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Astral

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
28,115
If there's one thing I appreciate from the final battle is the amount of counters they used on Yhwach. The Deus Ex Machina arrow, Tsukishima's Fullbring (remember when they teased that Ginjo was gonna do something lol), Aizen's hacks, and Uryu's Quincy ability whatever the fuck it was called. It was almost brilliant. Now if only we got to see what Ichigo's bankai actually did.
 

Slayven

Never read a comic in his life
Moderator
Oct 25, 2017
93,143
I like that Kenpachi literally scared a dude so bad dude killed himself accidentally.
 
Oct 30, 2017
3,629
In my opinion the only good part was the the soul society ark.

After Ichigo rescued Rukia the whole thing fell apart
Aizen/Hollow (Heuco Mundo?) ark has its moments, but ya you're mostly right. I lost most of my hype for bleach after the Soul Society ark came to an end.

No lies spoken. Heucio Mundo really shows the cracks of it being a painfully sold awful retread of the Soul Society arc and I bailed out by then.
 

Pancoar

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
1,551
All I remember is hating how Kubo killed off Retsu, and how my boy Uryu only showed up for like ten pages in an entire arc about Quincies. Oh and Ryuken showed up for like two pages.

At least the moment with Aizen was great. He'll always be one of the best parts about Bleach.
 

Flame Lord

Member
Oct 26, 2017
2,796
That whole arc had a hype ass beginning that was totally fucking squandered. Byakuya got revived, Unohana died off screen, Kenpachi jobbed after finally learning shi/bankai, Ishida did nothing, Ichigo stomped some fodder, got one shot, but actually Bach got one shot... I've never seen an arc be set up so nicely just to completely fucking fumble all of it. Naruto disappointed me, but I damn near regret reading Bleach.
 

RocketKiss

Banned
Oct 30, 2017
4,691
He probably doesn't actually need it.

But, as mentioned earlier, it only has to be seen once, ever, and Yhwach's ability is that he sees everything. Therefore, at some point, he already saw it (or will see it, since he sees the future, too) and is affected by it.
fGGuo6H.jpg
 

Lunar Wolf

Banned
Nov 6, 2017
16,237
Los Angeles
I've never been able to understand quite howOrochimaru's thing works in Naruto... even if he's good now he was basically the most unconditionally evil ninja walking around before and has destroyed literally thousands of lives (if not more)

I would even argue Aizen had gotten nowhere near the level of harm that Orochimaru did in the background of Naruto


Orochimaru is not good.

Orochimaru is just too valuable to kill off according to the Leaf. He's there as insurance in case the Leaf runs into trouble where "conventional" methods won't work as he long as he's under their surveillance.

He basically became Mayuri. He's a mad scientist but now he is Konoha's mad scientist.
 

Hoa

Member
Jun 6, 2018
4,304
I like that Kenpachi literally scared a dude so bad dude killed himself accidentally.

Still hate that shit 😂. Pretty much had Kenpachi dead, but they needed to kill Gremmy off somehow cause that power was OP.

Same with Miracle Thor. Man he wrote himself in a corner with all the Quincies 😂
 

RocketKiss

Banned
Oct 30, 2017
4,691
Orochimaru is not good.

Orochimaru is just too valuable to kill off according to the Leaf. He's there as insurance in case the Leaf runs into trouble where "conventional" methods won't work as he long as he's under their surveillance.

He basically became Mayuri. He's a mad scientist but now he is Konoha's mad scientist.
It's like operation paper clip after ww2
 

Furisu

Poutine on the Ritz
Member
Dec 5, 2018
2,991
Anyone here remember Chad's final fight

I still find that hilarious
 

Rendering...

Member
Oct 30, 2017
19,089
In Orochimaru's defense, now he's just a struggling single mom trying to make ends meet with a spot of light mad science.
 

Slayven

Never read a comic in his life
Moderator
Oct 25, 2017
93,143
Still hate that shit 😂. Pretty much had Kenpachi dead, but they needed to kill Gremmy off somehow cause that power was OP.

Same with Miracle Thor. Man he wrote himself in a corner with all the Quincies 😂
Everybody had arc villian level powers. Remember the Captain of the Super Soul Reapers having the ability to make anything happen just by writing it?
 

grand

Member
Oct 25, 2017
24,981
lmao Bleach might have one of the worst Shonen Jump endings despite having years to work on it's final arc

It's going to be hilarious watching the poor anime-onlies go through that god awful arc
 

Dale Copper

Member
Apr 12, 2018
22,035
I think Aizen only gives the thesis of the theme of the Manga because he reasoning for betraying the SS and wanting to kill the Soul King are the same reason as Bach, but though seeing Ichigo & Rukia fight he eventually saw the errors of his ways.

It's just REALLY poorly done because Aizen motivates are all over the place before that part.
 

Septimus Prime

EA
Verified
Oct 25, 2017
8,500
I think Aizen only gives the thesis of the theme of the Manga because he reasoning for betraying the SS and wanting to kill the Soul King are the same reason as Bach, but though seeing Ichigo & Rukia fight he eventually saw the errors of his ways.

