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Trisc

Member
Oct 27, 2017
6,488
I really have no idea. It would be much easier to ban all JKRowling media here than to need disclaimers, or having people coming in to say they don't care about trans women.
A small correction, and I hope I don't come off as brash saying this, but trans people. Not every trans person is a woman. Some of us are men, some of us are women, and some of us are just "people", because a rigid gender binary is bullshit.
I actually know a dev on this project. She is rightfully mortified at Rowling's comments and is deeply conflicted.

However, one thing is fully clear: sales of a game almost never go to individual developers of the project. Sure, maybe if we had better unions, this would be a slightly more complex issue. But it's not. Sales of a game determine future decisions about the IP, and the profit pages on a corporation's books, but it's very unlikely that the success or failure of this game, in this case, will cause layoffs to a well-established development team, *especially* if the game is competently made but simply didn't do as well due to the extent circumstances of JK Rowling being a massive piece of shit.

Supporting LGBT charities directly, with cash, is one of the best things you can do, but sending a message to WB over this game is certainly a good way to support your trans allies as well. Frankly, if one of my trans friends found out I was breezily enjoying this new title, I would feel like an absolute shithead.

So I won't.
Good post. Shuts down the "I want to support the devs" folks, too. Thank you.
 

Shining Star

Banned
May 14, 2019
4,458
I mean yeah it sucks that they've attached themselves to a beloved IP that then completely began shitting itself, but they're getting paid. No one at Avalanche is losing their job or getting hurt or anything.

The game will come out and, with any luck, will bomb so badly that the Harry Potter IP becomes completely radioactive, and the devs will move onto something else.

I guess you are right. I think I would just feel worse giving money to this series unfortunately.
 

Hey Please

Avenger
Oct 31, 2017
22,824
Not America
I actually know a dev on this project. She is rightfully mortified at Rowling's comments and is deeply conflicted.

However, one thing is fully clear: sales of a game almost never go to individual developers of the project. Sure, maybe if we had better unions, this would be a slightly more complex issue. But it's not. Sales of a game determine future decisions about the IP, and the profit pages on a corporation's books, but it's very unlikely that the success or failure of this game, in this case, will cause layoffs to a well-established development team, *especially* if the game is competently made but simply didn't do as well due to the extent circumstances of JK Rowling being a massive piece of shit.

Supporting LGBT charities directly, with cash, is one of the best things you can do, but sending a message to WB over this game is certainly a good way to support your trans allies as well. Frankly, if one of my trans friends found out I was breezily enjoying this new title, I would feel like an absolute shithead.

So I won't.

Appreciate this post. If WB lacks total creative freedom and/or JK is set to earn royalties from the sale of the title, it would still great gesture if the developers (if WB wishes to remain spineless) publicly announced that a certain and respectable percentage of their profits would go one or more of these charities in the UK and/or beyond.
 

KepperC

Member
Jul 17, 2020
97
The devs won't see your money regardless of whether you bought it full price or not so that's a non-starter.
You're the editor of Nintendo Wire. Why are you spreading this misinformation?

There are many developers that have bonuses and future projects directly tied to the success of current projects.
 

Deleted member 16657

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
10,198
I actually know a dev on this project. She is rightfully mortified at Rowling's comments and is deeply conflicted.

However, one thing is fully clear: sales of a game almost never go to individual developers of the project. Sure, maybe if we had better unions, this would be a slightly more complex issue. But it's not. Sales of a game determine future decisions about the IP, and the profit pages on a corporation's books, but it's very unlikely that the success or failure of this game, in this case, will cause layoffs to a well-established development team, *especially* if the game is competently made but simply didn't do as well due to the extent circumstances of JK Rowling being a massive piece of shit.

Supporting LGBT charities directly, with cash, is one of the best things you can do, but sending a message to WB over this game is certainly a good way to support your trans allies as well. Frankly, if one of my trans friends found out I was breezily enjoying this new title, I would feel like an absolute shithead.

So I won't.

Thanks for the insight. Are publishers generally in touch with why games perform badly? Like if they see good reviews and poor sales does that clue them in that the devs aren't at fault?
 

