this point, and slightly less silly to believe XSX will be more expensive.
Also, the assumption that XSX will cost more than PS5 I think originated from when the chip size was being calculated a while back. It's believed (last I heard) that the XSX chip is larger than the PS5 chip, which means lower yields, thus a higher cost. How much higher? Who knows, but we don't even know what the official (afaik) chip sizes are yet so it's all theory at this point.
I think just from a general standpoint of XSX having higher clocked CPU and more CU's in their GPU than PS5, and PS5 seemingly being engineered for maximum efficiency alone is what leads me to believe PS5 will be cheaper to make than XSX, but that says nothing about what they'll price retail units at. I think it's silly to assume PS5 will be more expensive at retail at this point, and slightly less silly to believe XSX will be more expensive.
this is why i need an offical announcement from sony. "insiders" and "experts" are pulling dates out of their ass. most were sure its feb, than it was march, april. no, just kidding: its may guys, we promise.
While that is true...I am excited for Sony in particular because by July we will have had FFVII R, TLoU2 and GoT. This kind of output is why I am excited to see what they deliver. I have confidence that they will impress, but am frustrated by the lack of communication.
My only real want from it too. Just all or nothing from Sony, console, price, release date (though would understand them sitting on something like that until it's absolutely guaranteed to hit that date), features and lots of games. I'm probably going to be disappointed.
You might be confusing me with someone else. I've never said there was a February or April event. I said there'd be a GDC lecture and now there's going to be more.
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Well, that is not saying much, is it? I mean we are relatively close to release, so news will be closer than ever
All of them can eat costs to some degree. In fact MS is already doing that with GP, so maybe their budget for hardware is limited.
This talk about MS being able to eat losses also comes mostly from people with a console of choice. If that was true, why would they put 6GB of slower ram instead of going 16GB of high speed one?
All of them can eat costs to some degree. In fact MS is already doing that with GP, so maybe their budget for hardware is limited.
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As we stand right now Sony just needs to show what Insomniac is doing, SSM, Poliphony Digital, other studios workng on PS5 games + other exclusives and show the console. People will forget all about the last couple months.
Yeah this is also super interesting. GP is taking significant loss all so they can establish and get users on board. As far as I can tell, this is working well for them
Agree.
Yes.
If thats the estimated BOM for PS5 isn't it reasonable to think it's more for Series X? IIRC, Series X has higher specs everywhere expect SSD and gpu clock speed.
If I think it will also be 499, I'm expecting MS to already be taking a loss.
If MS' famous 'War chest' comes out to play, it'll more likely be for services than hardware. Subsidising gamepass and cloud to acquire customers. If they don't care if people play on PC, series S, series X, XB1, smartphine or a browser window, then there is no significant need to subsidise high end hardware. Let xsx be the halo hardware brand like surface is for windows. make money on the hardware and push for subscriber base on the services
Reasonable and you acting like it's a fact is not the same thing. Sorry. As I said which you completely ignored is the PS5 will also have additional costs such as the controller and SSD and those high speed SSD's that are comparable even today are not cheap.
I was adding this to my post:
IIRC, Series X has higher specs everywhere expect SSD and gpu clock speed.
If I think it will also be 499, I'm expecting MS to already be taking a loss.
Bloomberg article, estimates at 450 for PS5.
Series X, better specs except 2 places IIRC.
Reasonable the Series X cost more to make? Yes. Easily.
Expecting MS to take a bigger or biggest loss, while selling Lockhart?
Yeah, that's what up for debate.
If the PS5 is cheaper all the more reason for me to get one but as you can see the PS5 is still going to cost more to manufacture than the PS4 did.
I added more to my post again. And yeah that's true, but that's not what up for debate.
And yet we got a $500 Xbox One at launch compared to a $400 PS4 and a $500 Xbox One X compared to a $400 PS4 Pro. We have MS Surface Products that cost as much if not more than competing Windows PC products. This narrative that MS is willing to undercut everyone to sell their hardware is based on what? They have more money. Yes, and they want to keep it that way. Being a loss leader in a console race does nothing for them.
The narrative is Microsoft wants to be price competitive this time.
I agree but some are still convinced that in the 11th hour Sony is going to undercut Microsoft again.
Yeah it's pretty obvious that next month has to be the time for Sony to reveal their hardware and their first party studios games for it... can't wait to be blown away with the feelings of true next gen jump.
I am kind of tired of the sprinkles crap.
I want a 2 hour meaty event with multiple 5-10 minute game showcases and reveals. I don't want a CGI teaser. We know how good CGI teasers look, since E3 2006. They are fine when there is other content but I am hoping for a meaty event, even if it is digital.
Sometjing like this
Opener with speech,
- brand new breathtaking AAA game, 5 minute trailer with story and gameplay.
- Spider Man trailer with hints of gameplay, 2021 year.
- Demon Souls Bluepoint Remake
- SOCOM reboot revealed, with high quality support, campaign and multiplayer.
- Knack 3, as well as a Crash Bandicoot surprise?
- Square Enix comes out with an in game real time trailer for Final Fantasy XVI, with a title.
- Capcom comes out with a new Resident Evil teaser AND a new IP
- Kojima is making a new PS5 game.
- Horizon Zero Dawn 5 minute gameplay/
This with some more surprises would be a sick event.
I want a 2 hour meaty event with multiple 5-10 minute game showcases and reveals. I don't want a CGI teaser. We know how good CGI teasers look, since E3 2006. They are fine when there is other content but I am hoping for a meaty event, even if it is digital.
Sometjing like this
Opener with speech,
- brand new breathtaking AAA game, 5 minute trailer with story and gameplay.
- Spider Man trailer with hints of gameplay, 2021 year.
- Demon Souls Bluepoint Remake
- SOCOM reboot revealed, with high quality support, campaign and multiplayer.
- Knack 3, as well as a Crash Bandicoot surprise?
- Square Enix comes out with an in game real time trailer for Final Fantasy XVI, with a title.
- Capcom comes out with a new Resident Evil teaser AND a new IP
- Kojima is making a new PS5 game.
- Horizon Zero Dawn 5 minute gameplay/
This with some more surprises would be a sick event.
Still waiting for that next-gen showcase. Seems like Sony will be the ones to show us once again.
This looks better than some of the stuff shown on that XSX "gameplay" reveal tbh. Certainly looks graphically more impressive than VTM did.
That "next gen gameplay" reveal was anything but. I have no idea what they were thinking.
Neither brand gets unlimited budgets from the mothership when launching a new console even if losses are projected and deemed necessary to be competitive. It's all decided from the context of how the brand is expected to perform over the course of the next decade.