It's just REALLY poorly done because Aizen motivates are all over the place before that part.
If you think about it, both he and Yhwach got what they wanted in the end: Yhwach wanted to kill the Soul King, and Aizen wanted to become his replacement. These both happen.

He's also the only one who died.
Ukitake (which is the stupidest. How the hell does someone die from TB in the afterlife?), Unohana (okay, maybe even stupider), and Yamamoto all bite it, as well.
 

Sanchoco

Member
Dec 3, 2018
2,098
The best things about this arc were

1. Aizen
2. The chair holding Aizen becoming a meme for a while.
 

Dale Copper

Member
Apr 12, 2018
22,035
If you think about it, both he and Yhwach got what they wanted in the end: Yhwach wanted to kill the Soul King, and Aizen wanted to become his replacement. These both happen.


Ukitake (which is the stupidest. How the hell does someone die from TB in the afterlife?), Unohana (okay, maybe even stupider), and Yamamoto all bite it, as well.
Aizen isn't the replacement, side novel revealed that Urahara and Ichibee made Bach corpse into the linchpin. Aizen back in jail, hell he could never be the Soul King unless you have Quincy powers which is why Ichigo was a candidate in case something went wrong.

Which is why Kyoraku gave Ichigo friends and family those soul tickets to visit Ichigo...you know when he's just floating in some crystal forever and might just be a torso like the old Soul king...sure Karin and Yuzu would love it.

Man the SS is just fucked up place with fucked up people.
 

Aaronrules380

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
22,472
Aizen isn't the replacement, side novel revealed that Urahara and Ichibee made Bach corpse into the linchpin. Aizen back in jail, hell he could never be the Soul King unless you have Quincy powers which is why Ichigo was a candidate in case something went wrong.

Which is why Kyoraku gave Ichigo friends and family those soul tickets to visit Ichigo...you know when he's just floating in some crystal forever and might just be a torso like the old Soul king...sure Karin and Yuzu would love it.

Man the SS is just fucked up place with fucked up people.
Soul Society really should never have stopped being villains because so much about them is profoundly fucked up and once they become allies they just forget about how fucked up SS is even though there's no reason to believe they've changed and several to believe they're a shitty as ever. Some of the captains should have gone rogue, but honestly the Aizen twist and how it instantly made the conflict with SS void honestly really hurt the series
 

Dysun

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,975
Miami
I fell off when Squad Zero got introduced. The arc started off pretty good but fell apart badly, same for the series as a whole really
I'm hoping the anime can patch some holes up
 

grand

Member
Oct 25, 2017
24,981
Aizen isn't the replacement, side novel revealed that Urahara and Ichibee made Bach corpse into the linchpin. Aizen back in jail, hell he could never be the Soul King unless you have Quincy powers which is why Ichigo was a candidate in case something went wrong.

Which is why Kyoraku gave Ichigo friends and family those soul tickets to visit Ichigo...you know when he's just floating in some crystal forever and might just be a torso like the old Soul king...sure Karin and Yuzu would love it.

Man the SS is just fucked up place with fucked up people.
Shonen Jump side novels are never considered canon and it would be frankly insulting to everyone who read the manga if these unlocalized filler novels were considered the real ending. There's no point in mentioning them because they have no effect on people's enjoyment & interpretation of the actual manga.
 

Dale Copper

Member
Apr 12, 2018
22,035
Shonen Jump side novels are never considered canon and it would be frankly insulting to everyone who read the manga if these unlocalized filler novels were considered the real ending. There's no point in mentioning them because they have no effect on people's enjoyment & interpretation of the actual manga.
They basically fill in too many gaps in the story left by the ending they just got to be.
 

grand

Member
Oct 25, 2017
24,981
They basically fill in too many gaps in the story left by the ending they just got to be.
Shonen Jump considers side novels the same as other spin-offs: merchandising opportunities, not canon material. Best case scenario would be if the anime took ideas from it, but that's very rare.

I guess what I'm saying is: don't be surprised when the anime & Kubo's spinoff series completely ignore the Bleach novels
 

RealTravisty

Member
Mar 29, 2018
1,165
Shonen Jump side novels are never considered canon and it would be frankly insulting to everyone who read the manga if these unlocalized filler novels were considered the real ending. There's no point in mentioning them because they have no effect on people's enjoyment & interpretation of the actual manga.

The Bleach novels starring Hisagi already have their first two volumes released in English. Considering they take place after the series and both authors (the Hisagi one and the one who covered Rukia and Renji's wedding) heavily consulted Kubo about tons of stuff, I wouldn't count them out so easily.

That's not to say they're good, though. I was wondering what reading a "shonen novel" would be like and the prose is dull and characters' personality traits and repetitive. I have no idea if it's the translator, but I absolutely hated reading these novels.
 

grand

Member
Oct 25, 2017
24,981
The Bleach novels starring Hisagi already have their first two volumes released in English. Considering they take place after the series and both authors (the Hisagi one and the one who covered Rukia and Renji's wedding) heavily consulted Kubo about tons of stuff, I wouldn't count them out so easily.