Horohorohoro

Member
Jan 28, 2019
6,724
JK Rowling is fucking disgusting and abhorrent. I wasn't even remotely interested in the game in the first place but it's just completely off my radar now because of her statements over the last few months. As someone with a trans immediate family member I have no idea how people can just look the other way for shit like this.
 

Blackthorn

Member
Oct 26, 2017
2,317
London
I feel so bad for the good people working on this game (some of who, going by statistical averages, likely to be trans) who have had their work tarnished by that awful woman.

Even my partner, a huge Harry Potter fan who would have cried at this trailer a couple of years ago, agreed that it was impossible to muster any excitement for the game knowing Rowling would profit off it. Even if she didn't, Harry Potter in general just has a stank on it now.
 

TojoT

Member
Oct 30, 2017
315
My money will never go to any product that provides royalties to J.K. Rowling. It does not matter how great it looks.

The devs have already been paid through their salaries. The consumer is not responsible for any potential bonuses associated with sales or review performance, nor are we responsible that the studio will keep their door open for all perpetuity. If this game flops (it won't) and Avalanche have to shut down (they won't) it is not the fault of the people who abstained from supporting this game based on the views of the property's creator.
 

trapt777

Member
Oct 25, 2017
552
bi0d08bo4y351.jpg


Fuck J.K. Rowling
 

Spinluck

▲ Legend ▲
Avenger
Oct 26, 2017
28,469
Chicago
If we can't get people to stand with trans folk by not buying a game then we're truly fucked.

I try to be an optimist but damn...
 

Weiss

User requested ban
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
64,265
I really can't condone Rowling's views, so I can't really support the game either.

I do want to because, really, it's everything I ever wanted from a Harry Potter game and I don't believe it's fair on the developers to destroy their careers. The game clearly has a significant budget and, if it fails to perform, they're not gonna blame Rowling or her views - they'll blame Avalanche - so I'm admittedly in a tough spot.

How do I support the developers that are making a game I want to play, but not support the game itself because of whose ideas it's based on? 🤔

Why would the devs get heat when the actions of JK Rowling are the reason anyone has a problem with the game?
 

CortexVortex

Banned
Oct 30, 2017
4,074
The Potter world is one one of my favourite things ever and the game looks absolutely brilliant. Gonna buy it second hand tho cause I don't wanna support her bullshit.
 
Oct 27, 2017
8,691
It would be better than nothing but donating doesn't really combat the issue at hand of her influence and people giving weight to her words, as a result of adoration of the IP.

It's like seeing someone light a forest fire over and over again and selling binoculars to watch that have a donation to planting trees.
That's a drastic side of the coin you're taking when some folks may have only had HP as a companion as a child in book or movie form and feel both attached to the material and sickened by the author's bullshit. It's that connection that is driving these poor kids to suicide and something that absolutely should be taken care. Strip the author of her "power" behind the scenes by having the game makers step up with a more powerful and positive voice and one that fans can get attached to.
 
Feb 4, 2018
1,713
She would love transgender women to face danger as a consequence for their "choice". Of course she does not care. Skateboarding downhill is something to be called dangerous and irresponsible. This is premediated murder.
You're right and I apologize, reading that sentence back I realize I made it sound like the harm she's causing trans folks is an unintended side effect when she's clearly demonstrated that's exactly what she wants.
 

Kyuuji

The Favonius Fox
Member
Nov 8, 2017
32,200
That's a drastic side of the coin you're taking when some folks may have only had HP as a companion as a child in book or movie form and feel both attached to the material and sickened by the author's bullshit. It's that connection that is driving these poor kids to suicide and something that absolutely should be taken care. Strip the author of her "power" behind the scenes by having the game makers step up with a more powerful and positive voice and one that fans can get attached to.
It's not. It's just the one that looks past that emotional tie, as someone with it.
 

Feep

Lead Designer, Iridium Studios
Verified
Oct 25, 2017
4,602
Thanks for the insight. Are publishers generally in touch with why games perform badly? Like if they see good reviews and poor sales does that clue them in that the devs aren't at fault?
Yeah, at least to some extent. A lot of the larger ones do a lot of focus testing/et cetera.

If I'm being perfectly honest, I don't actually think enough people will boycott the game to do any *major* damage to sales. Like, Chik-Fil-A is still doing fucking great. America (and the world) isn't really moral-acting enough to make a major dent in these sorts of things...yet...but that doesn't mean we all shouldn't do what we can.
 

Chumunga64

Member
Jun 22, 2018
14,269
if anyone here wants to buy this game, that's fine and dandy but please don't spout stupid "I need to support the devs!" shit

Just buy it without trying to justify it or whatever
 

SageShinigami

Member
Oct 27, 2017
30,474
I mean yeah it sucks that they've attached themselves to a beloved IP that then completely began shitting itself, but they're getting paid. No one at Avalanche is losing their job or getting hurt or anything.

The game will come out and, with any luck, will bomb so badly that the Harry Potter IP becomes completely radioactive, and the devs will move onto something else.

Chances of this happening are 0 percent. More people cared about Prince of Persia looking like trash than this. Like/Dislike on this basically tells me people either don't know or don't care. Bummer. This game looks good and the devs involved probably mostly think JK is a fuckwit. But I can't support this game.
 

Hey Please

Avenger
Oct 31, 2017
22,824
Not America
The Potter world is one one of my favourite things ever and the game looks absolutely brilliant. Gonna buy it second hand tho cause I don't wanna support her bullshit.

Given the push for digital only consoles, this last loophole of being able to enjoy a title without contributing to problematic developers/creators etc, will soon come to an end for those with limited means.
 
Oct 27, 2017
8,691
It's not. It's just the one that looks past that emotional tie, as someone with it.
I do not to be clear. But I'm just thinking of those who were and are and how they could be so hurt by her words and driven to depression and self harm. Is total erasure of the franchise the answer? Or deletion of the author? Hard for me to think of the answer when, again, for many others, that world is their own happy place.
 

Kyuuji

The Favonius Fox
Member
Nov 8, 2017
32,200
I do not to be clear. But I'm just thinking of those who were and are and how they could be so hurt by her words and driven to depression and self harm. Is total erasure of the franchise the answer? Or deletion of the author? Hard for me to think of the answer when, again, for many others, that world is their own happy place.
No one is suggesting to go out and book burn Harry Potter.

Influence is the issue and people – the majority of whom will likely not know someone trans – putting weight to her words as a result of affection or adoration for the franchise or, at this stage, her current playing the victim of the 'trans mob'. People can envelope themselves in the materials of their past without issue, I don't think I've seen anyone suggest otherwise.

Combatting the influence she has in literally, tangibly, corroding trans rights, lives, support and access to healthcare in the UK comes before having a broader space to actively gush over her IP. Before when it was dog-whistles and winks I'd accept the counter perhaps, but not now.
 

Rotobit

Editor at Nintendo Wire
Verified
Oct 27, 2017
10,196
You're the editor of Nintendo Wire. Why are you spreading this misinformation?

There are many developers that have bonuses and future projects directly tied to the success of current projects.

Sure I'll admit my fault there, though I was referring more to how in the grand scheme of things the game will be a success anyway. And even so, in this case any "future projects" that come about as a result of this game's success would almost certainly be sequels, which would counteract the whole point of avoiding giving JK money, considering that'd involve renewed licensing contracts and the like.

Also in that post I even mentioned how they could purchase Cars 3 or the Disney Infinity games if they wanted to support the devs.
 

FSP

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
1,644
London, United Kingdom
To be blunt: the only correct action for developers on this project would be, in any fair world, to abandon ship. This game represents transphobia de facto. The problem comes from economic concerns for devs who need to eat and need their careers.

I propose that the launch of this game be "commemorated" on Era by people here pledging the price of the game to some transgender charities instead. That'd send a message.

I'll chip in whatever the RRP of this is to Mermaids UK.

Sure we can't change the world, but Era is actually paid attention to by the industry.
 

Ryan.

Prophet of Truth
The Fallen
Oct 27, 2017
12,885
I said earlier in the announcement thread that I'll go used/second hand steam key but the more I thought about it I think the only way I'll probably play this game will be if WB somehow kicks JK out.
 

Quade

Member
Mar 8, 2019
1,195
I feel bad for the devs right now, the only way they can turn this around is by including prominent trans characters with good representation as a big fuck you to JK Rowling, because fuck JK Rowling.
 

trapt777

Member
Oct 25, 2017
552
Great illustration. I hate that I gave JK Rowling money all those years ago. never again, though!