That's not to say they're good, though. I was wondering what reading a "shonen novel" would be like and the prose is dull and characters' personality traits and repetitive. I have no idea if it's the translator, but I absolutely hated reading these novels.
That's even move damning to be honest. The only novels to be deemed worthy of localization were not the ones detailing the ending but rather the two spinoffs that shared a writing credit with Kubo and were written by the creator of Baccano & Durarara.
 

Sun-Squirrel

Member
Sep 25, 2020
152
Dundee
lmao Bleach might have one of the worst Shonen Jump endings despite having years to work on it's final arc

It's going to be hilarious watching the poor anime-onlies go through that god awful arc
No matter how bad bleach got at times it was still always better than Naruto and its shit pacing. Looking forward to April when the Anime arc is hopefully due to take black clovers time slot.
 

blitzblake

Banned
Jan 4, 2018
3,171
Never did finish it but growing up the big three were Bleach, Naruto and One Piece... two failed endings now... all my hope rest with One Piece landing the ending.
 

Imperfected

Member
Nov 9, 2017
11,737
Soul Society really should never have stopped being villains because so much about them is profoundly fucked up and once they become allies they just forget about how fucked up SS is even though there's no reason to believe they've changed and several to believe they're a shitty as ever.

It also, admittedly, really hurts the thematic underpinnings of the series.

Ichigo and friends versus the Soul Society, with Byakuya as its avatar, is (for Japanese kids) a very relatable story about youthful rebellion against a stodgy, conservative system that commits casual atrocities in the name of decorum and tradition. It's teenagers standing up and saying, "Wait, letting your little sister die to uphold the laws and dignity of a crumbling system isn't 'honorable' or 'noble', it's fucking stupid. Change the system!"

It's doubly problematic because it's not like Aizen is the secret architect of all of Soul Society's faults. He's, if anything, another rebel trying to bring down the broken system. So the core conflict of youthful idealism versus regressive conservatism never really goes anywhere, everyone just gets distracted by this other guy who's doing the wrong kind of rebellion. Oh, and Byakuya learns to be a little less of a douche, but the actual Old Guard in charge of Soul Society never do and none of their system ever really changes.

Even with the end of the series, it's not like they really learn and change. They just find a different blind, maimed god to use as a lynchpin.

(However, in terms of shit swerves, it doesn't even hold a candle to Naruto becoming the story about how the only thing that matters is who your parents are and what genes you have. There's really no contest when it comes to shitting the bed on theme.)
 
May 10, 2018
5,694
Never bothered finishing the manga and just read a summary of the ending.

I'm hoping the anime adaptation fleshes things out and spruces things up a bit.
 
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super-famicom

Avenger
Oct 26, 2017
25,209
Aizen is the only cool thing about Bleach. His shikai ability is such bullshit and I love it. At least OP is done and never has to touch Bleach again.
 

Gold Arsene

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
30,757
I lost interest when it was clear it was becoming the Soul Reaper show, I actually really liked Ichigo's group so the fact Kubo tried to bench them as soon as possible made me quit.
 

Imperfected

Member
Nov 9, 2017
11,737
Aizen is the only cool thing about Bleach. His shikai ability is such bullshit and I love it. At least OP is done and never has to touch Bleach again.

Tsukishima's Book of the End is pretty cool, too. They're both basically JoJo arc villain powers.

It's just a shame Tsukishima's stuck in such a totally shit arc that I cannot recommend on any level.
 
Nov 17, 2017
12,864
(However, in terms of shit swerves, it doesn't even hold a candle to Naruto becoming the story about how the only thing that matters is who your parents are and what genes you have. There's really no contest when it comes to shitting the bed on theme.)
People really need to stop repeating that this was always Naruto's main theme. It wasn't. It was always about overcoming hatred and violence to try and understand one another. That theme Naruto sticks to all the way through.
 

caliph95

Member
Oct 25, 2017
35,187
The final arc spent too much time dick around or being bloated with long ass unnecessary fights that there wasn't enough time to actually bring closure to shit that was important

The Thor fight was too long for example should have ended when ice guy and byakuya killed him or when the big dude finally achieved bankai
 

caliph95

Member
Oct 25, 2017
35,187
Soul Society really should never have stopped being villains because so much about them is profoundly fucked up and once they become allies they just forget about how fucked up SS is even though there's no reason to believe they've changed and several to believe they're a shitty as ever. Some of the captains should have gone rogue, but honestly the Aizen twist and how it instantly made the conflict with SS void honestly really hurt the series
I feel like the captains and lieutenants being popular in a lot of ways screw the series
It also brings how now every arc is bloated because they know needed to have their own individual fights
 

Qvoth

Member
Oct 26, 2017
11,897
yep, couldn't care about bleach's last few arcs at all
i think it started in the humans with super powered arc, i forgot what they're called
the ones after arrancar arc