I saw it posted on the Harry Potter subreddit a while back and thought it was great. There were a number of comments from users saying it helped them finally understand what it means to be trans - the mirror, of course, shows the 'deepest, most desperate desire of our hearts'.
 

Trisc

Member
Oct 27, 2017
6,488
Yeah, at least to some extent. A lot of the larger ones do a lot of focus testing/et cetera.

If I'm being perfectly honest, I don't actually think enough people will boycott the game to do any *major* damage to sales. Like, Chik-Fil-A is still doing fucking great. America (and the world) isn't really moral-acting enough to make a major dent in these sorts of things...yet...but that doesn't mean we all shouldn't do what we can.
As I've said to so many of my friends, "if our collective actions don't have an immense impact, that doesn't mean it's not working, it just means it's not getting immediate results." Just gotta tell two friends and hope they voice their dissatisfaction as loudly as you, if not louder. Ultimately, I don't think this game's sales will be impacted much, if at all by Rowling's bigotry. But it could send off warning sirens in the future, openly propping up transphobes.
 

Yabberwocky

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,260
We say it now with permission from those involved. Without giving personal detail, without betraying confidences, we must represent the seriousness of the situation. We are aware through our work with families that there have been cases of self-harm and even attempted suicide following J.K.Rowling's statements and the public response on social media and in the press. Surely this must cause us all to pause and question the way young trans lives are being debated in public.

This was absolutely crushing to read, and depressingly inevitable. Fuck.

Where the Harry Potter IP once brought joy and hope, now all I can associate it with is the vile transphobia Rowling spews. Whilst I feel sorry for the devs, I won't be buying the game.
 

Zombine

Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,231
Will not support anything relative to this shit tier IP or anything else that fucking bum Rowling has her hands on.
 

Deleted member 50374

alt account
Banned
Dec 4, 2018
2,482
Don't support devs. They aren't a charity. In fact, most game devs deserve better jobs than game development anyway. You get better pay and less stress.

Support trans kids. If I only think of those who grew up finding refuge in this franchise, my heart breaks apart. It fucking gets me livid that such vile persons hold so much power.
 

Aminga

Member
Oct 27, 2017
912
Not surprising, she is horrible to trans community. Not giving a damn penny to this game or her collective works, ever. Her characters and world <I always thought> was prettt inclusive but apparantly shes shown through action and words that it is not. Done with people that treat others lesser than.
 
Oct 27, 2017
8,691
No one is suggesting to go out and book burn Harry Potter.

Influence is the issue and people – the majority of whom will likely not know someone trans – putting weight to her words as a result of affection or adoration for the franchise or, at this stage, her current playing the victim of the 'trans mob'. People can envelope themselves in the materials of their past without issue, I don't think I've seen anyone suggest otherwise.

Combatting the influence she has in literally, tangibly, corroding trans rights, lives, support and access to healthcare in the UK comes before having a broader space to actively gush over her IP. Before when it was dog-whistles and winks I'd accept the counter perhaps, but not now.
I appreciate your replies and other posts in this thread to help me realize the bigger picture.

Rather than the devs, Rowling is the one that needs to fucking check herself, and give and give and give to the families, communities and charities of trans people and their rights. Fuck her.
 

KepperC

Member
Jul 17, 2020
97
the only way they can turn this around
I fully agree with the sentiment, but the response this evening (and even that it was featured during the PS5 event) suggests they don't need to. And they won't. Like with Strike (the BBC/HBO show), the audience can detach the entertainment from its creator.
 

Pargon

Member
Oct 27, 2017
12,017
I still think the game should have been placed on the site's prohibited games list long before the announcement today.
At the very least, it should be added to it now. Resetera should not provide a platform for it. Sophia


I posted this in the other thread about the game too, but as a reminder for people in the UK: Mermaids is registered on Amazon Smile.
Now of course Amazon is problematic for its own reasons, but if you are going to use it, this only takes a minute to set up. Once you do, 0.5% of eligible purchases will be donated to the charity at no cost to yourself.
https://smile.amazon.co.uk/gp/chpf/homepage?q=mermaids

Note: this has to be enabled separately in the mobile app settings.